The only thing I love about skill trees is maxing them out so I can roll with a character who's got a full suite of moves and buffs.
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damn skill trees are so satisfying
- Thread starter hwarang
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It put me off finishing the game, honestly. It just felt so mind-numbing to me, with hardly any exciting unlocks to work toward...
I played ZA, so not sure how the original was.
Been playing a lot of Civ 6 recently and it, and games like it, have 2 Skill Trees. Cheating I know but Research (Science) Tree and Civic (Culture) Tree go from Ancient Era to Future Era, not that games last that long typically but you can always play after you've won to unlock all the things. They directly play into what you can or cannot do at any given time. Agro neighbour? You'd better unlock the Policy Card that makes building Military Units quicker or your puny army will be no match for the oncoming Elephant Assault. Want a Religion? Gonna need a Holy Site as praising the sun does nothing in Civ. Want to be all cool and attract the tourists - well building Wonders can help so if you want the Pyramids you'd better unlock the tech that lets you build them (which you can't of late as they changed the AI lust for certain wonders which just means they build this one instead, which is a shame as it's the best wonder in the game). Anyway 2 Skill Trees!
Currently playing Classic, this is the way. Dual spec is the most flexibility I need. The new systems suck.
Final Fantasy XII License board is very satisfying.
This one came to mind. I agree I loved the License Board skill tree.
Agree.
Leveling is pretty much fucking nothing in the modern game.
Only of the skills are actually character skills and not something random. Looking at some hunting skills that "make rare enemies more common"
Wait, wait, wait. I'm about four or five worlds into the game and haven't seen this??? Is is unlocked later or did I just overlook it??Honestly... Ring Fit Adventure.
Yup. I hated how they simplified it in ... MoP to it not being an actual talent tree anymore.
Final Fantasy XII License board is very satisfying.
I like it too, but it sucks that you can get completely locked out of an ultimate weapon depending on what job combo and quickenings you choose. I think I prefer how the sphere grid works a bit more
Path of Exile(might be too much to handle):
Holy fuck...
I enjoy skill trees, as long as I am able to max (or almost max) them, even if that includes having to go post-game. But hate the whole 'damn, I will miss this in the game if I take this route' bit. I want to do, or have the option of, all.
One of the reasons why the sphere grid in FF X is one of my favorites.
In the latest version of the game (the Xbox release, and I think they patched it into the PC/PS4/Switch versions by now), you're able to reset the license boards (refunding all spent LP), quickenings, Espers and job selections for all of your characters at the Clan Centurio Hall in Rabanastre.
Skill trees are cool if you're choices are meaningful (like Etrian Odyssey), although let me respec if it's complex! I've grown to sour when they're thrown in for a cheap sense of progression in games like God of War, Horizon, etc., where you'll unlock everything by the end of the game anyway, just unlocking them in slightly different order. Don't even bother in that case. I'd rather just base it around story progression in that case.
I don't remember exactly when you get it but it's not available from the start, so you probably haven't overlooked it.
Just keep on exercising :)
I'm sick of skill trees. At least in the games I have played recently.
I guess I'd be fine with it if there were actual real tradeoffs.
Either there is no no way you'd unlock everything in a playthrough or there were real pros and cons to certain skills. I think that incentivizes a lot of replay value.
I guess I'd be fine with it if there were actual real tradeoffs.
Either there is no no way you'd unlock everything in a playthrough or there were real pros and cons to certain skills. I think that incentivizes a lot of replay value.
OP, I think a better question is what games don't have a skill tree. I like them when they're implemented well, but they are damn near everywhere.
Eh, I understand what you are saying, but I hate missing out on abilities/spells. I guess if it's just one giant skill tree that everyone can access, then it's ok as someone else in the party can take those skills.
But if it's just you, I just don't want to have to miss abilities/paths.
Yes, you can say that's what multiple playthroughs are for, but I don't have that kind of time, unfortunately. So I like to maximize the one time I can play through a game.
Generally loathe them, especially "adds 2% to melee damage" junk. Not as bad if it's meaningful new skills or perks, I guess.
