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Democratic Presidential Primaries & Caucuses |March OT| Last Tuesday was 1000 years ago, old news no one cares about (Discussion Guidelines in OP)

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Ignatz Mouse

Ignatz Mouse

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Oct 27, 2017
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PMS341 said:
SNL sucks ass in general and no one should go on it tbh, Sanders included. But I love how you immediately pivoted to the whataboutism of Bernie getting an entire Fox News crowd on his side regarding policies they would agree with, such as healthcare as a human right. But I guess we aren't supposed to reach across the aisle that way. :)

Immediately bringing up Rogan is laughable considering Biden is being supported by Bloomberg, even thanked him publically, but no one bats an eye at that. I wonder why?
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I'm not the one dunking on anyone for going on SNL. Or Fox News, or Rogan. But you just criticized Warren on some huge reach that SNL normalized Trump while completely ignoring Bernie, on SNL, Rogan, Fox. I brought it up as a double standard you have.

I am also all-in on taking the horrible billionaire's money to defeat Trump and support good causes. I'm for overturning Citizens United and clearing out money from politics, but until we do, I see no reason to fight with one arm behind our collective back.

I wonder why it's bad for Warren to reach out to an audience like SNL but it's not bad for Bernie to go on Fox, Rogan.
 

Deleted member 16365

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I'm with this guy. The video is catching a lot of heat because he calls it an ar-14, and tells a voter that he's full of shit, but honestly this makes me like Biden even more. No one else in Washington has the balls to call an idiot out like this.

He's not trying to win over a combative voter who clearly wouldn't vote for Biden regardless of what he said, but will hold to the fact that no one needs to own an assault rifle.
 
Lothars

Lothars

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Deleted member 13101

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Brock Reiher said:
I guess going on SNL is fine in a vacuum, but it obviously doesn't forward progressive causes.
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That episode actually went one better. It presented a skit of Fox News without mockery or irony, straight up as they would have run it themselves. It highlighted the danger of misinformation, particularly about the coronavirus. This skit is what Warren appeared on. I thought both the skit and her appearance were very effective and just what people needed on the eve of the outbreak news getting really bad.

How Warren knocking out the billionaires in the race, holding off on PAC money until the last desperate moment, running as a woman, and several other things doesn't forward progressive causes is...she's still in the Senate, unless people want her to not appear there either?

When people focus on gatekeeping "progressive", they run the risk of not letting anyone in at all.
 
Ignatz Mouse

Ignatz Mouse

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Lothars said:
Bernie has always been a bad candidate straight up, he was bad in 2016 and he's even worst now, he had some good policies but he isn't capable of winning the nomination. You may not see it but he wouldn't beat trump and I've said that constantly. Warren is a good candidate who can bridge the gap between the policies Bernie helps push without automatically throwing people under the bus. She has always been better than Bernie.
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They're both bad candidates. Bernie can't sell past his 30%-of-Democrats, and Warren can't even sell to that much of the crowd. Both those facst make me sad in different ways.
 

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Caspah said:


I'm with this guy. The video is catching a lot of heat because he calls it an ar-14, and tells a voter that he's full of shit, but honestly this makes me like Biden even more. No one else in Washington has the balls to call an idiot out like this.

He's not trying to win over a combative voter who clearly wouldn't vote for Biden regardless of what he said, but will hold to the fact that no one needs to own an assault rifle.
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David Frum? Bush's speech writer that came up with the phrase "axis of evil" which helped start the Iraq War/War on Terror?

That said, I also don't see what Biden did wrong in that video. He's just being straight up. That's better than giving a platitude.
 
Hellwarden

Hellwarden

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Oct 25, 2017
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If primaries are representative of ability to perform in the general, then yeah, Biden should be the nominee, and Bernie shouldn't.

The people who question how Bernie could win the general when can't win the primary would be right in that case. Those same people can't then turn around and say "I bet Warren could win tho."

That's just silly.
 
Qwark

Qwark

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Oct 27, 2017
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Caspah said:


I'm with this guy. The video is catching a lot of heat because he calls it an ar-14, and tells a voter that he's full of shit, but honestly this makes me like Biden even more. No one else in Washington has the balls to call an idiot out like this.

He's not trying to win over a combative voter who clearly wouldn't vote for Biden regardless of what he said, but will hold to the fact that no one needs to own an assault rifle.
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I'm a little lost on what Biden actually said, can someone explain? Was he trying to say an AR-14 was a machine gun? That's not going to be a good soundbite.

