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Did Kotaku just post an article with (animated) child porn? (NSFW) [Up: Kotaku apologizes]
- Thread starter Olaf
- Start date
I'm aware of this case, there was also a case in another midwestern state I believe of a guy who had some Simpsons porn in the mid to late 2000s. There are a couple isolated cases like this (this one, the other one I mentioned, and I think one other) in the last couple decades. In this case the person took a plea, it never actually went to court. Occassionally you will get a prosecutor who wants to try an obscenity prosecution but the fact that you can count the number of these cases in 20 years on one hand hould tell you all you need to know. Meanwhile the platforms that actually host this content or promote it are NEVER prosecuted. Personally I think going after individuals for this is stupid and if you really want to make statement about it you would try and prosecute a big site for hosting this content (Pornhub, YouPorn, Hentai Foundry, Rule 34, etc.) under obscenity law in order to actually get this stuff removed, but the DoJ or federal prosecutors aren't doing that because it's incredibly difficult to win obscenity cases.
I think having serious discussions about this content and it's ubiquity is extremely important, given that I was personally affected by it and the culture it perpetuates.
Video game porn isn't going to get better when you can make hella money physgunning two ragdolls crotches together to stock moaning sfx with dead eyed faces. Who needs pesky things like characterization, emotions, suitable tone, or a plot that leads up to doing it when consentual straight sex in the missionary position with air balloon titty women is good enough for fan works and video games too (cough Far Cry 3)
There's nothing wrong about investigating porn or writing articles about it... But this clickbait article filled with lines like "Wake up, Link," she says, after consuming enough Bokoblin sperm to feed a family" seems really dumb (I never expected better from Kotaku, they know a thing or two about clickbait and dumb articles) and out of place.
Sex in videogames should be explored in a more mature way, and I'm sure there's a lot to talk here that doesn't involve cringey animations from porn sites. Even porn based in videogame should have something better to investigate.
Sex in videogames should be explored in a more mature way, and I'm sure there's a lot to talk here that doesn't involve cringey animations from porn sites. Even porn based in videogame should have something better to investigate.
Honestly, the article is still pretty disgusting. I would still have thought this if the author was male inviting over his gay porn friend to watch Yarichin's B*tch Club.
It can be done a lot better but do we need plot in our pornography? We wanna go back to 70s type porn?
Also that's not happening until people start paying for their porn, otherwise we're going to get the dregs of what's possible.
Like there's something to be said for people in their adulthood recontexualizing things they may have found attractive as a kid in a new, and more explicit, fashion. I don't think I'd begrudge any kid who had a crush on Misty finding aspects of her character or design attractive and carrying that into adulthood. She's essentially just a redhead tomboy archetype. And incorporating these elements into your adult sex life with costumes or outfits that reach back to these feelings as a kid is OK when ultimately you're projecting those traits onto someone of age. Roleplay is an important part of the sexual experience.
But actually wanting to depict Misty, actual preteen Misty, in these sexual acts is crossing that line from finding the character traits sexually attractive, to finding the character itself sexually attractive. And knowing that this character is underage is essentially condoning the idea of child pornography. The harm of child pornography isn't just the children involved. They've already been harmed once it's been produced. The harm is allowing the "idea" of child pornography to exist by continuing to give it a market. That's what this kind of stuff does. Deplatforming works, and the way to stop this kind of stuff from existing is not giving it a place to exist.
But actually wanting to depict Misty, actual preteen Misty, in these sexual acts is crossing that line from finding the character traits sexually attractive, to finding the character itself sexually attractive. And knowing that this character is underage is essentially condoning the idea of child pornography. The harm of child pornography isn't just the children involved. They've already been harmed once it's been produced. The harm is allowing the "idea" of child pornography to exist by continuing to give it a market. That's what this kind of stuff does. Deplatforming works, and the way to stop this kind of stuff from existing is not giving it a place to exist.
You seriously think that this is a clever thing to post, regarding animated child porn?
Kotaku is so fucking trash, it doesn't surprise me.
With the obvious exception of Jason Schreier's articles.
With the obvious exception of Jason Schreier's articles.
But yeah, forgot to add, the porn of games these days gets both boring and disgusting. Maybe going against my previous post, but maybe more gay porn of games would maybe solve things if done right?
I don't know, stuff like:
Is just plain creepy as well as cringey.
But the conclusion at the end:
Feels kinda like it's giving some light disapproval for the quality of the porn rather than the 'problematic' content itself. There is ZERO indication on the the type of analysis or discussion you'd want. It reads like a more fucked up Buzzfeed article. And it doesn't touch on the actual 'problematic' aspects like depicting underage characters... Wouldn't the article point that out at the very least? It took an editors note to point that out.
