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Sanka

Banned
Feb 17, 2019
5,778
But it's, by definition, not more options. "Sell only on EGS" isn't more options than "Sell on Steam, GOG, EGS, itch.io"...


Oh man I forgot about that.
Hm, to me that sounds like all options increased by one. One more way developers are able to monetize their games. And seeing as how
positively some devs have spoken about the deal, it seems to be a good option.

There are plenty of options already out there that give the dev more of a cut, like itch.io. Epic exclusivity limits choice completely.
Yes, and one more store that is actually viable and can compete with Steam and is beneficial to developers shouldn't hurt much either.
 

Deleted member 42

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
16,939
Yes, which at worse will cause some people to be disappointed they can't get the game on Steam (or at all in some cases.) Like I said, scummy is a stretch to me.

EGS sucks as a store and I'd rather nothing be exclusive. I just find some of the language surrounding the scenario a bit much.. calling Sweeeny a monster and comparing him to Trump, lol Hell people seem offended that EGS offers a 18% higher cut.. it's kind of mindblowing to me. And yes, I know, that cut makes certain payment methods unviable without a transaction fee.. how does it make it nefarious? The fact stores selling w/ a 30% cut can afford those transaction fees w/o changing their cut doesn't raise eyebrows?

The Trump comparison stuff and attempting to demonize Sweeney is fairly disconcerting to me to be honest

We don't need to race to those kind of extremes to make our points, you don't have to immediately compare this situation to a racist President
 

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,361
Also,

*Not Burning Bridges*
-Criticizing Steam's policies with Steam Greenlight/other initiatives Steam used to determine what games do or don't get onto Steam and how over the years
-Criticizing Steam's positions with adult games over the years
-Criticizing Steam's revenue split for developers
-Criticizing the lack of effort Steam puts into giving indies coverage/exposure on their storefront and how they don't get much for how much they give Valve in the first place.
-Criticisms over how Steam handles its Summer Sale and other sales and events and how those decisions affect the sales/exposure of particular games in different ways.
-Criticizing Steam's terrible customer service, especially in the pre-current-refund-policy-era.
-Criticizing Steam (the program) for having lots of jank and flaws.
-Any of the number of other things developers have criticized Valve for over the years
-Taking an exclusivity deal in the first place.

*Burning Bridges*
-Publicly refusing an exclusivity deal.

Like, seriously. I've been peeking into the PC community for years now. And I can't be the only one who's noticed how over the years indie devs have been criticizing Valve/Steam for any number of issues for YEARS, including when obviously they were the only real big dog in town, but yet I never, never, never recall any of that criticism of Valve/Steam being referred to as "burning bridges" (again, considering how a lot of that happened way before EGS and thus people could have easily made that argument... but didn't.

But despite not coming up in any of those instances, THIS is when we suddenly hear about devs "burning bridges" by acting this way? This is what constitutes burning bridges, that's when that term suddenly popped when people were just fine with devs publicly trash-talking Valve and Steam all the time and didn't seriously consider any of that burning bridges, but this suddenly is? That's definitely a head-scratcher to me

Because the people know (or, really, think it's true) that Epic is NASTY if they don't get their way and Steam is chill.
 

LuckyLinus

Member
Jun 1, 2018
1,938
I love what the dev is doing, great initiative.

Paying for exclusives is fine, but refusing to sell games that turn down the exclusive deals is awfull.
 

Sanka

Banned
Feb 17, 2019
5,778
Before discussing endlessly what is and what isn't a monopoly; could you describe what consequences Valve's market share currently causes? What kind of competition are they actively hindering?
Devs being essentially forced to take a lower cut than necessary.
 

modoversus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,677
México
By implying what the dev did is shittier than EGS or Tim did, and ignoring the implication how bully and monopolistic was EGS when tried to get the exclusivity.

That's a stretch.

I did not say it was worse or better than what Tim did. I'm saying that what the dev has done is bad on it's own, and that the response to Tim's tweet is overreaction. Hell, I did not even mention EGS in my post. Don't project.
 

Demacabre

Member
Nov 20, 2017
2,058
Devs being essentially forced to take a lower cut than necessary.

You know what is a worse cut than what Steam, Playstation, Xbox, Nintendo, Mobile sets up (all of them being the same cut)?

0% because Epic refuses to sell your game because you want to release it on multiple storefronts they don't like.

EGS is really looking out for the small indie devs, aren't they? They are really giving the small indie devs in the industry more options. Fighting a "monopoly" by monopolizing the distribution of small indie games.
 
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Deleted member 42

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
16,939
How did I know this was going to turn into the 34829343th EGS fight thread lol

I feel like we're all stuck in a time vortex
 

olag

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,106
Devs being essentially forced to take a lower cut than necessary.
You realise ofcoarse that epic are free to run their store with their lower cut without resorting to exclusivity clauses.

And that's not even including the other variable cut rates on other stores which epic restricts.
 

derFeef

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,358
Austria
Devs being essentially forced to take a lower cut than necessary.
You know that by going Epic exclusive your game is only allowed to sell on two storefronts? Humble and EGS?
It would miss the what... other 30 stores and sites you could buy the game from.
How about you ALSO release on the EGS WITHOUT the exclusive deal? WIN WIN I would say.

This of course is all minus the exclusivity bonus you would get, but whatever.
 