I do love the "You're full of shit" line though, channeling a potty-mouth Leslie Knope I see.
 

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jcs said:
David Frum? Bush's speech writer that came up with the phrase "axis of evil" which helped start the Iraq War/War on Terror?

That said, I also don't see what Biden did wrong in that video. He's just being straight up. That's better than giving a platitude.
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Just because he was/is a dick doesn't make his point any less valid.

Qwark said:
I'm a little lost on what Biden actually said, can someone explain? Was he trying to say an AR-14 was a machine gun? That's not going to be a good soundbite.

I do love the "You're full of shit" line though, channeling a potty-mouth Leslie Knope I see.
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The voter came at Biden trying to call him a hypocrite for only going after machine guns and assault rifles instead of handguns, citing that Biden said he was "coming for his guns." If you watch the whole video you'll see that Biden handled it well considering this guy got in his face and started yelling. This video starts when he says "you're full of shit" to the voter who claimed that Biden hated guns and was going to undo the second amendment. What followed was two people yelling over each other where the voter wouldn't listen, and Biden was sticking to the tried and true "why do you need 100 rounds to defend your home or hunt?"
 
FIREKNIGHT2029

FIREKNIGHT2029

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Oct 31, 2017
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BringBackSonics said:
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I need this same energy from Joe in the general election. That guy was an obvious Trump supporter trying to spread misinformation. Joe should be polite and answer questions but if the person he's answering questions for has an obvious agenda to spread lies and misinformation they should be called out. This clip doesn't damage Joe at all, it makes him look stronger in voters' eyes.
 
Ripcord

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Oct 30, 2017
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Ignatz Mouse said:
They're both bad candidates. Bernie can't sell past his 30%-of-Democrats, and Warren can't even sell to that much of the crowd. Both those facst make me sad in different ways.
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That's the real deal. Couple that up with Biden being a bad candidate too and it's basically frowns all around. I'm afraid that by the time people are ready for a Bernie or an AOC it'll be too late. Which would absolutely be par for the course unfortunately.
 
effzee

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NJ
jcs said:
David Frum? Bush's speech writer that came up with the phrase "axis of evil" which helped start the Iraq War/War on Terror?

That said, I also don't see what Biden did wrong in that video. He's just being straight up. That's better than giving a platitude.
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He has become a never-Trumper.

And yeah Biden can get away with this whereas in 2016 HRC wouldn't even be able to avoid or engage without it hurting her chances.
 
gutter_trash

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Caspah said:


I'm with this guy. The video is catching a lot of heat because he calls it an ar-14, and tells a voter that he's full of shit, but honestly this makes me like Biden even more. No one else in Washington has the balls to call an idiot out like this.

He's not trying to win over a combative voter who clearly wouldn't vote for Biden regardless of what he said, but will hold to the fact that no one needs to own an assault rifle.
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gun nuts will always be gun nuts and that guy is would be voting Republican no matter what.

gun nuts are hopeless
 
Madison

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according to weigel

good night for bernie - takes Idaho, North Dakota, maybe Washington
Great night for Bernie - Takes Idaho, North Dakota, Washington, maybe Michigan
 
Steel

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Oct 25, 2017
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Qwark said:
I'm a little lost on what Biden actually said, can someone explain? Was he trying to say an AR-14 was a machine gun? That's not going to be a good soundbite.

I do love the "You're full of shit" line though, channeling a potty-mouth Leslie Knope I see.
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No, he basically asked the guy if machine guns are legal, the guy said no, Biden goes on to say that making AR-15s illegal and making having high capacity illegal is just as allowed (he messes up with AR-14 the first time he says, but says AR-15 the second time). Basically the 2nd amendment doesn't mean that literally every gun is legal.

He's made the point in other settings that if your goal is to be able to fight the government, maybe we should give F-15s to people, cause that's what you need to fight the government.
 
lmcfigs

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Oct 25, 2017
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that Biden clip telling some guy he's full of shit is almost as dumb as the time he called some guy fat and challenged him to take an IQ test. Very normal behavior. Why are we enabling this.
 
Ignatz Mouse

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RoninZ said:
Or maybe there are much more notable moderates in the democratic party than progressives.
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That's not incompatible with my comment.


