Digital Foundry: Ray Tracing in Games: How Today's Big Tech Gamble Became Tomorrow's Sure Thing [Sponsored]

[Deleted member 11276]

People complaining about this being an ad... Seriously? DF were always amazed by Raytracing, way before this sponsored video. And when AMD has hw Raytracing, they will analyse that very well too, that has nothing to do with the vendor.

The thing with RTX is, that a lot, and I mean a lot of misinformation spread over the internet because RTX and especially DLSS had a very rough start and because most people are not staying up to date with tech, you still hear phrases like "DLSS? lol blurry crap, just play with lower resolution and sharpening" or "lol RTX 2060 can't even run Raytracing" or " I don't like everything to be a mirror in my games"

Because DF is interested and open minded about new technology, they put a stop to this by delivering facts. And yes, this is great marketing for Nvidia, but not because DF are "Nvidia shills" but rather because the facts speak for Nvidia and no one could explain that better than DF which is why Nvidia choose to support them by sponsoring the video.

 

[copelandmaster]

I see. Sorry, didn't click at all.

In general I think it is okay to be critical with sponsored content and reviews. It is, after all, some kind of paid advertisement. But accusing DF of blatantly forging screenshots, without even trying to give them the benefit of the doubt and checking yourself first is not good. I do not always agree with them and they made some mistakes before, but I'm still pretty sure that this kind of forgery is not something they'd even consider.

Is it a worst vs best kind of scenario, though? For sure. But that's fair enough if you want to make a point about something.

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Yep, I feel that's a reasonable take. I appreciate that you added more reasonable "3rd party" examples like i-Lo did in post #271

It was fine to be skeptical in 2017/2018. Heck, just days before Nvidia officially dropped their GTC 2018 bombs, I wasn't expecting denoiser tech to be worth anything. Having followed real time efforts casually for close to a decade at this point I'm over gaming community polarization with RT tech itself, especially now that consoles are joining in on the fun. Pricing is another argument, of course!

 

[Chettlar]

Era really can come off as a hive of ignorance and negativity.

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It's this weird like half familiar jaded viewpoint fleshed out and justified in pure ignorance and then used to then justify criticism of someone else who probably knows plenty more.

Doesn't help when occasionally you will have people who should know better say things that are obviously wrong in whatever other topic, making the waters really muddy (like seeing a thread where someone - a dev or journalist or someone - was trying to chastise another developer for calling out Warcraft 3 reforged for being shoddy, shameful work, when it is clear to literally everyone it most definitely is).

But yeah, the former is more prevalent I feel like.

 

[Rust]

.
So the word sponsored to me is another way of saying paid marketing. And I feel everyone indirectly believes it, but some are more guarded to it, or more receptive to it than others.

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That's not strictly true.

When Schick sponsored the Game Awards, the GOTY winner didn't necessarily have to have a protagonist with a clean jawline. The Subway FRESH! indie game winner wasn't about making footlongs. Sponsorship is about getting your brand out there to your target demographic, and associating with a common element.

Nvidia sponsoring DF makes sense considering their target audience. Hell, I'm surprised more computer companies haven't been knocking at their door for all the great work they do. They want to be associated with a quality product.

 

[dgrdsv]

Hopefully the RTX on next gen cards don't cost a 40% decrease in framerate.

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A. The cost of adding some graphical calculation is up to the developer since that's who's adding the calculation.
B. The cost of doing RT will always be high and 40% isn't even scratching the surface of how high it will be in the future.

 

[Sems4arsenal]

Well, in the video, Alex talks about games like BF and Control utilizing hybrid systems, aka, tweaking incumbent rasterization solution where applicable and inserting RT based solution when the traditional method fails or more importantly produces far less accurate results. The only two games that are purely ray traced, or rather, 'Path traced' atm are Quake 2 and Minecraft.

The holy grail is essentially having current or next gen assets in terms of polygon, texture and animation detail and simply turn on path tracing for everything. That would essentially render every other lighting processes completely irrelevant.

