• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
Jun 20, 2019
2,638
Doesn't really matter, because Bitcoin is where all the interest is at the moment, and where most of the investment money is being pumped. The fact that you have dozens of PoS cryptos on offer means nothing if nobody is interested in them.

Besides, PoS is literally a 'Rich-Get-Richer' system, so if it ever did take off as a currency, it would just create yet more inequality.

So aside from creating hardware shortages and burning massive amounts of electricity on a planet that's fast approaching a climate catastrophe, crypto -in whatever form it takes- also completely fails to change the status quo of wealth inequality.
This is true. Talk about freeing transactions from interference from "corrupt governments" sounds wholesome when you portray it as an activity between marginalized people in regressive societies, but that's just fantasy. If such a thing existed- and I'm not sure crypto could even accomplish it- then crypto would become a tool for transferring wealth in secret around the world, which is the goal of the super-wealthy who want to maximize their ability to exploit people and pass on the costs of maintaining the commons to the exploited.

They're already doing that without crypto but hey, maybe it would make kleptocracy a little bit safer for the kleptocrats.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,131
Also tangetal but,

People act like Elon Musk and Tesla for instance accept Bitcoin because they care of believes in its future. No it's a way to accept payment in an appreciating asset while also pumping the value of said asset by announcing support.
 

FeD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,275
It has major drawbacks so I can see why people would be less than enthusiastic about it. Something like BTC does solve some problems on paper, and starting to solve some in practical cases. But the big driving force for BTC (and cryptos by extension) to get where they are is that the world has a value problem. There's simply too much money in the world right now. And then we're not even talking about how its divided. BTC and cryptos only serve to highlight that problem even more by their explosive growth.
 

Tokyo_Funk

Banned
Dec 10, 2018
10,053
That's kinda my point. It's not regulated in the sense that crypto is a universally accepted currency or anything. The "use case varies" part is really just a way of saying that "hey this shit might work or might not."

Disclaimer: I don't really care if there is a universally accepted digital currency or not, but pretty much every crypto that is currently available basically advertises itself as a pyramid scheme of sorts. If you can make bank on it, then kudos, good on ya, but so far it has never seemed to me to be some sort of replacement of currency and more an ethereal method for people to gain money with no actual tangible benefit or relation to real-world currency.

Well I can give you an example of one that does work incredibly well. I won't name it because I'm not a financial advisor. I worked for a bank temporarily for 8 months and the old system would take roughly 3-5 working days to process a transfer payment. We installed a new piece of software that allowed us to push the money faster and cheaper. 3-5 days became basically instant and the cost to the customer was easily 1/10th of what it used to be. Eventually they moved to a cloud service just before I left and they saved customers as well as the bank so much money that they stopped a tonne of general fees and lowered interest rates. That's the kind of impact it has.

There are also cryptocurrencies that solve problems like recognising legit products, fresh produce, even tokenized assets. Sure, there are a lot of cryptocurrencies that fall on the wayside and don't have good use cases and some that I will say are basically scams. Currently there is a case with the US senate on the regulation of cryptocurrency that would give more clarity and control over rogue companies that amount to nothing.

This is in no way an endorsement of crypto, but it wasn't long ago that people scorned and scoffed at cars, only to embrace them once they used them or found other use for them. I'd say out of every 50 crypto projects out there, only 1 or 2 will survive as legitimate services. The others will not meet use cases, be thrown out as unusable or in the case with BTC, become unsustainable due to its slow processing time, archaic systems and power usage.
 

Linus815

Member
Oct 29, 2017
19,680
And the right thing to do is to want all cryptos to be illegal? When not all of them have those problems?

No? Didn't say that. You asked why the hate, I answered. I am not smart enough to know the answer to this, but there absolutely does need to be something done about mining. And not just because people can't buy graphics cards.
 

Zoator

Member
Oct 27, 2017
401
There are many issues with cryptocurrencies, some of which could be solved with better regulation, but the biggest sticking point for me is the massive computational power requirement.

Any cryptocurrency based on blockchain requires an extremely large (and constantly growing) amount of computational resources to function securely. That's an invariant in the design and will always be the case. Blockchain works by ensuring the computational work needed to post a transaction is orders of magnitude beyond what any individual could possibly control. As computing technology advances, the computational work requirement must also grow (and it does by virtue of the blockchain ledger growing), or else people would be able to easily forge transactions, and the entire system would fall apart. This is why the power usage of Bitcoin is so insane, and it will only grow the more it is used.
 

