4 years for 6 issues of that. What a fucking heist he pulled on marvel and buyers of the comic. At least JMS gives you a good story eventually.
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Did Jon Favreau steal Kevin Smith’s Career?
- Thread starter UF_C
- Start date
Yeah agreed. He doesn't have the right eye to get out of his niche.
Good director but his eye is very limited in scope and it hurts his marketability
I'm not knocking his involvement, but Dave is like the next George. There's a clip where Filoni is referencing a very prominent scene from TESB and John has no idea what he is talking about. Dave absolutely is directing the trajectory cause I have no doubt John has no idea who Thrawn even is.
I don't think the two really have any sort of career trajectory that allows for each to be compared to one another.
The only thing I can say being a huge fan of both in my youth is that watching Kevin Smith films now, I kind of regret being a big fan of his at the time.
I still enjoy him as a person and personality, but it's very clear to me just how lazy his work ethic is and how lazy his work is now because of it.
Favreau has, since Dinner for Five and now with Chef Show, always proven that he's willing to put in the work to push himself harder.
I think his film directorial output (including Mandolorian) has always been kind of bland. But I do enjoy his script work on Swingers and really thought Chef was very sweet.
I think there's a lot to enjoy from him, even if he never does anything spectacular.
The only thing I can say being a huge fan of both in my youth is that watching Kevin Smith films now, I kind of regret being a big fan of his at the time.
I still enjoy him as a person and personality, but it's very clear to me just how lazy his work ethic is and how lazy his work is now because of it.
Favreau has, since Dinner for Five and now with Chef Show, always proven that he's willing to put in the work to push himself harder.
I think his film directorial output (including Mandolorian) has always been kind of bland. But I do enjoy his script work on Swingers and really thought Chef was very sweet.
I think there's a lot to enjoy from him, even if he never does anything spectacular.
I think Smith was maybe to ahead of the times (or tried to do to much too soon). You could argue he was the first with a cinematic universe and he wrote scripts for major comic book properties back in the 90s before Comic Book films really took off with Xmen and then Spiderman.
I'd have killed for a proper comic book film from Kevin Smith with the budget Favreaux got on Iron Man. I think his Green lantern film could have been great and he and tim burton tried to get the DC Film universe going with Superman Lives (supposedly with Keaton returning as Batman)
This reminds me of how I thought Zack and Miri Make a Porno was a Judd Apatow film for a decade before discovering it was actually Kevin Smith trying to make a Judd Apatow film.
Look at that movie Favreau wrote and made where you want to murder him constantly for being a jerk and an idiot who somehow got both Sofia Vergara and Scarlet Jo because he is this incredible chef who only cooks regular beginner dishes throught the entire movie. Kevin Smith would have never made such an awful movie.
Swingers came out in 96.
In 97 Favreau was recurring on Friends. Literally only Seinfeld and Clooney's ER were bigger shows.
In 1996, after Mallrats flopped the year before, no one could know Kevin Smith was going to spend the next decade telling stoner and sex jokes. Anyone saying Mallrats was a strong start to Kevin Smith's career is seriously mistaken. it wasn't until after Dogma and the DVD release that anyone even cared about Mallrats.
That they both happened to write wildly different movies about their wildly different lives but just happen to be the same age is not a link between them.
If there is a sliding doors moment between Favreau and Smith it is who Will Ferrell got for Elf. He knew and had worked with both of them and Smith was the more established director. But it seems Smith never wanted to try and tell other people's stories. So he ended up doing Jersey Girl.
I think all three of these are correct. And hilarious
Martin Scorsese stole Kevin Smith's career 😢
Umm...in 2000 Smith was coming off Chasing Amy and Dogma, and working on Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back. Calling him the "Next Tarantino" would have been far more fitting (but a huge insult to Tarantino.)
It was a success of range. Something that smith has never encountered. Thus, why we aren't talking about smiths recent supergirl episodes.... And discussing mandolorian.
Clerk 1 - "You know, Empire would be a better movie if it was set on Life Day"
Clerk 2 - "Yeah, how?"
Clerk 1 -"So imagine if while training yoda, chewiews family would be there too"
Clerk 2 - "what they would be doing outside of Kashyyyk ?"
