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Predict Crackdown 3's Metacritic score

  • 59 or lower

    Votes: 151 7.1%
  • 60-69

    Votes: 669 31.6%
  • 70-79

    Votes: 1,061 50.0%
  • 80-89

    Votes: 200 9.4%
  • fun (90 or higher)

    Votes: 39 1.8%

  • Total voters
    2,120
  • Poll closed .

bcatwilly

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,483
Here's a better idea:

Go back to the warm, comforting embrace of the OT and let the rest of us be free to dislike the game.

Wow, I guess that is what I will have to do so that you can continue to grace everyone with your insightful analysis on why some game sucks repeatedly and also point out repeatedly in this review thread why it is wrong for anyone else to disagree with said reviews based on their own experience with the game that they are enjoying. LOL.
 

Kaako

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,736
I think that maybe the only thing that many of us would agree at this point is that this stupid review thread should probably just be locked for further replies, as there isn't anything useful coming out of this mess at this point. If you like the game or are interested in whether you might want to try it then there is an OT thread, and there are certainly other places to just have fun trashing it on social media or otherwise too I guess if that is your thing.
Why does it feel like some of you wanted this review thread closed as soon as them reviews started going up? There has been so much meta-commentary over why/how this thread is so big and why it's open. By all means, stick to the OT if this thread bothers you that much man.
 

Deleted member 22750

Oct 28, 2017
13,267
If I had an agenda I'd be clogging up the OT with my derision, which I'm not.

This is a review thread and the consensus matches my own feelings about the game.

Take your own advice and ignore me if my critiques bother you so much.
Here's a better idea:

Go back to the warm, comforting embrace of the OT and let the rest of us be free to dislike the game.
just admit your hate for this game is an obsession at this point...
 

Morfid_Plays

Self Requested Ban
Member
Oct 27, 2017
943
When Nintendo or Sony release their next AAA flop, it will intriguing to see the arguments from different warrior camps about why this particular score is not indicative of the games true quality.


Maybe if Sony and Nintendo's quality slips to Microsoft levels they might have to also introduce a gamespass
 

DevilMayGuy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,577
Texas
We're getting into the realm of complete subjectivity here but the combat in Spider-Man is solid, yes, but what it emulates is a lot better (Batman). I don't want to turn this into pointing out my other issues with the game but the biggest problems it has it shares with Crackdown and one is dragged through the mud for those issues while the other has them largely ignored because reasons.

I can also point out how Crackdown's reception isn't THAT far off from Fallout 76. Now, I'll say again that I think agree with the consensus of crackdown, I even voted for 60-69 in the poll before it was closed on Thursday. But I can't fathom a reason why the literal biggest disaster of this console generation and an actual almost irredeemably bad game is very close in proximity to another game that is just ok at best. It's like the consensus was significantly more lenient on Fallout.



Spider-Man looks a lot prettier yes. The traversal system, while feeling great, is no more complex that Crackdown. There is just as much nuance to Crackdown's once you unlock all of the abilities. Neither are deep. Both are enjoyable. The combat is very much like other things available, there's a whole other series that it's combat is heavily derived from. And what mission variety? The only "variety" comes from the main story which is probably the biggest thing other than visuals that Spider-Man has over Crackdown. The side missions, which are the bulk of the game, are all very similar and either make use of the traversal or combat.

Spider-Man certainly LOOKS like a game from last year, but it doesn't play like one.
I can't think of a post I disagree with more in this thread, and I am actually, truly nonplussed that an actual human being genuinely thinks this.
 

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,958
I already stated an entire series. The assassin's creed games before Unity play similarly. Hell, even the Mad Mad game isn't far off from this same kind of combat. The combat in Spider-Man is good, but it's not revolutionary or exemplary.

I've played all of those games extensively and they do not play much like Spider-Man at all, outside of the basic Arkham combat structure which Insomniac took to an entirely different level.

Spider-Man is much quicker, far more dynamic, utilizes much larger combat spaces and implements all manner of tweaks, including much more pronounced environmental utilization. There are similarities to be sure but Spider-Man's combat is arguably the best iteration of the Arkham style seen yet and it certainly has a very distinctive feel.

Regardless, there was a clear attempt to evolve and innovate with the combat. I see no evidence of any real innovation or even incremental evolution in CD3.
 

xxracerxx

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
31,222
When Nintendo or Sony release their next AAA flop, it will intriguing to see the arguments from different warrior camps about why this particular score is not indicative of the games true quality.
Days Gone is coming up! So you may see it all in action very shortly.

