A standalone FF has more broader appeal than a FF mashup with Disney?
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Did anyone really expected KH III to ignore the non numbered entries?
- Thread starter Fj0823
- Start date
A standalone FF has more broader appeal than a FF mashup with Disney?
That fact that KH2's secret ending is what became BBS should tell any KH fan that it is a game that you shouldn't ignore. And KH 3D is basically Kingdom 2.5 as it's the setup to KH3; KH3 will borrow its story more from BBS and 3D than KH2.
But I can't really blame them from skipping out; to get the whole story before the collection sets you needed to own; A PS2, GBA, DS, PSP, and a 3DS...that's a lot of money.
But I can't really blame them from skipping out; to get the whole story before the collection sets you needed to own; A PS2, GBA, DS, PSP, and a 3DS...that's a lot of money.
Sales would suggest so, being able to pick up any game in the series and be able to understand what is happening probably helps.
Yes because while there are tons of Disney fans, there would be a far smaller number of Disney fans who are also interested in an action RPG crossover with FF characters. At the same time, not every FF fan would care about a Disney crossover game.
Or a ps4(the console 3 is on) and the collection. It's not that hard anymore, and most of the games are at least on par with 1+2. BBS and DDD, are going to arguably be more important to the story of 3 then 2 was, so it's a little crazy to skip them.
CoM(despite me hating the card system) also has one one the better stories in the series.
I said before the collection sets; yes it's simple now but before 2013 you had to own all those systems to get the full story.
I'm not saying there aren't some good character moments in the series. However, the things that link all of these characters together is so threadbare. Which isn't surprising when you start with a KH1 which is a game solely around the power of friendship and the biggest reveal is that "Kingdom Hearts is light". plus all the added stuff in the .5 versions just to hamfist in connections to other game. It's pretty obvious that the whole KH story was cobbled together AFTER the initial success of the first game and Nomura did a terrible job with fleshing it out.
I'd even go as far to say that FF13 series has a better storyline then all of the KH games, which is absurd to think about but is true.
I'm playing through all the games before KH3 and getting 100% in every game before I move on. Big motivator of this was to really see for myself if the story of KH is good. Sadly, it really isn't, it's just a pile of abstract terms, incredibly vague plot points, and very deep plot holes.
It's always between the original KH and BBS for me, but yeah- Birth by Sleep is top tier Kingdom Hearts. It's the lynchpin of the entire franchise at this point.
I don't even think Kingdom Hearts fans think the games are written that well. The sheer absurdity of major plot points like time travel in DDD are memetic in the fanbase, and for good reason. If you care about the story it's because you like the characters. Plot holes can easily be ignored if you care more about Roxas's journey from denial and angst to acceptance and (hopefully) to self-actualization. Even if parts of the story are hot garbage, the series has a way of making me care about its characters. "Looks like my summer vacation is... over." That line alone is one of my favorite in video games and perfectly captures the melancholy of the scene.
Actually it's like 12. 13 if you count the movie.
KH1(FM)
(Re)CoM
KH2(FM)
358
BBS(FM)
(Re)Cod
DDD(HD)
KHχ
KHUχ
KHUX
0.2
KH3
But if you want to mainline the series, just play the bolded.
Actually, before the collection you could cut out GBA and DS from the list since you could play CoM on the PS2 and the DS KH on 3DS BC.
With the remastered 1.5/2:5 collections readily available on PS4 there is little reason not to be caught up.
Get to it.
Get to it.
Square should've called KH2 and 3 something else or they should treat the in numbered entries as spin offs. Many will see a 3 in the title and think you only needed 1 and 2. I pray for the poor souls who's first KH ever will be 3.
You know what? Everything about KH's game titles is fucked up. KH 258/2 days? KH 2.8 HD Final Chapter Prologue? KH 0.2 Birth By Sleep A Fragmentary Pasaage? KH X (it's pronounced Chi!!!!). Good God.
You know what? Everything about KH's game titles is fucked up. KH 258/2 days? KH 2.8 HD Final Chapter Prologue? KH 0.2 Birth By Sleep A Fragmentary Pasaage? KH X (it's pronounced Chi!!!!). Good God.
Yea I expected it. Not gunna play through all that subpar BS I'll just wait til KH3 is 20 bucks then pick it up n ignore the nonsense story while I fight stuff.
Hell I waited this long what's another year.
Hell I waited this long what's another year.
Yeah it has to be the most mismanaged series around, it should be a lot bigger then it is
DDD and BBS are Kingdom Hearts spinoffs as much as Monster Hunter World isn't a mainline Monster Hunter game.
Just because they don't have numbers doesn't mean they aren't important, or that a numbered title can't come back and incorporate all that came before it, number or no number.
Just because they don't have numbers doesn't mean they aren't important, or that a numbered title can't come back and incorporate all that came before it, number or no number.
Because if you are playing a chapter III of anything, the expectation is that you only need to have played II and I to get the proceedings. It's not really that hard to understand. Does OP expect every gamer outside of a hardcore community like ResetEra to be aware of the multitude of "spin-offs" that are nonetheless essential to understand what's going on?
