I really enjoy this part of the game, honestly. As above it makes it feel like a 90s arcade game or something, which is really appealing to me. We have Doom 2016 which is a bit more reserved in that respect, I appreciate the difference.
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DOOM Eternal |OT| Hells Bells
- Thread starter AgentStrange
- Start date
It's amazing how two people can have the exact opposite impression of the same situation. I'm still enjoying Eternal, though, even though it shut down my console twice in the middle of playing.
Your console is possessed
Doomguy is just letting you know!
Reflecting back on it after having 100%'d, it's just weird how many extra praetor tokens there are. Makes the 100% feel less good tbh. In 2016 you had just enough for everything. Here at the end I think I had 16 extra tokens or so, same goes for batteries (and it's not like the batteries are mandatory for upgrades, 6 of them are used for cosmetics)
Next PT I won't bother using batteries for praetor tokens I guess lol
Next PT I won't bother using batteries for praetor tokens I guess lol
I finished the game last night and I have to say it's probably the best game I've played in a year or two since Hollow Knight. The only things I didn't like that much are the Maurauder and some of the platforming sections. The combat in this is perhaps the best there is and makes your hart pump like almost no other game does. It's just that intense.
I can kinda see why they designed the first Marauder fight the way it is; it's a terrible arena to fight one in but it's a great area to teach the player how to expose the character's weaknesses, and that knowledge is going to persist in future encounters (though I'd substitute enemy spawns with just ammo/health pickups to the side). Eternal has an interesting difficulty curve where the encounters start off hard but feel like they get easier despite the bigger abundance in enemies and hurdles later on.
This must be how DMC fans feel about their own games; a sensation that these mechanics set a really palpable skill ceiling thats unmatched by most contemporaries and just gets better the more you've settled in. Theoretically the encounters get tougher but it doesn't feel that much of the time because you get better.
This must be how DMC fans feel about their own games; a sensation that these mechanics set a really palpable skill ceiling thats unmatched by most contemporaries and just gets better the more you've settled in. Theoretically the encounters get tougher but it doesn't feel that much of the time because you get better.
Sorry, but I will not be shamed into silence for loving Doom Eternal
I absolutely love this game so far! I'm enjoying the exploration as well and trying my best to find everything in each level. I'm 10 hours in and almost at the end of the gore nest mission. I can't believe how smooth the platforming feels despite being a first-person title.
why are you being so dramatic? Who is trying to shame or silence you??
Gameplay? Red Dead wasn't very fun to play for me. Kind of a slog. I enjoyed the world, story, and characters a lot though.
Well... Okay? No one is saying you can't enjoy it. Some people don't and are saying so, others do and are obviously free to say so as well.
Who's trying to silence you?
Okay either Eternal has the most dedicated fans ever or something's up with the steam achievements lol:
Okay either Eternal has the most dedicated fans ever or something's up with the steam achievements lol:
I'm not seeing the problem. Everyone is self isolating, so there's lots of time to play Doom. Plus, all those achievements are really early game.
Okay either Eternal has the most dedicated fans ever or something's up with the steam achievements lol:
Those numbers are bullshit. If you go to your achievement page and choose to see the global scores, it shows the real achievement numbers.
Yeah but even with super popular games it's EXTREMELY common for people to play half the first level and never touch a game again. Even most games "complete level 1 achievements" are often only in the 60-70%.
I guess I'm just surprised at 100% stats. You would think ONE player would have not had those yet.
This is much more believable.
I finished it over the weekend (still got some slayer gates etc to do though). Thoughts:
+ Graphics
+ Gameplay
+ Level size
+ Sheer number of secrets
+ Some breathtaking vistas/art direction on some levels
+ Slight puzzling is fine
+ the majority of the platforming challenges are welcome, and well implemented with the dash mechanics
- Doom 2016 had better atmosphere and tone
- annoying level hazards (whose idea was the purple goo? Also those frikken sarcophagi and swimming)
- story is too big for the number of levels, and lacks weight as a result (story could have carried two whole games). Not enough time in the story for any one thing.
- Marauder is not fun to fight (he definitely didn't need a helper doggo, that's for sure)
- Cutscenes don't work for me as well as the first person ones from the previous game
- Ammo count is still too low despite their intention for it to be more balanced. 24 ss shells max, should have been 32 IMO
The worst bits for me are the Marauder fights and the annoying-ass level hazards. Doom 2016 was a 9/10 for me. This... probably 8/10 or a low 9.
Still enjoying the hell out of it.