Insofar as the performance is concerned, again, as evidenced in the video, significant strides in gaining back performance have made in less than 2 years and that is with only a minuscule install base of HW that actually support this feature. Simply imagine what strides this iterative tech will go through once next gen systems both supporting RT and set to sell tens if not hundreds of millions of units between them over the next 7 or so years, are released.

And again, just like the video says, reconstruction techniques have been maturing at a stunning pace which when allied to upcoming variable/adaptive rate shading would claw back even more performance to offset whatever is lost to RT.

Lastly, it is vital to remember that console games will general run at either 30 or 60fps (excluding VRR) which are set performance thresholds that presumably allows for a certain amount latitude for developers.

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An actual informative post. Thanks for that.

I by no means am downplaying it, I'm just not seeing the reason to implement it giving the performance cost. I've seen Gran turismo Sport running with RT and it made a big improvement with reflections. However, if the next GT will run at 1440P without RT or 1080P with RT on -- I'd still prefer the former.

 

[Deleted member 20297]

Well, in the video, Alex talks about games like BF and Control utilizing hybrid systems, aka, tweaking incumbent rasterization solution where applicable and inserting RT based solution when the traditional method fails or more importantly produces far less accurate results. The only two games that are purely ray traced, or rather, 'Path traced' atm are Quake 2 and Minecraft.

The holy grail is essentially having current or next gen assets in terms of polygon, texture and animation detail and simply turn on path tracing for everything. That would essentially render every other lighting processes completely irrelevant.

Insofar as the performance is concerned, again, as evidenced in the video, significant strides in gaining back performance have made in less than 2 years and that is with only a minuscule install base of HW that actually support this feature. Simply imagine what strides this iterative tech will go through once next gen systems both supporting RT and set to sell tens if not hundreds of millions of units between them over the next 7 or so years, are released.

And again, just like the video says, reconstruction techniques have been maturing at a stunning pace which when allied to upcoming variable/adaptive rate shading would claw back even more performance to offset whatever is lost to RT.

Lastly, it is vital to remember that console games will general run at either 30 or 60fps (excluding VRR) which are set performance thresholds that presumably allows for a certain amount latitude for developers.

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I really feel that the general topic of image quality will be a huge topic next gen but not because of resolution like this gen but because of all the things that happened with cbr, taa, dlss and the likes, even real time ai upscaling old games is on the table nowadays. And of course ray tracing is also a huge part of that discussion as lighting is a huge part of perceptive image quality.
I also wonder how vrs will fit into the discussion as this makes the image intentionally worse to save GPU resources which somehow goes against the image quality improvements I mentioned before

 

[GTAce]

People here discuss meaningless sponsorship. In the meantime I bath in the sexyness that is RT.
This shit is like the holy grail of 3D rendering and I still remember those old tech demos, which were just a huge bunch of noise everytime the camera moved.

 

[medyej]

The same reason they twist their brains until 30fps is good enough. Because the console makers haven't handed it to them yet.

When only PC gamers have it, it's the same song and dance as always: "Meh."

RT will be a revolution when Microsoft and Sony say it is.

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No lies detected. It's sad how predictable it is when new technology gets thought of as inconsequential until the consoles get it when it's suddenly a must have. Can't wait to see it happen again with Cerny's magic SSDs.

Indeed seeing master race nonsense from a mod is quite disappointing.

60fps is better than 30fps, sure. But ultimately a huge portion of the best games of the generation were 30fps.

It's not as important as the master race people will have you believe. A great game will still be great even if it's at 900p, 30FPS and has no RT. Just look at BoTW.

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Once again the only people bringing out 'master race' bullshit are not actual PC gamers. How exactly is what they said anything close to master race talk anyway?

 

[Nola]

The thing is though there isn't resistance to RT, people twist people not thinking RT is some real time game graphics revolution into "resisting RT"
RT in games like control is undoubtedly better looking, but so are other visuals settings.
Some ppl act like RT is a next gen leap, it's not even close to uncharted 3 to uncharted 4.