And the fact that it was the same case for II is not an excuse. Indeed, when I played it at launch I enjoyed it much less than I because I could simply not understand what was going on. I'd appreciate if squeenix made a summary in the form of a freely available video, so that I'm not forced to spend one more cent than I feel it would be fair to ask me to.
And the fact that it was the same case for II is not an excuse. Indeed, when I played it at launch I enjoyed it much less than I because I could simply not understand what was going on. I'd appreciate if squeenix made a summary in the form of a freely available video, so that I'm not forced to spend one more cent than I feel it would be fair to ask me to.
Yeah, this is why I'll not play KH3 at all.
I was an HUGE fan of KH, I played CoM on GBA cause was different, and I was looking forward for KH2.
Then, even KH2 started with more crap about Organization XIII that turned me off, but I still enjoyed the game. After that they released BBS on PSP (didn't had it and was not interested to buy one) and they started to do more and more "spin off" and definitely lost me.
I even tried to play 358 Days for example, I invested quite some hours to that game (and it was awful to play) just to catch up but the bit of story per-hour was so little and so lame that wasn't worth it.
I mean, I have a 3DS but refused to touch KH3D, at this point they completely ruined the love I had for the franchise and yes, the "remasters" doesnt help, I don't want to buy two separate remaster for BBS and KH3D, and I even need to watch 358 and other games cutscenes for have the complete picture of an huge, intricate and, honestly, pretty crappy story for what I have seen.
It's just not worth the effort and time at this point.
I was an HUGE fan of KH, I played CoM on GBA cause was different, and I was looking forward for KH2.
Then, even KH2 started with more crap about Organization XIII that turned me off, but I still enjoyed the game. After that they released BBS on PSP (didn't had it and was not interested to buy one) and they started to do more and more "spin off" and definitely lost me.
I even tried to play 358 Days for example, I invested quite some hours to that game (and it was awful to play) just to catch up but the bit of story per-hour was so little and so lame that wasn't worth it.
I mean, I have a 3DS but refused to touch KH3D, at this point they completely ruined the love I had for the franchise and yes, the "remasters" doesnt help, I don't want to buy two separate remaster for BBS and KH3D, and I even need to watch 358 and other games cutscenes for have the complete picture of an huge, intricate and, honestly, pretty crappy story for what I have seen.
It's just not worth the effort and time at this point.
Watch on YouTube. Not like it matters the plot is borderline gibberish anyway.
I played the first two and I can't remember what Kingdom Hearts actually is other than them calling it the heart of all worlds. What does that even mean? Even in the context of the game what is a heart? There are nobodys that supposedly don't have hearts but seem to be normal functional people who have dreams and ambitions and care for others.
Non numbered doesn't mean spin-offs or side stories. They are complementary stories but devs didn''t use numbers to not inflate the number of the latest sequel so people won't get the prejudice that the devs are milking the series. Great marketing strategy.
Ultimately, it's a series about light vs dark, the details are there if you want to dive into it, but I honestly believe you can play any of them if you like and be able to understand the minute by minute action. I highly doubt they'd make a game completely inaccessible to new people.
There's multiple physical Kingdom Hearts-es(?) but basically they are a source of seemingly unlimited power and that's why bad guys want it.
In the game, the exact idea of heart is still a mystery, the experiments to understand it are what create Organization XIII and emblem Heartless. Heart seems to be a general idea of will, emotion, and memory.
Each world has its own heart as a collective life force/ light of that world and the keyholes you lock at the end of each world are tied to those hearts. Locking them means keeping it safe from entry by the Heartless. If a world's heart is consumed, it crumbles and fades from existence.
Kingdom Hearts being the Heart of All Worlds is simply that, it is the light of all worlds.
Nobodies are implied to be able to develop new hearts and were oppressed into thinking they couldn't.
I have to agree, the main villain of 3 is already set up in DDD to be the prominent version of Xehanort in BbS. One of the main characters of BbS, Aqua, is the star of the prologue chapter and seems to be the objective of Mickey and Riku
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I don't really have a dog in this fight but the indignation of KH Fans that people dare to say the story is more convoluted than a Disney anime mash up should be and 'play the dozens of spinoffs over 15 years on multiple, random systems, some games are also retreads / remakes of others, many have been re-released multiple times under new and confusing naming structures to make it difficult to know which one is which!' being treated as a serious statement.... yeesh.
I see it two ways-
1. Accept that you 'had' to play all the supplemental material. Why? Many (most, if not all) other series try their hardest NOT to rely on this, in many mediums. Even say, Avengers Endgame, will basically be predicated on watching ONE other film, Infinity War. The other 22 films are supplemental to this. And even if this is true that you had to have a game do this- then expect the backlash as there are definitely people who this game will appeal to who weren't even born when the first one came out. I'll give props to Square Enix for having it all on the Playstation re re re release though.
2. Just make the game have lots of nods to the old stuff but have expository stuff explain it for those who weren't there. Also, make the story probably flow better in general.
Either way getting indignant that people won't be able to play so many games on so many systems just in enjoy a big game is ridiculous.