+ Graphics
+ Gameplay
+ Level size
+ Sheer number of secrets
+ Some breathtaking vistas/art direction on some levels
+ Slight puzzling is fine
+ the majority of the platforming challenges are welcome, and well implemented with the dash mechanics
- Doom 2016 had better atmosphere and tone
- annoying level hazards (whose idea was the purple goo? Also those frikken sarcophagi and swimming)
- story is too big for the number of levels, and lacks weight as a result (story could have carried two whole games). Not enough time in the story for any one thing.
- Marauder is not fun to fight (he definitely didn't need a helper doggo, that's for sure)
- Cutscenes don't work for me as well as the first person ones from the previous game
- Ammo count is still too low despite their intention for it to be more balanced. 24 ss shells max, should have been 32 IMO
The worst bits for me are the Marauder fights and the annoying-ass level hazards. Doom 2016 was a 9/10 for me. This... probably 8/10 or a low 9.
Still enjoying the hell out of it.
In what way? That's a very dramatic statement.
I think a problem for some with the complexity is that playing Doom Eternal can be sort of like trying to draw if you aren't skilled. You know what the subject of your drawing looks like, but when you try to draw the shapes it doesn't look anything like what you imagined. The game has so many keybinds you need to keep track of, that even at the end of the game I'd sometimes frantically mash the wrong keys.
If you lean in to this system though, and find the difficulty that works for you, I think the moment to moment gameplay has a lot of freedom, and is super personal and expressive.
I'm really enjoying the game but it puts me in a jarring mental spot because it's, in practice, a pretty awful direct sequel to Doom '16. id has taken the idea of Doom '16 on paper but rebuilt it as something completely, fundamentally different and it does not operate the same at all. From the progression through stages to the layered complexity of the combat system and encounter design, it's asking a different approach from the player and balances its enemy/weapon strength/weaknesses, ammo/armour/health distribution, mobility, and everything else around a new formula. And it's a good one, but man is it different.
I will say, one of the big standouts, despite the overall change in direction, that I don't like very much is the directional change of presentation. The tone seems more or less similar, although Doom '16 was bigger on the dreariness, but the game has really tripled down on lore, backstory, characterisation, premise, etc. Doom Slayer is now a far more fully formed identity we play as, as opposed to an elegantly simple avatar we become. If Doom '16 was a cheeky take on the the legacy of the franchise, in particular the Doom Marine, and how to reimagine it with minimalism for a new era, Doom Eternal is id going hard in building a fully formed character and universe.
It's very different. Not to my preference, but I guess that difference is to be expected given the rest of the changes.
I will say, one of the big standouts, despite the overall change in direction, that I don't like very much is the directional change of presentation. The tone seems more or less similar, although Doom '16 was bigger on the dreariness, but the game has really tripled down on lore, backstory, characterisation, premise, etc. Doom Slayer is now a far more fully formed identity we play as, as opposed to an elegantly simple avatar we become. If Doom '16 was a cheeky take on the the legacy of the franchise, in particular the Doom Marine, and how to reimagine it with minimalism for a new era, Doom Eternal is id going hard in building a fully formed character and universe.
It's very different. Not to my preference, but I guess that difference is to be expected given the rest of the changes.
Game feels really thought out but God damn does it feel real bad to be played on a controller. That or I'm going to have to drop the look speed dramatically. I've missed so many damn shots and I'm a guy who plays most console FPS at the highest look sensitivity.
Game plays like "you really should just be using a mouse"
Game plays like "you really should just be using a mouse"
i for one love the "bigger, better, harder, stronger" approach of Eternal. instead of being a highly iterative sequel they amped up everything to 11.
finished Arc Complex on Nightmare a few minutes ago and again, have to take a breather, it was just intense. i love the verticality in the areas and the arena encounters are just great with jumping pads, parcour bars and teleporters. the combat is frantic as fuck and really gets my adrenaline going.
this is one of the greatest videogames since a long time for me, it is everything i like about videogames, it has a distinct oldschool feeling like an 90s arcade game too which fits the whole thing perfectly.
nah, plays sublime on a controller, no problems at all. did you turn look smoothing to 0? (under control settings, last entry)
it plays much better when this is off. in fact this is one of the best playing first person shooters on a controller, it is responsive and you can bind every button to any action, don´t know why people are having problems with a controller. i even turned aim assist off because i don´t need it in this game. everyone should bind dashing to l1, you need to dash without lifting your finger from the analog.
finished Arc Complex on Nightmare a few minutes ago and again, have to take a breather, it was just intense. i love the verticality in the areas and the arena encounters are just great with jumping pads, parcour bars and teleporters. the combat is frantic as fuck and really gets my adrenaline going.
this is one of the greatest videogames since a long time for me, it is everything i like about videogames, it has a distinct oldschool feeling like an 90s arcade game too which fits the whole thing perfectly.
nah, plays sublime on a controller, no problems at all. did you turn look smoothing to 0? (under control settings, last entry)
it plays much better when this is off. in fact this is one of the best playing first person shooters on a controller, it is responsive and you can bind every button to any action, don´t know why people are having problems with a controller. i even turned aim assist off because i don´t need it in this game. everyone should bind dashing to l1, you need to dash without lifting your finger from the analog.
