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Democratic Presidential Primaries & Caucuses |March OT| Last Tuesday was 1000 years ago, old news no one cares about (Discussion Guidelines in OP)

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Volimar

Volimar

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Colonel Mustard said:
Is the BoiseTimes a satire page?

www.theboisetimes.com

Joe Biden Mistakes Idaho for Iowa in Visit to Boise Fundraiser

Joe Biden Mistakes Idaho for Iowa in Visit to Boise Fundraiser. How a private fundraiser meant to consolidate Idaho's Democratic Party ended
www.theboisetimes.com www.theboisetimes.com
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Today, the Boise Times boasts multiple Putilzer Prizes for ground breaking journalism. As Idaho's number #1 source for satirical and parody news, The Boise Times is intended for entertainment only and is protected under fair use.
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Wordballoons

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Oct 30, 2017
1,061
gnarlyxcharlie said:
Hillary was a sure thing in 2016 and ended up losing. With Biden, I feel more confident about the swing states, but we are going to see six or seven months of attacks on his alleged cognitive decline. I don't feel good about it.
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The cockiness was unbearable. Everyone thought she was going to have a Reagan-esque map ... not so much. I hadn't even considered that we could lose the rust-belt before she completely dropped the ball and insulted half the country. Still don't get how you watch Romney make the same mistake and then just go ahead and do it yourself. Terrible instincts.
 
Reyes

Reyes

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Coolest Person in the One Piece OT > Cantiam
Colonel Mustard said:
Is the BoiseTimes a satire page?

It is, good.
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Seems like it:

www.theboisetimes.com

Taco Bell Seeks Naming Rights for State Capitol

We've got the Taco Bell Arena, so why not the Taco Bell State Capitol? This week Taco Bell LLC. released a press release announcing their plans to explore buying the naming rights for the Idaho State Capital building. The current license is owned by the State of Idaho which is set to expire...
www.theboisetimes.com www.theboisetimes.com

www.theboisetimes.com

Idaho State Flag Revision Passes Sub-Committee, Heading to Vote

The Idaho State Historical Committee has picked the final design to replace the Idaho State Flag. This new flag features a well known symbol to Idahoans: the Potato. “Potatoes put Idaho on the map,” Committee Chair Ronald Spaulding said. “Most people haven’t even heard of Idaho, but they’ve...
www.theboisetimes.com www.theboisetimes.com

Or at least thats what I'm getting
 

Deleted member 4346

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Kyra said:
Trump cannot be handled with kid gloves. Bernie is vicious against his allies. Imagine how he would be against Trump. I don't see Biden bringing the same fire.
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Biden won't bring fire, but he appeals to a different voter than Bernie. "A return to normalcy" is a strong sell for older moderate voters, who don't like the chaos and scandal of Trump, but who are resistant to the kind of broad change that Bernie is running on. Biden loses younger voters and especially POC, chills turnout, but maybe picks up some Obama > Trump voters. I'm very interested in what the general election looks like. I think Biden walks away with it if we get a big economic collapse. If not, it's going to be really wild.

One thing I haven't seen much talk about yet is that Trump is going to have massive donor support. In 2016 he didn't have the kind of GOP donor backing that Clinton did. This time around is much different. This will be the most expensive presidential race in history I think by a wide margin.

The whole thing is gross and embarrassing, really. Two old white racists, backed by billions of dollars from corporations and the nation's wealthiest people, yelling at each other on TV, lying, lobbing insults, and making threats. It's the worst elements of America on display.
 
FIREKNIGHT2029

FIREKNIGHT2029

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Oct 31, 2017
3,287
DrewFu said:
The narratives in this thread are really something...

Biden can't beat Trump - even though the polls show otherwise.
Bernie would do better against Trump - even though he's likely to get destroyed within his own party during these primaries.
Biden will get destroyed by Trump in debates - even though Trump is a terrible debater.

