(and I can't say his reactions instilled great confidence in me but I'm really hoping he turns back up so we have some more to work with)
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Death Stranding Mafia |OT| Bridge the Divides in Society (Via Murder)
- Thread starter Natiko
- Start date
So, let me just get this straight.
Your PM specifically mentions dead players being the "other side" that you are asking for answers? But Nat gives you a very traditional alignment check response to your question of whether Mao was on Town or not? So we don't really know if you are getting responses from dead players or if they are involved at all, even though your PM specifically refers to dead players?
This is about as confusing as a Death Stranding trailer.
Fran you also asked earlier why I thought turmoil and Mao were townie and that's mostly coming from how they both acted in those last minutes, all three of us were feeling that something was afoot and that the relative silence between 20min to 10min before day end was telling. There was a 3 way tie for almost ten minutes and no movement. You however were on the opposite end not at all worried about the lynch and the lack of movement... until you came into the crosshair.
As was pointed out it is possible that scum!mao played me and turmoil there (but at that point you should also consider me actually), but I truly don't want this moment of joining hands to have been tainted by dirty scum intentions :(
What do you think about day end now?
As was pointed out it is possible that scum!mao played me and turmoil there (but at that point you should also consider me actually), but I truly don't want this moment of joining hands to have been tainted by dirty scum intentions :(
What do you think about day end now?
What is tripping me up is the uselessness of the ability if in fact it is reaching out to dead players. Surely there is more to it, or something we aren't understanding, because why would I ever care about the thoughts of the dead?
Medium (talking to dead players) is a role in Mafia, though I'm only used to the Town of Salem version, I have never seen it used in a game in this community myself, so it's at least not a very common one around here.
But still, do you have any other thoughts to share yet? Do you think Mao is Scum regardless of the check nonsense? Do any other players stick out to you? You've been pretty light on content during this phase so far, so I want to hear more from you.
You are severely underestimating how powerful shared suspicions from dead townies can be. If you want to see the only example in our community, you've got to go back and read MGS Mafia back from season 3.5. Dead townies figured out scum!me back then. Power was deemed pretty powerful and there is a reason it wasn't implemented since.
Gut is Fran and Maol right now. Gorlak's post about Fran up above had me re-read some EoD posts of Fran, and I don't get a good vibe. Especially:
That's a tad defensive, and a tad more of a stretch.
Oh shit, I actually have to leave for work in a few minutes here now, didn't realize what time it was lol.
But yeah, you should all know the drill by now: I'll be checking in on my breaks, and if it's slow then I can hang out, but please don't expect any big quote walls and whatnot from me while I'm on my phone, it's just not something I'm good at doing on mobile.
But yeah, you should all know the drill by now: I'll be checking in on my breaks, and if it's slow then I can hang out, but please don't expect any big quote walls and whatnot from me while I'm on my phone, it's just not something I'm good at doing on mobile.
OP
OP
==== DAY 2 VOTES ====
Day Start
Maolfunction (1 votes)
Dr. Monkey - #508 #517
Kitsunelaine - #797
Gorlak (0 votes)
Kitsunelaine - #655 #797
Dr. Monkey (0 votes)
Gorlak - #509 #513
Not voting: Fat4all, Kopite, Fantomas, Fran, Gorlak, Meatwad, Vincent Alexander, Maolfunction, malus, Kalor, Fandorin, Dr. Monkey
Post Counts:
Kitsunelaine: 74 Fat4all: 57 Gorlak: 38 Dr. Monkey: 36 Fantomas: 23 Fandorin: 18 Fran: 16 Maolfunction: 15 Vincent Alexander: 8 Kopite: 8 Meatwad: 5 Kalor: 5 malus: 2
Current Countdown:
Click here to go to the Vote Tool!
Day Start
Maolfunction (1 votes)
Kitsunelaine - #797
Gorlak (0 votes)
Dr. Monkey (0 votes)
Not voting: Fat4all, Kopite, Fantomas, Fran, Gorlak, Meatwad, Vincent Alexander, Maolfunction, malus, Kalor, Fandorin, Dr. Monkey
Post Counts:
Kitsunelaine: 74 Fat4all: 57 Gorlak: 38 Dr. Monkey: 36 Fantomas: 23 Fandorin: 18 Fran: 16 Maolfunction: 15 Vincent Alexander: 8 Kopite: 8 Meatwad: 5 Kalor: 5 malus: 2
Current Countdown:
Click here to go to the Vote Tool!