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Proof of concept that given a platform people can and will just say shit.

What single graphical feature is of greater importance Or capable of greater visual impact going into next gen?The fact you left off that part leads me to believe you don't really have an answer.

Ray tracing has been a holy grail of graphical design for decades. It is a game changer. The fact that so far no game has even fully implemented it from the ground up and in combination with the right complimentary features(Control lacking HDR) and the results are this amazing speaks to it.

Also, trying to compare a wholistic upgrade like a gen leap to one graphical feature is absurd. If the argument is that the resources are better spent on other graphical features that will produce a better overall picture, the burden of proof is on you.

The thing is though devs will arrive at other barriers which will limit environmental interactivity.
Your premise that without RT devs can't make progress in environmental interactivity is just false.

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'His point was that it can and does artistically limits developers, And it is easy to see how and why it does.

Developers and experts: yeah, this is a game changer

Random contrarian poster: nah.....argues in circles for 5 pages.

 

[Tokyo_Funk]

Can't play Metro Exodus without Ray-Tracing on, everything just pops and fits in the scene better than with normal rasterization. Some of the most natural lighting I have ever seen in a video game.

 

[Fezan]

Nice video but I am still not convinced by Real time ready tracing. The cost is to high and rays are limited or used in a limited manner to be actually make much difference besides reflections.

Also why does it appears come to console Vs PC thing. I mostly game on pc now a days and have a 144hz screen but for some high end games I mostly play at 60fps or even 30fps.

Not every one has a 2080ti

 

[Nola]

Nice video but I am still not convinced by Real time ready tracing. The cost is to high and rays are limited or used in a limited manner to be actually make much difference besides reflections.

Also why does it appears come to console Vs PC thing. I mostly game on pc now a days and have a 144hz screen but for some high end games I mostly play at 60fps or even 30fps.

Not every one has a 2080ti

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I am not sure how one can look at the Quake, Minecraft, and Control examples and come away with this absurd "it doesn't do much but reflections" take.

 

[z1ggy]

A short video of mine, Quake II RTX reflections and lighting...game looks crazy good



DLSS is needed for every RTX game tho.

 

[JahIthBer]

I am not sure how one can look at the Quake, Minecraft, and Control examples and come away with this absurd "it doesn't do much but reflections" take.

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Needs more support for people to take it more serious, it's disappointing Doom Eternal is probably cutting it.
I think some of the hate is sour grapes though, when AMD fans praise a sharpening filter but say RTX is a gimmick, like cmon.

 

[EvilBoris]

Nice video but I am still not convinced by Real time ready tracing. The cost is to high and rays are limited or used in a limited manner to be actually make much difference besides reflections.

Also why does it appears come to console Vs PC thing. I mostly game on pc now a days and have a 144hz screen but for some high end games I mostly play at 60fps or even 30fps.

Not every one has a 2080ti

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Did you actually watch the video?
Alex showed a load of examples of lighting and shadows changing with various RT techniques

 

[Nola]

Needs more support for people to take it more serious, it's disappointing Doom Eternal is probably cutting it.
I think some of the hate is sour grapes though, when AMD fans praise a sharpening filter but say RTX is a gimmick, like cmon.

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What????

I thought it was just a delayed feature?

 

[Eggiem]

Needs more support for people to take it more serious, it's disappointing Doom Eternal is probably cutting it.
I think some of the hate is sour grapes though, when AMD fans praise a sharpening filter but say RTX is a gimmick, like cmon.

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Control and Metro had beautiful RTX effects at launch and I thought that would be the standard by now. "We will patch it in sometime later!" is worth nothing when most hardcore players (the ones who can afford a RTX GPU) beat the game in the launch week.

It took them over half a year to patch Wolfenstein Youngblood. Nobody talks about this game anymore.

