That's the shitty thing. There should be woman like that in games and media who aren't afraid of their dick. But with the way it's presented here and with CDPR transphobic background this is a situation where the woman is being laugh at not with.
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Cyberpunk 2077 looks amazing, but I’m conflicted about supporting CD Projekt Red with the doubt they’ve cast around their social stances.
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It's really easy to tell yourself not to buy it considering there are so many other great games.
If you do buy it, you would be supportive of their transphobic behavior before they have corrected it due to your discomfort. Do you really think that is the best idea?
If you do buy it, you would be supportive of their transphobic behavior before they have corrected it due to your discomfort. Do you really think that is the best idea?
I disagree that it'd be a generous interpretation in that scenario but oh well. I'm still on the fence about the game generally speaking. I've seen/read/heard enough to have me very worried about the game not handling LGBTQ issues, sexism, racism, etc. well but I haven't yet seen enough to actually make me go "yeah, this game definitely isn't handling these issues well for a fact". So until we know more, I'll just stay highly sceptical while hoping for the best.
I'm buying the game and supporting them because I:
1. Love their games
2. Love the new setting
3. Understsnd that a few individuals does not represent the entire company
4. Hundred of people work really hard for years making the game and their livelyhood depends in it. Why would I want to punish them because of a few bad eggs
1. Love their games
2. Love the new setting
3. Understsnd that a few individuals does not represent the entire company
4. Hundred of people work really hard for years making the game and their livelyhood depends in it. Why would I want to punish them because of a few bad eggs
Looking at the image my view point was that it meant there were options out there for people to be how they feel/view themselves as being, however that may be. I don't view it was a joke, if anything I can see it pissing off some people who are less than tolerant on such things. This game does take place in the future so it makes sense that people are able to change aspects of themselves far easier than we can in todays world and fits into the themes the whole cyberpunk genre plays into where people are able to alter themselves to be whatever they want. Perhaps this is a naive take on it and if so I apologize for that. It stinks to see such a game having issues for various people.
User Banned (2 Week): Dismissing concerns of representation and transphobia
Who gives a shit? If you're on the fence because they don't think or act like you think they should, don't buy the game based on your supposed principles.
It's quite obvious that you want Cyberpunk 2077.
Cyberpunk 2077 is gonna be awesome.
It's quite obvious that you want Cyberpunk 2077.
Cyberpunk 2077 is gonna be awesome.
The first sentence in the OP IS THIS: If you don't care about these issues one way or the other, don't bother telling us that in this thread.
Way to go to dismiss the point of the thread.
Out of curiosity, exactly how many employees would have to be hateful towards transgender people before you'd say the above no longer applies? What's the percentage?
It's not just about principles, though, it's also about the question of whether these kinds of problematic views will inform the game's writing and handling of these issues. If a game handles LGBTQ issues poorly, it automatically becomes less appealing to me as an LGBTQ individual. Not because I disagree with some of its creators' views but because the game itself is actually less enjoyable to me due to its content.
Man you're pretty bave showing the world how ignorant you are
Thanks for this fresh perspective, next time be aware your posts come across as worthless drivel, who gives a shit what you say?
See, pretty dismissive don't you think...
That this developer makes certainly. I don't judge others for their choices. Let me ask you of the close to 900 employees in Cd Projekt Red do you think they all share the same train of thoughts? I don't think my position is that unreasonable. I have no clue how you got the idea I buy ever game that comes out from my comment.
Look man, I lean right on most things, but if I refuse to play games based on the political and social stance of a company, I'd be missing out.
The folks that created the fantastic Celeste are certainly not the type of people I would deal with on a regular basis, but man, Celeste was good as shit.
Ideology be damned.
I'm sure not everyone who works at chick-fil a are homophobic pieces of shit, but they work for a company that is.
Not giving a company your money is the most effective form of protest. People working at CDPR get paid to make the game, has nothing to do with a customers decision to boycott because their company represents bigotry.