Sorry your skin so thin you get upset over other people's opinions over a video game.
That's weird, I felt right at home from second 1 with a controller, even with look smoothing on. I may even prefer it to mouse and keyboard since the control scheme is more compact and less cluttered.
That's actually something I haven't thought much about and I'm curious to know the ratio of people who liked/disliked the game and what version/control method they played. On PC this game feels godlike but I could not imagine playing this on console (which is a shame since I really was gonna double dip on the Switch version).
it's the lack of aim down sight....it kills me.
I'll eventually adjust to it but it feels like I'm playing Halo....very old school arena feel. I know 2016 was like that as well and I eventually readjusted. I just have to remember how I did it.
Started playing this last night and finished the first two missions. Playing it on easy because I don't have the patience for frustration anymore when it comes to gaming. Even on easy I'm still having pretty intense encounters..
Anyway, having a blast so far, I think I'm enjoying it more than the 2016 version. I'm actually making the effort to find all the secrets which I never bothered with the previous game. It feels SO smooth and good to play.
Shame the platforming is hit and miss, but my word it looks gorgeous.
Anyway, having a blast so far, I think I'm enjoying it more than the 2016 version. I'm actually making the effort to find all the secrets which I never bothered with the previous game. It feels SO smooth and good to play.
Shame the platforming is hit and miss, but my word it looks gorgeous.
The game really starts to sing in the Gore Nest level. I had so much fun in that one, esp. the central plaza! Being able to move in such a satisfying and varied way really makes this game. The ARC complex was interesting because of the link with the previous game (this game starts in medias res os at this point I still don't know what happened between 2016 and Eternal) and the combat flows in a lovely way.
That Maurauder is very not fun though. It's all pattern recognition with little room for improvisation - and the latter is what makes these games so much fun to me. I've played on UV difficulty until now without any trouble but the Maurauder makes me want to drop it down all the way just so I can get past him. It's no fun - you have to keep a slight distance so he doesn't do ranged attacks but you can't because of the other monsters he spawns and that stupid wolf. I just don't understand what gameplay scenario they had in mind that'd be enjoyable...
That Maurauder is very not fun though. It's all pattern recognition with little room for improvisation - and the latter is what makes these games so much fun to me. I've played on UV difficulty until now without any trouble but the Maurauder makes me want to drop it down all the way just so I can get past him. It's no fun - you have to keep a slight distance so he doesn't do ranged attacks but you can't because of the other monsters he spawns and that stupid wolf. I just don't understand what gameplay scenario they had in mind that'd be enjoyable...
I don't have an issue with its difficulty. I have an issue with the constraints the core gameplay loop design puts on your freedom.
Sure I can nuke the spider without destroying his weak point X with weapon mod Y for weapon Z, but it's so much less effective that the game actively discourages you from doing your own thing. You have to switch weapons constantly, you have to set enemies on fire, you have to use your chainsaw (which is relegated to "oh shit there's an annoying red alert in the middle of my screen" button instead of the "awesome one hit kill + extra resources" button it was in 2016), you have to target weak points.
I understand the design idea, and I totally get this kind of gameplay is exactly what some people want. No contest there.
But for me, these imposed limits make for a significantly less entertaining game.
Weak points are mostly mandatory early game. Once you can ice nade + triple rocket + meat hook super shotgun a heavy in the face, their weak points don't really matter
It's a puzzle game now, where there are multiple solutions to the problem.
Had a few multiplayer games where the other demon player doesn't summon any demons. Get utterly crushed in those ones.
I think that's what bothers me with the game. It's not that Doom Eternal is bad, but it feels so fundamentally different from Doom 1, 2, 64, and 2016. Those games were not complex in combat mechanics, whereas Doom Eternal has a ton more to keep track of and requires of you during combat. If they had ramped up slowly over a few games to get to this, or even over the entire game, maybe it would feel better. It just throws it all at you pretty quick, which gives you more to play with sooner, but makes it feel all the more jarring.
I'm coming around to some of what it's doing (although I don't think I'll ever warm up to the low ammo counts), but the disappointment that it isn't closer to 2016 won't go away.