 

[Riflen]

Developers and artists have had years of experience with traditional techniques. They can draw on a huge pool of recorded knowledge about how to achieve the best results they can. They've learned to work with the limitations and how to design around the problems. Frequently, this means pairing back their ambitions in some fashion. There's a lot of effort expended into making sure the player doesn't slam into the restrictions too much.
They've not even had 2 years with DXR and Vulkan ray tracing at this point. Not to mention that this technology requires that the developers use DirectX 12 or Vulkan, which they may not yet have much experience with.

As to the question whether Nvidia released this hardware too soon; I say they didn't. There's no way to get game developers and API maintainers using the technology, exposing the bugs and thinking about what's possible without making the hardware and software and getting it out there. Performance is also about to take a huge leap with new silicon arriving this year.

Good luck getting close to this sort of interactivity, accuracy and performance without this hardware support.




Even as someone who plays games rather than develops them, it shouldn't take that much imagination to look closely at these scenes and see the potential. Think what can be done with physically simulated light and shadow. Characters can be truly concealed in darkness. A player can interact with the entire game world in a way that was completely impossible before. Some of the larger developers with access to good talent and a lot of time and money will have devised some pretty neat approximations, but they all break down when objects and light interact. Either that or the game is designed such that there is no way for the player to alter the lighting conditions themselves. Besides, those solutions are probably tracing rays anyway, albeit a low number and in limited fashion.

 

[KainXVIII]

A short video of mine, Quake II RTX reflections and lighting...game looks crazy good



DLSS is needed for every RTX game tho.

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Looks good but original atmosphere ruined completely..

 

[Dictator]

Looks good but original atmosphere ruined completely..

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I have written this here on ResetERA before pretty often, but you can just use the games original environmental map and turn down the "brightness" and it basically just looks like quake 2, but just with path tracing. Basic research about Quake II RTX or even watching any videos showing it off talk about how the light is adjusted to your liking.

Most of Quake 2 RTX footage in the video in the OP I made actually was made in that way. Same environmental box, turned down light intensity, just path traced.

Heck, if you wanted you could turn down light brightness even more so you can see nothing, much like OG quake 2.

 

[InaudibleWhisper]

I think one of the key points things about ray tracing is that fully path traced RT, as seen in Minecraft, is the holy grail because it eerily makes a scene look real, even when the textures and assets fall below the standards of reality. Minecraft is the perfect example because of how abstract it is, and people have been adding pretty lighting for years with shaders, but when you play with path tracing (which you can now with SEUS) it's almost magical. I'm not observant enough to tell you where traditional shader lighting tricks were failing, and what path tracing is adding or the mistakes it's removing (other than the obvious additions like reflections), but the brain just taking the information in as correct, and not subconciously noticing all of the ways the scene doesn't match reality, as it has with every other lighting trick, is a revelation.

 

[Nola]

I think one of the key points things about ray tracing is that fully path traced RT, as seen in Minecraft, is the holy grail because it eerily makes a scene look real, even when the textures and assets fall below the standards of reality. Minecraft is the perfect example because of how abstract it is, and people have been adding pretty lighting for years with shaders, but when you play with path tracing (which you can now with SEUS) it's almost magical. I'm not observant enough to tell you where traditional shader lighting tricks were failing, and what path tracing is adding or the mistakes it's removing (other than the obvious additions like reflections), but the brain just taking the information in as correct, and not subconciously noticing all of the ways the scene doesn't match reality, as it has with every other lighting trick, is a revelation.

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The video points this out and it really does highlight one of the bigger reasons I think this is such great game changing tech, especially once it has its time to mature, like the host and you point out, it just 'feels' more real. Likely because it is a much closer approximation than even the best baked lighting does at replicating the way light interacts in the real world.

 

[Isee]

Btw, Wolfenstein Youngblood is now on PC Game Pass. Just tried out the DLSS in there... mighty impressive imo.
That stuff is ageing like fine wine. Wish it would have been that good when the tech released.

 

[jett]

Alright, so what is it that you miss? What do you want to see that is no longer done? Can you select some examples?

