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Disney CEO Bob Iger regarding Star Wars - "...we might’ve put...too much in the marketplace too fast."
- Thread starter Kalmakov
- Start date
Marvel movies also in the grand scheme of things have less pressure on them.
There are plenty of Marvel films that quite honestly aren't anything that great. Ant-Man 2, Thor 2, Iron Man 2 and 3, Captain America: The First Avenger, Captain Marvel are all kinda average even below average at times. Age of Ultron was kinda dull too.
No one cares that much because each individual Marvel movie isn't supposed to be an "event". For Star Wars each Star Wars movie is an "event", and it's hard to just change that overnight.
It would be like if Nintendo started suddenly making the Zelda series some thing that came out yearly. Yes you can do that with Call of Duty, it wouldn't work for Zelda.
Just because you can do something with one entertainment property doesn't mean it would work for everything else.
A yearly Batman or Spider-Man or Lord of the Rings/Tolkien movie wouldn't work either. But Harry Potter made it work.
There are plenty of Marvel films that quite honestly aren't anything that great. Ant-Man 2, Thor 2, Iron Man 2 and 3, Captain America: The First Avenger, Captain Marvel are all kinda average even below average at times. Age of Ultron was kinda dull too.
No one cares that much because each individual Marvel movie isn't supposed to be an "event". For Star Wars each Star Wars movie is an "event", and it's hard to just change that overnight.
It would be like if Nintendo started suddenly making the Zelda series some thing that came out yearly. Yes you can do that with Call of Duty, it wouldn't work for Zelda.
Just because you can do something with one entertainment property doesn't mean it would work for everything else.
A yearly Batman or Spider-Man or Lord of the Rings/Tolkien movie wouldn't work either. But Harry Potter made it work.
Honest question, don't people think the Skywalker stuff is really the draw of Star Wars? These are charcaters and stories and the universe we've known for like 40 years. Is there really expected to be a huge life outside of that?
I still get laughs out people in the box office threads saying Mary Poppins was going to be huge. LMAO
It's not that they put too much out too fast, it's that the stuff they put out wasn't of the best quality. Rogue One, despite how much I enjoy it personally, as a really rough first half. And Solo is a movie that effectively tells us nothing we didn't already know about Han Solo and, in some ways, just ruins his arc in A New Hope.
Nah, there is tons of stuff they could have explored outside of the Skywalker stuff. Old Republic by itself could have explored a series worth of movies.
It absolutely fucking is. Star Wars is not the MCU nor will it ever be.
It's not really. Star Wars will not get traction without Jedi. You can step way from Skywalkers but you need Jedi
I think the market can handle 1 star wars movie a year.
I think the problem is with the Star War's strories movies. Probably most importantly neither were particularly great, though I like both, and then them being standalone makes them non-essential. There are plenty of MCU films I would have skipped if not for the connection to the larger story.
Unless you are going to do concurrent trilogies that feel "important" and have an entry every other year or standalone movies that all connect into one arc like the MCU, the only way to have a yearly movie is to do these one-offs which seem like ideas that make more sense as Disney+ shows rather than standalone movies.
I think the problem is with the Star War's strories movies. Probably most importantly neither were particularly great, though I like both, and then them being standalone makes them non-essential. There are plenty of MCU films I would have skipped if not for the connection to the larger story.
Unless you are going to do concurrent trilogies that feel "important" and have an entry every other year or standalone movies that all connect into one arc like the MCU, the only way to have a yearly movie is to do these one-offs which seem like ideas that make more sense as Disney+ shows rather than standalone movies.
Marvel doesn't get the same flack because they figured out the formula. Keep the story beats the same (typical hero's journey bs) but change the characters/settings/aesthetics juuuuust enough that it still interests people.
Black Panther, Ant-Man, & Guardians of the Galaxy are all pretty damn different just looking at them from the surface. Star Wars movies all look like....Star Wars movies though. Fighting an evil empire in space. Doesn't help that the same 20 or so characters are all they've focused on for forty damn years.
Black Panther, Ant-Man, & Guardians of the Galaxy are all pretty damn different just looking at them from the surface. Star Wars movies all look like....Star Wars movies though. Fighting an evil empire in space. Doesn't help that the same 20 or so characters are all they've focused on for forty damn years.
I've said it before, but honestly, the Star Wars IP is severely limited in comparison to something like the Marvel Universe. There's a world of difference between something like Winter Soldier and Guardians of the Galaxy. Even though there's some connective tissue, the experience between the two are barely on the same realm. There's just a diversity of powers, worlds, characters, narratives, etc. Star Wars just doesn't have that. At the end of the day, there's only so much they can do to differentiate each movie from the next
Yup, you can't make everything a yearly IP.