Futaleufu

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
3,910
In the coming years Epic will cement themself as the second option next to Steam and by doing that will definitely have taken some of their marketshare. Those games epic is making deals with would have normally just been released on steam. It's not just indies, it's every type of game.

I'm not sure they'll ever surpass GOG.
 

Sanka

Banned
Feb 17, 2019
5,778
You know what is a worse cut than what Steam, Playstation, Xbox, Nintendo, Mobile sets up (all of them being the same cut)?

0% because Epic refuses to sell your game because you want to release it on multiple storefronts they don't like.

EGS is really looking out for the small indie devs, aren't they? They are really giving the small indie devs in the industry more options. Fighting a "monopoly" by monopolizing the distribution of small indie games.
Again, it's an option. Devs can keep releasing their games on steam with a lesser cut or choose the more viable and secure option and release it on EGS.
 
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Deleted member 19533

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,873
I googled the charities that Epic give, and the Fortnite charities, then a poster provided info on charities that Tom donated to. Epic seems to give out a lot of money, and it makes sense to. I bet that's a big tax write off.

Post #160
Post #201
It's pretty standard stuff for huge companies. It's called Corporate Social Responsibility. Google has a whole philanthropic arm, for example. Coke brings water pumps to villages in Africa, etc. A lot of companies do good things. But, like you said, there's write-offs. It's also more about the good PR they get for it rather than doing something good for the sake of doing something good. A lot of them, while they give back to communities, also only give a pittance relative to what they earn. Even EA does a lot of stuff, but we all know they're the devil.
 
OP
OP
Kurt Russell

Kurt Russell

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,504
Isn't there a limit of how many Steam keys can be generated on a title?

Not really. You can't go and generate a million keys for no reason, but as long as the reason for requesting the keys makes sense (like, "I'm going to sell on itch.io or something along these lines) you can keep generating keys with no problems at all.
 

Sanka

Banned
Feb 17, 2019
5,778
You know that by going Epic exclusive your game is only allowed to sell on two storefronts? Humble and EGS?
It would miss the what... other 30 stores and sites you could buy the game from.
How about you ALSO release on the EGS WITHOUT the exclusive deal? WIN WIN I would say.

This of course is all minus the exclusivity bonus you would get, but whatever.
That would be another route they could have taken, but to take on Steam that wouldn't make much sense. Most platforms have exclusives in some shape or form and EGS exclusives are probably some of the most accessible of them all.
 

EllipsisBreak

One Winged Slayer
Member
Aug 6, 2019
2,156
Isn't there a limit of how many Steam keys can be generated on a title?
Not normally, but technically Valve does reserve the right to stop you if they think you're abusing the system. The example they gave was "say you've sold a few thousand copies on Steam but have requested / activated 500K keys, then we are going to take a deeper look at your games, your sales, your costs, etc."
 

Sanka

Banned
Feb 17, 2019
5,778
You realise ofcoarse that epic are free to run their store with their lower cut without resorting to exclusivity clauses.

And that's not even including the other variable cut rates on other stores which epic restricts.
Yes, but for now epic is willing to take on a lot of the upfront costs if they are willing to be exclusive to them, which is the thing that's so beneficial to devs right now.
 

Dr. Ludwig

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,521
That would be another route they could have taken, but to take on Steam that wouldn't make much sense. Most platforms have exclusives in some shape or form and EGS exclusives are probably some of the most accessible of them all.

No. No they're not.

And I'm not talking about the consumer perspective...
 

Sanka

Banned
Feb 17, 2019
5,778
I guess you are not really spending much time playing games on PC?
I mean all kinds of platforms be it Netflix, Microsoft, Nintendo, iphone what have you. In most cases to access the software you need to buy the hardware or subscribe to a service. EGS is just a different free store and therfore more accessible to all people.
 

BayonettasBuddy

Lead Producer at Cold Symmetry
Verified
Oct 30, 2017
233
Why are people so salty about EGS. They want to get people onto their platform, offer Devs better fees and pay Devs well for thier exclusivity? Just seems like people not liking change and raging
 

derFeef

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,358
Austria
I mean all kinds of platforms be it Netflix, Microsoft, Nintendo, iphone what have you. In most cases to access the software you need to buy the hardware or subscribe to a service. EGS is just a different free store and therfore more accessible to all people.
So you agree that games available on MORE free stores would be better, then?

Why are people so salty about EGS. They want to get people onto their platform, offer Devs better fees and pay Devs well for thier exclusivity? Just seems like people not liking change and raging
Change is cool if it actually benefits everyone. But change making it worse for someone is not something I want to see honestly. Would you?
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,663
This guy is very savvy. That's what I get out of his interactions with Epic. :P
 

BayonettasBuddy

Lead Producer at Cold Symmetry
Verified
Oct 30, 2017
233
Change is cool if it actually benefits everyone. But change making it worse for someone is not something I want to see honestly. Would you?

What is making it worse? I get EGS features don't match Steam currently, but it doesn't seem lightyears away. They do pay Devs a good chunk more on revenue split even after they pay a lump sum for exclusivity....
 

ramoisdead

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,609
Not really, yea sure steam games can be sold on 30+ stores, but you have to use steam to play these games.

It's because those developers choose to use Steam DRM in order to prevent piracy, even though Steam DRM is pretty weak and can be easily cracked. There are plenty of games on the Steam store that are DRM-free and don't require Steam to boot up.
 
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