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knightmawk

Member
Dec 12, 2018
7,482
I remember hearing someone suggest once that the long striking titles trend in games was actually influenced by the same trend in Manga, which comes from a desire to have a Manga stand out on the shelf / in magezines.

I have no academic or remotely researched source for that mind.
 

Starlatine

533.489 paid youtubers cant be wrong
Member
Oct 28, 2017
30,367
red dead redemption undead nightmare and call of duty modern warfare remastered probably sound like word salad to non english speakers, despite 'making sense'
 

Tacitus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,030
I think this is closer to what the OP is calling out
Daikatanabox.jpg


People using foreign words because they think it looks cool.
 

Zen_Master

Member
Nov 15, 2020
279
I don't speak Japanese but could it be that those words sound similar to other Japanese words and therefore convey a particular meaning or sound cool to a Japanese ear? I'm a bit baffled by some as well but that's my western POV. If anything it sounds exotic and more interesting than the same words being repeated over. The use of greek letters or capitalisation also adds to that.
 

hikarutilmitt

Member
Dec 16, 2017
11,404
OP didn't even bring up the names for light novels. I'm guessing the penchant for longer names comes from the fact that you can fit a lot more words in Japanese in the same space you might fit one or two in English. A lot of them are intentionally goofy, but others are by happenstance. Monstrum Nox doesn't strike me as odd, though.
Your Title Here: ~Now Put Some Shit in Tildes~

But that's more of a VN thing. I don't know who started this trend, but I want to fucking smack them.

The light novel trend of going I'm Putting the Entire Fucking Plot of my Book In the Title so that it Catches Attention at a Glance seems more like a clickbait/attention grabbing thing, similar to how so many western books put swear words in their titles now. It makes your book stand out among dozens of others, even though the practice is stupid in all other respects.
Do You Love Your Mom and Her Two-Hit Multi-Target Attacks?
 
Oct 25, 2017
14,741
It has more to do with how it sounds to a native speaker of whatever perspective you're considering at the moment, I think.

Demon's Souls is a fairly straightforward, proper english title, one demon who posesses multiple Souls. And yet to this day people can't get over it and we just had a thread with heated discussions about whether or not it was a mistranslation and if it should have been changed in the remake. The reason is because it just sounds weird to native english speakers.

Red Dead Redemption is kind of a weird ass title when you think about it, but it sounds nice, so every english speaker just accepts it as normal. But it probably feels a little less natural to bring up "Reddo Deddo Ridenpushon" in the middle of a conversation in japanese out of nowhere.
 

60fps

Banned
Dec 18, 2017
3,492
Yeah this is a great thread, thank you for this. Reading the OP alone cheered me up and I can't wait to read the rest :D
 

Renteka-Bond

Chicken Chaser
Member
Dec 28, 2017
4,259
Clearwater, Florida
I think if I ever said "mother's sister" in an English conversation, though, the other person would say, "you mean your aunt?" because while it's correct, most people just wouldn't say that.

Most people would just say Aunt unless they were asked what side of the family on, and only then would they say 'My mom's sister' or 'my dad's sister'. The point is, there's an equally simple way to put it in English, we just wouldn't use them most of the time cause no one cares unless they specifically ask. We just happen to have a catchall term as well.
 
OP
OP
DailyCalmSpirit
May 17, 2018
3,454
90% of the post is just 'dont these just sound weird' followed by three sentences asking about english titles being translated that seem to be thrown in after they released it was a just a rant about things that are different and had no purpose

responding with 'eh thats not that weird heres why' i would think is more useful than the actual answer which is get over it and not be so judgmental just because the title seems odd to you

if they really wanted the thread to be about how western titles get translated they could have spent approximately 2 minutes googling for examples and then posting them and asking for more. and condensing the longwinded paragraphs to simply: "UNDER NIGHT IN-BIRTH Exe:Late[cl-r] sure seems to break a lot of naming traditions in the west"

I had a question and provided context to the question. I literally gave you a beginning, middle, and end to my thought process of how I came to the question and provided some examples. I tried to make it a little fun, but, next time I'll just provide a list and request information on said list.
 