Seriously, WTF is going on in this thread?
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People make up their narratives as they go along even if those narratives aren't rooted in facts or reality. Anything that helps them believe that their candidate is the only right choice.
 
YamchasRevenge

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fierygunrob said:
A lot of us are worried about Biden vs Trump because it feels a lot like "trying the same failing strategy over and over and maybe it will work this time." Sanders is at the very least something different, and anecdotally, I know people who wouldn't normally vote democrat who would vote for him. I know this hasn't played out in the primary, but I also don't know a ton of people who vote in primaries.

Kerry was ahead in Kerry/Bush polling this time in 2004 as well.
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For the last time, it's not about ideology. Voters don't give a shit. It's about personality/likability. Hillary was -14 by this point in 2016.

Favorability ratings (BATTLEGROUND states RV)
Biden: 49/46 (+3)
Trump: 43/56 (-13)
Sanders: 38/58 (-20)
 
mentalfloss

mentalfloss

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Apharmd said:
The whole thing is gross and embarrassing, really. Two old white racists, backed by billions of dollars from corporations and the nation's wealthiest people, yelling at each other on TV, lying, lobbing insults, and making threats. It's the worst elements of America on display.
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The false equivalence between Biden and Trump is laughable.

Biden has the black and Latino vote and just got endorsed by Kamala and yet he's a racist.

Bernie bros aren't even trying anymore.
 
Volimar

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I've watched quite a few Sanders rallies and this one seems to emphasize defeating Trump and only some differentiating himself from Biden. A change in tone maybe?
 

Crocodile

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TheLostBigBoss said:
Ok, well you do that. I can't imagine taking an Axios article hypothetically talking about cabinet positions at face value... over half a year out from the election, but you do you.

Again, I'm bored and tired of the insinuations that if you're not with Sanders, you don't care about people being unable to afford medical care, who can't afford basic things like insulin. It's ridiculous, very self serving that people keep presenting this picture that only folks who support Sanders have peoples best interest in mind, and everyone else are shills who are laughing and lighting cigars as people die or something. So you can keep doing what you're doing, but the only time you've ever engaged me in this thread has been with open hostility so I'm gonna step back from this table. You can engage with other folks.
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I think these two tweets comment well on why "if you aren't with me 100% then you're against me" is not helpful and frustrating:



 

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mentalfloss said:
The false equivalence between Biden and Trump is laughable.

Biden just got endorsed by Kamala and yet he's a racist.

Bernie bros aren't even trying anymore.
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I don't follow this logic. Having an endorsement from a black politician means that you aren't a racist? I mean, Trump got an endorsement from Ben Carson, lol. Can it be an endorsement from any random black person or are there some qualifiers?

The "black friend defense" doing a lot of heavy lifting here.
 
Equippedwithtowel

Equippedwithtowel

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Wordballoons said:
I'm starting to feel like the amoral gay guy bit is getting out of hand. He is weasely, though. His approach to politics puts a lot of people off.
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How is it a bit to point out that someone with his private and public sector record is totally disingenuous?

Military intelligence, vacationing to somaliland, mckinzie, his record on race

all of these things point to someone who sees manipulation and amoral calculation as a regular part of their decision making
 
Aaron

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Fhtagn said:
This kind of logic is weird to me, given that the reasons people think Biden will likely lose to Trump aren't baked into the polls. People like Biden because of nostalgia for Obama but once they understand who he really is after months of news stories and ads hammering on his record and bizarre behavior/gaffes, it's going to be a much tighter race at best.

That said, I was much more confident in "Biden loses to Trump" before the COVID-19 situation, which may change everything.
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I'm gonna be real with you, I just don't find "but Biden will have to deal with months of negative campaigning!" that convincing as it ignores that literally every candidate in existence would face that same kind of scrutiny. Bernie would have his past statements and votes brought up too.

And while Biden's said and done some rancid shit, it all gets trumped by "he was Obama's VP for eight years," full stop. Anything he did before that might as well not even matter. I could very well be wrong, I just don't see any attack that draws on pre-2009 Biden's record being very effective.