I can't believe how much this bothers me. It really shouldn't. Maybe I should try to analyze why that is. I genuinely feel sick to my stomach re-reading that post. I really need help in dealing with critique, I think. I'm not well suited to handle it.

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That's just an asshole, man. There are so many of those around here. Don't pay them any attention.

 

[zedox]

Can't wait to get some time to use some raytracing on 2D/3D games so I don't have to worry about faking lighting and shadows and just let "light" do it for me. So much wasted time.

 

[Fezan]

I am not sure how one can look at the Quake, Minecraft, and Control examples and come away with this absurd "it doesn't do much but reflections" take.

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Did you actually watch the video?
Alex showed a load of examples of lighting and shadows changing with various RT techniques

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I meant it doesn't do much in terms of realism. The same effect can be achieved some what similarly with Tirunelveli methods.

It is much better than baked lightning but still not realistic enough to get performance plenty. This is what I want to say. I am glad the tech is started to appear but we still have long ways to go. I think generation after next we will properly see the benefits when much more rays and bounce rays can be calculated

 

[KillLaCam]

Metro Exodus sold me on Ray tracing. Ray traced global illumination is such a huge difference (in outside areas)

 

[Jobbs]

It doesn't matter if you guys comprehend ray tracing or have the opinion that's "good" or not. It's factually the future of game rendering. It doesn't matter how ignorant you are of it or whether nvidia sponsored a video or not.

 

[KainXVIII]

I have written this here on ResetERA before pretty often, but you can just use the games original environmental map and turn down the "brightness" and it basically just looks like quake 2, but just with path tracing. Basic research about Quake II RTX or even watching any videos showing it off talk about how the light is adjusted to your liking.

Most of Quake 2 RTX footage in the video in the OP I made actually was made in that way. Same environmental box, turned down light intensity, just path traced.

Heck, if you wanted you could turn down light brightness even more so you can see nothing, much like OG quake 2.

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I was commenting particular gif, even i know about about adjustable lighting condition in Q2 RTX.

 

[WRC]

Hey Dark1x I think you need to stay away and relax for a while for your mental health, that said, keep up your good work and passion! love you and DF team. Thank you for all the content now and in the future.

 

[Anthony Hopkins]

I never said it was the only thing preventing it, but it's a certainly a big reason. Watch any video about baked light maps in games, the major limitation is that it prevents items being moved from their location. I've worked with Unreal a fair bit, once you move something in your scene all the lighting has to be rebaked. You can't be moving or destroying objects in the scene if light maps have been baked for those objects. I'm not making anything up.

Here's a good presentation about game lighting if you want to educate yourself on the subject. I've timestamped it at a relevant location:

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While Ray tracing will make it easier for devs to have more movable objects in a game, this does not change game design as much as the move from 2d to 3d because 3 dimensions opened up possibilities which just were not possible in 2d. This is not the case with your example, while RT may make it easier for devs there are other paths to create more interactive environments in games.

 

[Buff Beefbroth]

That's just an asshole, man. There are so many of those around here. Don't pay them any attention.

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Seriously, this thread got me wondering where the mods are.

 

[Iron Eddie]

Nice video but I am still not convinced by Real time ready tracing. The cost is to high and rays are limited or used in a limited manner to be actually make much difference besides reflections.

Also why does it appears come to console Vs PC thing. I mostly game on pc now a days and have a 144hz screen but for some high end games I mostly play at 60fps or even 30fps.

Not every one has a 2080ti

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They showed vast improvements in games like Battlefield with updates. With the implementation coming to consoles we will get more games that use it and on the PC side better technology soon (1-2 years) that won't require $1,200 cards to have a decent experience.

 

[Anthony Hopkins]

Proof of concept that given a platform people can and will just say shit.

What single graphical feature is of greater importance Or capable of greater visual impact going into next gen?The fact you left off that part leads me to believe you don't really have an answer.

