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Deleted member 4346

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,976
To be fair, people in this thread talking about PoC have consistently forgotten about Latinos in Nevada.

It's erasure. If Bernie ends up losing the primary, it's such a shame, because in early contests he was able to mobilize lots of Latino support, among others. For some of these people, it's their first time engaging with this process. I hope we don't lose them.
 

skeptem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,745
Democrats: We need to compromise!

Bernie Sanders: We should move slightly to the left like the rest of the civilized world..

Democrats: Not THAT kind of compromise!!

I honestly think that it's more:

Democrats: We need to win!

Bernie Sanders: We should move slightly to the left like the rest of the civilized world..

Democrats: Too radical, we might lose swing voters!!
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,086
No

Racism brought about the election of Trump
If this is the only takeaway from 2016 then it's clear nobody is prepared to beat Trump in 2020.
The Tea Party was in large part due to Obamacare so it's hard to imagine how a bill eliminates private insurance and transforms the entire economy would lead to less right-wing backlash.

Any big left-wing policies will drive more right-wing hate. That's not an argument against Bernie, just trying to be clear here.
There's a reason the ACA still hasn't been repealed. It's really hard to take something away from people after giving it to them. A rightward push after a potential MC4A pass is still a massive net gain because anybody who votes to repeal it is not getting reelected, D or R.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,959
I don't see Warren disdain. Just reality setting in that she is getting zero delegates. It's just Biden vs Bernie now.

I can't imagine anyone having anything resembling disdain for Warren, woman's awesome.

It's just become clear she doesn't have the support that Sanders has and it would be great to see them coordinate to help their collectively progressive movement win this time.
 

VirtuaModel

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,712
Did my part and voted for Bernie Sanders. I think I'll do other things instead of following the news all day, though. I'll just see what's happening tomorrow morning.
 

Stellar

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
758
GCB is ~+8 right now
Biden is polling well above the required +2.5 to have a high chance of winning the EC vs the popular vote buffer.
Biden is maintaining the suburban swing we saw continue from 2016 -> 2018 -> 2020
Biden is the current candidate who is polling in relation to gaining a Democratic majority Senate

Anyone saying "Biden is four more years of Trump" are talking out of their ass.

Hahaha oh man it's 2016 all over again.
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,220
What? Yesterday I was told Nevada doesn't count for Bernie POC vote because it was a caucus and then was repeatedly told Bernie only appeals to white people. As someone who is POC, I am increasingly annoyed/infuriated by my voice being silenced and stuffed into somewhere else for convinience.
You're referring to my post, and I was saying that caucuses are unrepresentative of the locations they take place in and I never once said that Bernie didn't have POC. I was just repeating something I've been saying this entire primaries: caucuses are disenfranchisement by the very nature of being caucuses.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,179
User banned (until July 22nd): 2nd violation of the staff post; hostility over multiple posts
If you vote for Biden, you are actively voting to kill me and the people I care about and to create a hellworld where it is a crime to be poor.

Fuck you forever if you support Biden.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
What? Yesterday I was told Nevada doesn't count for Bernie POC vote because it was a caucus and then was repeatedly told Bernie only appeals to white people. As someone who is POC, I am increasingly annoyed/infuriated by my voice being silenced and stuffed into somewhere else for convinience.

You were? I saw a lot of praise for Sanders in Nevada last week, especially with his ability to attract the latino voting population, which has been rather illusive in the general election and could be a key point for nominating Sanders over Biden.

I've seen a lot of people give credit where it's due with Sanders, he has expanded his base. But in the same breath, as we saw in SC, he falls into the same pitfalls as 2016 (especially when he literally repeats the same shit by dismissing the voters of SC).
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,360
It's erasure. If Bernie ends up losing the primary, it's such a shame, because in early contests he was able to mobilize lots of Latino support, among others. For some of these people, it's their first time engaging with this process. I hope we don't lose them.


Honestly for the most part I think it's just people using PoC when they mean black people, and not meaning to refer to Latinos in the first place.
 

Deleted member 179

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,548
The issue with Biden and even if he wins. America will not improve for the better. It'll stay exactly as it is the day Biden gets in, the new Republican will run on the Democrats failing to improve America and then they go right back into a horrible position.
I know, and I'm worried about that. But I will still take it over the dumbass up top right now. I've had too many depressive episodes over our current state with him in power, I can't do it.
 

Zornack

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,134
As i said before, the GOP haven't even touched Biden yet, his poll numbers are going to be tested hard soon enough.
In fact the GOP & Fox News seem to be attacking Bernie more for some reason, i guess they believe hes the front runner still.

We just had months of the GOP/FOX talking about Biden/Ukraine.
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,102
The Biden campaign has been lazy as hell. He's not in his current position because of a good campaign strategy. At best he's where he is because he's the last candidate available who won't meaningfully try to change our nation's wealth inequality or interventionist foreign policy and many institutions support that. Progressives have to fight more than just the other candidates in the primary.
So you think black voters came out and voted for him in a massive wave because "he's the last candidate available who won't meaningfully try to change our nation's wealth inequality or interventionist foreign policy"?