Hrm. Maybe you're right, as it's an area I'm not familiar with. I'll concede that maybe it gets stronger as the pool of dead increases. I just can't wrap my head around how it works. Does the community of the dead decide an answer as a whole? Just one? And what happens when scum joins the ranks of the dead and can mess up answers? The real fun is what if scum join the ranks of the dead and we don't know.
How does that fit together though? Mao has been convinced of Fran being scum. Do you think that's a bus attempt?
I agree that the second quote from Fran sounds a little panicky though.
I phrased that poorly. Gut is Fran and Maol, but I didn't mean together as a team necessarily.
Sums up my questions about this role.
The fact Monkey doesn't seem to know whether the information is coming from dead players or not despite a specific mention to them in the role PM is really messy. I'm here just imagining the situation if someone less experienced rolled that role instead.
Medium can be really valuable roles depending on the situation, though I have similar questions regarding it's usage as well.
Not sure I understand what you're referring to on bolded.
OP
OP
Having caught up - I just want to remind everyone of the following rule:
9. While mafia can be an intense and stressful game, with play becoming heated at times, please try to keep discussion as respectful and congenial as possible. Take a break if you feel heated. If someone is breaking a rule you are encouraged to alert your gamerunner and game watchers. Reports about in-game action and behavior will be handled by them, and the gamerunner will issue final rulings in the event of disagreements.
I've not received any reports, but things did get briefly terse. Should you feel anything needs our attention and action, please reach out to myself or a game watcher.
Carry on.
9. While mafia can be an intense and stressful game, with play becoming heated at times, please try to keep discussion as respectful and congenial as possible. Take a break if you feel heated. If someone is breaking a rule you are encouraged to alert your gamerunner and game watchers. Reports about in-game action and behavior will be handled by them, and the gamerunner will issue final rulings in the event of disagreements.
I've not received any reports, but things did get briefly terse. Should you feel anything needs our attention and action, please reach out to myself or a game watcher.
Carry on.
Quoted but forgot to comment this.
Though nothing else popped up to me and I've liked Fran's contributions this phase, reading back on the EoD and I agree that that quote isn't really a good look. It's the type of post I'd expect from scum!Fran as he starts getting some overly reductive takes on the game state notwithstanding his usual sharpness.
Since you openly bluffed like this, I understand that you believe it is a harmful power but not a scum one at that? Kitsu stepping up with her claim shed more light into this I guess, but I'm curious as to why you chose that course of action.
Agreed, though I want to hear Maol's take on this to assess my feelings on him. Where else do you want to look for this phase?
I was thinking about the last heroes/villains game where a townie player flipped scum, and a scum player flipped with no information. Made me wonder if we might have some flip shenanigans again to kerfluffle Monkey's power? She might be speaking to the dead for advice without realizing there is scum in the mix. Pure conjecture and not very useful, especially since this is only my 2nd bastard game, so I'm not good at understanding game design.
There was a 3 way tie because everyone was voting one of the 3 wagons and the only 2 players who were voting off wagon were sleeping. That doesn't mean that one of the wagons wasn't scum.
Why would I be worried about what happens when 20 or 10 minutes left when I'm around and 2 of my scum leans are in the run. I could just change my vote to the other lean and be done. There was nothing that I needed to be worried about.
And both you and Maol are trying to paint it as self preservation, which is wasn't as I said plenty of time that I was scumreading Turmoil during D1 and I also voted to break the tie as I voted at the same time as Malus. And self preservation is not always used only by scum. I know that I'm town, I don't know other players aligment. Of course that I would try to safe myself to prevent town killing a townie. That's another thing that makes me think that Maol is scum. He said that wasn't going to self preserve but, if you are town, that's what you need to do.
I didn't explain myself righ there. Just look at this:
Post #457 the votes are:
Turmoil 5
Meatwad 3
Maol 2
Fanto votes Maol which makes a tie in the second place between Maol and Meatwad.
A couple of minutes later Maol votes Meatwad (and after that he said that he would not selfpres but he just did that, he voted Meatwad so wouldn't be the second wagon)
I voted for Maol. That makes the vote:
Turmoil 5
Maol 4
Meatwad 3
And Gorlak jumps from Turmoil to Meatwad making a 3 way tie. It's pretty obvious that Gorlak and Maol are trying to keep the Meatwad wagon alive. I thought that it was because the other 2 wagons were scum.
Here Maol says that he will not make a self preservation vote which makes no sense if you know that you are town, unless the only player who you can move your vote is your scum partner and he has a better role than you.
Then Turmoil voted for me, even when he said before that he was scum reading me as a joke, and Maol says that he likes that vote but he don't think that it would work. But then came Gorlak, who already protected Maol before and never said that he was scumreading me before, and voted for me creating a third wagon.