Shodan14

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,410
At the moment it's basically a highly volatile asset with a cult-like following. It'll be cool to see it actually get wider use, but at the moment it just another stock to gamble on.
 

Hecht

Too damn tired
Administrator
Oct 24, 2017
9,726
Well I can give you an example of one that does work incredibly well. I won't name it because I'm not a financial advisor. I worked for a bank temporarily for 8 months and the old system would take roughly 3-5 working days to process a transfer payment. We installed a new piece of software that allowed us to push the money faster and cheaper. 3-5 days became basically instant and the cost to the customer was easily 1/10th of what it used to be. Eventually they moved to a cloud service just before I left and they saved customers as well as the bank so much money that they stopped a tonne of general fees and lowered interest rates. That's the kind of impact it has.

There are also cryptocurrencies that solve problems like recognising legit products, fresh produce, even tokenized assets. Sure, there are a lot of cryptocurrencies that fall on the wayside and don't have good use cases and some that I will say are basically scams. Currently there is a case with the US senate on the regulation of cryptocurrency that would give more clarity and control over rogue companies that amount to nothing.

This is in no way an endorsement of crypto, but it wasn't long ago that people scorned and scoffed at cars, only to embrace them once they used them or found other use for them. I'd say out of every 50 crypto projects out there, only 1 or 2 will survive as legitimate services. The others will not meet use cases, be thrown out as unusable or in the case with BTC, become unsustainable due to its slow processing time, archaic systems and power usage.
Again, this doesn't really address the issues that plague crypto as a whole in that it's a totally unregulated asset that *sometimes* can manifest as a legitmate currency. I'm happy that it worked out for whatever community you're referring to, but that seems more like a process problem than something that crypto specifically solved. As of now there isn't some sort of regulation for how crypto operates, so the fact that this bank was able to make it work is actually really surprising, because cypto is literally a currency - just like any other - so I am legitimately surprised that the monetary savings involved was due to crypto and not some sort of process anomaly.
 
Jun 26, 2018
3,829
I wish we could undo crypto, like literally destroy it, because it seems like a largely detrimental force to pretty much everything it touches.
 

Tokyo_Funk

Banned
Dec 10, 2018
10,053
Again, this doesn't really address the issues that plague crypto as a whole in that it's a totally unregulated asset that *sometimes* can manifest as a legitmate currency. I'm happy that it worked out for whatever community you're referring to, but that seems more like a process problem than something that crypto specifically solved. As of now there isn't some sort of regulation for how crypto operates, so the fact that this bank was able to make it work is actually really surprising, because cypto is literally a currency - just like any other - so I am legitimately surprised that the monetary savings involved was due to crypto and not some sort of process anomaly.

In regards to the process, the problem is you can't just go "bang" and transfer one money into another account. Many services expect larger charges and there is the problem with the middleman taking a larger cut on the way through, in some cases many middlemen. The crypto we used on the new platform was treated as a bridge currency, which has to have an associated value with it to make the transfer successful. If the middle currency has a $0 value, then transferring say 50 british pounds to Japan would be a bit hard. So the solution is a currency with a set value/price that filled the gap, in this case a cryptocurrency. There are things that need to be considered also like tracability, transaction statements, settlement and other processes that a more linear "in between" process would do. There is a lot of negotiation, checks and handshaking going on in the background when money is exchanged. I wish there was a way of explaining it more simply, but there is more under the hood than most people know is going on. With some ridiculous amount like 14 Trillion a day being passed around through hundreds of different channels, making them more simple would be a huge step.
 

Glasfrut

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,533
Is that true though? I've read stories of women in countries where it's not easy for them to bank independently, starting businesses and taking payments in crypto currency and using it to buy stuff at online stores. Perhaps in many parts of the world, the banking culture and infrastructure is such that it seems redundant, but it's not true everywhere.
It solves a lot of things in countries with corrupt governments and banks

Which countries/part of the world?
 

artsi

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,681
Finland
There are many issues with cryptocurrencies, some of which could be solved with better regulation, but the biggest sticking point for me is the massive computational power requirement.

