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Mar 9, 2018
3,766
Warren must act now and avoid being known as Elizabeth-Worsen-the-progressive-chance-at-victory, which would be incredibly difficult to write on most forms. There is still time to beat Biden.

VOTE BERNIE NO MATTER WHAT! Give him the power he needs, even if Worsen-the doesn't come to our aid. Give him the best hand possible.
 

Seattle6418

Member
Oct 25, 2017
528
Brasília Brazil
I don´t know why would anyone believe Mike Bloomberg, a guy running just in case Biden can´t get it done, will stay in the race after tomorrow.

Only question is if he drops out Tuesday night or on Wednesday.

His delegates will 100% go to Biden, and his campaign infrastructure and staff as well.
 

Deleted member 4346

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,976
I'm beginning to realize I honestly don't care much at all for the Democrat party. I care about Sanders and I care about Progressive policies. It just so happens that once in a blue moon the Democrat party acts as a vehicle for those policies.

The rest of the time they're embarrassing and untrustworthy.

I wish the party would become more progressive in the future but it seems they want to just be Republican-lite.

This is my stance anymore. It's embarrassing. It's a party of people who are largely beholden utterly to the billionaire class, and who don't represent workers.
 

Exellus

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
2,348
The funny thing about this whole "Win SC = Win the Nomination" setup is that SC is definitely voting GOP in the GE...
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
Can somebody please explain to me a Biden GOTV strategy for the summer and fall that doesn't implode like it did for HRC?
 

kambaybolongo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,063
Yep, which is why they will lose in November. This place is going to collapse on itself in the process. People say they will write in Bernie is why Dems stay losing.
No, Democrats lose because they actively work against grassroots movements and push unlikable Centrist candidates like Biden who are severely compromised, scandal ridden, and inspire 0 voter enthusiasm.
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,543
If she loses her home state I'd say she's nearly guaranteed to drop.


I dunno. There's some merit to being the last one out once Bloomberg shuts down. Though I don't think there's much she wants aside from the office, she'd have tremendous bargaining power.
 

skullmuffins

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,426
It's funny how people get angry and complain about Bernie or Bust voters (or third party voters), but never acknowledge that the supposed "moderate swing voters" we supposedly have to fellate every 4 years are doing the exact same thing. Another example of how everything in this country is structurally anti-left wing. If you're a moderate that might vote Republican because the Democrat is too left-wing, you're "hostage taking" the same way that any left-wing non or third-party voter is!

Which is fine, as mentioned in my previous post, I don't have any special issue with "hostage-taking" in and of itself. That's the nature of any election. But it's obvious that only one type of hostage taker gets complained about and yelled at, lol.
i mean a mushy middle type voter who swings back and forth voting for the candidate they feel most closely represents them isn't the same kind of "hostage taking" as a left wing person who sits out because the most left nominee isn't left enough for their tastes, indirectly helping the most right wing candidate
 

Pilgrimzero

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,129
It's sad that our country is so broken and abused that Biden who will do nothing to help out country in any meaningful way is considered a better candidate by many.

Some people feel that going back to the way it was is preferable to having it really get better.

Just makes no sense to me
 

Regulus Tera

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,458
Moderate dems have voted in favor of funding those camps instead of shutting them down outright. And they fell out of the news cycle pretty quickly and don't appear to be a top point of discussion in this primary.

I've just grown to hate having to compromise on things that should be beyond the pale. The Democratic party treats the Overton window as the ceiling, while the Republican party treats it as the floor.

Over the past 20 years, I have been sapped of all enthusiasm and vote not in expectation of tangible results, but out of a sense of guilt that I don't want to be one of many who do literally nothing to stem the rise of fascism.
I voted for Sanders in the primary here in Houston, I get what you are saying. But I feel like some of the Bernie fans are not grasping that the damage the Trump administration is doing is not only about tax cuts for the rich or disparaging income inequality. The dude is creating a much more fundamental rift at the core of the trust in American institutions which reminds me a lot of how governments in Latin America are perceived. That's going to have much more enduring repercussions, especially in a country with the military power and global clout of the US.
 

ostrichKing

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,472
No, Democrats lose because they actively work against grassroots movements and push unlikable Centrist candidates like Biden who are severely compromised, scandal ridden, and inspire 0 voter enthusiasm.
Or...they lose because democrats don't understand that if their guy/girl loses, and they don't vote for the eventual nominee no matter what...the other side (which has proven to be far far worse- AND DOES go out to vote no matter the nominee) wins...
 