Tolkien/LOTR and Star Wars don't work as a yearly thing, especially if you're pushing past a "main trilogy" and trying to have spin-off movies in the mix simultaneously. It's way too much.
It wasn't the amount of content, but how it was handled both in production and timing. Rogue One had a messy first half as they half developed character relationships before trying to tie it all together for the road to A New Hope. Solo released too close to TLJ with a late/short marketing campaign and the film itself being a bit of a mess in trying to sizzle reel the characters backstory in one go.
It just felt like there was a lack of care that isn't seen with the modern MCU or projects like Clone Wars/Rebels.
Character with arguably the richest backstory potential with a variety of possible approaches = no interest
Character that to current knowledge had been sitting in a desert for 20 years avoiding anything that would draw attention = OMG MUST BE MADE!!!
Solo as a concept was fine, and he was arguably the most popular non-Force wielding character of the OT and possibly PT. It seemed more of the issue before the film released was that no one wanted someone other than Harrison Ford to be in the role, but somehow couldn't just stick with that. After the fact, that wasn't as much of an issue as the rushed nature of Forrest Gumping through nearly his entirely known past while trying to make him this intrinsic part of the formation of the Rebellion.
It just felt like there was a lack of care that isn't seen with the modern MCU or projects like Clone Wars/Rebels.
Character with arguably the richest backstory potential with a variety of possible approaches = no interest
Character that to current knowledge had been sitting in a desert for 20 years avoiding anything that would draw attention = OMG MUST BE MADE!!!
Solo as a concept was fine, and he was arguably the most popular non-Force wielding character of the OT and possibly PT. It seemed more of the issue before the film released was that no one wanted someone other than Harrison Ford to be in the role, but somehow couldn't just stick with that. After the fact, that wasn't as much of an issue as the rushed nature of Forrest Gumping through nearly his entirely known past while trying to make him this intrinsic part of the formation of the Rebellion.
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That's what ST video games, novels, comics have done for decades. The Republic lasted for 25,000 god damn fucking years. We're talking about a galactic civilization with quadrillions of sentient beings. If Disney wanted to they could take any genre, say slasher or romantic chick flick and have it take place in the ST universe. It's that's vast and diverse. Anything should be possible.
Yes it is.
Both the OT and PT were 3 years between movies.
I think The Force Awakens had like an 18 month production schedule from time people were first hired until release date.
Disney was in a big damn hurry to get the investment back for the billions they laid down for the franchise and it suffered for it.
It should have been 3 years between mainline movies. Maybe sprinkle in the occasional standalone movie but make them be something that a lot of people want to see.
Nobody in the fandom other than the Kasdans were calling for a Solo stand-alone movie.
Yeah, I'm in agreement here. I don't think MCU-ing Star Wars was a good idea. I love Star Wars but I don't think the Star Wars IP has as much flexibility as Marvel does in terms of variety.
The only good Disney Star Wars content has been the comics. They've otherwise just superficially attempted to recreate the OT.
Yeah that's definitely the thing. Say what you will about the longstanding Marvel blockbuster formula at this point, especially in regards to the giant third-act LOTR-style combat sequences, they vary in tone and subject a lot more than the SW films do.
If they were going to stake the trilogy on the Skywalker name, they shoulda gave them the Luke everyone wanted to see.
It's simultaneously amazing and outright bizarre to me that Disney's reaction to one moving bombing is "we're putting too much content out too fast". No, Solo was just a bad idea with worse production and marketing.
Let's see how SW movies have done worldwide at the box office:
EP7: 2 billion
R1: 1 billion
EP8: 1.3 billion
Solo: 392 million
Even factoring the one bomb, that's an average of 1.17 billion WW. That will only continue to rise after the release of EP9, which will easily clear 1 billion.
If they're slowing down to get the production issues sorted out, that's one thing, but the interest for SW movies is overall incredibly high. It's just that Solo proves you can't throw shit at a wall and people will love it because SW is attached to the name.
They've also overwhelmingly been critically acclaimed.
Let's see how SW movies have done worldwide at the box office:
EP7: 2 billion
R1: 1 billion
EP8: 1.3 billion
Solo: 392 million
Even factoring the one bomb, that's an average of 1.17 billion WW. That will only continue to rise after the release of EP9, which will easily clear 1 billion.