"I'm shocked", said nobody.
Always good to have a poster who's first entrance into a political thread is to shit all over the issue at hand because "Meh games!!"
In their rush to be the first snarky response, evidently anticipating lots of competition for the snappiest one-liner putting you in your place, they failed to pay attention to the first two of your four points.
I think people sometimes forget how heteronormartive and male centered the world really is. The reason we are seeing some people (including trans folk) upset at that picture is because trans people are usually depicted as fetishes for straight men to ogle at from a safe distance, same thing with lesbian couples, a common trope in cismale pornography and "mature" media.
How many times do we see the other side? How common is the depiction of FtM people in media, specially when they still have breasts showing? I will be damned if we see a single ad in the game where the character is a man with boobs. What about male homossexual couples in seductive and suggestive poses? This is the exact reason I pointed out earlier in the thread why I try to support queer creators, because they know best how to represent themselves, when they want to.
How many times do we see the other side? How common is the depiction of FtM people in media, specially when they still have breasts showing? I will be damned if we see a single ad in the game where the character is a man with boobs. What about male homossexual couples in seductive and suggestive poses? This is the exact reason I pointed out earlier in the thread why I try to support queer creators, because they know best how to represent themselves, when they want to.
Considering that the issues people have are with actions by 1. A social media person tasked with posting as the company and 2. The board of directors /company higher ups, I think it's pretty dang fair to attribute the bad acts and subsequent half assed non apology directly to the company. Like, there's really no other way to do it.
Could you give a little bit more information regarding what you mean by this?
You said
Well there are thousands of people who work on games everyday and by not buying those games you're punishing those devs whos livelyhood are on the line. What makes it ok not to punish these devs and not others?
You obviously do, considering you couldn't be bothered to read the first fucking sentence of the thread.
They specifically said other reasons as well (they love their games, and love the setting) so it was more like "I won't stop myself from buying this despite evidence of shitty people at the company" rather than some blanket statement.
I get the direction you're going with, because other people in this thread and others aren't so specific, but that angle doesn't really work given what they said.
Games can still be subject to criticism whether or not an individual wants to purchase or play them.
"Who gives a shit" should be grounds for a warning.
That's basically thread shitting.
If you want to make and argument or add something to the topic, do it without dismissing the thread you're posting in.
That's basically thread shitting.
If you want to make and argument or add something to the topic, do it without dismissing the thread you're posting in.
You'll have to elaborate on how CDPR "represents bigotry". The difference there is that CDPR is not lobbying against LGBT rights, where Chick fil A is. One had rogue social media employees make offensive jokes on twitter that have been apologized for, while the other's owner is pushing effectively for bad policy and laws in our government.
You saw these people at the VGA's last year.
Their lifestyle is definitely different than mines, but the thing is, is that I didn't know who they were and what they looked like before I played Celeste, but at the end of the day, what I thought didn't matter after seeing who they were.
I'm a fan of Matt Makes Games because their last game was amazing and I don't care what group these people are in or where they lean socially and politically.
That isnt the point the point is assuming everyone is because of some. If we go by your line of thinking then we may as well call the whole country of poland transphobic. It just doesn't make sense. Now to be clear i'm not defending this behavior or any king of hate I just don't think it's rational.
The point is a company is filled with people who may or may not share the views of the actions of a company, that has no impact on the "ethics" or "morality" to deny them your service because you might be harming the employee's paycheck.
And no, what they said wasn't close to an apology.
"Sorry to all those offended by one of the responses sent out from our account earlier," a tweet on the official Cyberpunk 2077 Twitter account said. "Harming anyone was never our intention."
All they said was "we're sorry you're offended", which is about as much of a non-apology as you can get.
And this isn't even talking about the GOG (part of CD Project, which owns CDPR and GOG) who had the very fucked up "Won't be replaced" tweet making light of Trump attempting to basically make the entire concept of trans not exist.
And guess what? Another non-apology
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I just looked up who they were, and I don't understand why you wouldn't hang out with them?