Any cryptocurrency based on blockchain requires an extremely large (and constantly growing) amount of computational resources to function securely. That's an invariant in the design and will always be the case. Blockchain works by ensuring the computational work needed to post a transaction is orders of magnitude beyond what any individual could possibly control. As computing technology advances, the computational work requirement must also grow (and it does by virtue of the blockchain ledger growing), or else people would be able to easily forge transactions, and the entire system would fall apart. This is why the power usage of Bitcoin is so insane, and it will only grow the more it is used.

No, look at VeChain for example, which is one of the most used mainnets at the moment.

The blockchain is verified by 101 authority masternodes, all controlled by a trusted institution (DNV GL, PwC, Deloitte, Grant Thorton being some) which is enough to give the blockchain trust and immutability, but not so many that it requires a ton of electricity to run.

For the blockchain to be compromised it would require 52 individual parties to collude (or be compromised), which is pretty much impossible considering their size and focus on security.

It's not as decentralized as Bitcoin or Ethereum but it's still public blockchain and very fast, and efficient.
 

strudelkuchen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,042
YVMFCFM.png


116917907_v266cd8de5-cf2e-4fb0-ba22-e6dfb9f2951c_nc.png
 

Hecht

Too damn tired
Administrator
Oct 24, 2017
9,726
In regards to the process, the problem is you can't just go "bang" and transfer one money into another account. Many services expect larger charges and there is the problem with the middleman taking a larger cut on the way through, in some cases many middlemen. The crypto we used on the new platform was treated as a bridge currency, which has to have an associated value with it to make the transfer successful. If the middle currency has a $0 value, then transferring say 50 british pounds to Japan would be a bit hard. So the solution is a currency with a set value/price that filled the gap, in this case a cryptocurrency. There are things that need to be considered also like tracability, transaction statements, settlement and other processes that a more linear "in between" process would do. There is a lot of negotiation, checks and handshaking going on in the background when money is exchanged. I wish there was a way of explaining it more simply, but there is more under the hood than most people know is going on. With some ridiculous amount like 14 Trillion a day being passed around through hundreds of different channels, making them more simple would be a huge step.
That makes some sense, but why is it different than just using regular currency? Those have established values and can be easily exchanged - you say there's no middleman for crypto but it has to be convertable to some sort of currency for it to be legitimate. Again, I still don't understand what problem that crypto actually "solves," even in this case. It's a monetary transaction. At some point there is a conversion of one currency to another, and I don't see how crypto is any different in that respect - crypto by its very nature has to be convertable to some sort of real world currency.
 

Tokyo_Funk

Banned
Dec 10, 2018
10,053
That makes some sense, but why is it different than just using regular currency? Those have established values and can be easily exchanged - you say there's no middleman for crypto but it has to be convertable to some sort of currency for it to be legitimate. Again, I still don't understand what problem that crypto actually "solves," even in this case. It's a monetary transaction. At some point there is a conversion of one currency to another, and I don't see how crypto is any different in that respect - crypto by its very nature has to be convertable to some sort of real world currency.

Ok this I can actually explain. This will be a depressing story, but it drives the point home

About 3 months into my job and fresh out of training, there was a man who needed to send money to Africa for his father for life saving surgery, he would not go into detail as to what was needed, but he required to send about $7000 AUD (5,400 USD) to his mothers bank in Sudan, which needed to be converted to Sudanese pounds. Now, the bank he used in Sudan doesn't just accept Australian Dollars when transferred, so it had to go through Egypt through a sister bank. For the exchange, we took an instant transfer amount, then the Egyptian bank took an amount and by the time the money actually got to his father, he was short almost $200 (8,600 Sudanese pounds). He did not receive the payment for 12 working days and his father's surgery was delayed because the money wasn't made up and it was late. Now, the man came back and paid another $500AUD to be sure which would take another 12 odd days. His father eventually recieved it, but he was deceased by that time as his brain swelling was too much.

Which system do you think would have saved his life?

