In a game that is extremely light on CPU. But guess what, games like AC Odyssey murder CPU performance and removing this fucking cancer would help.
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Denuvo-less .exe for Devil May Cry 5 leaked, performance improvements noted (up to 20FPS boost in performance, or over 20%)
- Thread starter Theswweet
- Start date
will he check the loading times aswell?? IIrc thats confirmed thing to get big hits due to denuvo unlike peformance which is i guess based on impelmentation
-7% off ~200 fps in half of 480p is an awful, awful loss of performance.
I've seen cases of games that had worse average performance on DX12, but better minimum framerates. Being a game with precise action, maybe that's what they were going for.
Thing is, even an old i3 can get a minimum of 71fps already, so it's not worth it if that's their angle.
Kaldaien says it's not the fault of the Denuvo + VMWare combo but rather exceedingly poor resource management. Ubi needs to stop delegating the PC versions of its AssCreed games to the clearly ill-equipped Kiev studio.
no reason to believe anything kaldaien says about denuvo
not saying the poor resource management isn't real, but denuvo's impact being shadowed by it doesn't mean denuvos performance hit doesn't exist, or isn't exacerbating the poor resource management
Oh, sure, I didn't mean to imply that Denuvo may not have any impact. That it can demand more than a negligible amount of processing resources is, most recently and most obviously, supported by Capcom's DMC5 snafu.
Steam's pre-load/retail data encryption is, to this day, ironclad, but its executable DRM is very easily circumvented and therefore wholly ineffective against release-day piracy. Denuvo, on the other hand, represents more of a challenge, although the extent to which that's the case has only dwindled since it became the plaything of the warez scene (e.g. FM2019 was cracked in less than a week, and Hitman 2 was actually cracked the on the same day it released for Gold Edition pre-purchasers).
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Sounds like something to work on improving to add even more value to their 30% cut. How much would a Dev save by not having to rely on a third party option like Denuvo?
Steam DRM on live games is completely cracked, even if it wasn't easy to remove (it is very easy to remove) there are extremely competent emulators that bypass the DRM entirely by making the game believe you are using a Steam account that owns the game. Some of these emulators even allow you to play online with other people using the same emulator.
It's been like this for several years now tbh. Only the preload DRM is ironclad.
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One of the cornerstones of Steam were that it's DRM is not intrusive and does not penalize the consumer. It isn't in their benefit to make the DRM competitive with Denuvo simply because it will upset their consumer base as the nature of a DRM like that is that it is intrusive to the consumer in some manner. It's also a waste of money because there is no ironclad DRM for a live product, it's a very fast losing battle as you've likely seen how Denuvo itself has gone.
Steam correctly opts to provide better features to developers & their consumer base that is actually beneficial to everyone, stuff like Valve offering their DDOS protected dedicated servers later this year and working on their machine learning extension for VAC for a better anti cheat, and their already existing features in forums/reviews/sales data/guides/trading cards/steam market/steam workshop/preloading/steam controller API etc.
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To be fair, Steam DRM is what it is because it's not designed to be an inconvenience. Denuvo, in contrast, while it can be more effective, requires first-run activation and periodical reactivation whenever there's a "major" system change (e.g. installation of new GPU drivers). Additionally, the way Steam DRM is implemented -- you upload the executables to the Steamworks site and the backend wraps them in what Valve calls "Custom Executable Generation" -- means Valve could distribute Steam DRM-free executables to all owners with a simple game update, whereas Denuvo, being an external solution, can be removed only by the developer.
Edit: That's not to suggest Valve can't make Steam's DRM solution stronger; rather, it feels that protection shouldn't come at the cost of user experience. Companies like Denuvo, on the other hand, operate with an inverse philosophy.
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The community was lucky to get access to the executable from the other branch... (wait for it) ...which actually works with the current version of the game, but on the same lines its good to take note of the probably performance impact without any compromises (if any, I am not sure myself. Like maybe missing visual effects, or unloaded textures or etc and/or even the other way around).
What if the branch contents were different?
What if the branch contents were different?
Ah well, could we at least agree that denuvo is also at fault. At least just a tiny bit?
*trades in Denuvo pitchfork for Ubi doesn't care about PC gaming pitchfork
On second though: Who am I kidding? I have two hands. I can easily have two pitchforks equipped! Thank god for modern game design.