Ray tracing has been a holy grail of graphical design for decades. It is a game changer. The fact that so far no game has even fully implemented it from the ground up and in combination with the right complimentary features(Control lacking HDR) and the results are this amazing speaks to it.

Also, trying to compare a wholistic upgrade like a gen leap to one graphical feature is absurd. If the argument is that the resources are better spent on other graphical features that will produce a better overall picture, the burden of proof is on you.


'His point was that it can and does artistically limits developers, And it is easy to see how and why it does.

Developers and experts: yeah, this is a game changer

Random contrarian poster: nah.....argues in circles for 5 pages.

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If all I do is argue in circles why even engage with me?

 

[Shocchiz]

I think this is the best comparison yet. Good job Alex :)

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Wasn't mine better? :'-(



https://www.resetera.com/threads/control for -pc-ray-tracings-killer-app-plus-full-xbox-one-x-vs-pc-comparison-digital-foundry.138176/page-3#post-24072481

Also, I made ton's of comparisons for SOTR

https://www.resetera.com/threads/sh...-shadows-and-dlss.106234/page-5#post-19195881

That said, can't wait enough for real time RT future to happen.

 

[GhostofWar]

Factual reporting does not care for the way a viewer perceives a product, they just want all or most of the facts to be known. EG: PS4 Pro and Xbox One X still had garbage Jag CPUs, were heavily bottlenecked, and games were never going to truly take advantage of the One X and Pro. Imagine if Richard mentioned that in a sponsored article like the one he was asked to cover and unveil the Xbox one X from MS HQ

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How did neither of those consoles never fully use the gpu when they most of the time had to upscale to 4k because the gpu was maxxed?? They were both sold as 4k consoles but now you want richard to say hey the x1x can't use it's gpu to the full extent cause of the cpu (which is wrong), yet I never saw any ps4 pro coverage say that either? You want him to say something that's factually incorrect so you can get the unbiased "facts"?

 

[Dennis8K]

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When Minecraft looks like this and is playable my time to play Minecraft has come.

By the way, an open-world immersive sim walking simulator RPG that looks like this is my dream game.

 

[zedox]

While Ray tracing will make it easier for devs to have more movable objects in a game, this does not change game design as much as the move from 2d to 3d because 3 dimensions opened up possibilities which just were not possible in 2d. This is not the case with your example, while RT may make it easier for devs there are other paths to create more interactive environments in games.

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Though I'm not going to argue with the 2D/3D vs. Raytracing. I will say that when we get raytracing everywhere...it basically allows (given cpu resources for physics) for everything in a game world to technically be moveable. If that is possible, then you have to design a game in which the physics of objects are taken into account so as to not get in a bad game state (ie blocking a path in which you need to advance). There's a lot of variables that needs to be taken into account in how one is designing a game just based off of that premise...which is something that is done now but when you get to the point where everything is moveable because you don't have to worry about baked lighting...it's something to keep in mind much more. Obviously you can force certain items to not move... That's just moving objects...

Then you have (as Cerny as others here stated) raytracing with sound...now how enemies can hear you based off of the physics of objects you interact with more realistically, it has a certain "ask" of a player depending on how the designer designed it. It's just more variables that designers have to worry about the more realistic the game world gets...as the real world has a shitload of variability.

 

[Anthony Hopkins]

Though I'm not going to argue with the 2D/3D vs. Raytracing. I will say that when we get raytracing everywhere...it basically allows (given cpu resources for physics) for everything in a game world to technically be moveable. If that is possible, then you have to design a game in which the physics of objects are taken into account so as to not get in a bad game state (ie blocking a path in which you need to advance). There's a lot of variables that needs to be taken into account in how one is designing a game just based off of that premise...which is something that is done now but when you get to the point where everything is moveable because you don't have to worry about baked lighting...it's something to keep in mind much more. Obviously you can force certain items to not move... That's just moving objects...

Then you have (as Cerny as others here stated) raytracing with sound...now how enemies can hear you based off of the physics of objects you interact with more realistically, it has a certain "ask" of a player depending on how the designer designed it. It's just more variables that designers have to worry about the more realistic the game world gets...as the real world has a shitload of variability.