I mean how many examples of transphobia have to come out of this company before you have a problem with them? I mean with what has just come out, whatever good actors are in the company are not catching this stuff. Nothing good comes from just ignoring it and not calling the company out.
I am not trying to be dismissive, OP, but I don't know how you take this position and function in the world. I doubt there is any company in existence that doesn't have someone who works for it that has politics that differ greatly from mine. Moreover, I'm not sure I want to live in a world where people are fired just for having different political/cultural beliefs than mine. In fact, no doubt in pretty much every company, there are likely many, many people who have views different from my own.
I'm a gay man with very progressive politics and supportive of LGBT issues politically, but for me, demanding that every company I buy something from assure they have no employees that have homophobic / non-gay friendly views is a bit too much for me. For me, I'm perfectly find just voicing my disagreement and voting for people who support policies I agree with. I don't really need the person who bags my groceries to be 1 to 1 with me on all my politics, or even to agree with my orientation. As long as they bag my groceries well and aren't aggressive about their views, we're cool. It's not something I see as important.
If I'm totally honest, moreover, I find it a bit morally problematic for me the way people go on witch hunts. Even people who have views repulsive to me need to eat and make a living. And I don't think trying to shame them into change does much good, in fact it's likely to just result in a lot more resentment and hostility. The politics and meaningful legislative changes are where its important for me. And beyond that, how I treat people 1 on 1. And as someone who lives in the deep South, I've personally seen how being charitable towards those who have homophobic views / language can gradually change. It doesn't happen overnight, but it happens. It just doesn't happen through ostricization, in my view, nor should it.
I'm a gay man with very progressive politics and supportive of LGBT issues politically, but for me, demanding that every company I buy something from assure they have no employees that have homophobic / non-gay friendly views is a bit too much for me. For me, I'm perfectly find just voicing my disagreement and voting for people who support policies I agree with. I don't really need the person who bags my groceries to be 1 to 1 with me on all my politics, or even to agree with my orientation. As long as they bag my groceries well and aren't aggressive about their views, we're cool. It's not something I see as important.
If I'm totally honest, moreover, I find it a bit morally problematic for me the way people go on witch hunts. Even people who have views repulsive to me need to eat and make a living. And I don't think trying to shame them into change does much good, in fact it's likely to just result in a lot more resentment and hostility. The politics and meaningful legislative changes are where its important for me. And beyond that, how I treat people 1 on 1. And as someone who lives in the deep South, I've personally seen how being charitable towards those who have homophobic views / language can gradually change. It doesn't happen overnight, but it happens. It just doesn't happen through ostricization, in my view, nor should it.
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You can't bring up "not punishing devs" without you looking like a massive hypocrite.
It's the same bullshit excuse used to shut down any criticism when it comes to social issues.
Every single one of your posts reads like the drivel coming out of the mouth of a person who has benefited from privilege their entire life.
Don't tell people that they shouldn't care about important issues just because you have the luxury of ignoring them and shitting on those who are affected by shortsighted ignorance and harmful stereotypes. Or just straight-up bigotry.
Yeah, I mean, you're right that the phrasing of 'punishing devs' makes it sound like an accusation that using the fact that the company has been transphobic as a purchasing factor is unfair, rather than just saying you opt not to use that as criteria. It definitely comes off as a bit of an indictment of that behavior.
I'm just waiting for him to say what I pretty much know he's going to say at this point
You need to fix your post
Here:
Also, as a side note, saying you question how someone can function in the real world due to their point of view is extremely dismissive and offensive.
This... sometimes I fell like everyone here are really young, which probably is not the case you just can't live life in black and white.
I'm a black male that lived in the hood, was poor and work at a rehab facility so I engage with people of all walks of life as my job.
Tell me why it's so important that TC voice that he doesn't want to buy a CDPR game because of where he thinks they lean socially and politically?
But here's the twist, though!
TC does want to play Cyberpunk 2077.
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