Bernie does not know how to sell himself to the people even a little to his right. The party as a whole is drifting left, and he's responsible for a lot of that, and yet he can't get anyone is his corner directly.
 
Steel

Steel

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Madison said:
according to weigel

good night for bernie - takes Idaho, North Dakota, maybe Washington
Great night for Bernie - Takes Idaho, North Dakota, Washington, maybe Michigan
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CNN has been pushing a 60% Bernie scenario where he takes the delegate lead as possible because of how he beat expectations in Michigan in 2016.
 
Chaotic-Strike

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Oct 25, 2017
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BDS said:
Percentage doesn't tell us anything. What is the actual number of young human beings who voted in 2016, and did it increase or decrease in 2020?

We all know old people turned out in force to vote for Biden. This isn't news.

According to the actual raw numbers, youth turnout was up in some states and down in others.

ESS8ioaWoAY_iE4
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On the bright side that's a pretty big increase in VA for the youth turnout. Bernie didn't win, but at least they showed up it's just that there was a bigger surge with older voters than younger.
 
JABEE

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Oct 25, 2017
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David Frum is not just a dick.

But his point about that clip not being bad for Biden is an opinion held by more than just war criminals.
 
RDreamer

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kambaybolongo said:
Warren managed to lose both the progressive and moderate lanes while going after both. The only people she won over were well off white liberals with college degrees (which she admittedly did very well with). Let's hold off on the revisionist history until at least the primary is over.
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In her first time campaigning against two of the most recognized politicians in the country. Biden and Sanders sucked the air out of things. I don't know that anyone was realistically ever going to take and hold either of those lanes with them there.

But I don't agree necessarily with the post you quoted. Sanders is a good candidate but his message for this particular time was poor and out of touch. It didn't lose him the fervent fan base he won from last election but it didn't bring anyone else in because it didn't speak to the country right now.

I think it's silly to necessarily label an entire candidate as poor or bad because of one campaign, and claim that's all they can ever get. Campaigns aren't set in stone. They're a product of the time and who else is around.

Biden is a poor campaigner overall but what he symbolizes and represents resonates right now more than it has in any previous year for example. Sanders is a good campaigner overall but what he said this year didn't resonate. I think Warren ran a mostly good campaign but was crowded out by big names and cemented coalitions plus weighed down by electability concerns after the democrats ran Hillary.
 
EricTheGamerman

EricTheGamerman

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Tiger Priest said:
Hopefully, this primary can be put to bed tonight so we can all focus on the real threat in November. The world's in free fall right now and we need a stable hand.
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You won't get a stable hand any quicker regardless of what happens tonight. Let it play out and stop trying to force the "it's time to focus on the real threat" down people's throats. We're in agreement, the vast majority of voters across all the primaries so far are in agreement when it comes to the voting for the nominee, we're going to be united against Trump when the time comes. "Focus on the real threat" is happening regardless of how this primary turns out unless some crazy shit goes down in the next couple weeks.
 
Richiek

Richiek

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Nov 2, 2017
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Lothars said:
Bernie has always been a bad candidate straight up, he was bad in 2016 and he's even worst now, he had some good policies but he isn't capable of winning the nomination. You may not see it but he wouldn't beat trump and I've said that constantly. Warren is a good candidate who can bridge the gap between the policies Bernie helps push without automatically throwing people under the bus. She has always been better than Bernie.
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This right here. Bernie supporters who counter with "Bu-bu-but Warren did worse!" doesn't change the fact that he's still a bad candidate.
 
Kusagari

Kusagari

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Oct 25, 2017
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Tamanon said:
The left will soon be compressed down to the size of a Bernie Sanders cutout at this rate if they are kicking out one of the strongest voices for progressive causes this past decade.
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They already want to cancel AOC over everything. "The left" as it's defined by people like Krystal Ball won't exist after Bernie Sanders is gone, because that's all "the left" really is to them.
 
OP
OP
Poodlestrike

Poodlestrike

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Oct 25, 2017
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lmcfigs said:
It doesn't really seem like Biden has to do this.
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Hm.

That's honestly kind of an interesting take. The new left feeling like it's not being properly catered to - because truly it's *never* been catered to - is a real problem, and in a future election that doesn't feature a Bernie Sanders locking so much of it down I think you'll see people do that more.

For now, I was thinking of the smaller gradations in policy inside the party. And to a lesser extent experience working with Republicans but honestly that doesn't actually count for shit at this point.
 
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