God that game looks so bland outside of being set in Eastern Oregon.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
I can't think of a post I disagree with more in this thread, and I am actually, truly nonplussed that an actual human being genuinely thinks this.

Someone has an opinion different than mine. Unfathomable.

Regardless, there was a clear attempt to evolve and innovate with the combat. I see no evidence of any real innovation or even incremental evolution in CD3.

Well for one the traversal in Crackdown 3 is miles better than 1 or 2 because of the extra abilities they have added into it like the thrusters, double/triple jump, and an actual working ground pound. Small additions that make a big difference in getting around the game's world.
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
I never said it should score like Crackdown I just pointed out the huge discrepancy when the games share similar issues. It's not even about just Spider-Man. That's just the closest analog I can think of that I've played. A log of these criticisms can be applied to plenty of other open-world titles that fair better in their public reception.

Here's some thoughts, maybe because severity of these issues is bigger in CD3? Maybe the good things are really good in Spider-Man (and the other open-world games) that they outweigh the bad things but the good things are not that good in Crackdown 3?
 

zedox

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,215
That's great that Game Pass exists so games like this might get a decent chance of longevity however, if the base sku is priced at $60 then it is getting reviewed and should get reviewed as a $60 game. At the same time, you can give the nod to the gamepass option as the majority of the reviewers already do(?)
This is something that will take a while for reviewers and players to get used to. I had this discussion with chobel ...how do you accurately review a game that is both $60 retail but also at max $10 with a subscription (I say at max because one may have already had the subscription so it's not an additional $10)? Your audience is totally different and we don't live in a world where Xbox Game Pass doesn't exist (and the game was really hit hard with marketing of getting it with Xbox Game Pass). Because you can't rate it as a $60 title just as you can't rate a $20 title like you would a $60 because users can get it at $0, $10, or $60. A score doesn't really tell the value that you are getting with those options. That's why I believe you should be reviewing the title on the merits of the title (not saying that reviewers aren't) and not how much it costs because that's just a murky situation where there is literally no size fits all.

I say this because when people look at 6, we know especially on this forum, what it means. It's usually not "worth" playing, not even worth buying. But if you are getting it as part of your subscription, that may be totally different. It really just makes things different.
 

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,958
Wow, I guess that is what I will have to do so that you can continue to grace everyone with your insightful analysis on why some game sucks repeatedly and also point out repeatedly in this review thread why it is wrong for anyone else to disagree with said reviews based on their own experience with the game that they are enjoying. LOL.

Whatever makes you feel better, sport.

Just remember, you're the one looking to close down a thread because the bulk of the posts don't align with your tastes.
 

DrDeckard

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,109
UK
Woof almost 80 pages. I bet I've missed some amazing posts.

Too busy playing this game. Ton's achievements already. Outside of the dodgy driving the game is exactly what I wanted.
 
mod post

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
32,776
Official Staff Communication
This is a review thread. People can react however they want to the scores. All this backseat modding over what people should be posting, or whether the thread should be open, needs to end. As should the platform warring. Thank you.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
Here's some thoughts, maybe because severity of these issues is bigger in CD3? Maybe the good things are really good in Spider-Man (and the other open-world games) that outweigh the bad things but they are not that good in Crackdown 3?

But they really aren't, at least not to the extent they can be overlooked for near universal acclaim while Crackdown is relegated to an average of a 60 rating, which is extremely low in the world of videogame reviews where anything under a 7 = bad.

In a better world, where the full spectrum is used, this wouldn't be an issue. Because I feel like Crackdown 3 is indeed a 6.
 

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,958
The comparison between the two games absolutely beggars belief. Truly.

"Am I out of touch?

No, it is [everyone else] who are wrong."

The odd comparisons have persisted throughout this thread and they are something...

DOOM, Sunset Overdrive, RDR2, Spider-Man

What's odd is thinking that comparing CD3 to genuinely well-received software somehow makes it the better game when I would argue the opposite is true.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
The comparison between the two games absolutely beggars belief. Truly.

I'd like to know how? They're very comparable games. Unless you're not even going to contribute to the discussion and just post passive aggressive insults, in which case don't bother responding to this.

What's odd is thinking that comparing CD3 to genuinely well-received software somehow makes it the better game when I would argue the opposite is true.

I have at no point said or even insinuated that Crackdown is the better game.
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
But they really aren't, at least not to the extent they can be overlooked for near universal acclaim while Crackdown is relegated to an average of a 60 rating, which is extremely low in the world of videogame reviews where anything under a 7 = bad.

In a better world, where the full spectrum is used, this wouldn't be an issue. Because I feel like Crackdown 3 is indeed a 6.