hikarutilmitt

Member
Dec 16, 2017
11,404
The Results From When I Time Leaped to My Second Year of High School and Confessed to the Teacher I liked at the Time
The funniest part is that I love these sort of titles because they're just so honest and tell me at least the basic plot before I even have to read/watch. They're also generally silly wish fulfillment/fantasy that can easily be picked up or dropped.
 

lunarworks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,117
Toronto
Siphon Filter confused western audiences. I can't imagine how it sounded to eastern audiences.
My favourite vide game related name ever is not even a video game but a console: FM Towns Marty, what the actual fuck.
FM is for Fujitsu Micro, and Towns is named after Nobel Prize physicist named Charles Townes. As for Marty? Maybe they just liked Back to the Future.
 

tobascodagama

Member
Aug 21, 2020
1,358
The funniest part is that I love these sort of titles because they're just so honest and tell me at least the basic plot before I even have to read/watch.
They remind me of Chuck Tingle titles. It's weird, but I don't hate it. And it seems to me that the tone struck by these titles is pretty similar to the content? (Again, not unlike Chuck Tingle.)
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,711
Undernight's titles are pretty bad but I remember seeing people complain about BlazBlue subtitles which all make sense

Calamity Trigger
Continuum Shift
Chrono Phantasma
Central Fiction

I just assume people are being intentionally stupid
 

tobascodagama

Member
Aug 21, 2020
1,358
And also the main character is Solid Snake. So the title can be parsed as either "<Name of Mech That's Super Important to the Series and the Game Plot> 3D" or "<Name of Mech That's Super Important to the Series and the Game Plot> <Codename of Main Character>". It's a pretty obvious pun, actually? Like most of Kojima's work, it's not fucking subtle but people somehow claim that it's super weird and obscure anyway.
 

Zonic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,372
Do You Love Your Mom and Her Two-Hit Multi-Target Attacks?
The Results From When I Time Leaped to My Second Year of High School and Confessed to the Teacher I liked at the Time
Let us never forget the king of word salad/"just describe the plot" titles for a video game.

Summer-Colored High School ★ Adolescent Record – A Summer At School On An Island Where I Contemplate How The First Day After I Transferred, I Ran Into A Childhood Friend And Was Forced To Join The Journalism Club Where While My Days As A Paparazzi Kid With Great Scoops Made Me Rather Popular Among The Girls, But Strangely My Camera Is Full Of Panty Shots, And Where My Candid Romance Is Going. –
 

DeadMoonKing

Member
Nov 6, 2017
903
We got a lot of stupid names for sports teams.

"Utah Jazz" still confuses me

A lot of those have to do with moves and not changing the name.
For example the Jazz used to be in New Orleans, the "birthplace of jazz".

Or the Lakers, which in SoCal makes not a lot of sense as we aren't exactly known for our abundant lakes, but makes more sense when you realize they were originally from Minnesota, the "land of 1,000 lakes.

I would bring up the Dodgers as well, but being as I'm from SD and the fact that we lost to them in the playoffs, fuck the Dodgers.
 
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ErichWK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,532
Sandy Eggo
A lot of those have to do with moves and not changing the name.
For example the Jazz used to be in New Orleans, the "birthplace of jazz".

Or the Lakers, which in SoCal makes not a lot of sense as we aren't exactly known for our abundant lakes, but makes more sense when you realize they were originally from Minnesota, the "land of 1,000 lakes.

I would bring up the Dodgers as well, but being I'm from SD and the fact that we lost to them in the playoffs, fuck the Dodgers.
A fellow Padres Fan? I see you are a man of culture as well. 858 Reppin'
 

Swiggins

was promised a tag
Member
Apr 10, 2018
11,445
A lot of those have to do with moves and not changing the name.
For example the Jazz used to be in New Orleans, the "birthplace of jazz".

Or the Lakers, which in SoCal makes not a lot of sense as we aren't exactly known for our abundant lakes, but makes more sense when you realize they were originally from Minnesota, the "land of 1,000 lakes.