AUD($125 fee) -> Egyptian pounds ($100 odd fee) - Sudanese Pound (12 days)

AUD - > $5 fee -> Bridge currency (Fee included) - Sudanese Pound - (3-10 seconds)

You have to understand, that one of the biggest killers of transactions is time, cost and inbetween bank prices. This varies from bank to bank and network to network. So sending money to Thailand is cheaper than sending to Russia because there are less exchange steps and better networks. I wish it were as simple as "Single exchange and done"
 

GeoGonzo

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,318
Madrid, Spain
"Sure, the planet got destroyed, but for a beautiful moment in time we created a lot of value for shareholders."

I don't care about scalpers or graphic card scarcity but the environmental impact of mining is disgusting. And dismissing that concern with "not ALL cryptocurrencies are mined" is disingenuous as fuck.
 

Hopewell

Member
Jan 17, 2018
513
What about alt coins?
When we talk about environmental issues we mention Bitcoin but there are alt coins which are less energy consuming. But maybe it's not enough I don't really know.
 
Jan 27, 2019
16,071
Fuck off
"Sure, the planet got destroyed, but for a beautiful moment in time we created a lot of value for shareholders."

I don't care about scalpers or graphic card scarcity but the environmental impact of mining is disgusting. And dismissing that concern with "not ALL cryptocurrencies are mined" is disingenuous as fuck.

Exactly this.

It's peak late stage capitalism. Destroying the planet for short term gain. On top of that as multiple people have said the crypto community is massively shitty.
 

behOemoth

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,606
What about alt coins?
When we talk about environmental issues we mention Bitcoin but there are alt coins which are less energy consuming. But maybe it's not enough I don't really know.
Afaik, the are still in the same order of magnitude. We need magnitudes, i.e. 100 to 10 thousands, less energy consumption.
 

jelly

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
33,841
Do people actually buy normal stuff with crypto or even change it into real money to buy stuff or is it just hoarding?
 

Hecht

Too damn tired
Administrator
Oct 24, 2017
9,726
Ok this I can actually explain. This will be a depressing story, but it drives the point home

About 3 months into my job and fresh out of training, there was a man who needed to send money to Africa for his father for life saving surgery, he would not go into detail as to what was needed, but he required to send about $7000 AUD (5,400 USD) to his mothers bank in Sudan, which needed to be converted to Sudanese pounds. Now, the bank he used in Sudan doesn't just accept Australian Dollars when transferred, so it had to go through Egypt through a sister bank. For the exchange, we took an instant transfer amount, then the Egyptian bank took an amount and by the time the money actually got to his father, he was short almost $200 (8,600 Sudanese pounds). He did not receive the payment for 12 working days and his father's surgery was delayed because the money wasn't made up and it was late. Now, the man came back and paid another $500AUD to be sure which would take another 12 odd days. His father eventually recieved it, but he was deceased by that time as his brain swelling was too much.

Which system do you think would have saved his life?

AUD($125 fee) -> Egyptian pounds ($100 odd fee) - Sudanese Pound (12 days)

AUD - > $5 fee -> Bridge currency (Fee included) - Sudanese Pound - (3-10 seconds)

You have to understand, that one of the biggest killers of transactions is time, cost and inbetween bank prices. This varies from bank to bank and network to network. So sending money to Thailand is cheaper than sending to Russia because there are less exchange steps and better networks. I wish it were as simple as "Single exchange and done"
I'll repeat that I don't really have a dog in this fight in general. But again, this whole transaction is relying on a currency that is not regulated and is not fiat currency, meaning that it isn't backed by anything other than whomever out there is "mining" it (and that's a whole other can of worms I'm not going to get into right now). Again, if it works in these instances, then great, but my concern is the overall usage of crypto as some sort of legitimate currency, If it can get there, great, but as of now, it's really just this back room boogeyman that is opaque to your average person and is not something that is readily usable or even profitable for your average person due to the fact that it's an unregulated currency.
 