*A couple of hours later: It's night, the room is illuminated by a flickering monitor light. Two Pitchforks are resting on a table. A CC is being drawn and a ominous figure buys The Division 2: Gold Edition on Uplay. A tear is dropping on the keyboard. A whisper can be perceived : "I'm sorry, but I'm part of the problem."
Denuvo runs the game in an encrypted virtual machine meaning that some percentage of CPU is needed to run this VM which runs the original code.
There are two things which people are generally wrong about when talking about Denuvo lowering a game's performance:
A. Denuvo only affect performance in cases where a game is running severely CPU limited - this isn't an often case in modern games at all and most games are usually showing very high fps when being CPU limited anyway.
B. The amount of effect Denuvo has on a game's performance is more relatated to how the devs of the game have integrated the protection into their code than Denuvo itself.
Denuvo does regular checks for triggers when the game is running. Regular DRM like Steam only checks your license on startup, but Denuvo does it in-game too, multiple times within a second.
That's basically their 'anti tamper' solution.
What happens when you actually try to start the game and it has to load a level?
It looks like it needs steam opened just to make some kind of check, but when it loads the game, you can close it. My friend shares his steam library with me, so I would end up playing with denuvo anyways, but then I tried this when he was playing, and it worked... The "problem" is that it still works even if you don't have the game in steam...
I thought Lord Gaben already removed the exploit to download from Steam?
If it's because of the CPU, then it might help a tiny bit.
If it's the GPU that can't keep up, then no point at all
Kaldaien has been a staunch defender of Denuvo from day one, to the point of bordering on corporatism. He'll always blame performance issues on something else.
Is there any drawback to using modified .exe files with purchased Steam games? As in risks of account bans or other action by Steam/the publisher?
I ask because for Pro Evolution Soccer 2019 the modding community have developed edited .exes that alter the ball weight, pass speed etc to affect the gameplay (such as here). I haven't run one of these yet as I'm not sure how Steam would treat that - I wouldn't want to get account banned or anything just for trying to change the gameplay.
I ask because for Pro Evolution Soccer 2019 the modding community have developed edited .exes that alter the ball weight, pass speed etc to affect the gameplay (such as here). I haven't run one of these yet as I'm not sure how Steam would treat that - I wouldn't want to get account banned or anything just for trying to change the gameplay.
had 0 issues modding exe files to get uiltrawide res on previous games, and actually using this denuvo less exe since it got leaked, 0 risks from it
Thank you! That's reassuring, just thought I'd check before I decided whether to try it.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2019-devil-may-cry-5-pc-denuvo-protection-tested
Eurogamer put up an article about this, they said they only noticed a difference when GPU was completely taken out of the bottleneck (480p on the lowest settings). They noticed a consistent 13 FPS difference between the patched and unpatched exe.
Eurogamer put up an article about this, they said they only noticed a difference when GPU was completely taken out of the bottleneck (480p on the lowest settings). They noticed a consistent 13 FPS difference between the patched and unpatched exe.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2019-devil-may-cry-5-pc-denuvo-protection-tested
Eurogamer put up an article about this, they said they only noticed a difference when GPU was completely taken out of the bottleneck (480p on the lowest settings). They noticed a consistent 13 FPS difference between
Eurogamer put up an article about this, they said they only noticed a difference when GPU was completely taken out of the bottleneck (480p on the lowest settings). They noticed a consistent 13 FPS difference between
Makes sense. Probably the reason why Ubisoft games hammer the CPU so much.
Lemme try an analogy. Imagine a game engine as a factory in the strange land of PC. It's highly tuned for efficiency, and while it's a big building, it's laid out logically. And it's 100% automated - no human employees except the manager who comes in once every month. Early in the morning, all the previous day's packages get shipped out. In that time, some of the machines can start, but full production can only commence once the warehouse is emptied out. Once production has started, things can only go into the warehouse, not come out.
Now, you want to rob that factory. You get out your x-ray camera (a part of every master thief's toolkit in PC land) and take some photos of the place. The first thing you see is that the only lock in the entire building is a Steam™ lock on the front door, and someone posted a guide to make universal keys for those 10 years ago. So you literally just walk in there with your fake key, go to the storage room and take whatever you want.