Clerk 1 - "They would be on vacation. It is a hollyday."
Clerk 2 - "so you want a Christmas Vacation version with wookie chevvy chase?"
Clerk 1 - "LIFE DAY vacation with wookie chevvy chase"
Jay - " wookie noises i am chevy chase, motherfucker"
Clerk 3 (who is a woman) - "Life day don't exist, morons"
Clerk 1 - "You sit in a throne of lies"
Wait, what??? Have always thought it was a Judd Apatow film as well!
No, it's actually the second film Favreau directed. Yes, he wrote Swingers, but Doug Liman directed it. (There's another early Favreau film like this, too.)
Don't worry, easy mistake: I often forget Doug Liman directed The Bourne Identity, since I so heavily associate the Bourne franchise with Paul Greengrass.
There was a video Patrick Willems put out a few weeks back where he was looking at Smith's early career and he totally mentions that directors like Favreau, Judd Apatow, and Edgar Wright basically picked up the torch from where Smith left off.
I still enjoy Kevin Smith as a filmmaker and personality, but he's long since been surpassed and Kevin himself would probably be the first to admit it.
I still enjoy Kevin Smith as a filmmaker and personality, but he's long since been surpassed and Kevin himself would probably be the first to admit it.
I think Smith could have written a good comic book movie back then. Probably not now, I feel like as a writer he's become incredibly self indulgent over the years, but back then he could probably have written something good. Him trying to direct a big budget superhero movie though I feel like would be a disaster.
That's always been the thing with Smith though. He's a good writer, at least somewhere in there. Clerks is really prescient and nails the feel of that sort of job. Dogma is a mess but with a lot of really interesting stuff in it. I know some will judge Chasing Amy today but I'll still stand up for it. Most of its "flaws" are more flaws of the 90s than of his writing. As someone who lived through that era, the movie feels like that time period. Its being told from the wrong perspective for sure, but what's there still works, at least for me.
He's just not a very good director though. He has no eye for visual storytelling. His movies are so flat, and basic. As a director, he tops out at adequate. Can he direct a good movie? Sure, if he mostly gets out of his own way and hires the right DP and editor. He just doesn't have the eye for it though. Like, in recent years he's directed a good number of episodes in the Arrowverse. Which I mean, cool, as someone who actually thinks Kevin Smith seems like a really cool guy and who finds him quite entertaining in the right situation, I'm happy for the guy. I also love how he talks about working with some of the actors there, how much doing it seems to mean to him. God, when he talks about Melissa Benoist I feel like he's going to kiss the ground she walks on, but not in the sort of creepy way that a 50 year old director kind of obsessed with their 32 year old star would normally be. He just seems to really appreciate her talent, how beautifully she embodies that role, and just her as a person. Who knows, maybe it isn't, but it seems really genuine. But if you watch The Flash or Supergirl, can you name more than one of the 7 episodes of the two he's directed without looking it up? I can name exactly one, and its because its the one where Jay & Silent Bob show up. Which was fun, admittedly. But those episodes have no strong point of view, they don't have any directorial stamp on them, they aren't visually interesting, and this is him directing a freaking CW show. Even there he doesn't stand out as a director.
Bingo.
Hell, Apatow helped wrote Cable Guy and Fav wrote Swingers and both were under the radar to the late 90s and then you can say both exploded just as Smith's career waned.
I don't think Smith ever aspired to more than he has worked on now. His Superman stories are funny but you get the picture that even he himself knew he wasn't ever aiming that high. He's an indie guy and that's all he wants to do. He often repeats this, in his way, in his many podcasts.
Favreau on the other hand was always constantly climbing higher and higher in terms of scope. It just turns out that he's really good at taking things that were already appealing to the masses but making them endearing to new viewers.
Favreau on the other hand was always constantly climbing higher and higher in terms of scope. It just turns out that he's really good at taking things that were already appealing to the masses but making them endearing to new viewers.
Did you guys ever see an old show Favreau made called Dinner for Five? it was about a bunch of actors/performers who would eat out and talk about the industry at a fancy restaurant. This was pre-iron man but Favreau would hand the show over to Smith when he was busy, so I think they get on well.