Oct 25, 2017
20,202
I'll repeat that I don't really have a dog in this fight in general. But again, this whole transaction is relying on a currency that is not regulated and is not fiat currency, meaning that it isn't backed by anything other than whomever out there is "mining" it (and that's a whole other can of worms I'm not going to get into right now). Again, if it works in these instances, then great, but my concern is the overall usage of crypto as some sort of legitimate currency, If it can get there, great, but as of now, it's really just this back room boogeyman that is opaque to your average person and is not something that is readily usable or even profitable for your average person due to the fact that it's an unregulated currency.

its also assuming that not government intervention and regulations ever happen. every theory ive seen floated on hacker news from die hards gets countered quite easily because its either a non crypto issue or a non currency issue. newrly every crypto fantasy operates under the guise a fully deregulated system which is just a pipe dream
 

Hoot

Member
Nov 12, 2017
2,104
Because it's setting our planet even more on fire to please a handful of meme ultra capitalists, and should be considered an assault on humanity
 

Tokyo_Funk

Banned
Dec 10, 2018
10,053
I'll repeat that I don't really have a dog in this fight in general. But again, this whole transaction is relying on a currency that is not regulated and is not fiat currency, meaning that it isn't backed by anything other than whomever out there is "mining" it (and that's a whole other can of worms I'm not going to get into right now). Again, if it works in these instances, then great, but my concern is the overall usage of crypto as some sort of legitimate currency, If it can get there, great, but as of now, it's really just this back room boogeyman that is opaque to your average person and is not something that is readily usable or even profitable for your average person due to the fact that it's an unregulated currency.

Oh right I get you now. We're on the same page.

I'll pretty much sum it up for you as easily as possible : The Securities and Exchange commission is currently in the process of finalizing regulation this year on cryptocurrency. Those that tick all the boxes of the howie test will be treated as not a currency and basically a security. The one thing about most crypto is that they're still fairly new, and laws that decide what is and isn't a security/currency are basically ancient at this point. That's why we have newly formed government groups that will be tasked with regulation of crypto. Japan, Britain, Singapore, Korea and Australia already have boards and government approved regulation of them. I don't want to sound crude, but the US are really dragging their asses on clarity, though the Justice department officially declared the currency I was talking about a currency. Personally I'm all for regulation and clarity. We don't need EA or COD moneybucks-like cryptos out there.
 

gofreak

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,734
Let's not pretend crypto is gonna lift 3rd world countries out of poverty.

Didn't say that.

Which countries/part of the world?

It's testing my memory, but I think it was Afghanistan or a north african country.

Far more personally, I have an ex-colleague whose family fled Venezuela a couple of years ago. I don't know the details of how, except that Bitcoin was a key part of them getting some of their money out of the country.

You don't need crypto for any of that.

Maybe, depending, but if people are choosing it over other options then presumably it is of benefit to them.

Which is winding back on my original counter - simply that it's of zero benefit at all. There being alternatives doesn't mean there's no benefit. It not saving the entire third world doesn't mean it's of no benefit. I think the bottom level idea of a trustless transaction system, independent of government, or any one entity, is of benefit as long as we're in a world where higher barriers or corrupt centralised entities do exist in some places. We can definitely argue about the how that's implemented, and the costs of implementation and the need to find efficient systems, but to say there's no benefit or potential benefit at all in the idea seems to lack nuance.
 

Hecht

Too damn tired
Administrator
Oct 24, 2017
9,726
its also assuming that not government intervention and regulations ever happen. every theory ive seen floated on hacker news from die hards gets countered quite easily because its either a non crypto issue or a non currency issue. newrly every crypto fantasy operates under the guise a fully deregulated system which is just a pipe dream
Yeah that's probably my point at its most basic. It's like the libertarian pipe dream of complete deregulation which isn't feasible in this whole thing we call reality.

Oh right I get you now. We're on the same page.

I'll pretty much sum it up for you as easily as possible : The Securities and Exchange commission is currently in the process of finalizing regulation this year on cryptocurrency. Those that tick all the boxes of the howie test will be treated as not a currency and basically a security. The one thing about most crypto is that they're still fairly new, and laws that decide what is and isn't a security/currency are basically ancient at this point. That's why we have newly formed government groups that will be tasked with regulation of crypto. Japan, Britain, Singapore, Korea and Australia already have boards and government approved regulation of them. I don't want to sound crude, but the US are really dragging their asses on clarity, though the Justice department officially declared the currency I was talking about a currency. Personally I'm all for regulation and clarity. We don't need EA or COD moneybucks-like cryptos out there.
If crypto can be a feasible currency in the sense that it's universally accepted and handled similarly with countries across the globe, then great. However, right now it's generally seen as this ethereal thing that can or cannot make money for a select few that happened to get in early and were able to ride the high of everyone else buying into it in order to make a profit. I'm hopeful that the former can happen, but it's gonna piss a lot of tech bros off that were essentially using crypto as a money-making machine rather than an actual alternative to tangible currency.
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,217
I've been involved with the space since 2016 but I gotta admit I do hate how tribal it has become. Console wars don't even come close to the type of tribalism going on in crypto. People dedicate their entire lives to promoting whichever coin they are invested in while going around and shit talking every other project. It's an ugly side to a space where a lot of actual paradigm shifting development is happening. I'm sure it won't be too long before even the die hard crypto naysayers here will in some way be benefiting from said development, without even realizing it.
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,471
While I understand that we should eventually be able to separate crypto from mining altogether, as things are right now, it is like asking people to separate the idea of ivory goods from poaching.
 