To me it seemed that they tried to create a third wagon with Meatwad but, when that wagon wouldn't move, they tried to create another wagon to try to see if it would take off. Obviously I was wrong because Turmoil was town but I still think that I'm right about Maol and Gorlak. Gorlak just keep voting to protect Maol.
Oh, right. That was all me btw. I fake flipped weem and made their role PM look like mine while I also flipped with no role. Pretty cool power but I never saw anything else like it.
Ok. I see where you're coming from. I went back and read the posts you're referencing. I'm all for being flippant and free with votes, but less so towards EoD. This post/vote:
Comes off like Maol just wanting another wagon, and not like town voting for actual scum. Then when votes moved, it again felt like scum trying to get out of a lunch, and not scum voting.
I agree with this, Maol was definitely looking for a wagon at the end of D1. He certainly didn't seem all that concerned about finding scum
I wanted to know who targetted me, a townie should've had no problem to claim it. I was immediatly reminded of a neutral marking all living players situation. Figuring that out would help in our current state.
In my opinion something like marking people with a handprint sounds like a neutral role and it makes sense to me that Kits role is designed to find this neutral.
That's assuming Kits is telling the truth about her role of course.
When did I do this?
It seems we strictly disagree about the game state at the end of the day and wether a 10 minute silence before day end is a good or a bad sign of the lynch candidates. I acknowledge that at least your conclusion of Mao and me trying to swing the lynch elsewhere seems consistent with your previous thoughts.
There are a few problems with that line of thought though, because there have been several other wagons beforehand, which all could've been chosen and pushed instead, but that didn't happen. I have actively spoken against a meatwad lynch and only voted him to create that specific tie.
Why do I move away from turmoil at 20min before day end and tie him specifically with Mao and Meatwad if my main goal is to ensure Mao's survival? How does that fit together?
Morning all, sorry for not being around last night. I passed out once I got home from work. Anyway, I'm gonna claim since it may be useful in understanding Monkey's role. It may be picking up on the fact that I sort of already have one foot in the grave. I'm a dying generic soldier named CDT6. (I've barely paid attention to Death Stranding news, not sure if that's a character in a trailer) If I'm still alive by the end of D4, I die. That's my whole role.
If Monkey has a limited list of players to pick from, and since the role seems to be connected to the dead, it's possible that everyone on her list has a death date. Or it could be something else, but that's the only idea I could think of for why she could target me and why she can't target the whole game.
As it is, my claim is extremely easy to prove if I'm still alive post day 4. I'm gonna petition that town not lunch me today, you are guaranteed my flip no matter what, we should use today to lunch a better target.
Vote: Fran
Fran has spent most of today sowing doubt about players now, both me and Kits he questioned. Not with any game solving intent behind it, just throwing doubt out into the game so other players question the claims and thoughts by both me and kits.
And now it looks like my D1 play is being questioned again, even though I stated all of D1 that I don't place my votes on D1 thinking I'm voting scum because the odds of town hitting scum on D1 is so low. My vote on Fran was a scum hunting vote, however and his explanation here for his EoD play is poor. He states I make a self preservation vote by voting Meatwad... the target with the lowest amount of votes. If I was making a self preservation vote, I would have voted turmoil. And I would have never joined turmoil and Gorlak and Fran if my focus was to stay alive.
As you can see from my claim, it's low impact. Losing me on D1 would basically be losing a vanilla town, but also a dying vanilla town. I'd have been totally fine with it, because again as I've said repeatedly, since town is most likely to kill town on D1, the goal of D1 is to make sure town doesn't lunch an important PR. Fran's whole point about town players must try to stay alive makes no sense. If you're a townie with little impact on the overall game, you should absolutely be more willing to die than other players who might have a PR. To say otherwise is extremely scummy.
If Monkey has a limited list of players to pick from, and since the role seems to be connected to the dead, it's possible that everyone on her list has a death date. Or it could be something else, but that's the only idea I could think of for why she could target me and why she can't target the whole game.
As it is, my claim is extremely easy to prove if I'm still alive post day 4. I'm gonna petition that town not lunch me today, you are guaranteed my flip no matter what, we should use today to lunch a better target.
Vote: Fran
Fran has spent most of today sowing doubt about players now, both me and Kits he questioned. Not with any game solving intent behind it, just throwing doubt out into the game so other players question the claims and thoughts by both me and kits.
And now it looks like my D1 play is being questioned again, even though I stated all of D1 that I don't place my votes on D1 thinking I'm voting scum because the odds of town hitting scum on D1 is so low. My vote on Fran was a scum hunting vote, however and his explanation here for his EoD play is poor. He states I make a self preservation vote by voting Meatwad... the target with the lowest amount of votes. If I was making a self preservation vote, I would have voted turmoil. And I would have never joined turmoil and Gorlak and Fran if my focus was to stay alive.
