If we believe Monkey's last claim we shouldn't use that red check as a confirmed check.
His vote on D1 for Fat4All was pretty throwaway and he avoided taking a stance on Turmoil or anyone else in contention, which made me suspicious. Today he's engaged more in talking about role claims and mechanics than talking about any of his own reads, so to me it just seems like naturally scummy behavior.Why Kopite? I have nothing on him so another point of view could help.
Anything really, I just prefer playing when other people are around to talk lol.
Yes, as I stated above in my read list, Mao is who I would like to vote for today for basically all of the same reasons.
The more interesting question to ask, in my opinion, is who would you want to vote if we couldn't vote for Mao today? My answer would be Kalor.
If we believe Monkey's last claim we shouldn't use that red check as a confirmed check.
This is the second time you've stated the fact I'm playing defensively like it's a bad thing and acting like I haven't made any other reads in the game, which is completely not true. I was almost lynched on D1 and today I'm a townie looking at a red check on me. What town mafia player do you know that would not play defense when faced with that situation? In fact, most of the game at this point revolves around me and how people perceive my play. It's not a very strong position to start jumping into reading other players when the rest of the game is squarely centered on me.Hello, If you had to vote right at this moment who would it be? I'm personally leaning towards Mao myself, Because of the strange nature of his roleclaim, the fact that he only seems to appear to defend himself, and seems set on the idea Fran is scum without considering other possibilities, and then there's the red check Monkey says she got.
Seems like the safest bet imo. Thoughts?
That, and the fact that I am not good at playing sporadically, I prefer to be around as much as possible, so not being around for like 3/4 of every day is something I am trying to get used to if I want to keep playing Mafia at all.or just also clueless townie trying to navigate a rather ridiculous day phase.
Before I start responding to individual posts I will say I don't sit on red checks. Some people do and try to tease out reactions. I don't. I had a pretyped post in pineapple pizza mafia, too. I'd rather just put the information out there.
If town Maol (in which case, probably telling the truth)
I check Maol (town power 1)
Someone applies the hated modifier (could be any alignment)
Someone applies a switch or redirect or something (more likely scum but indeterminate)
There is one thing and I honestly don't know what to make of it, like if it's flavor or a hint at bastardy and Natiko gave me nothing when I asked. I am Mama and my information (results) comes from my connection with the other side. As in dead players. That is specifically indicated.
I can ask for information but it's limited (I can only ask for information about certain players) AND Nat has to approve my question. So while there is nothing in my role PM that indicates this info ISN'T to be trusted, there's also absolutely nothing that proves they are OR if they actually come from dead players (people in spec). It comes down to whether or not we trust the phrasing. So you can see why I am not feeling super 100% AND why I did not want to begin speculating on scum powers d1 because what the absolute fuck balances this? The limits are there I guess because it's potentially broken as fuck without them.
So when I said there may be elements that impact my information, it comes down to just how bastard the game is and if dead players really means dead players (as in just turmoil at the time). turmoil and Ket's flips weren't particularly bastard. Even if Maol really did get hit with a modifier it apparently didn't change his actual role so that's not that bastard, either. So I lean toward... maybe not that bastard? Maybe the dead thing is flavory? I've been weighing everything all day so far and I honestly don't know where I come down on it. It felt like a holy shit moment when I got my results back, like hell yeah! but even while typing up my initial post I started to wonder and I've just wondered more as the day goes on.
I'm in bed so I'm not grabbing the actual posts but I asked if Maol was aligned with town and got a no, not aligned with town. The answer was p traditional investigation type response which is why I don't know if my role stuff is actually just flavor or real like if I'm really asking people or if it's just a dressed up investigation role or what.
Ask one question/night
Question has to be approved
Can only reference limited pool of players
Fran+Meatwad, yes. Fandom, maybe but also just as likely, if not more likely, to be one if the people who's really not playing.That, and the fact that I am not good at playing sporadically, I prefer to be around as much as possible, so not being around for like 3/4 of every day is something I am trying to get used to if I want to keep playing Mafia at all.
So a Meatwad + Fran + Fando world is what you're possibly looking at here? I could buy it, Meatwad feels like he's sheeping some majority opinions a lot, and Fando has somewhat given me that feel as well. Fran is always possible, he's really good and has fooled me early on in the past, like just last game in HvV2.
Can you point me to a post with your Town read on Fat4All by chance? I just checked back quick and saw one where you explained why he wouldn't be Scum with you, but didn't see a Town read on him.
I'm not sure who the third scum player is, but I'm comfortable with Gorlak and Fat4All being town at this point. The doggo gets town points just for asking good townie like questions all game.
