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Do you think the demo is impressive?

  • Yes

    Votes: 2,855 92.0%
  • No

    Votes: 247 8.0%

  • Total voters
    3,102

Nacery

Member
Jul 11, 2018
1,475
Yeah some people should tame their expectations of what is to come regarding games. A lot of them started their development in UE4 (Hellblade 2) or using their in-house engine (Sony) and UE5 still isn't production ready so don't expect games running it coming alongside PS5 and XSX released.
 
Jan 2, 2018
2,027
At the end,this is a 3rd party engine with heavy focus on scalability- now just imagine what ND,Insomniac, SSM etc can do with their engines..holy shit.
 

riotous

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,320
Seattle
Yeah is like saying last of us 2 cutscenes is how the whole game looks. People need to stop taking things at face value
An engine demo also lacks tons of running game systems, AI, etc. It's really not that different from an in-engine cut-scene.

TLOU2 cut scenes are just the game running w/o all of those things as well... just pre-recorded vs. dynamic. But if you turned off all the game systems TLOU2 could look like it's own cut scenes.
 

mordecaii83

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
6,855
For the purposes of the demo I'll take your (and others) word for it, but I'm still skeptical as to how most third party games will use the SSD to eliminate those mask-loading techniques (and not just for the first two years of the new consoles where there's a lot of cross-gen). I'm really hoping I'm wrong.
Not every "squeeze through a tight space" is masking loading, some devs will still use it where appropriate for other reasons (hopefully it will be vastly reduced and not appear in games it didn't need to like FFVIIR).
 

Windows-PC

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
434
No doubt about it. Was a pretty enclosed demo. Even the end flying scene just just flying straight to a target. Just an engine trailer shown on a PS5, not an engine trailer that is only possible on PS5.

Thanks :) Do you also know the difference between real-time demo and in-engine demo? Or do you know a good video which explains that?
 

ABIC

Banned
Nov 19, 2017
1,170
Because both are projected to run on XSX, theoretically, with the Hellblade 2 in-game trailer going beyond U5 demo with facial animations. Gives as a starting point to discuss expectations. If we were to speak solely on the merits of gameplay, the U5 demo is fairly simplistic and would largely be considered a disappointment tbh. Demo was beautiful there's no mistaking that.

Because UE demos are about gameplay.. right

Can we all stop polluting this thread with Xbox stuff?

Both systems are going to run multi-platform games similarly.

There's no denying this UE5 demo, structured to feel like gameplay with player control, feels more impressive because it's an interactive piece, not a visual piece
 

Plum

Member
May 31, 2018
17,271
The issue is you framed it in a way that suggests this is going to have some type of long lasting "ripple" affect on how these consoles are perceived. Which is, of course, a ridiculous assertion.

Why? Unless you're projecting onto that statement and thinking I was saying "The Xbox is doomed!" that is perhaps one of the least controversial things things one can say in marketing analysis.
 

Dark1x

Digital Foundry
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
3,530
For the purposes of the demo I'll take your (and others) word for it, but I'm still skeptical as to how most third party games will use the SSD to eliminate those mask-loading techniques (and not just for the first two years of the new consoles where there's a lot of cross-gen). I'm really hoping I'm wrong.
The thing is - in current gen games, those sections ARE NOT always used to hide loading. Of that I can assure you directly.

In some cases, yes (FF7R), but that game has a lot of data streaming issues across the board. People lump this and 'slow walking' in together - these are often used for atmosphere building and/or narrative purposes.
 

Shogmaster

Banned
Dec 12, 2017
2,598
I'm curious to see it on the XSX. One of the developers pointed out how PS5's SSD is helping stream all this detail (with no bottleneck in I/O because of the PS5 tech). And the PS5 has an additional 3GB per second because of the custom SSD, over XSX.
I'm curious how much BC pack will make up the difference. Supposedly MS just started to share BC pack details with key devs recently. Still won't talk about it publicly.
 

Twenty7kvn

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,749
It's not hate, but they decided to show off games on Series X and none of them made people sit up and exclaim "Wow, now THAT is next gen!"

Most were disappointed and felt like they didn't see anything that couldn't be done on consoles already.

