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Devs - A new sci fi miniseries written and directed by Alex Garland - Thursdays on Hulu
- Thread starter RatskyWatsky
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it split before then, when she turned her head back to Katie, the thing they saw still happened just now that universe now
by her throwing the gun she really created the multi-verse for the reality in the machine.
i see it as back to where Katie's teacher said the multiverse theory didn't follow reality. well now it does but the reality in the machine. the show's Forest and Lily are now being put into infinite realities that made it to that point. from a few days before Sergei was killed
i see it as back to where Katie's teacher said the multiverse theory didn't follow reality. well now it does but the reality in the machine. the show's Forest and Lily are now being put into infinite realities that made it to that point. from a few days before Sergei was killed
Multiverse is the theory the system was running on at the end. It explains why Forrest was completely against using the multiverse theory as he was always planning to put himself and Lily into the simulation. By using an infinite number of universes, he has condemned countless versions of himself to hell worlds.
I thought everything was more that the simulation couldn't process a break in predetermination in the real world as the processing power was not there to see multiple realities on top of the existing reality. Lily basically caused an infinite number of realities on top of another infinite number of realities, which I think is what broke the system. But because even people are just data, the system could see up until that point. I am going to give it leeway that the system had one interpretation of events that it could show before it could not calculate past that.
But man how crappy is it that Katie is basically in charge of keeping a simulation up for Forrest because she loves him. Even when she only looks at ones where he is happy without her in his life.
And Stewart saying it was predetermined when Lily proved seconds before that it didn't have to be. The whole thing is full of tragedy.
I thought everything was more that the simulation couldn't process a break in predetermination in the real world as the processing power was not there to see multiple realities on top of the existing reality. Lily basically caused an infinite number of realities on top of another infinite number of realities, which I think is what broke the system. But because even people are just data, the system could see up until that point. I am going to give it leeway that the system had one interpretation of events that it could show before it could not calculate past that.
But man how crappy is it that Katie is basically in charge of keeping a simulation up for Forrest because she loves him. Even when she only looks at ones where he is happy without her in his life.
And Stewart saying it was predetermined when Lily proved seconds before that it didn't have to be. The whole thing is full of tragedy.
technically the name didn't change, since U was written as a V in Latin
/theory
/theory
Pretty sure the Ex Machina universe isn't going to last much longer for humanity lol, i would say maybe Devs is a prequel but the tech on display is a literal quantum leap forward from what we saw in Ex Machina so I would doubt it, creating an AI that can pass the turing test seems like childs play in comparison to accurately simulating the universe down to a cellular level
Sure but they showed it written as Deus in the final title card, which to me conjured the idea of "Deus Ex Machina".
(finale spoilers)
I loved this ending. I never considered that they could add data to the history projection; I saw the rat being brought back to life in the previous episodes but I assumed that could only work to create something new, and not also edit what was already there in the simulation (namely, replace the Forest who was living in the simulation with the Forest who had just died). It is a very simple solution to the show's mysteries.
It means Devs was never about predicting past or future, all Forest ever wanted to achieve was to visualize a portion of the past and create an "Import" function.
It really is San Junipero like another user said, and I'm sure the government would want to do all kinds of stuff with this eternal life that is only given for 2 people on Earth, lol.
I loved this ending. I never considered that they could add data to the history projection; I saw the rat being brought back to life in the previous episodes but I assumed that could only work to create something new, and not also edit what was already there in the simulation (namely, replace the Forest who was living in the simulation with the Forest who had just died). It is a very simple solution to the show's mysteries.
It means Devs was never about predicting past or future, all Forest ever wanted to achieve was to visualize a portion of the past and create an "Import" function.
It really is San Junipero like another user said, and I'm sure the government would want to do all kinds of stuff with this eternal life that is only given for 2 people on Earth, lol.
I would assume it's an afterlife for everyone on earth not just two, even if they're alive in the real world. Sergei was there, Jamie was there, Lyndon and Stewart are there, bum KGB agent was there. For this system to work in the first place they had to have monumental data on everyone on earth in the first place, so they're all there and accounted for, within the show's logic these constructs are so similar to their counterparts that they're virtually the same beings, otherwise it would be a kinda fucked up ending, she would be eternally sentenced to eternity with a bunch of soulless NPC's and might even run into invisible walls if she tried to leave SF
Liked the first half of the episode disliked the second half.
Also I really hated this one thing:
Started on Monday and overall my feelings are it had a lot of unnecessary bloat from being 8 episodes. Would have preferred 4 or even a movie that had to sacrifice some interesting things. I didn't like the series overall. Especially that ending.
Finally the ending really called to mind one movie for me. I wonder if it's the same for anyone else?