Last edited:

Necromanti

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,545
Ignoring the speculation, the cult-like behavior associated with it, the impact on the environment, and its actual applicability...

I want to at least humor the notion that cryptocurrencies can benefit people living under an authoritarian government, but I'm still not satisfied by the arguments.

Cryptocurrencies can potentially allow people to hide and protect their money from a government wanting to seize it. (Without context, that opens a whole new can of worms given what an issue offshore assets/tax havens/tax evasion are outside of the cryptocurrency space).

But unless you get paid in cryptocurrency or can make most of your purchases with it, it seems pretty insolvent. Surely you'd still need your money in a bank to purchase it from an exchange or to actually convert it to money that you can pay your rent and bills with. It doesn't seem like a thing a government can't ultimately stymie from some angle.
 

Tokyo_Funk

Banned
Dec 10, 2018
10,053
Yeah that's probably my point at its most basic. It's like the libertarian pipe dream of complete deregulation which isn't feasible in this whole thing we call reality.

If crypto can be a feasible currency in the sense that it's universally accepted and handled similarly with countries across the globe, then great. However, right now it's generally seen as this ethereal thing that can or cannot make money for a select few that happened to get in early and were able to ride the high of everyone else buying into it in order to make a profit. I'm hopeful that the former can happen, but it's gonna piss a lot of tech bros off that were essentially using crypto as a money-making machine rather than an actual alternative to tangible currency.

Oh I agree with you on all of this. That's why I was laughing at the Dogecoin thread, people are jumping on FOMOing it as a "Get rich quick" scheme without understanding it at all. You're also dead right that in many cases only a few at the top make money and the rest miss out.
 

Culex

Member
Oct 29, 2017
6,840
I've done hundreds of wires for many crypto currency's. The ones that my fraud department didn't flag were 100% for investment only. I've spoken to literally every individual and never once has anyone said they spend it.

they sit on it for speculating.
 

Sandersson

Banned
Feb 5, 2018
2,535
Huge waste of energy, yet to see any real mainstream adoption, huge in the goldbug/conspiracy theory circles and causes actual stock problems for hw buyers.

I think its a literal no brainer why people dislike them. The way your average ERA user probably experiences crypto is the "hardware x sold out so people can crunch meaningless equations."

I've done hundreds of wires for many crypto currency's. The ones that my fraud department didn't flag were 100% for investment only. I've spoken to literally every individual and never once has anyone said they spend it.

they sit on it for speculating.
Exactly, and like instead of sitting on stocks ie companies that actually do something, these "currencies" do nothing but consume time and energy for nothing.
 

GamerJM

Member
Nov 8, 2017
15,595
Even outside of mining (which is my main issue with crypto since it fucks over PC prices and is awful for the environment in terms of energy consumption, but you at least addressed that in the OP so I'll sidestep it) it's just bullshit capitalist shit. Like, actually using crypto as currency serves no purpose for 99.99% of the population except for illegal/grey market transactions. By trading crypto you're just trading some asset that has an arbitrary fluctuate value. From what I've seen it's not that far from a glorified gambling game where your odds are, admittedly, better than actual gambling.
 

Okii

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,189
This is a gaming forum, we want RTX cards to not be snatched up by miners that's literally the extent of most people's hate for crypto.
 

shnurgleton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,864
Boston
It's a speculative toy for hedge funds, WSB dorks, and technolibertarians that provides little real benefit to the world and consumes a hell of a lot of power. I'm sure the fucking lottery lifted one or two people out of poverty too, but that doesn't make it a good thing