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Do you like the concept of the "Bat-family" from Batman comics?
- Thread starter Bor Gullet
- Start date
*looks at calendar* He has been back for 15 years? WTF?!
I still don't like it, deaths mean so little in comic books that I really appreciate when one sticks.
They rotate villains in and out, Riddler was part of it too for some time.
The only "villain" that should be allowed in the bat family is a cat.
This is almost as dumb as Harley being part of the superheroes celebrating Superman's identity shenanigans.
This is almost as dumb as a huge arc where the main villains are all Batman becoming villains with the powers of the justice league in dark universes, because people buy anything with Bat on it.
Now if this was animated Harley Quinn Clayface, I have no problem.
I get what you mean, but I don't mind Jason Todd being alive because in life and death he can still equally represent Batman's failure, at least to Batman.
It's just too much people, every new writer wants to go on and insert their new shitty hip batfriend in what is a quite good story and afterward they are unused cos the new writer has no ideas for that.
Some like Jason, Batwoman and nightwing have managed to stand out, but Duke, Spoiler, Cass are just good in their introduction stories, otherwise they are just "Robin but it's Ironman", "Robin but lesbian", "Barbara but her dad is bad"
Some like Jason, Batwoman and nightwing have managed to stand out, but Duke, Spoiler, Cass are just good in their introduction stories, otherwise they are just "Robin but it's Ironman", "Robin but lesbian", "Barbara but her dad is bad"
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What? Spoiler sucked in her introduction story and in her time as (sacrificial) Robin, it wasn't until Steph became Batgirl that she really came into her own (and then they yanked it). Similar with Cass. But it depends on editorial and writers being interested in the characters, obviously.
I love the bat family. Maybe one day we can get this in the movies. And maybe more acknowledgement for Bruce's daughters too.
While it can be done justice, I just feel the majority of stories revolving around them aren't very interesting so I prefer loner bats.
I don't know how you can get this in movies unless you both skip the origin story and the Justice League. There's just not enough time to focus on establishing who Batman is, or who he is in terms of a cinematic universe, to go into multiple sidekicks and guest characters. It's perfect for a series, though. Like if they expanded Titans into a bat family spinoff (and got completely new writers) I'd be down with that.
You're right. They gotta show at least 30 minutes of each Bat movie on a falling pearl necklace, a Wilhelm scream, and a smoking barrel. It's Hollywood law. (I'm not even being all that sarcastic.)
I have mixed feelings. There are way too many of them. They soften the character in a way that can be good or bad. There are some good stories that utilize them. I prefer the members of the family that have some distance from Batman and Gordon. Spoiler, Cass, Batwoman, Batwing, the Batman Inc. cast, etc. There are too many Robins.
I don't get the "absurd/silly" comments. They are cape comics. They are all absurd.
I don't get the "absurd/silly" comments. They are cape comics. They are all absurd.
I feel that most the people who don't like the Bat-family haven't been exposed to all the great depictions in the comics. I highly recommend James Tynion IV's run of Detective Comics to show how wonderful the dynamic is.
People who don't even like Batman having a Robin don't really understand Batman as a character, in my opinion.
Indeed a fantastic run and one that sold me on the larger concept.
Though my Bat-comics knowledge is rooted in the 80's and 90's largely when the family was much smaller. But I had a great time reading that Rebirth run and wholeheartedly recommend others to do so as well.
Bruce being smart enough to pull in people around him, gradually fixing his own trauma by helping other people with theirs is genius. Every member of his family serves a different purpose. Alfred's his dad, Dick is his little brother (now), Batwoman is his sister, Tim and Cass are his kids, etc. etc.
Solo Batman is comedy because it screams "take superheroes seriously". No. They're wearing costumes and "fighting crime", which we should all know isn't how crime works by now.
Solo Batman is comedy because it screams "take superheroes seriously". No. They're wearing costumes and "fighting crime", which we should all know isn't how crime works by now.
I've always found Batman boring as hell by himself. The Family always made the stories come alive to me. Whether with the JL or the Family, Batman books have always been far more enjoyable with a team around him.
I wouldn't give a fuck about Batman if he didn't have kids, to be completely honest.
You know me too well.
Reminder that even THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS, the seminal "serious" Batman story, knew Batman had to have a Robin
This is the summation of how I feel about Batman.
Yeah I've been listening to people talk about how the Bat-Family is a "bad idea" for years even as Nightwing and Robin had more interesting solo books than he did.
I like the Bat-Family more individually than as a group. I prefer smaller team ups, it sometimes feels a little crowded.
This 'could' be mitigated if they did a Burnside angle with more of them, either having them stationed throughout specific parts of the city or establishing and sticking to an idea of how they work together.
This 'could' be mitigated if they did a Burnside angle with more of them, either having them stationed throughout specific parts of the city or establishing and sticking to an idea of how they work together.
For real. And I think they work best when aimed at a teenage audience. Sure, adults can enjoy it, but I don't need it to be specifically aimed at adults.
I have a question, little off topic, but do they ever say how old Bruce is supposed to be? The Robins are all adults, except for Damien who's a teen(?), so is Bruce in his 40s? I know, I know, it's comics, but I just wanna know if they've ever addressed it.
I like it. I'm not entirely sure why though. I think it's because Batman is ultimately human which means it's realistic he'd want backup or a squad, AND he'd want to train someone to take his mantle once he gets too old or a lucky dude takes a good shot. I guess you could throw some ninja clan metaphors in there as well where it's cool he has this ninja squad. The different dynamics of the characters are all pretty great too. It's one of the things I'd really like to see explored more (or at least better) in the movies.