Also fucking 'the cake is a lie'. What a fucking boomer JFC.
Lol, as if gay porn isn't full of problematic shit. No, I don't think that would necessarily 'solve' anything.
There is fuck tons of gay video game porn. I don't really think that's the issue.
I'm a bit curious, what sort of problematic content is in gay porn for games?
Unless I missed something, most of her problematic parts were that the scenes didn't make sense with regards to the source material. Was the uncomfortable part the Pokémon scene? Because even then she praises that scenes inventiveness. She also praised the attention to detail the Zelda scene had.
Yeah, like I said, it's a bad article. A good article could be done on the subject, but this ain't it. I still don't think the article is condoning the porn in question, but it is not critical enough either. Including actual images was insane though and triggering for people like me who have sexual abuse trauma. I'm not sure what you want me to say at this point.
This just illustrates a problem I have with Kotaku as a whole.
They have a lot of great, thoughtful and well researched articles about lots of different themes, be it mainstream or niche. Their stories cover subjects that a lot of other gaming sites don't really touch upon, and they fill a very important space in games J E R N A L I Z E M.
But they also publish a bunch of shit in their front page that simply does not deserve that space. It's baffling how a lot of their writers are allowed to post a bunch of random nonsense that has no place in a professional site like that. Like, there's no harm in talking about porn, games or sexuality if you have an actual point (Patricia Hernandez's articles come to mind) and its not just pointing at stuff and laughing. It's that kind of leniency, that wanting to have their cake and eat it too, that leads to this kind of clusterfuck. All their credibility goes to the toilet while giving ammo to the anti-SJWs. Total shitshow.
I think it's a total exagerration to put it on the banned sites list, but cases like this remind me why Kotaku has that reputation.
They have a lot of great, thoughtful and well researched articles about lots of different themes, be it mainstream or niche. Their stories cover subjects that a lot of other gaming sites don't really touch upon, and they fill a very important space in games J E R N A L I Z E M.
But they also publish a bunch of shit in their front page that simply does not deserve that space. It's baffling how a lot of their writers are allowed to post a bunch of random nonsense that has no place in a professional site like that. Like, there's no harm in talking about porn, games or sexuality if you have an actual point (Patricia Hernandez's articles come to mind) and its not just pointing at stuff and laughing. It's that kind of leniency, that wanting to have their cake and eat it too, that leads to this kind of clusterfuck. All their credibility goes to the toilet while giving ammo to the anti-SJWs. Total shitshow.
I think it's a total exagerration to put it on the banned sites list, but cases like this remind me why Kotaku has that reputation.
Yeah including the Harry Potter porn was completely wrong of them to do. Same thing for the Zelda and Pokémon porn. Both were absolutely disgusting.
She literally says that she found all of it gross. It's not exactly a detailed analysis but it's not positive either. Gross means off-putting, uncomfortable, giving you a queasy feeling. You don't use 'gross' to describe not respecting the source material.
What...but the characters ARE teenagers. That's the point? Huh? What a bizarre non-apology.
You serious? Rape porn, underage characters, anything you find in this article you can find in gay rule 34 porn also...
There are only two instances of the word gross in that article, one in the title and one for the Pokémon scene which, again, she still praised for its inventiveness.
I was at least in periphery to that culture while I was underage. I can't pretend to claim a personal knowledge of how deeply it affected you -- especially considering some of the other related postings I've seen -- but you have my sympathies. It's very easy to become normalized to it.
And it's irritating that creating this stuff frequently bandied about as a "victimless crime" and, I guess that you could make that argument if literally nobody else sees it. (Which of course is why this article was so irresponsible as presented!) Once it starts getting public, then that argument goes out the window. It's not wholly without point -- it's the reason I think trying to actively legislate/prosecute on this, at least at the individual consumer level (as you noted), is mostly pointless or counterproductive on its own, but I am strongly in favor of everyone who hosts adult content agreeing it is a bridge too far for them.
As a corollary I do think there are ways in which you could do a story about a character or characters who were underage in the stories they originated in just in the same sort of way that you refer to projecting those traits onto someone of age. I believe it was in the anime feminism OT that it was discussed that Nanoha, for example, has a, well, complicated relationship with adult content in general, but at the same time the main characters of Nanoha were given the opportunity over the course of the series as a whole to actually become adults, and I don't see any reason that can't happen to other characters in fan works. What would it be like if [character_name_here] went to college and got into some relationships? What about their life as a working adult? It wouldn't excise fetishism/objectification from the discussion but it would at least meet a baseline level of responsibility for depiction of that sort of content.
But then that's getting far afield from what this article was actually about -- which was closer to "man people make some fucked up shit in SFM" -- so that sort of discussion, that sort of contextualization, was never what it was going to be about. And it's frustrating because that's the kind of stuff I want to be seeing more of!