How are you sure of that? Obviously the reviewers disagree, so why are you right and they're wrong?
 

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,958
I'd like to know how? They're very comparable games. Unless you're not even going to contribute to the discussion and just post passive aggressive insults, in which case don't bother responding to this.

They really aren't.

The problem with reductive analysis is that you can make the claim that just about any two things are similar but under more critical and intellectual scrutiny that becomes difficult to sustain.

I mean, I can draw quite a few parallels between Golden Axe and The Witcher 3 but that doesn't mean they are really all that similar once you delve into their actual, respective compositions.

Spider-Man is a melee-centric action game and CD3 is an open world TPS.

They really aren't even operating in the same ballpark in terms of genre.
 

Grenchel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,296
This is something that will take a while for reviewers and players to get used to. I had this discussion with chobel ...how do you accurately review a game that is both $60 retail but also at max $10 with a subscription (I say at max because one may have already had the subscription so it's not an additional $10)? Your audience is totally different and we don't live in a world where Xbox Game Pass doesn't exist (and the game was really hit hard with marketing of getting it with Xbox Game Pass). Because you can't rate it as a $60 title just as you can't rate a $20 title like you would a $60 because users can get it at $0, $10, or $60. A score doesn't really tell the value that you are getting with those options. That's why I believe you should be reviewing the title on the merits of the title (not saying that reviewers aren't) and not how much it costs because that's just a murky situation where there is literally no size fits all.

I say this because when people look at 6, we know especially on this forum, what it means. It's usually not "worth" playing, not even worth buying. But if you are getting it as part of your subscription, that may be totally different. It really just makes things different.

I am not sure it makes a difference. Film critics evaluate (or should be) movies the same regardless of the medium/price, and it should be the same with games. BUT I really love the idea that we could have a service(s) where people can take more chances with the games they play.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
They really aren't.

The problem with reductive analysis is that you can make the claim that just about any two things are similar but under more critical and intellectual scrutiny that becomes difficult to sustain.

I mean, I can draw quite a few parallels between Golden Axe and The Witcher 3 but that doesn't mean they are really all that similar once you delve into their actual, respective compositions.

Spider-Man is a melee-centric action game and CD3 is an open world TPS.

They really aren't even operating in the same ballpark in terms of genre.

But they absolutely are. This isn't reductive whatsoever. Just because one is an action game and the other is a shooter doesn't mean you can't draw parallels between two games that rely on traversal systems through the open-world and have a very similar open world structure and progression system. The only substantial difference between the two is the combat system and that alone doesn't negate comparison.
 

Deleted member 32018

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,628
This is something that will take a while for reviewers and players to get used to. I had this discussion with @chobel ...how do you accurately review a game that is both $60 retail but also at max $10 with a subscription (I say at max because one may have already had the subscription so it's not an additional $10)? Your audience is totally different and we don't live in a world where Xbox Game Pass doesn't exist (and the game was really hit hard with marketing of getting it with Xbox Game Pass). Because you can't rate it as a $60 title just as you can't rate a $20 title like you would a $60 because users can get it at $0, $10, or $60. A score doesn't really tell the value that you are getting with those options. That's why I believe you should be reviewing the title on the merits of the title (not saying that reviewers aren't) and not how much it costs because that's just a murky situation where there is literally no size fits all.

I say this because when people look at 6, we know especially on this forum, what it means. It's usually not "worth" playing, not even worth buying. But if you are getting it as part of your subscription, that may be totally different. It really just makes things different.

Reviewers probably do take the price as a factor when reviewing games as well as enjoyment for time spent among other things but at the same time is "it's a good game for $2" something that should be seen as a good thing?

I do agree that it does make it more difficult to review the game if you are able to get it with a subscription but that is going to happen not only with gamepass but with other subscriptions too. Perhaps it should be reviewed as a $60 game if that is the price it is being sold at but reviewers can add the caveat that it may be worth playing if you have the subscription.
 

Skeeter49

I wish Jim Ryan would eat me
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,297
When Nintendo or Sony release their next AAA flop, it will intriguing to see the arguments from different warrior camps about why this particular score is not indicative of the games true quality.
505107016004665344.png


The issue people have is with the consistency of it, MS has consistently put out flops over the last 2 or 3 years, minus their Forza titles. It's getting harder to care about MS's published content when only the racing games have been worth a $60 purchase as of late.

