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Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
As a product of the late 80s and early 90s, I grew up seeing comics go through a pretty dark period of taking campy, colorful heroes and putting them through the angsty, gritty vortex of "X-treme" edgy violence and style. I saw adaptations that took what were fundamentally children's properties and try and "mature" them up for adult (or at least mid-teen) sensibilities. Most of these endeavors have, well... NOT... stood the test of time. Even today, I roll my eyes at the sheer concept of turning peppy Speedball into "Penance".
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But then I think about a few that, oddly enough, really did, to the point that we just sort of accept that what we got was an improvement over what came before.

For comics, a few that I recall...

Angel -> Archangel
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Good ol' Warren was not one of the more popular X-men, even though he was a founding member. His ability to flap his wings and fly grew progressively less impressive when characters like Storm fly like a goddess riding lightning or Rogue could just zip around with ease. I'd argue that Warren getting the Horseman of the Apocalypse treatment was the best thing that could have happened to him. A new, darker look and design. His fluffy and brittle wings replaced with weaponized steel razors. It was silly and edgy... but I think most agreed it gave him a boost he never had before, and few wanted him to go back.

Bucky -> Winter Soldier
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Similarly, it's almost impossible to reconcile the super-spy and one-time Captain America Bucky Barnes with the plucky kid sidekick he was created to be. Bucky had, ostensibly, been written out for decades, but his re-emergence as a prominent power player in the Marvel universe - and his now well-known recognition in the MCU - means that the darker, more deadly interpretation has long overshowed his original portrayal.

And for something like cartoons or TV shows... Reboot springs to mind.
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Sort of another "plucky, silly kid grows up to be a badass" take, Enzo going from a slightly insufferable younger brother tag-along to a gun-toting, grizzled war vet was quite the welcome surprise to this show, and I recall a lot of people being very happy with that change.

Anyone else spring to mind? Who got the gritty, darker treatment and had it stick?
 

Ryuelli

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,209
Dude was going to die in Season 1.

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And as a whole, I think very few people look at Batman as a "silly" series anymore.

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Lord Fanny

Banned
Apr 25, 2020
25,953
Didn't the Penance stuff happen in Civil War? That was like 2004, not the 80s/90s. Not that it matters, but probably worth mentioning.

I guess you could say Jason Todd sort of fits in here. Him reviving to the Red Hood eventually turned out to be pretty good. It was a long and bumpy road with some terrible shit in-between, but seems like most people like that character now.
 
OP
OP
Garlador

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
Didn't the Penance stuff happen in Civil War? That was like 2004, not the 80s/90s. Not that it matters, but probably worth mentioning.
It absolutely did. Just because it was a big trend in the edge 90s doesn't mean they still don't try and do it. Don't get me started on the grittier version of the Superfriends kids.
 

Dark Knight

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,306
Fullmetal Alchemist. Ling went from goofy, proto-Saitama, comic relief figure to badass immortal and it was pretty cool.

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Gunny T Highway

Unshakable Resolve - One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,022
Canada
Was going to say Enzo as well OP. As a kid it was awesome seeing him completely change mid way through season 3. The whole tonal change from the end of Season 2 through season 3 was unexpected but I am glad they did it because it made the show that much more memorable.
 

Mama Robotnik

Gaming Scholar
Member
Oct 27, 2017
670
Would you consider The Sisko?

Went from bored and disinterested Starfleet Commander to planet bombing, senator killing, black-market dealing, space God.
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,095
Here's a controversial one, because some think it's better, and some think it's worse.

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I am personally on the side that as a character, Jak got a heck of a lot more interesting when he was allowed a voice from 2 onwards, with 3 being the best of both worlds approach to the character.

(Never played Jak X, so dunno if he was better or worse in that).
 

Senator Toadstool

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,651
Here's a controversial one, because some think it's better, and some think it's worse.

MdKjasLLbdJ185V7tFO8zLcGiMlqsiPq.png


I am personally on the side that as a character, Jak got a heck of a lot more interesting when he was allowed a voice from 2 onwards, with 3 being the best of both worlds approach to the character.

(Never played Jak X, so dunno if he was better or worse in that).
there wasn't too much of an interesting story in x and jak in 3 was great
 

TeraDax

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,354
Québec
I was a kid, so for sure Enzo was my favorite character in Reboot. But man Matrix was soo cool. His showdown with Megabyte is still one of my favorite TV-Show moment.

Look at that punch!



No main character in the show before fought Megabyte hand to hand like that!
 

Soap

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,188
Star Trek TOS camp to Star Trek DS9 (and then a regression with voyager and enterprise).
 

ShaggsMagoo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,674
Came here to see if Wesley Wyndam-Price has been mentioned, sees he has been mentioned, leaving satisfied.
 

KDR_11k

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
5,235
As a product of the late 80s and early 90s, I grew up seeing comics go through a pretty dark period of taking campy, colorful heroes and putting them through the angsty, gritty vortex of "X-treme" edgy violence and style. I saw adaptations that took what were fundamentally children's properties and try and "mature" them up for adult (or at least mid-teen) sensibilities. Most of these endeavors have, well... NOT... stood the test of time. Even today, I roll my eyes at the sheer concept of turning peppy Speedball into "Penance".
700ea1b19f049c1bfdc2e08121565879.jpg
I'm guessing that panel is from later on when even the writers thought this was stupid?