Im not going to refute that he's run a shitty campaign but he's in the position he's in because of those voters.
 

Jarate

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,614
Imagine, it's 2020, and you embrace Joe Biden

Voting against universal healthcare because a twitter Bernie bro got upset at me for maintaining the status quo
 

Hoot

Member
Nov 12, 2017
2,105
User Banned (1 Week): Ignoring staff post; hostility.
At this point, people still voting for Warren are putting their own spite before the needs of the poor

Gonna just bunker down and be there for my friends in the future. American neolibs cannot be trusted and never should be, they have chosen barbarism
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,959
Where you went wrong is actually thinking that a "fix" is possible. You can't fix human nature. Selfish, fear/disdain of "others," etc.

Don't get me wrong, I got my Bernie vote in today. But I've never been under the impression that a progressive can actually win.

Sad, but ultimately true.

My optimism gets the best of me sometimes.

Our greatest enemy is, indeed, our nature.

:/
 

Znazzy

Member
Aug 27, 2018
1,241
GCB is ~+8 right now
Biden is polling well above the required +2.5 to have a high chance of winning the EC vs the popular vote buffer.
Biden is maintaining the suburban swing we saw continue from 2016 -> 2018 -> 2020
Biden is the current candidate who is polling in relation to gaining a Democratic majority Senate

Anyone saying "Biden is four more years of Trump" are talking out of their ass.
Thank you! It's so ridiculous and annoying. Polls are 100% certainty when it comes to Bernie beating Trump, but the same exact polls that say Biden will beat Trump are incorrect. Makes so much sense..
It's crazy how hard Era's shift in tone towards Bernie has become. About 4-5 months ago everyone was Warren and you were generally laughed at if you were rooting for Bernie. Now generally every thread is full of Bernie love and Warren disdain. I've wanted Bernie since 2016 so I'm very happy to see his massive momentum gains, but man people are fickle as fuck.
It just further solidifies that this is sadly just a game to so many people.
 

blackw0lf48

Member
Jan 2, 2019
2,935
This article makes a strong case that if Warren does well in delegates tonight, even if technically she didn't have a mathematical path to the nomination, she should stay in because it could benefit Bernie.

https://theintercept.com/2020/03/03/warren-sanders-working-families-party/

One reason I'm thinking Warren should stay in, at least through the next debate, is that she is increasingly focusing her criticism on Biden (see her speech last night) and on a debate stage she could severely hurt Biden that I don't think Bernie can. I love Bernie, but I don't think he's as strong on the attack, which is to his credit since he's a genuinely nice guy. Warren though can really do damage to Biden if she goes after him.

Having Warren go after Biden and Bloomberg, and Bernie stay above the fray, would be a good scenario for Bernie.
 

OfficerRob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,084
Bernie will absolutely beat Trump
Bernie is certain to lose to Trump
Biden is certain to lose to Trump
Biden will absolutely beat Trump

ALL of these are lazy twitter style hot takes. The reality is we have no idea, but based on polling, both would have a slight edge on Trump. The only certainty is that if you are certain either is a guaranteed win or loss, you are not being rational.
 

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
So you think black voters came out and voted for him in a massive wave because "he's the last candidate available who won't meaningfully try to change our nation's wealth inequality or interventionist foreign policy"?

Im not going to refute that he's run a shitty campaign but he's in the position he's in because of those voters.

Black People in SC voted for him because he was, in their eyes, the safe candidate coupled with the huge endorsement helping driving people over the edge towards him. It's why Biden's camp is pushing out all the endorsements over the last few days to hopefully repeat it.
 

Jroc

Banned
Jun 9, 2018
6,145
Yang is a libertarian whose UBI proposal was a literal TRGR plan (if you got government benefits from other safety nets they'd count against the $1000, so it would only go to people not currently using any social safety nets) which appealed to young single men since they're the least likely group to be on any sort of social safety nets. He was literally the left critique/fear of UBI programs incarnate!

A lot of his ideas felt more like rough-drafts, but I liked hearing a candidate actually talk about reforming things in a new and interesting way. That's why I would like to see him have some sort of influence, or at the very least work with others to nail down the best way a UBI program could work.

Then again I'm also evil and might support something that benefits 90% of people if it means 10% are slightly worse off.
 

Chitown B

Member
Nov 15, 2017
9,596
Trump won by the absolute skin of his teeth and has been on the backfoot his entire presidency. He hasn't destroyed any one other than the people he's harmed through his tenure, both domestically and abroad.