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Yes I never disagreed with this.
I never knew RT fanatics were so dam defensive and petty, will stay clear of this topic in the future.
If these RT fanatics would just relax and not jump to such defensive conclusions they would realise that all I'm saying is that RT in games like control is a nice but small evolution in visuals, but the difference in RT visuals will be more significant as the hardware gets more capable.

Some ppl here have this caveman like mentality where if Somone says something other then absolute praise for RT they are like "attack attack attack" it's so dam pathetic and sad when you consider that we actually agree.

I mean isn't it pretty much a concenses that RT in games is a nice evolution today but will be a bigger deal as hardware gets more capable?

 

[plagiarize]

Btw, Wolfenstein Youngblood is now on PC Game Pass. Just tried out the DLSS in there... mighty impressive imo.
That stuff is ageing like fine wine. Wish it would have been that good when the tech released.

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Oh I had no idea this was on gamepass. Will check it, because that DLSS implementation looked like a step up over the good stuff Control had.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

Some ppl act like RT is a next gen leap, it's not even close to uncharted 3 to uncharted 4.

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Normal Minecraft looks like shit dude. We're comparing it to games where they put effort in the faked lighting. That RT can transform butt ugly games is great news for ... a handful of titles.

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it's almost like some of you people genuinely can't tell the difference between technology and production value.

 

[KKRT]

Wasn't mine better? :'-(

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Havent been in this thread, sorry :)

 

[amc]

Once RT becomes a console feature next gen we are going to see a lot more tricks and wizardry being introduced into tools and routines. That, along with the head start the PC space has brought into play is going to make performance penalties much less harsh as the knowledge spreads and matures. Just look at the gains we are seeing in games from their RT launch to today. Nice big chunks of performance improvements thanks to more hands on time with the tech.

Yes we will probably see a good few frame rate killers, or inconsequential implementations of seeing ones face in the mirror but just imagine when people over at Guerrilla, Polyphony, Turn 10 et al hit their stride. Plus like I say the devs already hands on in the PC space. These guys don't mess around and I don't think we'll see too many frame gimped games from them once they get stuck in.

It's going to be eye watering,

 

[Edgar]

Yes I never disagreed with this.
I never knew RT fanatics were so dam defensive and petty, will stay clear of this topic in the future.
If these RT fanatics would just relax and not jump to such defensive conclusions they would realise that all I'm saying is that RT in games like control is a nice but small evolution in visuals, but the difference in RT visuals will be more significant as the hardware gets more capable.

Some ppl here have this caveman like mentality where if Somone says something other then absolute praise for RT they are like "attack attack attack" it's so dam pathetic and sad when you consider that we actually agree.

I mean isn't it pretty much a concenses that RT in games is a nice evolution today but will be a bigger deal as hardware gets more capable?

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are you being serious right now , with post like this?

 

[RoninStrife]

How did neither of those consoles never fully use the gpu when they most of the time had to upscale to 4k because the gpu was maxxed?? They were both sold as 4k consoles but now you want richard to say hey the x1x can't use it's gpu to the full extent cause of the cpu (which is wrong), yet I never saw any ps4 pro coverage say that either? You want him to say something that's factually incorrect so you can get the unbiased "facts"?

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My goodness.. :/

 

[Anthony Hopkins]

are you being serious right now , with post like this?

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Have you read the thread...

 

[ILikeFeet]

You know, the best part about RT is thar the naysayers will just have to accept it when next gen consoles get here. You can't stop progress

 

[Dennis8K]

You know, the best part about RT is that it is all about the mathematics of light.

You can't beat the PHYSICS OF REALITY for realism.

 

[Jiraiya]

You know, the best part about RT is thar the naysayers will just have to accept it when next gen consoles get here. You can't stop progress

Click to shrink...

The fact It's hardware based has and will probably remain my favorite part about new gen hardware.