BADMAN

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,887
Today's events got you feeling down? Phone banking will make you feel better. I guarantee it.

berniesanders.com

Make Calls for Bernie Now!

Make calls to voters from home to help grow our grassroots movement and win! Can you hop on the phones to make sure Bernie wins this election?
 
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Deleted member 3896

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,815
Here is my thing, Now that we know that many people have this attitude and there is nothing we can do about it. What drives us to go ahead with our plan anyways? Is whatever the answer is a preferable thing to maintain over maintaining a Trump presidency?
I'm not sure I'm following exactly, can you clarify what you mean?
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
9,271
The funny thing about this whole "Win SC = Win the Nomination" setup is that SC is definitely voting GOP in the GE...
That's entirely irrelevant. The Primary is about Democrats choosing who they want to represent them. Democrats in SC deserve just as much say in that as Democrats anywhere else.
 

Rampage

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,140
Metro Detriot
Why do you think the Left owes the DNC anything?

End of the day- you not voting for Bernie or the DNC- you are voting for peoples quality of life. Period.

True progressive will vote for incremental change over no change. Or in the era of Trump- to win the Supreme Court back to protect women and minority lives. I too want unicorns and rainbows, but we are never going to get there if people sit out because their choose savior is not elected.

You want a better party- become part of the solution by joining and change from within. Or form a collation that funds "Bernie-like" progressive down ballot. What you don't do, is chase away allies with purity test and then demand they vote for you.

In seriously looking toward Biden over Bernie if Warren has no hope. Because Biden appreciates my vote and has a record of getting shit done in government by forming collations with Dems and Reps. Bernie views both as the enemy- so getting anyone to follow him is going to be an uphill battle.
 

Vestal

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
2,297
Tampa FL
Why do you think the Left owes the DNC anything?
So what would you have the DNC do?

if neither candidate has both majority of delegates or majority of the vote?

let's say Bernie gets more delegates but less raw vote and Biden gets higher vote total. Who should be the nominee? What if it's reversed?


will you support 1 over the other regardless of who it is if they have both delegate lead and raw vote lead?
 

schuelma

Member
Oct 24, 2017
5,901
It's sad that our country is so broken and abused that Biden who will do nothing to help out country in any meaningful way is considered a better candidate by many.

Some people feel that going back to the way it was is preferable to having it really get better.

Just makes no sense to me

this is absurd. Biden replacing RBG alone would be a huge win over Trump. This equating non-Bernie Dems to Donald Trump is ridiculous.
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,220
I dunno. There's some merit to being the last one out once Bloomberg shuts down. Though I don't think there's much she wants aside from the office, she'd have tremendous bargaining power.
She'll have gained enough delegates to have bargaining power after Super Tuesday. I don't think she can make a reasonable case to even herself to keep going and raising money if she can't even win her home state.
 
Oct 25, 2017
21,466
Sweden
Ugh I'm so torn. I live in AZ and got my early ballot by mail (one of the few things the state does right!) I've been a Warren supporter and want to vote her in the primary. At the same time, I'd be nearly or close to equally happy with Bernie. But I hate the idea of a contested convention. So I'm struggling with voting for the one I want, or the one that I think deserves the nomination with the higher delegate count. Not that it may matter. I've been holding off sending my ballot until I see tomorrow's results.
i voted tactically in the latest swedish election and i'm happy i did. tactical voting like mine was crucial to shut the racist party out from power
 

Uncle at Nintendo

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Jan 3, 2018
8,606
Good thing I invested heavily in Biden on predictit after Iowa. If Dems are gonna be dumb as fuck and nominate Weekend at Joes and give us 4 more years of Mr. Deals I may as well make some money out of it.
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,543
It's sad that our country is so broken and abused that Biden who will do nothing to help out country in any meaningful way is considered a better candidate by many.

Some people feel that going back to the way it was is preferable to having it really get better.

Just makes no sense to me


He has good ideas, but not really what the country needs right now. I'll just share the link on his positions that was posted before.

www.politico.com

Where Joe Biden stands on the biggest 2020 issues

Our policy team breaks down all of the presidential candidate’s proposals on the biggest issues driving the 2020 race.
 

