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$10 Bagel

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,481
I wish someone would trophy hunt trophy hunters.

I don't even care about "promoting violence" fuck these people.
 

Raza

Member
Nov 7, 2017
1,566
Ohio
I'm really disappointed the backlash before didn't drive his clients away apparently.

Disgusting human.
 

SecondNature

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,157
Wasnt the argument that these people pay a ton of money which gets invested into the wildlife?

I'm confused as to how he hunted this animal if it's illegal. Shouldn't he be arrested?
 

Christor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,571
He's not gonna stop hunting animals you guys. As long as he has money, he will continue to kill. He's hunted since Cecil and he won't stop.

And that's fucked up completely. Dude is messed in the head
 

Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586
When he killed Cecil the Lion his business got hurt pretty bad. Review bombed to hell on yelp as well. Did he go back to practicing again?
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,460
What pisses me off is that this piece of shit thinks he's above any rules or laws made by black and brown people. He probably thinks people are rightfully put in cages on the border cause they're "breaking the law" while he goes and kills legally protected animals abroad.
 

Curler

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,600
I'll never understand a game hunter mindset...

Humans are equipped with enough weapons/tech to take out any of earth's creatures nowadays, it's not that difficult, so how is it even fun? The mentality of how an animal is becoming more "rare" therefore "I must go kill it?" To get your Instas of the kill (that you easily made and were aided with)?

It's gross and no one cares that you killed some creature that you aren't planning on eating/using :/
 

Ovaryactor

Member
Nov 20, 2018
416
Started my voyage toward vegetarianism 3 weeks ago, the only meat I've eaten since has been very small amounts of fish.

On topic: This guy is a fucking asshole and I kinda hope he gets in to a car accident only involving himself that doesn't kill him but paralyzes him from the neck down.
Godspeed, edited or not, on that vegetarianism.
 
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FFNB

Associate Game Designer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
6,090
Los Angeles, CA
I really can't stand trophy hunters. It's so fucking gross.

I'm not necessarily against hunting. Sometimes hunting is done for the good of a particular ecosystem. Sometimes people hunt for food, as it's their only means to provide for themselves (whether that be feeding themselves, or selling the meat they've hunted to survive). But hunting just for the "fun" of it? To have some kind of bragging rights over your fellow over privileged rich assholes? To feel some kind of "power over nature," and asserting your "dominance" to the natural world? Get the fuck out of here with that shit. It's gross and disturbing, and I admit I want all the bad things to happen to people like this.
 

Spish!

Member
Oct 27, 2017
571
what a dangerously stupid cause to conflate with trophy hunting, smh
Dangerously stupid? Meat eating is harmful to human health and animal agriculture is responsible for the current pandemic and the increase of novel zoonotic disease.

I take your point that sport hunting is egregiously despicable though.
 

Curler

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,600
Dangerously stupid? Meat eating is harmful to human health and animal agriculture is responsible for the current pandemic and the increase of novel zoonotic disease.

Eating too much meat can be bad, yeah. "Animal agriculture" in itself is not necessarily bad, but when you mix exotic species + bad living conditions, then it's a recipe for disaster.

Still, there is a huge difference from killing a white-tailed deer for venison (especially in places with an over abundance of deer due to fewer predators to keep their numbers in check) and going to some grounds in Africa/Mongolia, complete with a tour guide, paying out buckets of money, just to kill this thing with big horns/fangs, just to say "look what I did!" I don't even know what they do with the corpse. Take its horns and leave it to rot? Stuff it? Waste of an unecessary death...
 

Pandaman

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,710
So we know he paid, we know the animal fits the profile of animals reserves will sell the hunting rights for and we know mongolia does issue hunting permits for this species, so what's the problem?

If this was an above board kill he's done more to help endangered animals than anyone here ever will.
 

Squarehard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
25,840
So we know he paid, we know the animal fits the profile of animals reserves will sell the hunting rights for and we know mongolia does issue hunting permits for this species, so what's the problem?

