ALL Osamu Tezuka manga books have warnings of content in them. Issued by Tezuka Productions themselves. It's possible.
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
Digital Foundry - Ion Fury - Every Console Tested - How An Ancient Engine Stresses Current-Gen CPUs
- Thread starter Geobros
- Start date
- Status
Oh, yes, people wanting to address bigotry is the industry and just asking for a big relevant channel to just put a "hey, we don't agree with their views" is the same as nazis.
The issue with this has never been just that "joke". That is just a common line of discussion to try to downplay what happened. It's that the developers used the platform and audience gained by their game to promote transphobic and hateful bigoted messages. There is also a slur within the game itself, and then the developers hiding behind the censorship argument, when combating and removing bigotry that doesn't change the message of the art isn't censorship.
You're right that they would have gotten a lot of bullshit from trolls and harassers, and that is something to consider both for John and DF, but being an ally to LGBTQ+ and marginalized folks is the right thing to do, though it can take courage.
It is perfectly reasonable that people have been making the arguments that they have, and requesting something as simple as a disclaimer. It's actually quite standard ("The views expressed by..."). Now it may not be John, or even DF's choice, but that doesn't invalidate the argument, nor free DF from criticism from promoting said content.
I think its a slight concern when someone steps away from a video game forum for the purpose of their mental health, that implies a large issue, maybe this was not the thread to highlight that, though.
Thank you for taking the energy to spell that out.
I see reductive and/or misguided reactions to this kind of topic often enough that I'm inclined to assume the worst re: motivations, and I always need to remind myself that stating things plainly is the best response.
it's easy to be an ally for the oppressed when you can stay safe from it all and watch from the sidelines. It gets a lot harder when it affects your life personally. It's a real tough thing to deal with mentally as well. Would adding a disclaimer be the right thing? In my opinion, yes. Would it be worth all of the pushback from the alt-right crowd? That's a lot tougher to answer and it depends on each person individually. Some people cope with certain things better than than others.
I understand that people reaction to his job affected John, even if it wasn't direct attacks, I can see how it might soured him.
But I also understand why people have demanded that disclaimer, why people in the LGBTQ+ community wnats more level of compromise from the games media, specially after the actions of these devs.
Maybe John can't do it or maybe he dosn't want to or maybe Eurogamer dosn't want it, in the end most gaming places wouldn't have done it either, when Vavra next game gets announced, it will get full previews on most places with no disclaimers or something. And he's basically a Nazi.
That dosn't mean the forum shouldn't get less political, that people, especially in the communities more affected by the bigotry that is still constantly present in the industry, shouldn't have a place to protest, to demand representation, to demand more compromise from the industry as a whole and point fingers at whatever issues games might have.
If John can't reconcile his job and passion with the political nature of this forum, the best he can do is what he did. Is for the better.
But I also understand why people have demanded that disclaimer, why people in the LGBTQ+ community wnats more level of compromise from the games media, specially after the actions of these devs.
Maybe John can't do it or maybe he dosn't want to or maybe Eurogamer dosn't want it, in the end most gaming places wouldn't have done it either, when Vavra next game gets announced, it will get full previews on most places with no disclaimers or something. And he's basically a Nazi.
That dosn't mean the forum shouldn't get less political, that people, especially in the communities more affected by the bigotry that is still constantly present in the industry, shouldn't have a place to protest, to demand representation, to demand more compromise from the industry as a whole and point fingers at whatever issues games might have.
If John can't reconcile his job and passion with the political nature of this forum, the best he can do is what he did. Is for the better.
But it isn't, it's coming down hard on someone just trying to do an analysis on a game that they're passionate about, in which even posting a simple disclaimer would result in a barrage of abuse. John as well as other DF staff have already posted about the pressure they're under, along with the abuse they get on a daily basis. I know, and I sure hope that almost everyone else knows, that neither John nor DF support any sort of homophobic slurs; if anything, I would personally feel a little bit less comfortable playing the game if I saw such disclaimers on websites covering it as it feel it is just drawing more attention to the presence of said slurs.