Also I really hated this one thing:
There was absolutely no reason to give her random free will to throw the gun away. If everything else was absolutely exactly the same up to that point how could she deviate that much compared to everyone else without being magic or something. Not to mention it doesn't even change the ending at all as they still both die. It just raises questions as to why Stewart did what he did at that moment as well as how he could do it? Why would he be able to stop the magnetic system? Can every dev can do that?
Started on Monday and overall my feelings are it had a lot of unnecessary bloat from being 8 episodes. Would have preferred 4 or even a movie that had to sacrifice some interesting things. I didn't like the series overall. Especially that ending.
Finally the ending really called to mind one movie for me. I wonder if it's the same for anyone else?
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Her coworker with the prosthetic feet did not have them anymore on the end. Probably some other differences too. But did notice that one, because it was so obvious
Liked the ending. But show felt too long for me. Think it would have worked better as a movie or with maybe 2 or 3 episodes.
Her act of free will is what breaks the simulation going forward. Stewart always kills them by dropping the lift. If you watch the original version that the machine predicted, he was punching in the code to drop it. They only thought Lily's gunshot was the cause. I assume Stewart could do it because they had to have staff able to work on the lift as they were the only ones allowed in the building.
Yeah that's basically my conclusion as well.
It's not though. The simulation breaks minutes later when she dies. If the simulation broke because of her choice than it would stop right when she got in before she tosses or keeps the gun. There's no real explanation for why the simulation originally stops. I had assumed it was tied to Lily which is why when she finally dies the simulation stops. Tossing the gub wouldn't explanation why the simulation shows one future for a few minutes and then cuts out.
I think it goes back to the first episode. When we see Sergei's limited simulation and how correlation breaks. When free will is introduced into the real world, the correlation of events start to break. We get a limited glimpse into the future that is not 100% correct until it gets too much for the system to handle. Basically, Lilly's action creates the multiverse as free will did not exist until that point. I am speculating though. I am sure there will be a post interview where the creators will discuss what they were trying to get across.
Why are we all using spoiler tags?
Anyway
Anyway
I just don't think they justified why Lily was able to make a different choice. Only thing I didn't really like.
I like to think of it like a machine achieving sentience. It was the turmoil of the life she led along with observing that she was in a predetermined path that allowed her to use free will. In the series we are literally like machines following directions. If AI reaches that level there will not be a straight forward answer as to why that AI over another AI.
the justification would be she wasn't as compulsive about it (see earlier episode where Katie moves the pen to be in the right position she saw before talking to Lily).
you can say last episode with all the devs seeing 1 second into the future being it's too short of a time to react otherwise, but given enough time to contemplate what you saw you could change things if you were so inclined.
One could argue
But only the times the machine was made
They were already in the simulation from start of the show. Except at the end Lily made a choice which lead to Stewart making a choice which lead to Forest finally making a choice (to keep their memoirs from this loop variations)
Also Lily made her choice at the static screen alone before her and Forest walks out to Katie. She is always afraid to not do something and she plans ahead of time her moves
Also Lily made her choice at the static screen alone before her and Forest walks out to Katie. She is always afraid to not do something and she plans ahead of time her moves
But only the times the machine was made
Lily has freewill so everyone has freewill they were just compelled to follow their future projection because most people are afraid of doing what they want (unlike Lily, who is afraid of not doing what she wants).
Homeless guy says live your life to it's fullest, which is the common philosophical saying of living in the present. Forest is stuck in the past and so doesn't experience his life (what he has, which is Katie whom he has unceremoniously abandoned to a life of depression).
Stewart knows Devs has to be destroyed because he sees that Forest and Katie have little understanding of why people do what they do. Forest and Katie are actually mirrors of most people, who are anchored to their pasts and afraid of their futures and so make no choices at all, they just float. People who do not live moments to their fullest because they're afraid of acting.
We see at the end that Lily and Forest have clearly different understandings.
Forest stuck in the past, what he had, not what he has. (Katie stuck on a past love, honestly the most heart wrenching part of the show. She gave her all to him, was Forest really interested?)
Lily always feeling what she has right now, so she goes to Jamie, not Sergei.
Forest thinking that the past is a cross to bear.
Lily thinking that it is a place to move on from, that was once experienced but need not be experienced again.
I wish Lily would have said why she broke up with Jamie. I think it would have tied everything together nicely. Shown the fallibility of people and therefore implied freewill. But maybe that would have messed with the ambiguous nature the show has. To come to your own conclusion.
Homeless guy says live your life to it's fullest, which is the common philosophical saying of living in the present. Forest is stuck in the past and so doesn't experience his life (what he has, which is Katie whom he has unceremoniously abandoned to a life of depression).
Stewart knows Devs has to be destroyed because he sees that Forest and Katie have little understanding of why people do what they do. Forest and Katie are actually mirrors of most people, who are anchored to their pasts and afraid of their futures and so make no choices at all, they just float. People who do not live moments to their fullest because they're afraid of acting.
We see at the end that Lily and Forest have clearly different understandings.