When Hugo Martin spoke about the combat mechanics and strategies I felt that this game would be a mess with a controller. The game requires constant weapon swapping, mods switching and quick reflexes. I felt that the game would be amazing but the console users would be given the middle glory finger.
Lo and behold, I am not mistaken. Way too overcomplicated for its own sake.
Lo and behold, I am not mistaken. Way too overcomplicated for its own sake.
I'm on mission 3 and one of the encounters, the first hallway with the swinging axe blades on a switch, where you fight a trio of mancubi, the encounter doesn't mark as "cleared" for me, and I'm done everything else in the level. Is this a bug or is there a second encnoutner to trigger here?
This really can't be argued with. I get not enjoying this, but anyone claiming otherwise doesn't really understand how to use the mechanics well.
I actually don't mind needing to use the chainsaw and flame belcher for ammo and armor, respectively. The issue I have is that your ammo capacity is too low earlier in the game, and by the time it hits a decent point, the number of deadly enemies the game throws at you has grown exponentially. That and the annoyance of the marauder. The guy has to be taken out a specific way and is surrounded by enemies that are attacking you as well....yet you throw in an annoying dog and a face filling RE1 intro teeth shot every time it bites you? There's a ton to love about this game and I'm convinced if they balance it just a bit it would be all the better for it.
I usually suck at aiming in FPS (PS4) but somehow, Doom Eternal is a joy to control for me. Look Smoothing at 0 and everything else at standard works great for me. Combined with the "slow-mo in Air" Perk, i have no problem with hitting Weakspots across the whole arena. The only thing i find impractical is switching weapon-mods and grenades on the fly, but its still not really a problem. Game really finds its groove around the third level.
Maaaaybe they could bind weapon-mod switch to a quick double tap on the alternate-firemode-bumper but i guess that could be misread quite easily.
I also really enjoy the new Mechanics now afer som hours of playtime, as they force me to play strategically without 100% forcing me to use the "intended" strategy (like Sekiro with its Counters for example). In comparison, in 2016 i was using the super shotgun like 90% of the time. it sure feels like a completely different game but they kinda had not really an option as 2016 was already a biiiit too long for its rather simplistic combat. Right now, i find them both to be equally as goof but for different reasons.
Maaaaybe they could bind weapon-mod switch to a quick double tap on the alternate-firemode-bumper but i guess that could be misread quite easily.
I also really enjoy the new Mechanics now afer som hours of playtime, as they force me to play strategically without 100% forcing me to use the "intended" strategy (like Sekiro with its Counters for example). In comparison, in 2016 i was using the super shotgun like 90% of the time. it sure feels like a completely different game but they kinda had not really an option as 2016 was already a biiiit too long for its rather simplistic combat. Right now, i find them both to be equally as goof but for different reasons.
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I agree with Claven, I don't really like the strengths/weaknesses approach to enemy and weapon design and how that blends into encounters. It's not that it's complicated, it's just that I personally find the puzzle-like nature of combat strengths a boring approach versus a more organic flexibility to all skills and weapons. With Doom Eternal I feel there's an overt pressure to juggle multiple factors of combat, namely cause and reaction, using particular skills, gear, and weapons in very specific context and order to fuel the combat loop at its most efficient and effective. And it's not that you can't just do whatever, moreso that there's such an enormous benefit and borderline necessity to do so on higher difficulties that it gives the illusion of complexity but in practice is actually pretty fomulaic.
And it works. It's fine. It's fun and exciting. It's just not what I wanted from the game. I didn't really want to find myself thinking WELL NOW I NEED TO FILL UP MY ARMOUR SO I BETTER USE FIRE AND THEN ATTACK or GEE WIZZ THAT ENEMY IS TOUGH BUT IF I BLOW OFF THESE PARTS IT'LL BE MUCH WEAKER alongside CONSTANTLY RUNNING OUT AMMO SO I REFILL WITH THE CHAINSAW and MAKE SURE TO USE GRENADES FOR AN EASY KILL OR ELSE THEY'RE BULLET SPONGES. It's a great rock/paper/scissors system with a flexibility in approach that makes the encounters lively and organic, but in a markedly different way to what a run-and-gun shooter is usually like, where total freedom is usually expressed in a simplicity that isn't lesser but instead accommodating to the flexibility and openness of play.