Inaction in this case is just as bad as outwardly supporting the bigoted views this game represents. This video is selling copies of the game by introducing new people to it through DF's YouTube feed. If DF isn't willing to take the heat from adding a small disclaimer, they shouldn't have posted the video in the first place. It is very important to note that the Ion Fury debacle was pointed out to John before the video went live. So a purposeful decision was made by DF (not necessarily John) to post the video knowing of the controversy.
Exactly this! I and im sure no one here is solely putting blame on Dark1x, but DF and Eurogamer as a whole are responsible for this. I think its a perfectly fair and reasonable thing to inform your viewership via a discription. The medias job is to inform period.
The fact that this is a legitimate concern is troubling and says a lot about how terrible the internet is outside these forums.
The idiots you are referencing claim to want "freedom of speech", yet harass people to the point of submission. Not just with "criticism" but also with personal insults, death threats, and inflammatory misinformation. All to trick vulnerable people to join their cause.
When Jim Sterling made fun of "apolitical gamers" in his dark souls jimquisition, he lost so much patreon support that he considered it a failure. Not because his video was low quality or incorrect but because the idiotic side of his audience did not like it. And that subset of fans had enough financial influence on him to control what he talked about in future videos. It is sadly ironic - he left the escapist to avoid being controlled but ended up being controlled anyways.
These morons want to control us, who say things that they find inconvenient and hard to swallow. Even if we follow what we feel is right.
They are trash. Utter garbage. I hope one day the sites they call their "homes" burn to ash and fade away to be forgotten forever.
All I can say as a transwoman is that the reactions here are incredibly disappointing, but not at all surprising, and I've felt the need to unsubscribe from DF over their complete silence.
You know, for someone who said
You sure seem to be making that argument right now.
Not on normal.
I mean, try Blood to compare. "Maranax Infirmux!" my ass.
To all who are saying that Eurogamer/DF isn't adding a disclaimer because they want to avoid threats, hateful comments, etc., lets be really clear. They don't care about threats being hurled their way. What they are really trying to do is not piss off a portion of their audience that wouldn't watch their videos in the future based on their handling of this video. AKA bowing to the almighty $. The same exact thing 3DR did when Ion Fury started getting review bombed.
I must just suck. Also, I probably wouldnt have bought it if I knew about the whole homophobia issue.
I think most people in this thread didn't come down all that hard on this though. People here are aware of that they'll be harassed by bigots if they'd even put in a disclaimer. That doesn't mean it wouldn't be worth doing. In this case, inaction is support in the eyes of the harassers. Not doing anything empowers them, and if DF would ever get in a similar situation again they would come back even harder. I get why DF wouldn't do anything, but that doesn't mean people here are in the wrong for pushing them to take a stance.
Also, you should feel uncomfortable playing a game developed by people who are so openly bigoted.
Last edited:
Yup, this is purely a business decision on their end and they don't want to lose their alt right audience. They are free to do so, but that choice makes the criticisms warrented.
I'm not saying the game is piss easy, I can see how people could struggle with it. It's just that there are much worse Build games difficulty wise. Just play it on easy, who really cares.
And I bought the game in EA over a year before the release and any controversy. Plus I was mostly done with it by the time it started gaining traction, so I just finished it. The game itself is solid, although when it comes to the recent retro shooters I prefer DUSK. Wrath seems to be shaping up pretty well too. As does Nightmare Reaper.
I agree fully
I also find it ridiculous/hilarious/sad that the response to Voidpoint 'censoring' the joke was dramatically stronger than the response to Bruce Dickinson actually trying to ensure that the game never came out.
this is one of the most civilized critical threads i've ever read on era and yet there's still "i can't believe era is attacking john/df" people in here? suspect.
Fuck right off. I'm a gay man who has had to remove references to my sexuality from profiles just to not get bombarded with anti-gay shit, don't you dare throw that shit at me.