Anyone watching the polling numbers in 2016 would have known Hillary had some massive liabilities going forward, and that just hasn't been the case for Biden. Bernie's -14 favorability and Biden's +3 mirrors Bernie's +3 and Hillary's -14 from this point in 2016 too perfectly.

Also don't think Trump will (as effectively, anyway) be able to gish gallop his way through poor approval ratings this time because unlike in 2016, he's the incumbent and he has a political record. The fact that he was running as the insurgent in 2016 allowed people to more or less wishcast their ideal positions onto him, and that just can't happen this time. He's been doing this for three years now, you can't pretend he's going to enter office as some kind of rational centrist. Like I pointed out, swing voters thought Trump was closer to the center in 2016 than Hillary, think about that for a moment. 90% of this is projection.

Again - could very well be wrong on all of this! Let's just not pretend like "Biden will definitely lose" is anything more than a gut feeling.
 
Jeremy

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Apharmd said:
I don't follow this logic. Having an endorsement from a black politician means that you aren't a racist? I mean, Trump got an endorsement from Ben Carson, lol. Can it be an endorsement from any random black person or are there some qualifiers?

The "black friend defense" doing a lot of heavy lifting here.
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I'm embarrassed for you, that you are doubling down on your false equivalency between Trump and Biden's levels of racism.

Biden definitely is problematic, but you're doing yourself no favors rhetorically.
 
Kirblar

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Equippedwithtowel said:
How is it a bit to point out that someone with his private and public sector record is totally disingenuous?

Military intelligence, vacationing to somaliland, mckinzie, his record on race

all of these things point to someone who sees manipulation and amoral calculation as a regular part of their decision making
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The idea that working in intelligence makes one "amoral".... doesn't track.

You can point to him having no ideological bearings and flipflopping all over the place trying to find open space in the primary without having to make it ugly and personal. Because it's a real issue and a gigantic red flag.
 
Fhtagn

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this thread is about to go off the rails from the above take about endorsements making someone "not racist"
 
Equippedwithtowel

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Kirblar said:
The idea that working in intelligence makes one "amoral".... doesn't track.

You can point to him having no ideological bearings and flipflopping all over the place trying to find open space in the primary without having to make it ugly and personal. Because it's a real issue and a gigantic red flag.
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i'm sorry but i consider people who willingly sign up for america's imperial death machine as a resume booster (say right out of the ivy's) to be morally compromised.

it's okay that you disagree kirb but you're not gonna convince me

Pete has strong Kim Roosevelt energy
 

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Jeremy said:
I'm embarrassed for you, that you are doubling down on your false equivalency between Trump and Biden's levels of racism.

Biden definitely is problematic, but you're doing yourself no favors rhetorically.
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The poster's argument is that Biden isn't a racist because he has an endorsement from a black politician and so cannot be a racist. We are past the point of embarrassing ourselves here my friend. That's... not a valid defense of Joe Biden's record on race.
 

Wordballoons

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Equippedwithtowel said:
How is it a bit to point out that someone with his private and public sector record is totally disingenuous?

Military intelligence, vacationing to somaliland, mckinzie, his record on race

all of these things point to someone who sees manipulation and amoral calculation as a regular part of their decision making
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Hey, I don't disagree with you. I think he's terrible and I have always hated him. I've certainly called him a rat on plenty of occasions. I don't think he's particularly worse on this than Klobuchar or Biden, though. Maybe it pops more because he's younger/worse at it but I didn't get why it stuck on him more than the others.
 

Deleted member 42484

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Garrett 2U said:
This narrative that Biden can't beat Trump is wild to me.
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I agree.

As much as I support Bernie/Warren and the progressive movement, I actually feel Biden has a better chance than anyone. He clearly has a following given the ST results, he will do well in the rust belt states, and I can't see how he'd be at all unappealing to anyone even considering voting for Trump.