I suppose it's a totally subjective end-user-experience kind of thing. I find myself in Doom Eternal too frequently thinking about what I need to do as opposed to just doing. Where shooting straight and athletically dodging shots isn't really enough, because you'll probably need to specifically set some enemies on fire and chainsaw others just to make it through. It does make sense in the design trajectory though. id specifically cited games like Bayonetta for the inclusion of glory kills in Doom '16, that moment of relief in a battle that lasts a split second and rewards you with something. They've tripled down on that idea and blossomed it here, making for this puzzle-like ebb and flow to combat, with still a sense of real time freedom to do what you want.
I'm basically on a level-a-day policy. I can feel the disinterest gnawing away in the back of my brain and it hasn't hit yet. Because I'm finding it a lot of fun and I want to keep playing, but I know if I push too hard too quickly I'll burn myself out and some of the design idiosyncrasies and changes over Doom '16 will weigh it down. Right now combing over a single level a day, especially given how fucking long they are, is just the right amount.
And it works. It's fine. It's fun and exciting. It's just not what I wanted from the game. I didn't really want to find myself thinking WELL NOW I NEED TO FILL UP MY ARMOUR SO I BETTER USE FIRE AND THEN ATTACK or GEE WIZZ THAT ENEMY IS TOUGH BUT IF I BLOW OFF THESE PARTS IT'LL BE MUCH WEAKER alongside CONSTANTLY RUNNING OUT AMMO SO I REFILL WITH THE CHAINSAW and MAKE SURE TO USE GRENADES FOR AN EASY KILL OR ELSE THEY'RE BULLET SPONGES. It's a great rock/paper/scissors system with a flexibility in approach that makes the encounters lively and organic, but in a markedly different way to what a run-and-gun shooter is usually like, where total freedom is usually expressed in a simplicity that isn't lesser but instead accommodating to the flexibility and openness of play.
I suppose it's a totally subjective end-user-experience kind of thing. I find myself in Doom Eternal too frequently thinking about what I need to do as opposed to just doing. Where shooting straight and athletically dodging shots isn't really enough, because you'll probably need to specifically set some enemies on fire and chainsaw others just to make it through. It does make sense in the design trajectory though. id specifically cited games like Bayonetta for the inclusion of glory kills in Doom '16, that moment of relief in a battle that lasts a split second and rewards you with something. They've tripled down on that idea and blossomed it here, making for this puzzle-like ebb and flow to combat, with still a sense of real time freedom to do what you want.
I'm basically on a level-a-day policy. I can feel the disinterest gnawing away in the back of my brain and it hasn't hit yet. Because I'm finding it a lot of fun and I want to keep playing, but I know if I push too hard too quickly I'll burn myself out and some of the design idiosyncrasies and changes over Doom '16 will weigh it down. Right now combing over a single level a day, especially given how fucking long they are, is just the right amount.
It's still flexible though, very. There are the obvious, tutorial given weak point best ways.. but there are many other solution to the combat encounters. It's not rigid, at all, and that's one of the best parts of the design.
You can "just do", absolutely, you just need to be quick on your feet about it.
I guess I don't agree? It feels flexible enough to be still really fun but I don't think it's as flexible as Doom '16 or other more focused run-and-gun shooters that don't deeply integrate crutch gameplay systems into the combat loop, which Doom Eternal does. It actively wants you to recharge your armour mid battle. It actively wants you to run low on ammo quickly. It actively wants you to experiment with the strength/weakness nature of enemies and abilities and juggle all of them at once. It's fun, but the loop is distinctly different in my opinion and not what I expected.
I can see you don't.. but if myself and many others are finding the flexibility, it does exist.
Imo it's just as flexible as Doom 2016, with some added shortcuts if you want to focus.
Heres this enemy, he attacks from afar and from close range, also he moves really fast and you have to wait to he's eyes glow green to attack and also we are going to give him a dog... now fuck off.
Honestly I'd consider the Marauders "fixed" if they did away with the respawning fodder and made the Marauder himself just drop some health and ammo when you shoot him. I don't mind other enemies being around at first, but if I take the time to clear them out, it should be possible to get it so it's just me and the Marauder alone.
I am playing on Ultraviolence on a controller, because I got my PC hooked up to the TV and I didn't want to miss out on the HDR.
It's perfectly fine. I was scared, but it plays really well. I have died 2 or 3 times tops and I'm halfway through the North Pole level. It might get impossible halfway through the game, can't say, but so far if you understand the mechanics of the game a controller isn't an issue. Glory kills, chainsaw, the flamethrower... It's all contextual anyway. That said, I'm not feeling it for the reasons stated multiple times in the thread. I am way more fond of the charm of Doom 2016 and how much more simple, in a good way, it was. Sometimes less is more. I do like the new gibbing and weak point mechanics. The platforming doesn't bother me a lot.