I'm saying that I find it highly unnecessary for websites that have never remotely had any sort of anti-LGBT rhetoric or association to announce that they do not support an anti-LGBT viewpoint and that seeing such messages makes me less comfortable as it just helps to draw attention to whatever anti-LGBT rhetoric may be present.
It's completely ridiculous.
"Wow it's very disappointing they would do a video on this game without at least a disclaimer"
"STOP DOG PILING! leave John alone! REEEESETERA really is the worst, you guys harassed him! Don't feel bad John 'ol buddy, BUT IF YOU GIVE IN TO THE SJWs mark my words you will be sorry, you reap what you sow pal!"
Edit: this is the jist of a lot of the youtube comments.
I've liked Dark10x for a long, long time even as far back as when he was just a very well informed poster back in the GAF days. That feeling was cemented for me when he started producing amazing content at DF with the retros and other great videos so it's a real shame to see him step away from the forums over something that could and should have been so easily preventable. It's understandable why he's chosen to step away though and I wish him all the best and I'll likewise keep watching any videos he keeps making in the future.
Having said that, the decision to not include any sort of statement or disclaimer about the type of bigots the Ion Fury developers are in the video that is probably netting them some sales at this very moment is deeply disappointing. Granted, chances are adding said disclaimer is out of John's hands but if either Digital Foundry or Eurogamer are worried about said disclaimer inciting the ire of alt-right gamergate assholes, well, then they have truly dropped the ball hard.
Having said that, the decision to not include any sort of statement or disclaimer about the type of bigots the Ion Fury developers are in the video that is probably netting them some sales at this very moment is deeply disappointing. Granted, chances are adding said disclaimer is out of John's hands but if either Digital Foundry or Eurogamer are worried about said disclaimer inciting the ire of alt-right gamergate assholes, well, then they have truly dropped the ball hard.
It's transparent enough reducing the prejudice we're talking about to "a political perspective," but straw-manning polite/normal discussion into a screeching "look what they did to John" deserves some serious side-eye.
Obviously it's not just this, but John said outright that he was disgusted by the situation the original devs put him in; It was a video for a game he loves and put immense production work into, including close communication with the port studio (not the original dev). That got tainted by something ugly the Ion creators insisted on doing that he was totally unaware of. He mentioned stepping away the moment he realized what they had done, and his last post was that he would be doing no further videos covering the game. His responses honestly couldn't have been any better.
It's really obvious when someone sidesteps his explanation, and Gríma Wormtongues it to deflect criticisms of that dev, and cast it all as "attacks on John."
Obviously it's not just this, but John said outright that he was disgusted by the situation the original devs put him in; It was a video for a game he loves and put immense production work into, including close communication with the port studio (not the original dev). That got tainted by something ugly the Ion creators insisted on doing that he was totally unaware of. He mentioned stepping away the moment he realized what they had done, and his last post was that he would be doing no further videos covering the game. His responses honestly couldn't have been any better.
It's really obvious when someone sidesteps his explanation, and Gríma Wormtongues it to deflect criticisms of that dev, and cast it all as "attacks on John."
Last edited:
unfortunate situation, the behavior of the devs was terrible and put me off from the game, I still haven't tried it and probably will not, but, the video itself had nothing to do with it, from the technical standpoint which is the DF's angle it was an interesting story since it's a very inadequate engine to be running on these consoles and a different challenge to port it.
in any case, I do think that a small disclaimer about not condoning the devs viewpoint and "humor" would have been a good compromise, at the same time I understand Dark1x being unhappy with the feedback, since as I said his video was merely a tech focused look on the port.
in any case, I do think that a small disclaimer about not condoning the devs viewpoint and "humor" would have been a good compromise, at the same time I understand Dark1x being unhappy with the feedback, since as I said his video was merely a tech focused look on the port.
User Banned (2 Weeks): Inflammatory Drive-By; Attacking the Community
Can y'all stop running GOOD posters off the site?! What the fuck?
Can you add something of substance to the thread or get out? Nothing anyone has done here has run John off the site.
Sounds like he had his own personal problems that contributed to him wanting to leave. The only tiring posts were the "I can't believe this forum!" posts when no one was attacking anyone harshly at all.