The comics are always deaging him so it's hard to keep track.
I have a spreadsheet with ages based on stuff before new 52 that has Bruce "dying" in his late forties.
Batman: Year One puts him as becoming Batman at 26, so I lowered it two years. The other big difference is that Cass should be the same age as Jason, but I prefer her being closer in age to Tim. Dick is taken in by Bruce any time between 8 and 12 years old, depending on what story you're referencing. I generally prefer them becoming his kids when they are younger. The timeline also doesn't work with Tim being there for Flying Grayson's performance. You either have to make Dick older when his parents die or make Tim older when he becomes Robin. The latter of which happens canonically when he's 13, but I bumped it down to 12 and would rather him have seen the Flying Graysons some other way instead of being there in person.
If he's not with a Bat-Family he's also good when he's mentoring a junior Leaguer or other type of superhero, like Blue Beetle or Firestorm or whoever else
Batman is really, really boring when he's just one dude brooding about his dead parents and inevitably winning the day because he has a gadget for the situation or whatever. There have been enough stories about that. He needs a Robin, or a Catwoman, or a Nightwing, or a Batgirl. He's interesting when there's a dynamic like that, when he has people to play off of. Batman Beyond's great for showing how Bruce is just a lonely, pathetic curmudgeon when he's isolated himself and mentoring Terry gives him that spark again
Batman is really, really boring when he's just one dude brooding about his dead parents and inevitably winning the day because he has a gadget for the situation or whatever. There have been enough stories about that. He needs a Robin, or a Catwoman, or a Nightwing, or a Batgirl. He's interesting when there's a dynamic like that, when he has people to play off of. Batman Beyond's great for showing how Bruce is just a lonely, pathetic curmudgeon when he's isolated himself and mentoring Terry gives him that spark again
I'm not a fan. Maybe it's because I'm out of the loop but they feel like all the extra Sonic the Hedgehog characters.
For folks saying that it's too many characters, they were originally spaced out enough that stories only needed to involve a few of them at a time, or in vastly different roles. You can group them in organic ways that don't feel overwhelming. New 52 and Rebirth really just squished everything together in a way that I don't find very satisfying.
Right before New 52, I was hoping for the following:
Gotham Team: Dick (Batman), Babs (Oracle), Steph (Batgirl), and Damian (Robin)
International Team: Bruce (Batman), Cass (Black Bat), Tim (Red Robin)
Jason works well with non-Bat teams, so you could do still do Outlaws. Maybe have Selina be in the International Team, but I'm fine with her being a recurring guest and doing her own thing otherwise. Kate (Batwoman) is also more of her own thing, focusing on more supernatural horror type stuff. Helena B. always seemed more invested in Birds of Prey so that should be her main book.
I don't care about Jean-Paul sorry. :(
Right before New 52, I was hoping for the following:
Gotham Team: Dick (Batman), Babs (Oracle), Steph (Batgirl), and Damian (Robin)
International Team: Bruce (Batman), Cass (Black Bat), Tim (Red Robin)
Jason works well with non-Bat teams, so you could do still do Outlaws. Maybe have Selina be in the International Team, but I'm fine with her being a recurring guest and doing her own thing otherwise. Kate (Batwoman) is also more of her own thing, focusing on more supernatural horror type stuff. Helena B. always seemed more invested in Birds of Prey so that should be her main book.
I don't care about Jean-Paul sorry. :(
The DC editors seem to like him more than Cass at the very least. :(
I am all for a bat-family, as long as associations are cleanly divided. Batwoman is great as a peer and is actual family but shouldn't be hanging around bruce on the reg (detective comics run was great at this.) The Robins should grow up and go on their own paths.
At the end of the day I'm partial to the idea of a future where a grizzled Bruce Wayne married to Selina is living a mostly quiet and solitary life in the manor (probably mentoring terry) but never far from friends and family, with Dick and Damian always popping by and Supes hitting up his friend and asking to advise on Justice league stuff.
At the end of the day I'm partial to the idea of a future where a grizzled Bruce Wayne married to Selina is living a mostly quiet and solitary life in the manor (probably mentoring terry) but never far from friends and family, with Dick and Damian always popping by and Supes hitting up his friend and asking to advise on Justice league stuff.
Does it really matter when ultimately the character is so popular he tends to almost always have stories (and sometimes entire comic books) going on without them?
It's not like they made him a member of the X-men and that's the only book you ever see him in anymore.
It's not like they made him a member of the X-men and that's the only book you ever see him in anymore.
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Some characters just feel unnecessary though.
Can someone tell me what the point of Batwing is?
Most assuredly.
Yep. Still on the Bat Family database page.
This makes me happy. Sword of Azrael was the first Batman story I remember reading, and I've always liked Jean-Paul. I'm glad he's still around.
Honestly, same. His relationship with the family is my favorite part about Bruce, and it is frustrating to see how many creators like to either destroy it or just ignore it to keep him dark and edgy. I wish his relationship with Cass was explored more though. I remember it being pretty sweet when it was actually explored.
Reminder that even THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS, the seminal "serious" Batman story, knew Batman had to have a Robin
No hooks, no grapples, no parachutes
these two are about to die
Is Tim an adult now? I thought he was still a teenager? The ages are all over the place, though. I swear Batgirl of Burnside deaged the character with absolutely no explanation, still established that she had been oracle but having her act like she was in her really early 20s somehow, then they reverted without saying anything. And it wasn't just the art.
To be fucking cool? To have black representation? To have a techy Batman? To give the Fox family a closer connection? I dunno, take your pick.
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I don't know... the character comes off as diet Cyborg and the Iron-Man Batman is just silly.