I would bring up the Dodgers as well, but being I'm from SD and the fact that we lost to them in the playoffs, fuck the Dodgers.
To be a Padres fan is to know suffering.

At least when we lose, we can drown our sorrows with craft-beer and dope ass street tacos.
 

XaviConcept

Art Director for Videogames
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,900
The one that broke a lot of mainstream audiences was BRAVELY DEFAULT: FLYING FAIRY
 

DeadMoonKing

Member
Nov 6, 2017
903
A fellow Padres Fan? I see you are a man of culture as well. 858 Reppin'

619 here!
Though I've lived in the land of the enemy for the past five years and doubt I'll ever make it home...

To be a Padres fan is to know suffering.

At least when we lose, we can drown our sorrows with craft-beer and dope ass street tacos.

To the first point: yes, but we do have 2 WS appearances to date, and with the Darvish and Snell gets, we are going to be a fucking monster this coming season!
(Side note, I was born in MI, so my football team is the Lions. Now that is some Mado Magi level suffering.)

As to the second: I'll see you on the first, but politely grab a California Burrito instead. :P
 

Het_Nkik

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,396
I don't know but I think it's hilarious that Dragon Ball Z: Budokai Tenkaichi is only called that in the west and it's simply Dragon Ball Z: Sparking! in Japan.

EDIT: Whattup, my fellow San Diegans.
 

Nessus

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,907
I think a big difference is a lot of (most?) Japanese games use English in their titles, while very few western games use Japanese in their titles.
 

Swiggins

was promised a tag
Member
Apr 10, 2018
11,445
619 here!
Though I've lived in the land of the enemy for the past five years and doubt I'll ever make it home...



To the first point: yes, but we do have 2 WS appearances to date, and with the Darvish and Snell gets, we are going to be a fucking monster this coming season!
(Side note, I was born in MI, so my football team is the Lions. Now that is some Mado Magi level suffering.)

As to the second: I'll see you on the first, but politely grab a California Burrito instead. :P
Oh man, that IS some suffering.

I'll see your California Burrito and raise you some carne-asada fries.
 

XaviConcept

Art Director for Videogames
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,900
Honestly, that name becomes super awesome once you learn what it **really** means in the story.

Even at face value its good. Turning Brave-by-Default into Bravely Default is a great way to tie gameplay into something cool sounding. When you play around with other languages you risk using appropriation or sounding offensive but you do get creative results because they're more worried about phonetics than "everyday English". Some good stuff comes out of that.
 

Lord Azrael

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,976
Is that seriously the title you get bent out of shape over? It's super tame lmao, and obviously Latin
 

Inquisitive_Ghost

Cranky Ghost Pokemon
Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,120
It has more to do with how it sounds to a native speaker of whatever perspective you're considering at the moment, I think.

Demon's Souls is a fairly straightforward, proper english title, one demon who posesses multiple Souls. And yet to this day people can't get over it and we just had a thread with heated discussions about whether or not it was a mistranslation and if it should have been changed in the remake. The reason is because it just sounds weird to native english speakers.
It isn't, which is why people struggle with it. "Demon" is a common noun, and you don't use common nouns in that way without an article. If "Demon" was replaced with a word that was clearly a title or a name (meaning, a proper noun as opposed to a common one), no one would be confused by the title. Similarly, if the title was "A Demon's Souls" or "The Demon's Souls", no one would be confused, because those include the missing article.

The actual title is grammatically awkward.
 
Oct 25, 2017
14,741
It isn't, which is why people struggle with it. "Demon" is a common noun, and you don't use common nouns in that way without an article. If "Demon" was replaced with a word that was clearly a title or a name (meaning, a proper noun as opposed to a common one), no one would be confused by the title. Similarly, if the title was "A Demon's Souls" or "The Demon's Souls", no one would be confused, because those include the missing article.