Basically what Fran just quoted. He's one of the only players that didn't jump immediately to trusting Monkey's red check, which to me would be counter productive to being scum if their plan is to frame her once I flip.
I have not full claimed. There is an aspect I will not reveal, as I've said like three times now, because it would impact the flow of gameplay in a negative way. I don't think it matters for evaluating the role, either.I'm not sure I'm buying all of what Dr. Monkey is selling. Like I said prevoiusly in my drunken ramblings, the more I sit on today the less I trust how Dr. Monkey's claim unraveled through the day so far.
We started the day immediately with this:
This soft claim annoyed me for the reason I stated earlier today; why are you claiming so early, why couldn't you've sat on this info, etc.
Dr. Monkey's general response was:
So. Dr. Monkey got a red check. Dr. Monkey does not sit on red checks. Simple enough.
Monkey goes through a few scenarios discussing the possible misdirection of her check on Maol. She calls her power a 'check' still at this point.
Though at the start of the day Monkey is keen on not full claiming their role, they do so anyways (with very little prodding from others):
This quote from a bit later is also relevent:
So, this is what sticks out to me:
Monkey asks "Is Maol aligned with Town" and got back the answer "No". Monkey said earlier that she could only ask specific questions, I'm wondering, if you could ask "Is Maol aligned with Town", could you of asked "Is Maol Scum"?
Monkey herself said she wasn't 100% positive where the information was coming from, but still considered this a "red check", when I feel like this could be one of any number of things.
But because Monkey felt this was a red check, and Monkey doesn't sit on red checks, day 2 opens with the claim. Looking more and more at this role, Mama, this is a role that seems like it would get better the longer it's in the game. A net positive for town when you get a few days in and have a stash of info you can drop when the need be.
Is Monkey expecting night protection? If she is Town I hope she gets it.
I feel the inconsistencies of the day 2 Monkey claim feels very unbalanced;
going from "I don't sit on red checks. I don't want to full claim unless I have to."
to "Here's the full claim, it's not exactly a red check, I have slight doubts about where it comes from"
(not direct quotes)
Her role doesn't sound like one that could be misdirected, or altered. Maybe the message comes from the dead, maybe it comes from Spec chat. I doubt it comes from Scum, going by the supposed wording from Monkeys claim.
Or Monkey came up with the role herself, and Mama is one of the provided Scum roles.
Sure lets lynch Maol today, maybe I'm too much in my own head about this and Monkey found some Scum.
but if they flip Town then I think Monkey is Scum, one hundo
Whoops, Fando is now an entire fandom for something.
I also said it's a long PM and there's more to the role, including how it's limited.certainly feels like a full claim
you gave the role, the power, hell some flavor text and the name
I though you did this on purpose lol
Thank you, and yeah I'd probably agree there too. Out of the Shadow Lurkers in the room, do any of them stick out as looking more suspicious to you than the others? Mainly speaking of people like Malus, Kopite, Kalor, and Vincent.Fran+Meatwad, yes. Fandom, maybe but also just as likely, if not more likely, to be one if the people who's really not playing.
Hey look, even this post makes me think Fat4all is town. If the doggo is scum, it'd be pretty easy to just wait on my lunch and my flip. If doggo is scum, he knows I'm town, so he knows after the lunch, that Monkey is gonna look very bad start of D3. If he's scum, he sits on this info until the start of D3 and unleashes (dog puns!) all of this at day start, earning a bit of town cred in the process because any townie is gonna be suspicious of Monkey going into D3. It's not a scum tell and he's got a pretty good argument here.I'm not sure I'm buying all of what Dr. Monkey is selling. Like I said prevoiusly in my drunken ramblings, the more I sit on today the less I trust how Dr. Monkey's claim unraveled through the day so far.
We started the day immediately with this:
This soft claim annoyed me for the reason I stated earlier today; why are you claiming so early, why couldn't you've sat on this info, etc.
Dr. Monkey's general response was:
So. Dr. Monkey got a red check. Dr. Monkey does not sit on red checks. Simple enough.
Monkey goes through a few scenarios discussing the possible misdirection of her check on Maol. She calls her power a 'check' still at this point.
Though at the start of the day Monkey is keen on not full claiming their role, they do so anyways (with very little prodding from others):
This quote from a bit later is also relevent:
So, this is what sticks out to me:
Monkey asks "Is Maol aligned with Town" and got back the answer "No". Monkey said earlier that she could only ask specific questions, I'm wondering, if you could ask "Is Maol aligned with Town", could you of asked "Is Maol Scum"?
Monkey herself said she wasn't 100% positive where the information was coming from, but still considered this a "red check", when I feel like this could be one of any number of things.