Even digital foundry's video on Inside Xbox was titled "Is this next gen?"

The same digital foundry labelled this tech demo "This is next gen"
To be fair neither did Sony, yea the Xbox event was bad and this was good move by Sony to get buzz. But no real game was shown and we probably won't see any on this engine for a minute, so who knows what we'll get and the full Sony reveal.
 

xem

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,043
looks incredible. I just pray the devs give us Modes in games. Performance/graphics. Really want the option that was given to us in a lot of 1X and Pro games to get 60fps if we so chose. pretty pretty please with a cherry on top!
 

riotous

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,320
Seattle
How will the LOD improvements affect game sizes? I presume direct LOD models pile up in memory, so several assets in different quality levels saved in storage? If that's the case then surely this could help improve storage, or at least mitigate the fact this allows much higher quality assets, because now you will only need that one asset and not 5 progressively lower quality version as well..?

Sounds amazing anyway! No more pop in!
Yeah I feel like people are ignoring this.

I wondered earlier in the thread if DF knows the file size of this ~5 minute demo area.

Dark1x?
 

T0kenAussie

Member
Jan 15, 2020
5,089
Obviously, but we should be allowed to discuss the present and their current messaging - not just hold out for whatever they might do in the future. Let's discuss, this is fun after all!
Tbh I think the showcase was fine, the PR man behind the Twitter accounts needs a demotion though because their hyperbolic hype ruined some games first time to be in the spotlight.

overall this just makes me wonder what if no covid. Would we have seen this at GDC maybe? Also this shotgun marketing strategy of everyone owning a day is becoming tiring already and we haven't seen a box yet or any pricing reveal info. At least with e3 we would have a touchstone to fall back on. Also the hot takes this gen switch are spectacular
 

DoradoWinston

Member
Apr 9, 2019
6,106
damn an engine (which will be used on both Xbox and Playstation) reveal made era go full on gamefaqs lol

fanboys chill
 

Karak

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,088
The thing is - in current gen games, those sections ARE NOT always used to hide loading. Of that I can assure you directly.

In some cases, yes (FF7R), but that game has a lot of data streaming issues across the board. People lump this and 'slow walking' in together - these are often used for atmosphere building and/or narrative purposes.
Exactly and this bears repeating so many times.
 

Sho_Nuff82

Member
Nov 14, 2017
18,410
The next gen exclusive titles they showed at their third party showcase didn't look next gen at all, hence a lot of people's disappointment with the event.

And like I said before, if you'd told me all the games at Inside Xbox were cross gen I'd believe you, nothing looked next gen worthy.

This tech demo, even if actual games are years away from looking like this, felt and looked next generational, it's got me excited finally.

I don't understand some of the train of logic here given all that we know. Not just aimed at you, mind.

"Hellblade 2 wasn't a game, it's a realtime cutscene and not indicative of how Series X games will look at all."
"This tech demo isn't a game, but this vertical slice is totally indicative of how all next gen UE games will look on PS5."

Hellblade 2 runs on Unreal Engine. Epic advertised it on their social media after the Game Awards. Hellblade 2 is next gen exclusive. Hellblade 2 is published by MS. Hellblade 2 will actually come out.

"MS has not and will not show any games with graphical features like this" requires...imagination, to say the least.
 

Egida

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,378
Lmao so much salt.
Anyway, I see this being the Agni's philosophy to Tomb Raider in the future.
 

riotous

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,320
Seattle
Sure, but with twice the GPU and 4X the CPU throughput, it would be far more the norm than current gen by logic. But I guess that only depends if you use current gen engines...
It will be like other gens..

Everyone demands top resolution and top framerate (this gen that's 4k60)

Some games will achieve this... they'll be called ugly.

The games that dip res and framerate will be the one's praised for the graphics... and the 4k60 devs will be called lazy.

And the world goes on.. to live for another generation of people not understanding sacrifices lol
 

MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
Looks great. The best part was the lighting, and the high detail without lod changes. I knew they were going to open it up at the end, it would be a great way to show that the detail doesn't drop when you get to a bigger map.