The actual title is grammatically awkward.
But wouldn't the fact that it's a title give it poetic license to omit the article? Similarly to how you wouldn't use "Bloodborne" by its own anywhere, it's always "a bloodborne disease", for example, which is exactly what the title refers to, but they simply went with "Bloodborne". I don't think the missing article is what causes the confusion, when the thread I've mentioned literally had people saying "there's no such a thing as one demon in posession of many souls in the game". They understand what it means, but the multiple S sounds make it sound awkward, making them second guess it.

Conversely, Dark Souls, plural, are never mentioned in Dark Souls. There is one Dark Soul, and the meaning of the title has to be interpreted by the player based on the story, but nobody questions it because it sounds natural, and doesn't lead people to pay any more attention to it than seeing it as a representation of that game.

You're not wrong that "A Demon's Souls" would remove any doubt, though. "The Demon's Souls" I still think would have people saying it's actually referring to The Demon Souls you collect throughout the game. I suppose saying it's "proper english" is indeed incorrect. Thanks for the information, by the way!
 

jwhit28

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,048
UNDER NIGHT IN-BIRTH Exe:Late[cl-r]

I can't tell what they are trying to do here. The short fan abbreviation is UNICLR. How do you say that to another person?
 

chromatic9

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,003
As a European, Forza and Gran Turismo sound fitting but for a Japanese person not into cars or car/European history they must look really odd at first especially just Forza.
 

Inquisitive_Ghost

Cranky Ghost Pokemon
Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,120
But wouldn't the fact that it's a title give it poetic license to omit the article? Similarly to how you wouldn't use "Bloodborne" by its own anywhere, it's always "a bloodborne disease", for example, which is exactly what the title refers to, but they simply went with "Bloodborne". I don't think the missing article is what causes the confusion, when the thread I've mentioned literally had people saying "there's no such a thing as one demon in posession of many souls in the game". They understand what it means, but the multiple S sounds make it sound awkward, making them second guess it.

Conversely, Dark Souls, plural, are never mentioned in Dark Souls. There is one Dark Soul, and the meaning of the title has to be interpreted by the player based on the story, but nobody questions it because it sounds natural, and doesn't lead people to pay any more attention to it than seeing it as a representation of that game.

You're not wrong that "A Demon's Souls" would remove any doubt, though. "The Demon's Souls" I still think would have people saying it's actually referring to The Demon Souls you collect throughout the game. I suppose saying it's "proper english" is indeed incorrect. Thanks for the information, by the way!
Okay, so disclosure, I haven't played most of these games, just a bit of Dark Souls, so I'm talking strictly grammar, not whether they make any sense in-universe. 😅

The problem is the possessive case. "Demon Souls" would also be correct. Because it's not possessive.

The distinction between a and the is required in every possessive case because otherwise it's unclear who or what is doing the possessing. Proper nouns don't need this because they are by nature making it clear who the possessor is. The entire point of a proper noun is that you're identifying something specific. When talking about common nouns, the key is whether the possessor is something measured in units or in volume.

If I say "Demon's Souls" you expect that there should be a distinction for whether it's a specific demon or a generic one. But if I say "Water's Souls," you don't. You assume that I'm talking about the entire concept of water. And that's because water is never an "a"; it's always a "the", therefore the article is assumed and you can drop it. The reason it's always a "the" is because there's no such thing as "a water" (the only exceptions being when we force it to become a unit, such as in bottles of water. And then it's no longer volumetric and we can't assume the "the"). Anything like water, flour, sand, etc that is an assumed "the" is something where the units are too small to talk about in day-to-day life, so it's just measured in volume. Therefore using "a" would make no sense because there is no single item to point to within the volume in normal usage. Note how even the actual units are called water molecules, sand grains, etc, because those are distinct from the typical way we talk about these items. Those are when we actually want to talk about these things in units, which is uncommon.

Essentially, "Demon's Souls" is grammatically broken because it's placed a common unitary noun into a possessive grammatical structure that is reserved for proper nouns and common volumetric nouns. Proper nouns and volumetric nouns are assumed specifics, but demons are common discrete units, and anything measured in units in English always distinguishes between specifics ("the") and generics ("a") when using the possessive form because otherwise who the possessive case refers to becomes a source of confusion.
 
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