What can a factory owner do about this? Sure, they could get better locks, but thanks to the x-ray vision, that's only a minor hurdle. They get one more day of selling their products undisturbed while you study the locks, then you have fabricated keys for those too.
In comes Denuvo. They transform the entire building into a maze. Go through the wrong path and the door behind you closes and you gotta head for the emergency exit and start over. They replace production lines with bizarre Rube Goldberg machines that produce the same results but also have ways of detecting anyone in the building with a fake key and forcing them out. This is already pretty annoying, but the path is still pretty clear because 90% of the maze's corridors are empty, so in every empty corridor they put a machine that looks like all the others but doesn't actually produce anything. Those are never turned on, so they don't waste any energy, but you gotta go in and peek around the corners to see that.
Of course, if they did this with every production line, the factory would spend an eternity getting a single product out while wasting copious amounts of energy. So a while before the plans for the facility are finished, the owner sends Denuvo a draft and one of their engineers goes over it and finds the ones that don't matter. Of the tens of thousands of machines in any given factory in PC land, there's hundreds that need to run for half a minute at the start of the day. Denuvo picks out some of those and replaces them. Their new machines take 10 minutes for the same job, but that's perfectly acceptable. During the rest of the day (when you can't get in the warehouse anymore), none of Denuvo's machines are even on. If they all finish before the shipping process mentioned earlier, the slowdown doesn't hold anything up at all.
Usually, this works as it should. But with such a complex system to go through, there's always the potential that Denuvo's engineers make a wrong decision. Or maybe they make the right decision at the time, but your plans changed, and one of the machines they picked now holds up every single 1-hour production run. Then, replacing exactly the same machine with exactly the same replacement that would've made no difference worth mentioning with the original plans, they'd be making every single product take 15% longer to roll off the line.
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If Denuvo makes a game slower, that's how it would happen. Not because (as many people seem to think) the technology needs to constantly run in the background eating a large chunk of your CPU time, but because an error causes it to waste time when you really can't spare any. Developers could deal with that by performance testing the final protected build and yelling at Denuvo if they see it's no good. But they'd have to have that build ready early enough that they can afford to wait for the response.
The reason I keep saying "if" is that as far as I'm aware there's still no concrete proof that's ever actually happened; you'd first need a performance test with proof that the only difference between the game versions being compared is that one has Denuvo (cracked or not) and the other is DRM-free. In DMC5's case Denuvo is a likely explanation but not the only one.
Isn't it the weaker your processor, the more performance you will get? It def let me crank a couple more settings higher with my 2600k and still maintain 60fps, although I didn't do extensive tests to see how much of an FPS boost I actually got.
I wish some of these places tested on a few different CPUs. A couple weak ones, a couple mid rangers and a couple god tier CPUs.
I wish some of these places tested on a few different CPUs. A couple weak ones, a couple mid rangers and a couple god tier CPUs.
Yep, the whole point of this is that it lowers the CPU requirements of the game, but people keep testing it with an i9 9900k and a RTX 2080ti lol.
It'd be interesting to see the performance difference with an i5 2500 and a GTX 970, for example.
why would that be interesting when most dedicated gamers (the ones who would have any idea about this secret .EXE in the first place) have something newer than a i5-2500?
that's over 8 years old
I do half agree with you that they should not necessarily test it with literally the highest-end CPU either though. a 2-year old CPU seems like a good realistic case to me
This is such a stupid reply I'm not going to bother reading the rest of your post
Overclock3d used a 6800k which is "old" by today's current CPU at the same price point.
My sister still rocks my 2500k and a GTX 970. Might have her try it to see what happens.
My sister still rocks my 2500k and a GTX 970. Might have her try it to see what happens.
6800k is reasonable for a test, because that's a full 3-years old
We shouldn't test for just "Realistic" cases, we should test to see what scenario it happens in, if at all.
The steam survey shows 25% of users still reporting a 2 physical core CPU (likely 2c/4t parts). I'd be interested to see if that makes a difference running on an older i3, as 25% of the marketplace is not an insignificant chuck, even if you think it's unlikely they are "hardcore" enough to even know about this.
Trust me, when you are in a situation where your PC isn't up to modern snuff, you are going to sniff out literally any means possible to gain performance.
My 6500 barely breaks a sweat without Denuvo.
It's not like MHW case where one core is maxed out
It's not like MHW case where one core is maxed out