The above quote made me chuckle as Favreau would talk incessantly about Swingers on every episode, to the point that Kevin would take the piss out of Jon about it when he was on hosting duties.
Was Tusk any good? I remember there being alot of buzz for it back when it was first talked about. Smith probably had a horror franchise in it.
What kind of entitlement is this? Haha. Just because Kevin Smith was a big nerd who loved nerdy shit, doesn't means he should be making or heading those brands.
Jon Favreau has more of a cinematic vision for each, and I think a big part of his success is not pandering to those fanbases but making something that can stand on its own two feet and be enjoyable to masses. Kevin Smith never had that sort of success or filmmaking. And in terms of career vision was drawn back to Clerks 2 some 12 years after in a way Favreau would never do with Swingers
Smith is a cool enough person, but there's no "stealing" or anything remotely close here.
Jon Favreau has more of a cinematic vision for each, and I think a big part of his success is not pandering to those fanbases but making something that can stand on its own two feet and be enjoyable to masses. Kevin Smith never had that sort of success or filmmaking. And in terms of career vision was drawn back to Clerks 2 some 12 years after in a way Favreau would never do with Swingers
Smith is a cool enough person, but there's no "stealing" or anything remotely close here.
Smith is talented and I love his 90's stuff, Clerks, Mallrats, Chasing Amy (amazing) and Dogma were all fantastic, but he peaked there. He can do that 90's slacker thing and he kept doing it. He isn't a big budget Hollywood director, I don't think that's his thing or he has the chops for it. His aesthetic is also very 90's counter-culture American slacker. If you go to say Barcelona, Jakarta or Bangkok...and try to discuss his movies, no one will know him, or get the movies, they are locked in that very specific, very American time capsule.
Favreau's appeal is global. Even Swingers, an indie movie that can be liked by anyone, anywhere, because it's relatable. Try explaining Clerks to anyone outside the US.
Favreau's appeal is global. Even Swingers, an indie movie that can be liked by anyone, anywhere, because it's relatable. Try explaining Clerks to anyone outside the US.
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All I remember about that show is that I saw an episode with Kevin Smith and Jennifer Garner, and she HATED him.
No one stole Kevin Smith's lunch, he's an average director at best and never seemed to have the confidence or desire to move outside his wheelhouse.
Jon Favreau is a very competent director who works well within the studio system and can bang out mass appeal films on time and budget. He may not have the artistic flair of top directors but he brings a hell of a lot to the table.
Also Chef is one of my favourite films of the past decade.
Jon Favreau is a very competent director who works well within the studio system and can bang out mass appeal films on time and budget. He may not have the artistic flair of top directors but he brings a hell of a lot to the table.
Also Chef is one of my favourite films of the past decade.
I've started turning hard on Chef in the last couple years. Great "food porn", but Favreau's self-insert character with everyone adoring him for his genius and both Scarlet Johansson and Sofia Vergera wanting to ride him because of how good of a cook he is? Like... come on.
It seems to me that one of Favreau's big contribution has been the willingness to work with and help develop new technologies and production techniques, that's not something Smith would ever do. Some of his films like the Lion Kong remake seems more focused on testing out techniques than anything, which then make things like Mando possible with the Volume and Stagecraft. It sounded like Favreau had a big hand in those things but I'm happy to be corrected if that's not the case.
I love Smith more than most, but no. Guy is lucky he even has a career at all.
That said, there are great moments in his movies that are some of my all time favorite movie moments. Pillowpants and Cock Knocker come to mind.
That said, there are great moments in his movies that are some of my all time favorite movie moments. Pillowpants and Cock Knocker come to mind.
Favreau is great, but without RDJ, I don't think the MCU would exist. I don't think favreau gets the opportunities that he got.
Not a competition at all no, Kevin Smith made his bets in order to go mainstream and eventhough I think he deserved more mainstream success his schtick was always to make edgy content for a particular crowd and hope it goes viral whereas Favreaus approach is to make needy shit digestible to a very broad audience.
overall, I think your premise is incorrect
overall, I think your premise is incorrect