Forest stuck in the past, what he had, not what he has. (Katie stuck on a past love, honestly the most heart wrenching part of the show. She gave her all to him, was Forest really interested?)
Lily always feeling what she has right now, so she goes to Jamie, not Sergei.
Forest thinking that the past is a cross to bear.
Lily thinking that it is a place to move on from, that was once experienced but need not be experienced again.
I wish Lily would have said why she broke up with Jamie. I think it would have tied everything together nicely. Shown the fallibility of people and therefore implied freewill. But maybe that would have messed with the ambiguous nature the show has. To come to your own conclusion.
think this show is worth 13$? already used my hulu free trial and it's pretty much the same price as 1 month of hulu.
I didn't mean that the people in the simulation aren't "real humans", I mean that the only people inside it who are aware they came from the real world with their memories, and aware that it is a simulation, are Forest and Lily (Forest even says himself that only the two know of it).
For instance, Sergei is there but he doesn't have the memories of his real life self; to him, the life in the simulation is the only life he ever knew, unlike Forest and Lily who were given a second chance to live.
I wouldn't assume that. There's no information that anyone else in the simulated reality existed outside of this simulation except for Forest and Lily.
Why does that matter? There's no evidence everything isn't a simulation from the very beginning.
Yeah those are my thoughts. This didn't need to be dragged out for 8 hours, and the Russian hacker spy part could probably be cut. The ex-military security thread line could have been rolled back too. A lot of superfluous action that detracts from the cool concepts and leads nowhere.
The best parts were the Devs team exploring the consequences of this system, e.g. the episode where it's showing the many worlds simulations and various outcomes simultaneously, and then introducing new people, not the creator, e.g. Sergei's or Lily's reactions when they learn what Devs is, and seeing how they cope with this technology.
Yeah and I think they heavily hint or question reality outside the Deus system being a simulation as well; however, only Lily and Forest are downloaded into the Deus system simulation. The rest of "reality" continues with everyone in it as shown by Katie outside of the "simulation" trying to get funding to keep the simulation going.
While everything is real in the simulation Lily and Forest also know that these people exist outside of this simulated reality as well as the fact that there is an infinite number of simulated realities.
While everything is real in the simulation Lily and Forest also know that these people exist outside of this simulated reality as well as the fact that there is an infinite number of simulated realities.
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Sucks that it had to end.
Curious to see if Garland decides to do an anthology type of thing with this.
edit - https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-features/devs-creator-alex-garland-interview-980235/
Curious to see if Garland decides to do an anthology type of thing with this.
edit - https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-features/devs-creator-alex-garland-interview-980235/
I enjoyed the finale and the show overall. Some really good direction overall.
But I can't get over the idea that if one sees the future they can't simply not do it and Lily is some groundbreaker by doing something different. It's obvious a paradox and something that can't be tested but I have some trouble buying it. Knowing your future 5 minutes ahead of time would break it.
Lily was also really bland as a protagonist. The dude from Parks was the most compelling character.
But I can't get over the idea that if one sees the future they can't simply not do it and Lily is some groundbreaker by doing something different. It's obvious a paradox and something that can't be tested but I have some trouble buying it. Knowing your future 5 minutes ahead of time would break it.
Lily was also really bland as a protagonist. The dude from Parks was the most compelling character.
this is so dumb
i'm not saying i don't like it, i kinda like it. i have been entertained. but it's very dumb.
i love to write myself into a corner and make characters recite cliche action movie lines in order to prove they're written into a corner for 20 minutes. idk
i'm not saying i don't like it, i kinda like it. i have been entertained. but it's very dumb.
i love to write myself into a corner and make characters recite cliche action movie lines in order to prove they're written into a corner for 20 minutes. idk
Was impressive how Lily managed to replicate the angry and desperate facial expressions she saw on the screen after not having a single emotion for 7.5 episodes.
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OP
'Devs' Creator Alex Garland Breaks Down the Series Finale
'Devs' writer-director Alex Garland explains the mysteries of the FX on Hulu sci-fi thriller.
www.rollingstone.com
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The show often did feel like it was a movie plot stretched out to a series length, but apparently it was always conceived of as a show
On Lyndon
On Lyndon
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naw it's more like
they can't just live in only 1 perfect universe they are in all of them with this new knowledge and "they" are in the good ones as well and know that some o of "them" are in bad ones but who cares "they" aren't not "them"[ and also is "them"/SPOILER]
It was fairly obvious they were going to
Architecturally and visually, this episode really reminded me of Sunshine, glad to see Garland nodding back to
at least partially retcon Jamie's death, because it just seemed way too cruel to both him and Lily to have *another* romantic interest die a terrible death. I suspected some reality-bending shenanigans and was not disappointed.
still the best thing he's ever written.
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man knowing that you're dead and everyone is a simulation and there are an infinite number of versions of you, many of which are living some kind of excruciating hell-life, that's heavy shit.