I see then. And toxic masculinity is another huge issue too. Would the be any sort of any positive gay Yaoi porn out there then?
I was originally arguing that she doesn't do enough to say r34 porn is "fucked up/gross". Not outright condoning it, I agree, but I mean you really can't say 'this porn is totally gross y'all' then go into a play by play on said content using 3D models of underage actresses. And then to praise the 'uniqueness' of Pokémon porn and complain the fact that there aren't properly rendered female genitals... Like what the fuck.
There really isn't much else to say though you're right. I don't want to continue discussion over this kind of stuff either.
Though I do also wish that there were more serious critiques and analysis on porn like this. Or start a mature discussion around it. But Kotaku and this woman won't be the ones to start it. I'll be waiting for some serious journalist from actual media to tackle it or maybe some education institutions. Hopefully in the future.
Looking at the previous articles for this author, I see a pattern:
I feel like these images really underscore a bigger issue with Kotaku, which is that it's inundated with filler and basically unreadable with any sort of regularity.
this article is sooo bad yes (cake is a lie reference, what a loser lol) but reading through this thread has made me think more about the problematic nature of rule 34. before the most i've ever really thought is like lol sonic fucks that's funny
Eh. Looks like the same stuff that frequents every other gaming outlet.
She already posted a previous article about Overwatch porn previously? I guess it wasn't mentioned this time because its too high quality.
literal unedited images of rape, bestiality etc featuring underage characters
I agree. But I don't agree with putting them on them on the ever growing cancel list.
EDIT: Actually, looking at all the shit they did - oh man that's fucking bad. Damn Kotaku wtf is wrong with you? This is some THQNordic shit of stupidity.
She says at the end of the article that all of it was gross, but yes she doesn't condemn it enough nor does she meaningfully engage in why it's gross. The article is bad, but it didn't have to be.
I think it's a 'victimless' crime in the same way, like, heroin use is a 'victimless' crime: most of the harm is being done to the user, the external harm is indirect, hard to quantify, and varies wildly from user to user, and the harm done by prosecuting individual users is out of scope with the harm they are individually causing and thus a really bad idea and not something society should start doing on a broad scale. At the end of the day, putting individuals in jail for drawings is going to do more harm than good.
However, deplatforming and pursuing fines and takedowns of sites that host this content under current obscenity laws SHOULD happen, because this type of content can be harmful to people consuming it, especially young people. And it can lead people who are being abused to normalize or rationalize their own abuse, make people less receptive to listening to abuse victims and their stories, encourage victim blaming or contribute to harmful views about women, etc. But that's not gonna happen if we can't meaningfully discuss this issue in the first place.
Yes you are right, she did not condemn it hard enough nor analyze adequately what makes content like this gross and off-putting. I agree with you, I desperately want to see more critique and analysis of this subject and I think Kotaku COULD do it, this article just isn't the way to do that.
I believe "yaoi" is more often refers to works with gay characters made to be consumed by straight women, so consider that it's similar to, say, lesbian porn for straight men.
She didn't, she said:
"I'd love to see a video with the inventiveness of the Pokémon porn done in a slightly less gross way, with the attention to detail of the Zelda porn, plus the references to the source material that the Harry Potter porn attempted (and failed) to do. The ingredients are all there, but the cake is still a lie."
That is not saying that all of it was gross, she said the Pokémon stuff had gross scenes.
I understood that as her saying that they were all gross, but ymmv. The title itself calls it all gross. But ultimately it's a bad, poorly thought out article. And very triggering.
Dude, they had a NSFW warning. If you see that on an article from a site that mainly deals with videogame news then you should 100% assume there will be graphic pics of children having sex with each other or children being assaulted by magic pocket monsters.
Like...duh!
It would not make sense to write it like that if she found all of them gross, she divided each feature she would want to see:
1. Inventive scenario like in the Pokémon scene but less gross
2. Attention to detail like in the Zelda scene
3. Accurate reference to source materials like what the Harry Potter scene tried but failed to do
The title may say "Animated Video Game Porn Could Be A Lot Sexier And Less Gross" but in this context, if you read the article, the only thing that she found gross was a scene in the Pokémon one that she watched.
Yeah could be the case, I mean you'd have to ask her. I think a lot of people in many fandoms have seen so much rule 34 content that they are pretty desensitized to what's actually being being depicted. Could certainly be the case for her.
I've forgotten about Kotaku, but never thought they'd do anything like this. Haven't looked and don't plan to but from the reaction here it seems pretty batshit insane. Wtf is going on.
I mean, they didn't. Drawn images are nowhere near the same as actual pictures; not even remotely close to the same ballpark. It's distasteful, sure, but that doesn't make it child porn.