You think Dark, currently suffering depression, which face is known publicly, so easy enough to find name, adress etcetera doesn't care about threats being thrown his way and doesn't add a disclaimer only because of money ?
You being gay doesn't just validate your viewpoint. Can you not agree that some sales will be generated from the video which then financially lines the pockets of bigots? The video being purely technical is a bad argument. The video is selling copies of the game and raising visibility to its existence.
Yes. That's why they posted the video in the first place when knowing of the situation and the continued lack of a disclaimer. DF could have easily just not posted the video when they learned of the problem and there would have been 0 threats or backlash but views are more important than morality.
Edit: Just to clarify, let's leave John out of it. It wasn't his decision to post the video.
I love Digital Foundry and it's creators just like most in here, but I do agree that people in here have the right to criticize the site over not having a disclaimer. It's a small little thing to do, it takes courage but I have to think that good people have no problem showing that. I hope DF shows those with hate in their heart that they aren't going to be cater to.
please find the irony in this post, please find the irony in this post, please find the irony in this post, please find the irony in this post, please find the irony in this post
I'm not going to fuck right off. It's laughable to argue that GAMING of all things does not have an undercurrent of anti-LGBT rhetoric, and that rather than make even the most token of gestures towards a community who already faces this harassment on a daily basis, they willingly act as a piece of marketing without any sort of acknowledgement or pushback.
Each and every depiction of media with problematic elements, without being willing to highlight or at the very least acknowledge those elements no matter what your "focus" is, is serving as endorsement and advertisement for that media. It doesn't matter if that's not your intention, it doesn't matter if you're adamant that this is not an endorsement, it doesn't even matter if you personally are against those elements and have made it known separately and publicly. Each and every piece of content is displayed in a vacuum, a potential avenue for someone's first exposure to something. Organizations have to own that. They don't get to put out "we don't support this kind of bigotry in these games" statements then run videos on those very games without being willing to bring it up.
It's unfortunate that John has to be caught in the crossfire of this, because you know he had little choice in the matter once the video was done, but this is the dilemma that everyone must face as we become more willing to acknowledge and engage with the problematic elements of the media we consume. DF (or Eurogamer if the call ultimately lies with them) deserves all the criticism in the world for being willing to be an advertising mouthpiece for this game, and by proxy this dev. It doesn't matter if that wasn't their intention, that's ultimately the result.
At least John gets the best thing to do right now is just disengage with it all.
Honestly, I'm not sure if this is entirely true. Eurogamer and specifically Digital Foundry aren't faceless, truth is people making videos for DF could face harassment if they'd even do something as little as add a disclaimer. Not wanting to lose the audience could absolutely be a factor, but that doesn't mean avoiding threats and harassment isn't one either.
That being said, you're right that regardless they still posted the video knowing about Voidpoint's bigotry. Even if harassment wouldn't be a factor, I'm not sure they'd pull the video or even put in a disclaimer.
I hope John is taking care of himself, and he's able to bounce back. Love his content and wish the best for him.
Bigots and trolls AKA actual snowflakes really don't need much to harass folks who are willing to step up to them, so if you're able to stand up to them, do it even just for your conscience. If you're fine with the inaction when it was possible for something to do to help marginalised folks, then don't do anything. Like mentioned already, Jim Sterling and other liberal or leftist content creators have been through this. Lost subscribers, lost money, threats, etc. Don't let them win if you can help it. If a simple disclaimer like "the views expressed by..." can't be done, then what hope is there for progress in this medium at any higher stage?
Innuendo Studios' Alt Right Playbook is a good guide for how to combat these fools.
Bigots and trolls AKA actual snowflakes really don't need much to harass folks who are willing to step up to them, so if you're able to stand up to them, do it even just for your conscience. If you're fine with the inaction when it was possible for something to do to help marginalised folks, then don't do anything. Like mentioned already, Jim Sterling and other liberal or leftist content creators have been through this. Lost subscribers, lost money, threats, etc. Don't let them win if you can help it. If a simple disclaimer like "the views expressed by..." can't be done, then what hope is there for progress in this medium at any higher stage?