If this was an above board kill he's done more to help endangered animals than anyone here ever will.
May want to read more than just the first paragraph, but then again, the title of this thread already tells you none of what you said was the case with this story.
According to WWF, the argali is legally protected by Mongolian law, and hunting it is banned. Internationally, the species is officially classed as near-threatened.
 

Pandaman

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,710
User banned (3 days): antagonising other members, prior ban for hostility
May want to read more than just the first paragraph, but then again, the title of this thread already tells you none of what you said was the case with this story.
Maybe you should finish the article. Don Jr. got a retroactive permit for the same species, permits do exist.

But continue being angry without thought.
 

Mahonay

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,316
Pencils Vania
So we know he paid, we know the animal fits the profile of animals reserves will sell the hunting rights for and we know mongolia does issue hunting permits for this species, so what's the problem?

If this was an above board kill he's done more to help endangered animals than anyone here ever will.
You can just retire this old ass argument. No one is buying it.
 

BetterOffEd

Member
Oct 29, 2017
857
Dangerously stupid? Meat eating is harmful to human health and animal agriculture is responsible for the current pandemic and the increase of novel zoonotic disease.

I take your point that sport hunting is egregiously despicable though.

Stopping the murder of endangered animals is a widely favorable position, ending consumption of all meat is not...

so yes,
conflating the two is dangerously stupid.

Why would you want to attach behavior that is obviously despicable to behavior that is widely favorable, unrelated to said abhorrent behavior, and has been a biological necessity for our species since well before recorded history? All you will accomplish is turning off the 97% of Americans who do want to eat meat from saving endangered animals. Worse, you'll inspire some "they're going to take our meat!" slippery slope nonsense when you try to save these creatures. Conflating these issues hurts the cause, terribly

If you don't want to eat meat, good for you.
That does not mean eating meat is 'harmful to human health' or that doing so responsibly caused the current pandemic.

Trophy hunting is not the issue to use to try to dig up wider support for an idea as unpopular as banning all meat, and any conflation of the two is flat out irresponsible.

Why don't we work together and give these endangered animals a chance, instead of trying to roll this up into a moonshot cause that saves farmed chickens?
 
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Squarehard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
25,840
Maybe you should finish the article. Don Jr. got a retroactive permit for the same species, permits do exist.

But continue being angry without thought.
I did finish the article, and nowhere in that excerpt mentions he got a permit, just that he also hunted it.
Two weeks after Palmer's trip to Mongolia, the US president's eldest son Donald Trump Jr also travelled there to hunt the sheep, the Mirror said, costing American taxpayers £60,000 for secret service agents.
Unless you're reading a different article I'm unaware of, nothing in this article, or that statement says he got a retroactive permit.
 

Pandaman

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,710
I did finish the article, and nowhere in that excerpt mentions he got a permit, just that he also hunted it.

Unless you're reading a different article I'm unaware of, nothing in this article, or that statement says he got a retroactive permit.
I did infact do further reading.
www.propublica.org

Donald Trump Jr. Went to Mongolia, Got Special Treatment From the Government and Killed an Endangered Sheep

During a summer 2019 hunting trip, Donald Trump Jr. killed a rare argali sheep. The Mongolian government issued him a hunting permit retroactively and he met with the country’s president.

This article states three were issued that year, so it wasn't just a political cleanup job, these permits are actually a thing.
 

Squarehard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
25,840
I did infact do further reading.
www.propublica.org

Donald Trump Jr. Went to Mongolia, Got Special Treatment From the Government and Killed an Endangered Sheep

During a summer 2019 hunting trip, Donald Trump Jr. killed a rare argali sheep. The Mongolian government issued him a hunting permit retroactively and he met with the country’s president.

This article states three were issued that year, so it wasn't just a political cleanup job, these permits are actually a thing.
But there was no indication that this particular case with this story is that he got an official permit, and that he paid two hunters to kill.

Why are you assuming this person did the same? Do you feel he deserves the benefit of the doubt for some reason?