Vilix

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,055
Texas
Or...they lose because democrats don't understand that if their guy/girl loses, and they don't vote for the eventual nominee no matter what...the other side (which has proven to be far far worse) wins...
This the thing I see happening. If Biden gets the nom far left won't vote. If Sanders gets the nom centrists, independents, and moderates on both side might not vote. We shall see.
 

electricblue

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,991
I hate this argument because the Republicans aren't actually fighting over meaningful differences, at least not on a national level. It's easy to line up. The Dems are actually torn by genuine ideological, strategic, and material contradictions, and one side has to win out over the other.

If there's a democrat in the whitehouse next year there will maybe be a slight difference in trade bills and immigration policy depending on who it is. There will be no major legislation passed so there's no reason to die on the hill of genuine ideological differences.
 

Seattle6418

Member
Oct 25, 2017
528
Brasília Brazil
A lot more people will fucking die if Trump wins.

True, but don´t be so quick to judge Bernie or Bust people. So Biden wins, and his admin is like all other centrist democratic admins. Then what? Trump Junior in 2024 can make the Supreme Court be worthless for two generations while also killing millions of people with their policies.

You can disagree with the rationale, but there´s is some long term thinking for those wishing the establishment to crash and burn. For those people, the sooner you can start from scratch the better.
 

poptire

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
9,985
I think most progressives are willing to vote for Biden vs Trump but he has a history of giving in to the whims of conservatives. He's nowhere near as bad as Trump but it's hard to get excited for a guy who worked with Republicans to try and cut social safety nets. Plus his opposition to busing and cozying up to segregationists back in the day is worrisome.
 

jeelybeans

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,948
I'm voting Bernie no matter whonie.

The DNC can fucking rot. If Biden (or heaven forbid, Bloomberg) is the nominee, I'm writing in Bernie. I was told to grin and bear it and vote Clinton in 2016, and I did. This year? Fuck that. The DNC can reap what it sowed.

Lmao, it begins.

Apparently it's the DNC's fault that Bernie can't win with rules favorable to him (that he negotiated with the DNC) and not the fact that the country simply isn't as progressive as we would like / Bernie has not effectively sold his message.
 

hurlex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,143
That's entirely irrelevant. The Primary is about Democrats choosing who they want to represent them. Democrats in SC deserve just as much say in that as Democrats anywhere else.

Democrats in SC are one of the least representative states of the Democratic party. Them acting as kingmaker is dumb.
 

darkside

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,318
Good thing I invested heavily in Biden on predictit after Iowa. If Dems are gonna be dumb as fuck and nominate Weekend at Joes and give us 4 more years of Mr. Deals I may as well make some money out of it.

Who is giving him anything? If Biden has more delegates than Bernie hes going to be the nominee. And he should be. And if he doesn't then he shouldn't.

Even Bernie was on board with the candidate who had the most delegates being the nominee.
 

Tfritz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,286
imo letting the courts fall even further into the hands of far right judges is probably real bad for the chances of any actual leftist piece of legislation becoming a law
 

ostrichKing

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,472
This the thing I see happening. If Biden gets the nom far left won't vote. If Sanders gets the nom centrists, independents, and moderates on both side might not vote. We shall see.
This is why dems lose...they don't do what republicans do...dems need to circle around whoever the candidate is (Bernie or Biden) and vote. If you don't....well...again...4 more years of Trump and fucked Supreme Court...it really is that simple.
 

Snowy

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
1,399

It's the truth. The country is deeply broken, and in need of a revolution. If the powers that be are content to exercise their power only to stop genuine challenges to their sources of power from materializing at the ballot box, and the populace too stupefied to see the plain fact in front of their faces that things are not working, well, there really is only one logical conclusion.
 

Deusmico

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,254
Bernie or bust is some selfish shit when there are people who stand to get an epic fucking if trump continues his bullshit. With so many people standing to lose, it must be nice to eat shit for 4 years and let others suffer because you're shielded by your principles from having a decent sense of empathy.

Bernie needs to run against 20 moderates splitting the vote to get the nom, how will he beat trump and the whole gop machine behind their 1 presidential nominee then?
 

darkside

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,318
Democrats in SC are one of the least representative states of the Democratic party. Them acting as kingmaker is dumb.

As opposed to small states like New Hampshire having way more influence than gigantic states that happen to have primaries in late March and April?

The whole primary system is flawed.
 
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