With that said I think any of them could have beaten Trump. The "Trump's going to win" or "Trump2020" thing is all propaganda. Even in the red states, I know a lot of people upset and disillusioned. People like Clint Eastwood and that Evangelical magazine are turning their backs.

I think Biden will win, honestly.
 
Volimar

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I hate the parts of rallies where it's just "Opponent did this" "BOOOOOOOO", but "I did this!" YAAAAAAAAYYYYYY" Seems so juvenile.
 

Deleted member 42484

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Maledict said:
One guy is accused or rape and sexual assault by multiple women across literally decades. An ex-wife claimed he raped her. Denies it all and makes fun of those who accused him, and other sexual assault victims.

The other has some weird looking clips, and not a single alleged crime. has apologised if he ever made anyone feel uncomfortable. Has the backing of almost every major woman's group on the left.

This ridiculous and insulting technique people have of saying the two are the same is frankly disgusting and just goes to show that you don't care about the issue at all - it's purely political points scoring
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Yup. Although I do think Biden's little moments are weird, they don't actually cross a legal line and I consider it "old creepy man at retirement home" type of activity.

Trump is a rapist. He should be charged with sexual assault.
 
Equippedwithtowel

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Wordballoons said:
Hey, I don't disagree with you. I think he's terrible and I have always hated him. I've certainly called him a rat on plenty of occasions. I don't think he's particularly worse on this than Klobuchar or Biden, though. Maybe it pops more because he's younger/worse at it but I didn't get why it stuck on him more than the others.
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klob and biden are at least career public servants as terrible as their own records are

pete gives the vibe of that one guy in every poli sci program with a double major who will just go into their plans for elected office out of nowhere

i have a very particular loathing for that kind of person
 
Br3wnor

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Cheebo said:
I mean to be fair, even if Bernie wins in a tight election in MI that still means its over for Bernie as well. Because Biden will extend his lead regardless by winning the southern states tomorrow by 20-30% points.

Bernie has to win MI in a landslide to makeup for the delegates Biden will amass in the south tomorrow.
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Not to mention Biden's (likely) 30+ point win in Florida next week. It's getting late early as they say, Bernie not w/ alot of options moving forward. But if he loses Michigan by 20+ (these recent polls seem too good to be true for Biden, I'm skeptical) then it's blouses. His ONLY hope is retaining white working class voters in numbers like he had against Hillary, and so far that's not happening. Rest of his coalition isn't going to save him w/ the states that remain if he doesn't get non college educated whites back in his camp by a much larger margin.
 
schuelma

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TheLostBigBoss said:
Ok, so maybe it might be a complete blow out...
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I suspect a 10-15 Biden victory is the most likely scenario. These polls still have a decent amount of no response/undecideds and I would bet most of the impact of Bernie's blanketing the state the last 2 days hasn't really been captured. I'd be shocked if Bernie won though.
 

ChippyTurtle

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Don't be surprised at Bernie actually losing. Consolidation, and momentum and probably a dose of "end this already" is taking a poll on his poll numbers.
 
mo60

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The only contest I think sanders will win at this point in this primary is democrats abroad. Sanders is likely going to barely lose or be blown out elsewhere.
 
Aaron

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YamchasRevenge said:
Biden beating Trump by 7 in Michigan
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This seems pretty informative:

For voters who backed a third party candidate four years ago, their 2020 intentions favor the eventual Democratic nominee (55% Biden to 17% Trump and 48% Sanders to 18% Trump). Among those who did not vote at all in 2016, the race is more evenly divided (45% Biden to 43% Trump and 47% Sanders to 41% Trump).
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And from what I can tell, tracks with studies on non-voters - they come in all stripes, if you got everyone to vote I don't think bottom line numbers would change that much (minor advantage to the Democrats, probably).

Winning over the people who, to their credit, actually assed themselves to vote in 2016 even if it was for a third party, is probably more generally conducive to putting together a winning coalition.
 
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