But because Monkey felt this was a red check, and Monkey doesn't sit on red checks, day 2 opens with the claim. Looking more and more at this role, Mama, this is a role that seems like it would get better the longer it's in the game. A net positive for town when you get a few days in and have a stash of info you can drop when the need be.
Is Monkey expecting night protection? If she is Town I hope she gets it.
I feel the inconsistencies of the day 2 Monkey claim feels very unbalanced;
going from "I don't sit on red checks. I don't want to full claim unless I have to."
to "Here's the full claim, it's not exactly a red check, I have slight doubts about where it comes from"
(not direct quotes)
Her role doesn't sound like one that could be misdirected, or altered. Maybe the message comes from the dead, maybe it comes from Spec chat. I doubt it comes from Scum, going by the supposed wording from Monkeys claim.
Or Monkey came up with the role herself, and Mama is one of the provided Scum roles.
Sure lets lynch Maol today, maybe I'm too much in my own head about this and Monkey found some Scum.
but if they flip Town then I think Monkey is Scum, one hundo
As for your question, I'll ask. I assume so since I could ask about town.
Doggo is a good vote, this may be Era-Meta but I feel Fat4All will be a Blarglike figure in the game who I'd like to get rid of early if no one else is very scummy.
I wanted to have a vote down, and I decided to vote Fat4All because of his relatively little contribution to the game. I don't think he's the only one but Im happy to leave my vote there. And while he's apparently not Blarglike he's done an excellent impression so far with all the fluff posting.
Kalor, but only because Kalor has made the most of an attempt to play the game. I'm not sure how big the lurker scum strategy is here yet though.Thank you, and yeah I'd probably agree there too. Out of the Shadow Lurkers in the room, do any of them stick out as looking more suspicious to you than the others? Mainly speaking of people like Malus, Kopite, Kalor, and Vincent.
Fran has already mentioned that Monkey would be in hot water tomorrow if I flip town. If he continues to push for her tomorrow after my flip, seriously consider lunching him
I caught you EoD yesterday and another confirmed town agreed with me and Gorlak who I also think is town picked up on the same vibe.The game is about to have two confirmed townies lean scum on you based on your EoD play.
If Monkey is Town, and the answer they got about Maol can be trusted, then Maol should be Scum.
If they ain't Scum, the whole Monkey role scenario falls apart imo.
caught you EoD yesterday and another confirmed town agreed with me and Gorlak who I also think is town picked up on the same vibe.The game is about to have two confirmed townies lean scum on you based on your EoD play.
You're also not doubting Monkey's check today like Fat has been,
But it still comes back to the start of the dayBut you can't trust the answer that Monkey got because, if she is telling the truth and she is a médium, she is just asking for opinions of someone.
Three townies leaning scum on one player is a huge flag that the rest of town should take notice of. Investigative powers or not, your EoD play reeked of scum.And that means nothing because Turmoil didn't had investigative powers and, if we believe your claim, you don't either. So both of you could be wrong.
Are you freaking kidding me? Are you even reading my posts since Monkey changed he claim to medium? I have said plenty of times that we shouldn't trust that check.
In a similar situation, I counter claimed the cop with a cop claim of my own, and got the cop lunched even with him bread crumbing his role.,but I also don't doubt for a second that Mao would be able to talk himself out of this situation as Scum.
Where are you at on all of this right now? If you couldn't vote for Mao today, where do you think you would vote? You've had Scum feelings on Gorlak for most of the game it seems, do you still think he could be Scum here? Are there any other players that stick out to you?this game is wild but i'm glad we have actual information to go off of so early
I called this post a stretch and defensive, and Fran responded:So Golak, Maol and Turmoil voted Meatwad to create a wagon against Turmoil. It didn't worked and now the 3 of them are voting for me.
I'm ok lynching any of the 3.
Going back and re-reading EoD with this lens, I can follow Fran's logic. And I think I buy into it, for now. So...let's bump Fran off my lean scum list for now.I didn't explain myself righ there. Just look at this:
Post #457 the votes are:
Turmoil 5
Meatwad 3
Maol 2
Fanto votes Maol which makes a tie in the second place between Maol and Meatwad.
A couple of minutes later Maol votes Meatwad (and after that he said that he would not selfpres but he just did that, he voted Meatwad so wouldn't be the second wagon)
I voted for Maol. That makes the vote:
Turmoil 5
Maol 4
Meatwad 3
And Gorlak jumps from Turmoil to Meatwad making a 3 way tie. It's pretty obvious that Gorlak and Maol are trying to keep the Meatwad wagon alive. I thought that it was because the other 2 wagons were scum.