This is great detail, and some say "real games won't match it for a while," but I'm not so sure about that. The PS4 UE4 tech demo was surpassed quickly. In fact, I think early gen PS4 games from first party already looked better. Killzone, Second Son, etc. surpassed that quickly. It will all depend on what the first party studios are doing and if they can launch some games early on. That's when we will see this fidelity, and beyond it.
 
Nov 2, 2017
2,275
At the end,this is a 3rd party engine with heavy focus on scalability- now just imagine what ND,Insomniac, SSM etc can do with their engines..holy shit.
I don't think the best looking UE4 games like Gears 5 or Days Gone much if any worse than ND, SSM, Insomniac games.
It will be only common for those sticking to current gen engines without RT I fear. Next gen engines or heavy in RT will target 1440/30 or some similar performance is my guess.
Does this demo use RT? Dictator gave some vague comment but never clarrified in the other thread. Probably under NDA?
 

Pancracio17

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
18,694
How will the LOD improvements affect game sizes? I presume direct LOD models pile up in memory, so several assets in different quality levels saved in storage? If that's the case then surely this could help improve storage, or at least mitigate the fact this allows much higher quality assets, because now you will only need that one asset and not 5 progressively lower quality version as well..?

Sounds amazing anyway! No more pop in!
... good point. How big is an open world game with film quality assets going to be? A full terabyte?
 

btags

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,078
Gaithersburg MD
The actual gameplay here was nothing special, but I don't really care about that, the important thing was that it was one extended cut of actual gameplay rather than a bunch of hastily cut shots. This is what I would have liked to have seen from Microsoft's showcase, even if the games didn't look as good as this. There is something so much more exciting about seeing something being played, even if the gameplay is nothing special, than seeing a trailer. It gives you a much better idea of what the console or game or whatever actually offers.
 

Canucked

Comics Council 2020 & Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,414
Canada
For what? It looks like a bad Uncharted/Tomb Raider deal. There is nothing remotely inspiring or novel about it. You will get plenty of games better than this.

Don't get too hung up on what I like 'cause I'm not gonna explain it to you. If you don't have fun watching things likes this, that's too bad for you.
 

Shogmaster

Banned
Dec 12, 2017
2,598
I don't think the best looking UE4 games like Gears 5 or Days Gone much if any worse than ND, SSM, Insomniac games.

Does this demo actually use RT though? Dictator gave some vague comment but never clarrified in the other thread. Probably under NDA?
It doesn't AFAWK, but that's why I put "or" instead of "and"...
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
Why? Unless you're projecting onto that statement and thinking I was saying "The Xbox is doomed!" that is perhaps one of the least controversial things things one can say in marketing analysis.
Saying that Sony putting their logo on a 3rd party graphics engine demo creates a long term rippling negative effect on the perception of the Xbox Series X is pretty controversial. And asinine.
 

DarthBuzzard

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
5,122
The problem is that VR needs at least 60FPS so we'll have to temper our expectations.

But yeah, I'm also excited for next gen VR.
Temper expectations at the start. However once foveated rendering is perfected, you'll see VR pushing graphics further than any other area of gaming. I can imagine an Unreal 5 VR game in 2026 being unbelievably profound in fidelity. Even just visiting that setpiece with the 500 statues would be a very real experience.
 

Segafreak

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,756
Sony is back in pole position with this, a PS5 trailer with the newest graphics, this will keep people talking until what is shown next. Their attempt at spreading out next gen hype has so far been way more effective than that fiasco of the Xbox Direct, which they marketed as "THIS IS POWER, THIS IS SPEED".

MS needed something like this, something that clearly shows the power of the Series X.

What's with these 'but hellblade 2 though' comments?

Why so insecure?

For real, it was just a cinematic, basically the Uncharted 4 first trailer. It also wasn't even impressive as far as cinematics go, sure end product will look great but I don't think it was a good trailer to show off.
 

Flandy

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,445
Haven't watched the video yet but is there any word on if VR support will continue into the new engine?
 

The Gold Hawk

Member
Jan 30, 2019
4,515
Yorkshire
It looked nice, but not that mind blowing honestly.

They really should have gone for more colour and vibrance. Show me some mad colours and the like, that stuff actually pops rather than "look how extra gritty we can make our gritty world"