If they're slowing down to get the production issues sorted out, that's one thing, but the interest for SW movies is overall incredibly high. It's just that Solo proves you can't throw shit at a wall and people will love it because SW is attached to the name.
They've also overwhelmingly been critically acclaimed.
I've said this before here and got flamed. Solo was a big misfire that was made basically as a favor to the screenwriters.
Disney wants five star quality in McDonald's burger time limits for SW, it's unreasonable. Besides making and spending so much money on Solo; then they had to nerve to release it only a few months after the last SW film... that was just stupid
Disney wants five star quality in McDonald's burger time limits for SW, it's unreasonable. Besides making and spending so much money on Solo; then they had to nerve to release it only a few months after the last SW film... that was just stupid
I think shifting Star Wars to television is for the better overall but it is still weird to me how you have three acclaimed billion dollar grossing movies and then one flop in four years and the message is "franchise fatigue." More like no one wanted Solo, as much as I like it, and Kasdan was in the wrong to fire Lord and Miller and make the production budget double.
He pretty much said the same thing last quarter too.
Have no idea if this is the case or not but I wonder if they aren't looking at those numbers at face value but beyond them, projecting towards the future, and they don't like the health of the franchise or the trajectory. Us normal fans can see those numbers and be like well why aren't you happy?! And they could be like, we're seeing some alarming underlaying trends... Iger's a smart man, and his led Disney has become a powerhouse. I'd like to think they have a much deeper grasp on the IP than people give them credit for.
Have no idea if this is the case or not but I wonder if they aren't looking at those numbers at face value but beyond them, projecting towards the future, and they don't like the health of the franchise or the trajectory. Us normal fans can see those numbers and be like well why aren't you happy?! And they could be like, we're seeing some alarming underlaying trends... Iger's a smart man, and his led Disney has become a powerhouse. I'd like to think they have a much deeper grasp on the IP than people give them credit for.
I kinda warmed up to Solo
Maybe my bar for enjoying SW movies is lower these days ... i don't know
Maybe my bar for enjoying SW movies is lower these days ... i don't know
The fact that they don't tackle anything in the prequel trilogy in any of the movies and only relegates them to comic fair is a problem long term, the people who grew up in that era are adults with money now and they dont look down on the movies as the old fans do. It kinda shows how safe they made it
Rian Johnson's trilogy will be the big test. We're gonna see how audiences react to well made, big budget Star Wars movies that have nothing to do with the Skywalkers or the OT story.
That said, Obi Wan, Luke Skywalker, Darth Vader, Palpatine, 3P0, R2, Chewie, Yoda, Princess Leia and Han Solo are household names and not going anywhere. Ever. They're some of the most influential and iconic fictional characters ever and a huge part of the IPs appeal. There is room for entirely new Star Wars stories in addition to tales featuring your old favorites. Especially now that there's Disney+ subscriptions to sell...
SW moving to television for now is a good idea tho.
Because I am not really interested in the D&D trilogy.
Because I am not really interested in the D&D trilogy.
I'm not sure if it's fatigure so much as the reception to the films.
I liked TFA, thought TLJ and Solo were OK and I really thought Rogue One was meh, but at no point did I feel like "I've had too much Star Wars".
I think what the series really needs is a clean break away from the "saga". Rogue one is a direct link into A New Hope, Solo tries to tell the story of Han Solo (although, I still hate how they tried to basically make all his big achievements happen in like a week) and the two "Episodes" are obviously sequels.
There's a massive galaxy, tell me stories in it that don't need to link into existing parts of the lore.
I liked TFA, thought TLJ and Solo were OK and I really thought Rogue One was meh, but at no point did I feel like "I've had too much Star Wars".
I think what the series really needs is a clean break away from the "saga". Rogue one is a direct link into A New Hope, Solo tries to tell the story of Han Solo (although, I still hate how they tried to basically make all his big achievements happen in like a week) and the two "Episodes" are obviously sequels.
There's a massive galaxy, tell me stories in it that don't need to link into existing parts of the lore.
That's the issue. It's a huge universe and they insist on just giving us the same characters.
A Harrison Ford han solo movie might have worked. But a different actor? Nobody wanted that.
They took the entirely wrong lesson from this.
You might be right but Iger is also the man that banked on Mary Poppins Returns for the Christmas date and forced Solo to bomb in May instead of having a traditional Christmas release like Kathy Kennedy wanted.
He ain't perfect either.
I'd honestly be ok with this. The OT seriously needs modern action and VFX updates. I saw it for the first time in years back in July and yikes age has finally caught up to it.
In conclusion: The blame everything besides the story they were trying to tell/sell. Excuses.