Here Maol says that he will not make a self preservation vote which makes no sense if you know that you are town, unless the only player who you can move your vote is your scum partner and he has a better role than you.
Then Turmoil voted for me, even when he said before that he was scum reading me as a joke, and Maol says that he likes that vote but he don't think that it would work. But then came Gorlak, who already protected Maol before and never said that he was scumreading me before, and voted for me creating a third wagon.
To me it seemed that they tried to create a third wagon with Meatwad but, when that wagon wouldn't move, they tried to create another wagon to try to see if it would take off. Obviously I was wrong because Turmoil was town but I still think that I'm right about Maol and Gorlak. Gorlak just keep voting to protect Maol.
Welp, since you're here. I feel like bolded is contradictory and not really a good look. If not because of Monkey's claim, why would we need to lynch Maol today? Not saying that there aren't enough reasons to want to vote there, but your phrasing means more than that and it caught my attention.Just got caught up. Like I said yesterday there I don't think we can afford to not lynch Mao today. Monkey's roleclaim is so obtuse though that if Mao flips town I don't even know what to read from that.
Fran
RE: My strong players take. It's simple, for the most part D1 ends with folks on the block for weak reasons, just like how our D1 ended. I'm just saying that if we had 2 or more players in that position I'd rather not vote for the more experienced town player as they could be more useful later. This has nothing to do with whether they're scum or not, I'm just playing the odds. Of course if someone was really scummy I'd have no problem lunching them even if they're a strong town player.
RE: Fat4All. I didn't like them D1, I don't like them now. They haven't done much IMO (yeah I know that's a bit rich whatever) and really only engage in mechanics/fluff for the most part.
Anyway my strongest town reads are Gorlak, Kits and .........> Fanto. Gorlak has done a fair bit of game solving, Kits seemed to be reminiscent of town Kits when she claimed and I feel alright about Fanto as well, just not as much as the other 2
I'm left with the belief that if Maol flips town, it tells us nothing about Monkey. IF Monkey is scum, her power lets her distance herself from the check real easy and play innocent.Just got caught up. Like I said yesterday there I don't think we can afford to not lynch Mao today. Monkey's roleclaim is so obtuse though that if Mao flips town I don't even know what to read from that.
Mao is most likely scum, it's almost always the best play to make when you're redchecked. His weird roleclaims later, and if he's actually hated, which means if he dies earlier its in towns favour (in-fact if a scummie has the hated modifier it's best if he gets bussed earlier, which is possibly whats happening here as well).Welp, since you're here. I feel like bolded is contradictory and not really a good look. If not because of Monkey's claim, why would we need to lynch Maol today? Not saying that there aren't enough reasons to want to vote there, but your phrasing means more than that and it caught my attention.
Like what I said in my post above I agree, but Monkey's still going to be in hot water if Mao flips town, and I would genuinely be at a loss then on what actually transpired. Hopefully Mao flips scum, and even if he doesn't the flip gives us enough info to piece more of the game together so that we can figure out what the hell's happeningI'm left with the belief that if Maol flips town, it tells us nothing about Monkey. IF Monkey is scum, her power lets her distance herself from the check real easy and play innocent.
Oh and I forgot to address this but I don't remember Fat4All in that game at all, but I did effectively get NK on N1Something that it's bothering me is that Kopite voted for Fat4all claiming that he could be like Blarg:
But I just checked and the both of them actually played together before (The Mansion Mafia, 9 months ago). I usually read too much into thinks like this so, I'm overthinking this or this could mean something?
Mao apparently doesn't have that role anymore, he's just hatedAs for Maol, I genuinely can't tell anymore whether I want to vote him because I think he is scum or if it's because I know I'm going to be pissed at myself if we let him go until Day 4 and he winds up being scum. Looking back at D1 suspicions on Maol as I read through the pages, and I get a sense some of the leans came from people voting (what they considered) bad play, and it sort-of sprouted out of that post Maol made about dropping a random vote. And it just kind of...carried on, and evolved into bickering and sniping at one another. If there is more to Maol suspicion D1, someone me with the deets, because it looks like a mountain was slowly made out of a molehill. I just can't help but read most of Maol's posts EoD, and today even, as townie. So...I'm taking Maol off my list for now as well.
Gorlak and Fran seem weird and aggressive to me, in a way that sets them apart from most other players in this game so far. I'd be down for a vote on either.Where are you at on all of this right now? If you couldn't vote for Mao today, where do you think you would vote? You've had Scum feelings on Gorlak for most of the game it seems, do you still think he could be Scum here? Are there any other players that stick out to you?