I quite enjoyed Child of Light's skill trees. Never overwhelming yet constantly rewarding within its 15 hour playtime.
Skill trees are aces. They get a lot of hate, but my favourite games have some form of them. I have noticed as of late that UI can really help/hinder implementation of a skill tree. I love the choices and progression offered by Dragon Age Inquisition for instance, but the UI and design is god awful. I am currently playing an really enjoying Kingdoms of Amalur, but the skill tree UI is average at best.
Looking forward to seeing some suggestions of well designed skill trees.
One of my favorite things to do in Etrian Odyssey is agonize over where to put my skill point when I level up a character. It looks like a small amount of choices compared to other games, but the many possibilities on how it synergizes with the rest of the team make it a bit thrilling to choose.
Yessss great example. Well designed, meaningful skills, and just enough choice.
Path of Exile(might be too much to handle):
Also FFX Sphere Grid:
Good grief....
Wait OP ISN'T blame space?
Anyway to answer the OP's question both SpiderMan games have a few highly customizable ones on top of being actually good games.
Not going to lie I don't disagree with you that it's flawed. The aesthetics and sound design are probably what elevates it more than it deserves in my mind.
Who is doing that?
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Games with skill trees that actually involve differentiation of skill sets and real choice are satisfying.
Games which seem to shoehorn in a skill tree just for the sake of it...not so much.
For example, take Spider-Man: Miles Morales. Great game, I've really enjoyed my time with it, but the skill "tree" is just really unnecessary. It's basically just skills that unlock as you progress through the game, presented as a tree. There is no choice, no real differentiation in how you play. My Spider-Man at the end of the game will have the exact same skills, abilities, and point allocations as every single other person that plays the game. There is no variability.
The entire point of a skill tree, at least to me, is to give the player the opportunity to build their character in their own unique way, such that at max level, their talent point spread, skills, and play style are different from that of other players, leading to unique gameplay experiences. This of course also creates replayability as well as someone can start a new game with a different build and experience the same content in a new way.
Games which seem to shoehorn in a skill tree just for the sake of it...not so much.
For example, take Spider-Man: Miles Morales. Great game, I've really enjoyed my time with it, but the skill "tree" is just really unnecessary. It's basically just skills that unlock as you progress through the game, presented as a tree. There is no choice, no real differentiation in how you play. My Spider-Man at the end of the game will have the exact same skills, abilities, and point allocations as every single other person that plays the game. There is no variability.
The entire point of a skill tree, at least to me, is to give the player the opportunity to build their character in their own unique way, such that at max level, their talent point spread, skills, and play style are different from that of other players, leading to unique gameplay experiences. This of course also creates replayability as well as someone can start a new game with a different build and experience the same content in a new way.
To everyone talking about Path of Exile skill tree complexity, you don't know the half of it.
There's the main huge skill tree where you get a point with each LV-Up. That's what everyone always links to.
You also pick 1 of 19 ascendancy classes and can get up to 8 points to spend there and the bonuses are much bigger than the regular skill tree. It's stuff like "You have Spell Block equal to your Attack Block" and "+2 to the level of all minion skills."
You can get cluster jewels that you can customize and expand the skill tree.
There are also special jewels that you can place that will transform the skill tree near them.
Finally, they recently added skill trees for each postgame region to allow you to customize what kind of content shows up on the maps you go to.
There's the main huge skill tree where you get a point with each LV-Up. That's what everyone always links to.
You also pick 1 of 19 ascendancy classes and can get up to 8 points to spend there and the bonuses are much bigger than the regular skill tree. It's stuff like "You have Spell Block equal to your Attack Block" and "+2 to the level of all minion skills."
You can get cluster jewels that you can customize and expand the skill tree.
There are also special jewels that you can place that will transform the skill tree near them.
Finally, they recently added skill trees for each postgame region to allow you to customize what kind of content shows up on the maps you go to.