I see it two ways-
1. Accept that you 'had' to play all the supplemental material. Why? Many (most, if not all) other series try their hardest NOT to rely on this, in many mediums. Even say, Avengers Endgame, will basically be predicated on watching ONE other film, Infinity War. The other 22 films are supplemental to this. And even if this is true that you had to have a game do this- then expect the backlash as there are definitely people who this game will appeal to who weren't even born when the first one came out. I'll give props to Square Enix for having it all on the Playstation re re re release though.
2. Just make the game have lots of nods to the old stuff but have expository stuff explain it for those who weren't there. Also, make the story probably flow better in general.
Either way getting indignant that people won't be able to play so many games on so many systems just in enjoy a big game is ridiculous.
No because the non-numbered games are just as crucial to the story. Kingdom hearts 3 is actually like kingdom hearts 10
They're not spinoffs though. BBS and DDD are mainline. Plus the collection features them completely playable, while the less important ones are movies.
But they are. In the real world they are. I know in the fandom they aren't but in everyone else's life they released KH1 on PS2, then they did noticeably different and lower budget KH games on other consoles and handhelds like so many other spin offs have been, then KH2 on PS2.
Your order is wrong. They did KH1, then the GBA game (Chain of Memories), then KH2, then the other games on other consoles, then KH3. Chain of Memories really was a side-story spinoff, because KH2 basically ignored the fact that it happened since characters lost their memories of Chain of Memories' events. Some of the other games though really should have been numbered since they directly affect the ongoing story.
You have spinoffs that retread the worlds and stories of previous games, and then you have mainline games that feature new worlds for the series and new stories. Again, the collections make it abundantly clear by what they let you play, as do the years of trailers.
Why does 2.8 exist, a collection that doesn't feature 1 or 2, if not to tell the audience that DDD is important? Or that BBS is important?
Should they have called BBS 'KH0' and given DDD a number too? Almost definitely, but /shrug. They made the important games easily available - unless you're an Xbox player, in which case you were shit out of luck.
People are used to side games being generally ancillary or skippable content. In the case of this series, that's what made it hard to follow for a lot of people because you had to collect different systems and games over the years to actually experience the story in its entirety. It's a bit unusual in that regard, though now that everything's collected in one spot it shouldn't be as much of an issue.
I've seen this happen with Resident Evil as well, particularly Code Veronica which I've seen dismissed as a side game on multiple occasions, ignoring the fact that it's one of the most story heavy games as far as tying into the overall canon and what followed, particularly with Wesker.
I've seen this happen with Resident Evil as well, particularly Code Veronica which I've seen dismissed as a side game on multiple occasions, ignoring the fact that it's one of the most story heavy games as far as tying into the overall canon and what followed, particularly with Wesker.
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How is "well for Endgame you just need to watch infinity War" an argument?
IW is complete nonsense if you haven't watched any of the previous films
IW is complete nonsense if you haven't watched any of the previous films
Sorry, I can't hear you from all the keyblades I'm throwing at the heartless of random people who played xCross!
Honestly, I kind of figured that was going to be the case if Dream Drop Distance was our "last stop" before KH3. Still, I wouldn't have guess that they would make reference to literally all of them though. I know the little tidbit about Jiminy Cricket's journal and a "Digital Sora" probably would have confused the hell out of those who didn't play that game.
...except for people who don't have a PS4, but are playing KH3 on an Xbox One.
If your game is important to the story, plays similarly to the rest of the series, and deserves to have a number in its title, then it isn't a spinoff. Doesn't matter what system(s) it released on.
A spinoff is Persona or Apex Legends, not Birth By Sleep or Dream Drop Distance. They are very much still part of the main Kingdom Hearts series, and are not spinoffs.
Hell even I was lost at the last bit of KH3 as they really through KH: X/Back Cover at you hard! they really wanted you to play everything before KH 3 dropped.
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I'd say the X/Back cover stuff were the most tame references...And that's saying something lol
I somewhat expected it earlier on that Disney might require Square to retcon a lot of that stuff to make it more digestible for their overall audience.
I'm quite surprised they were able to go about it untouched and just as convoluted. I'd pay good money to watch videos of that Square meeting where they had to explain the premise and the story to Disney execs/reps.
I'm quite surprised they were able to go about it untouched and just as convoluted. I'd pay good money to watch videos of that Square meeting where they had to explain the premise and the story to Disney execs/reps.
I expected them to cover everything, which is a problem, because they did.
The problem being that even if you had played all the games (Like me!) the degree of referencing is... problematic, to say the least.
BBS and 358/2 Days are my favourite KH games. The way the material from both games was treated in KH3 was abysmal.
Except that mashup of Vector To The Heavens/The Other Promise. Probably the only thing about the game I don't view with sheer antipathy.
The problem being that even if you had played all the games (Like me!) the degree of referencing is... problematic, to say the least.
BBS and 358/2 Days are my favourite KH games. The way the material from both games was treated in KH3 was abysmal.
Except that mashup of Vector To The Heavens/The Other Promise. Probably the only thing about the game I don't view with sheer antipathy.