As you can see from my claim, it's low impact. Losing me on D1 would basically be losing a vanilla town, but also a dying vanilla town. I'd have been totally fine with it, because again as I've said repeatedly, since town is most likely to kill town on D1, the goal of D1 is to make sure town doesn't lunch an important PR. Fran's whole point about town players must try to stay alive makes no sense. If you're a townie with little impact on the overall game, you should absolutely be more willing to die than other players who might have a PR. To say otherwise is extremely scummy.
In the meantime I really think we should pressure some people
Vote: Kalor
I really want to hear more from you. Things happened, D1 is over, time to get active and contribute
Vote: Kalor
I really want to hear more from you. Things happened, D1 is over, time to get active and contribute
This should say on Fran. I'm mobile and missed this when rereading.
It's in the post that I quoted:
Or did I missunderstood it and you are not talking about self preservation there?
In my original theory is because Turmoil was your scum partner. I was wrong there. Maybe you liked more the Meatwad or my lynch instead of Turmoil's. Turmoil had a lot of heat on him and was an easy mislynch in the future.
You're pleading to be left alive until after D4? Are you serious Mao? Do you think your presence will not be a source of continuing discussion? Wouldn't it have been better to flip yourself than turmoil yesterday?
Generic soldier is also not in line with the rest of the flips/claims or my own role name.
Generic soldier is also not in line with the rest of the flips/claims or my own role name.
Also, Gorlak mentioned somewhere earlier that he's afraid I may be pocketing him. I had the same thought earlier, and based on that, I'm more comfortable with assuming he's town at this point if we're both getting paranoid about each other.
Maol's claim could be real but it's also convenient since it encourages us to keep them alive until the end of day 4. Even if they don't win and exit the game, the damage of a potential scum or neutral role would already be done. They're going to be a constant point of discussion until the end of day 4 now.
I don't see why my being a source of discussion is a bad thing. And I do think that, which is why I never voted turmoil. Can't be helped that nobody else was game for voting out someone like Meatwad or Fran at the end. Do you think town would have been game to vote me if I just told everyone to vote for me instead?
I never said that I scumread your vote/self-preservation. My problem was the attitude as explained above. The wild "you're all scum together" accusation for example.
Take a step back and look at what you're trying to pursue here. It looks like you want to stick with your initial theory even if it doesn't really fit.
Lol. This role is a bad lie. There is no way that a reviewer approved this role. It's a really shitty role to give a player as they have a death sentence on them when the game starts.
Also, what would happen if town is in mylo/lylo at the end of D4? They instant lose? That makes no sense.
So I'm asking question but I'm not trying to solve the game? How does make sense? Maybe you don't like the questions but asking questions to solve claims is a very valid way for town to solve the game.
If you are town you don't know the aligment of the other players. Of course that you should try to stay alive as you know your aligment and the other player could be scum.
How the fuck is trying to avoid a townie lynch scummy?
I understand, and a neutral arsonist or w/e is the first thing that came to mind as well, it's just that I wouldn't have bluffed like you did at the risk of outing a town PR.
That doesn't sound right. You want town's trust to leave you alone until D5 really and it's a good idea to have that topic being brought up everyday to waste town's time as well?
And of course town would've voted you out, I definitely would have, if you asked.
I explained why I thought that the 3 of you were together. You made not like it but I think I made my line of thought pretty clear.
The thing that I see is that you are sheeping Maol. Are you denying that both your vote near EoD helped Maol?
In a game where the flavor is based on a game called Death Stranding, I think it fits into the flavor just fine.
Because you're not interested in the answers to your questions. You take the answers given and immediately twist them to continue to sow doubt. It's extremely unproductive to not consider a player is being truthful about what they're saying. You're playing with a pre established notion and taking every answer and twisting it to fit what your preconceptions were.
And you're incorrect about not knowing player's alignments. At the start of the game, there's 15 players and at most I would guess 4 non town roles. That leaves 11 town players. It's extremely more likely that the first player lunched on any given D1 will be town. As another townie who knows their role, you should know if your role is low impact, especially if you're given a role that is essentially vanilla townie. You should not be striving to stay alive D1 that much considering the very tangible risk of losing a powerful PR instead.
Youre acting like knowing the odds of things and taking into consideration your own role and using them to craft a strategy is an impossible task.
Erh... yes, pretty clearly the first vote leveled him with turmoil and meatwad, how that is helping him I don't know.
I have told you already that the second one felt like a combined townie action.