This was how I felt about the Witcher 3. At a certain point I just stopped bothering to use my skill points when I levelled up because the number of perks you can actually equip is so tightly limited and once you've upgraded the ones you want it's like, "ok, do i want 2% extra damage from crossbows that i won't equip, or 1% extra adrenaline points that i won't equip?"
Yakuza 0's skill trees are great though, I found myself grinding out random battles if I was close to being able to afford an upgrade. I do kinda wish that the currency for upgrading was separate from the money you use for everything else, though. It made me wonder if I should be conserving it more.
The skill trees for each character in FF XII are also super satisfying. I especially like in the remastered version how picking different classes for your characters can lead to a different experience with a new skill tree. Makes the game much more replayable. I do wish that it was separated out from equipment though and purely focused on skills/spells. Is that how it works in other FF games?
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Honestly... Ring Fit Adventure.
Ring Fit is probably the only, and best, Skill Tree I really enjoyed, mostly because it unlocked new moves I wasn't aware the Switch would recognize me doing them.
Other than that, I always thought Skill Trees were a very artificial way to show progress within a game, you weren't mastering the existing mechanic to become better, you were just unlocking moves/powers/whatever which were themselves more powerful, and sometimes, very easy to use.
Not saying I won't enjoy games with skill trees, but most of the games I played recently don't have them and I truly enjoyed that. Don't know if DOOM Eternal can be considered as a game with a skill trees that said, as that's not really a tree, but you do have a lot of unlockable stuff for your weapon, but it doesn't change how you play the game compared to how you play it with the base mechanics it offers.
I just really enjoy it and with the job boards , you have to apply strategy to your choices but you're free to disagree.
One of the main reasons I disliked it so much was the lack of meaningful strategy needed... it could be maxed out so quickly, too.
I honestly feel like I'm missing something here, people say they love this board all the time but I've never seen it explained precisely why.
If anyone knows of a good showcase for this that someone's done, a video or article, I'd love to read it.
Did you also play the remake or just the original? I don't see how you could max out the different job boards that quickly.
Zodiac. I almost maxed out on both boards for a few characters shortly after reaching Fran's village.
The amazing thing is that image is actually old and it has grown since then. Now you can craft jewels to expand your skill tree, have other jewels that influence it as well. They just added skill trees onto the atlas so you can customize the game mechanics. The customizability is amazing but overwhelming. Below is my current character's build.Path of Exile(might be too much to handle):
I like them sometimes, but as I get older and have less time to play, they are more likely to inspire FOMO. I always feel like I'm going to screw up and pick something useless and I won't want to bother going back to try something different.
I think skill trees are only satisfying when I feel like I'm actually making choices and building the character around my playstyle. This is one of the things that I disliked about Spiderman. Why is there a skill tree if in the end I'll finish the game with everything bought? Why not just make the player get the skills in some specific points of the game? I felt I was making choices and the only choice I had was choosing which skill I wanted first.
Really? Yeah no, not me. I had to specialise and think hard where to spend points.
It's worth understanding that Path of Exile's skill tree is big because this is a game most of the fanbase plays WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY past endgame. You're going to want to constantly be able to stand a chance in the millions of endgame dungeons and portals and raids or wtfever is happening after the main stories...
The skill tree looks huge but it's probably one of the best things about the game- you can still progress your character for a VERY long time, and that's after having sent them down a path that makes your character's build unique to begin with....
The skill tree looks huge but it's probably one of the best things about the game- you can still progress your character for a VERY long time, and that's after having sent them down a path that makes your character's build unique to begin with....
I love skill trees so much, builds and point investment are one of the biggest hooks for me in a game. Path of Exile, Grim Dawn, and Borderlands 3 are the first things to come to mind.
I probably just did too much side stuff, unlimited LP and ways to get them easier means eventually you're going to get there. If you beeline for the story, it's gonna take longer and might even feel a bit better.
WWE 2K20
I actually hate this feature in wrestling game. Sorry.
why tho?
Skill trees can definitely be satisfying, but there are so many variants in so many games nowadays, that it starts to become a chore to learn and master.
They still treat WWE like it's a real sport. They should just make a turn based RPG out of it one day.