Innuendo Studios' Alt Right Playbook is a good guide for how to combat these fools.
Thank you for the update. It's a shame that we're losing both him and you. Though I'm in the camp that is disappointed, for the time being at least, that the video still features no disclaimer of any kind, I also understand that the views espoused by the original developers of the game are not John's or, I assume, yours or the Digital Foundry team's. I understand if John is not in a place to handle this or similar discussions, and if he wants to prioritize his personal life. It's only natural. I wish him all the luck in the world, and I'll keep watching your videos (when they don't feature stuff like Ion Fury obviously). Heck, I rewatched your NES TMNT Let's Play the other day. Take care, and hopefully we'll see you around soon. Even if we don't, that's okay.
Sidenote, but for those who were wondering: this is not the first time Krejlooc has requested a self-ban, though for what reason and for how long, I don't know. Honestly none of our business unless he wants to make it ours.
No issues with signal boosting and platforming Digital Foundry content for years, building up a fambase here, but the slightest bit of good faith criticism comes along and now gamers want the organisation to be treated with kid gloves if there's a threat of harassment? Compare that to the harassment, doxxing, and bigotry some of us ERA/GAF regulars who happen to be minorities have received over the years just for daring to criticise and demand for representation and diversity, call out bigotry, how we live rent-free in alt right fools' heads and are obsessed over in our social media posts, appearances, and content. We can't redirect all that to a company or other person to handle our social media if it gets to us. We can't take a break because we are followed wherever spaces we go.
After playing Doom Eternal? No way. That fucker really challenges you. I rarely died in Ion Fury.
Forreal. I only recently discovered that there are some websites and forums out there that actively look to dox and humiliate people they deem as lesser, but like you should that should discourage ya'll from fighting the good fight.
To be clear, John wasn't lamenting any particular bad treatment, from anything I saw. What seemed to distress him most when this came to light was the situation he was forced into; His own work (and appreciation of a game) was tainted by the original dev's hostility to others. The natural stress from that added to unrelated pressures in his life, so he decided to gracefully step back, even specifying that he wouldn't do any future coverage of the game because of the dev's actions. Social media is stressful for an individual, but that's magnified a thousand-fold for a public figure. Human limits don't magically grow when they become a public figure.
Turning this into either (a) an attack on him for being "thin skinned" or (b) an attack on sincere discussion of the game as somehow being an "attack" on him are both deeply out of line. Don't take this to dismiss your point (which I appreciate), but in a situation like this, it's cruelty to dismiss the suffering of others as a balance of what we feel ourselves.
Parsed through the thread, and your framing doesn't help your argument, honestly. As a pan woman, I've read through many accounts that this person was, all in all, a pretty decent and respectable person. And, looking at their post history, I haven't seen anything particularly inflammatory in regards to LGBT+ rights.
What anonymity on the internet does is enable people to forget that there is literally another person on the other side of the screen. People forget that several to dozens to hundreds to thousands of responses, depending on visibility and platform really, does a number on someone's mental health, and it's disappointing you're downplaying that aspect entirely when discussing his feelings.
That said, I feel that a more measured approach in addressing concerns are better, especially when it's understood that the person that you're addressing is often an ally that is trying their best. Being in the public eye is difficult enough, honestly.
I would not go as far as saying those are attacks. But the requests for him to include the disclaimer, plus the insinuation that any inaction from him is as good as him taking a side, coupled with countless people expressing their disappointment or displeasure (not rage, mind) are incessant enough to drive him out of this forum. You're right, being a public figure puts a heavier toll when it comes to social media interactions. And it doesn't need to be rage-filled posts; some people just buckle from dealing with disappointment. "Expectation is the root of all heartache' and all... This isn't equating LGBTQ issues with his own problems. But we shouldn't dismiss the latter either.
The person you're responding to and everyone else saying the same thing are saying it because they know this forum and they know John will be attacked if he doesn't do this in the future.
- Status