I'm genuinely curious as to your thought on THIS story.
 

Pandaman

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,710
But there was no indication that this particular case with this story is that he got an official permit, and that he paid two hunters to kill.

Why are you assuming this person did the same? Do you feel he deserves the benefit of the doubt for some reason?

I'm genuinely curious as to your thought on THIS story.
I am not, which is why I asked why people were assuming it was illegal despite the article going out of its way not to actually directly make that claim, and i even couched my position on the potentially good of trophy hunting with the statement ' If this was an above board kill'.

The case for Cecil for example involved the guy paying people to lure the lion off a reserve, i'm asking for similar evidence, or any evidence at all, that the guy did something wrong here.
 

Curler

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,600
The case for Cecil for example involved the guy paying people to lure the lion off a reserve, i'm asking for similar evidence, or any evidence at all, that the guy did something wrong here.

Even if it was legal, many people would agree that nothing is "right" with killing rare animals for fun. There is nothing honorable about it. The guy made the news because he was blasted for game hunting (especial which animal he killed and how it was done), and then went out and did it again. Despite what happened to his practice, he is clearly well-off to keep going out to kill rare creatures.
 

Squarehard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
25,840
So we know he paid, we know the animal fits the profile of animals reserves will sell the hunting rights for and we know mongolia does issue hunting permits for this species, so what's the problem?

If this was an above board kill he's done more to help endangered animals than anyone here ever will.
I am not, which is why I asked why people were assuming it was illegal despite the article going out of its way not to actually directly make that claim, and i even couched my position on the potentially good of trophy hunting with the statement ' If this was an above board kill'.

The case for Cecil for example involved the guy paying people to lure the lion off a reserve, i'm asking for similar evidence, or any evidence at all, that the guy did something wrong here.
The problem with your first statement is that you make an assumption, and connect things that are not necessarily correlated, especially with the information we have.

Just because we know he paid and the animal might fit the profile of animal reserves, it does not mean that he had gotten a permit to have hunted the animal. That is based on conjecture, rather than evidence. If you can find further evidence to prove this, like you did with the Don Jr. bit, then that's fine. However, I feel the way you phrased that sentiment, particularly the end when you ask, "what's the problem?", you've already insinuated you believe this is in fact true without providing evidence to support that claim.

And honestly, saying things about a man who has been known for doing the wrong thing in the past, and then making a statement like "he's done more to help endangered animals than anyone here ever will", is sort of a bad faith argument at its core, as supposition than fact.

In regards to this particular person, from what I recall at the time there actually have been numerous other illegal hunts that were detailed out in prior articles of his other hunting activities, so it wasn't just Cecil the Lion, but it was just the most high profile one at the time.

In the end, if you wanted to make a case for legal killing, your approach in doing so just came off as crass, which is why I was not the only one who responded as such, and others as well.

While I still don't agree with you on your perspective, I do understand a bit more clearly what you meant now, so thanks for clearing that up.
 

Scottoest

Member
Feb 4, 2020
11,332
Eating too much meat can be bad, yeah. "Animal agriculture" in itself is not necessarily bad, but when you mix exotic species + bad living conditions, then it's a recipe for disaster.

Still, there is a huge difference from killing a white-tailed deer for venison (especially in places with an over abundance of deer due to fewer predators to keep their numbers in check) and going to some grounds in Africa/Mongolia, complete with a tour guide, paying out buckets of money, just to kill this thing with big horns/fangs, just to say "look what I did!" I don't even know what they do with the corpse. Take its horns and leave it to rot? Stuff it? Waste of an unecessary death...

Yeah, there's nothing wrong with hunting. My uncle does it every year, and then lives off the moose burgers and venison and whatnot for months, haha.

But there's everything wrong with this kind of hunting, where wealthy people pay to go shoot some critically endangered species simply to take a picture with the corpse, and bring home a trophy to put in their home office.
 

JayC3

bork bork
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
3,857
We don't see this thread leading to good discussion, so it's locked.
 
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