Y'all fall for the swindle so easily lmao

SCOTUS. We should have a 6/3 Liberal majority by now. If Trump wins again it's 7/2 conservative. Breyer ain't lasting forever and RBG is out soon.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
I know, and I'm worried about that. But I will still take it over the dumbass up top right now. I've had too many depressive episodes over our current state with him in power, I can't do it.
I don't disagree. I just feel a lot of people will either not vote or just vote Trump cause if you are voting for more of the same, why change?
I think it's dumb, just know that's how a lot of people think
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,360
It just further solidifies that this is sadly just a game to so many people.


I don't think that's it. There was a sense that Era was anti Bernie for some time thanks to a vocal small minority of shitposters. But once we had the poll that showed how favored Bernie was, I think it made people more comfortable to be vocal about their support.
 

Deleted member 5322

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,523
So you think black voters came out and voted for him in a massive wave because "he's the last candidate available who won't meaningfully try to change our nation's wealth inequality or interventionist foreign policy"?

Im not going to refute that he's run a shitty campaign but he's in the position he's in because of those voters.
You don't think him having been Obama's VP had anything to do with it?
 

mztik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,258
Tokyo, Japan
The democratic party really doesn't like Bernie, huh? A lot of candidates dropping and joining Biden. Didn't they bash Biden at the debates? Now they're all "change of heart, I'm with you now". What a compromise.

Politicians...
 

TooBusyLookinGud

Graphics Engineer
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
7,939
California
The Biden campaign has been lazy as hell. He's not in his current position because of a good campaign strategy. At best he's where he is because he's the last candidate available who won't meaningfully try to change our nation's wealth inequality or interventionist foreign policy and many institutions support that. Progressives have to fight more than just the other candidates in the primary.
Once everyone realizes that the fight isn't really against Trump or Republicans, but the structure of business power in politics, then you will get your change. Democrats are just as guilty as Republicans in this regard.
 

LProtagonist

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
7,576
The clear problem here is that there is no progressive party in the United States and the two parties we have are controlled by corporate interests and therefore will never be progressive.

There are progressives in the Democratic party, but that's only because it's the only place for them to be, not because they agree with the establishment's ideals.
 

Rodderick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,667
The democratic party really doesn't like Bernie, huh? A lot of candidates dropping and joining Biden. Didn't they bash Biden at the debates? Now they're all "change of heart, I'm with you now". What a compromise.

Politicians...

Politicians dropping out and endorsing a candidate that's more aligned with them. Never happened before, it's a ploy to stop Bernie.
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
The Democratic Party is as obligated to its donors as the Republicans, just different sets of donors. The party has hardly fought for workers since the Clinton presidency. But you're right about white workers turning their backs on the Dems largely because of civil rights. I... don't know what to do about that. And no one, outside of Hillary Clinton for one brief moment in 2016, seems to be willing to hold these voters feet to the fire publicly.
"What do we do about that" has been the problem for the Dems for the past 50+ years, because it's been THE thing keeping them from political power. The populace getting more metropolitan/educated actively helps fight that as both those things assist the party with getting power in the House on a national level, but the problem is that the Senate and EC don't benefit the Dems from those changes (yet) to the same degree because of the demographics differences, which became unfortunately clear in 2020. The (bad) solution besides waiting for the EC PV compact to come online is to add more states to the Senate to try and compensate for this, but to even do that you have to fight and win the uphill battle in national elections.
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,470
The Biden campaign has been lazy as hell. He's not in his current position because of a good campaign strategy. At best he's where he is because he's the last candidate available who won't meaningfully try to change our nation's wealth inequality or interventionist foreign policy and many institutions support that. Progressives have to fight more than just the other candidates in the primary.

This is how I'm feeling about it as well, honestly.

Once everyone realizes that the fight isn't really against Trump or Republicans, but the structure of business power in politics, then you will get your change. Democrats are just as guilty as Republicans in this regard.

Aaaaand also this.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
Thank you! It's so ridiculous and annoying. Polls are 100% certainty when it comes to Bernie beating Trump, but the same exact polls that say Biden will beat Trump are incorrect. Makes so much sense..

It just further solidifies that this is sadly just a game to so many people.
Polls aren't 100% certain either way, last election proved that.

I just know for a chance that Biden has no chance in hell against Trump. Trump has literally been preparing and gathering dirt on Biden, hell he got impeached over it.

Biden is Trump's choice of opponent, give Trump what he wants during the election he wins. Bernie at least stands a chance.
 

Deleted member 10224

User requested account closure
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Oct 27, 2017
360
It's going to be so much fun reading about how Trump is flying all over the country doing rallies 24/7 while Biden's senile old ass is staying in some hotel room or trying to raise money in NY. And when he actually decides to go out campaigning he will say/do something stupid... It's going to be so embarrassing.
 

nintendoman58

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,109
Reminder for today:

Biden came in fourth in Iowa.

Biden came in fifth in New Hampshire.

Biden wasn't even close to beating Bernie in Nevada.

Biden has only one office in California compared to Sanders' 23.

Biden's presence in Super Tuesday states has been largely non-existent.

Anyone can answer a poll at home. To actually get out and vote is another matter entirely.
 
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