I mean, if you like the game, you like the game. Nothing wrong with liking CD3, just like nothing wrong with liking Sony's next flop or Nintendo's next flop. The issue is with attacking journalists and coming up wtih conspiracy theories on why the game reviewed poorly. To bring in a Sony game, people did the same thing with THe order 1886, and everyone called bullshit on those damage controlling assholes. The bad game reviewed bad because it's bad. That doesn't mean people can't like it, but if it's consistently being reviewed as bad, spoilers, it's probably not a good game to the majority of gamers out there.
 

Kaako

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,736
This is something that will take a while for reviewers and players to get used to. I had this discussion with chobel ...how do you accurately review a game that is both $60 retail but also at max $10 with a subscription (I say at max because one may have already had the subscription so it's not an additional $10)? Your audience is totally different and we don't live in a world where Xbox Game Pass doesn't exist (and the game was really hit hard with marketing of getting it with Xbox Game Pass). Because you can't rate it as a $60 title just as you can't rate a $20 title like you would a $60 because users can get it at $0, $10, or $60. A score doesn't really tell the value that you are getting with those options. That's why I believe you should be reviewing the title on the merits of the title (not saying that reviewers aren't) and not how much it costs because that's just a murky situation where there is literally no size fits all.

I say this because when people look at 6, we know especially on this forum, what it means. It's usually not "worth" playing, not even worth buying. But if you are getting it as part of your subscription, that may be totally different. It really just makes things different.
Agreed with pretty much everything you said. The score should absolutely reflect the merits of the game first and foremost. At the same time, it does get quite tricky with the $60 to own, $10 subscription model. We are still figuring it out as players and reviewers but once you are part of that subscription, the perception will be different. Because the value proposition is also different. Getting more for the money, but maybe not as much insane AAA quality which would be fully acceptable as a subscriber.
The cynic in me fears a bit the precedent that acceptance might set in the future in terms of quality but I know that it'll balance out if there is not enough quality.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,138
When Nintendo or Sony release their next AAA flop, it will intriguing to see the arguments from different warrior camps about why this particular score is not indicative of the games true quality.
What does anything have to do with being a warrior? I think Skyrim is trash and I think Uncharted 4 is the best in the series. So what? Doesn't mean I'm trying to champion for some mega-coporation.
 

E.T.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,035
505107016004665344.png


The issue people have is with the consistency of it, MS has consistently put out flops over the last 2 or 3 years, minus their Forza titles. It's getting harder to care about MS's published content when only the racing games have been worth a $60 purchase as of late.

I mean, if you like the game, you like the game. Nothing wrong with liking CD3, just like nothing wrong with liking Sony's next flop or Nintendo's next flop. The issue is with attacking journalists and coming up wtih conspiracy theories on why the game reviewed poorly. To bring in a Sony game, people did the same thing with THe order 1886, and everyone called bullshit on those damage controlling assholes. The bad game reviewed bad because it's bad. That doesn't mean people can't like it, but if it's consistently being reviewed as bad, spoilers, it's probably not a good game to the majority of gamers out there.
That is completely fair, everybody has different tastes and just because reviewers may feel differently about a title, does not mean the same problems hurt your experience. GamePass here can act as a cushion to soften the blow in regards to monetary spending and people who experience the game through that service are more likely to react more favorably to the game I feel.
 

tyfon

Member
Nov 2, 2017
3,680
Norway
So I wrote yesterday that after playing for a few hours the game was fun but felt a bit dated, especially in animations and gameplay and I could understand the review scores due to that. I played a bit more today, and I came over a section which encapsulates what I mean quite well so I decided to make a gif out of it.
While I made this gif, my wife came over and asked what that was and I said it's a new game I played that I recorded a bit from.
Her immediate reply was "Oh, they don't use motion capture in this game?" and I think she hit the nail on the head actually.

Here is the gif I made. IQ is not what is in game, this is just for the animation. My gifmaking skills are not the greatest.
giphy.gif


Please note, I don't hate this game I actually find it quite fun to play. But I'm an old fart and I still find games like SMB2 fun (which dropped on Nintendo Online recently!!)
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
Because videogame critics are usually very fickle and often lack consistency in their perception and judgment.

Alright, let's say I believe this. Now explain to me why aren't game reviews more chaotic? Reviewers being "very fickle" means we should be seeing the 5-6s reviews about the same as the 9-10s reviews.
Also explain to me how all reviewers went fickle at the same when it's CD3? You said they lack consistency, they sure went consistent with each other in CD3 and Spider-man.
 

Skeeter49

I wish Jim Ryan would eat me
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,297
Hell, I don't care how bad CD3 is reviewing, I'm sure it's better than trash GTA4, and that has a 97 meta.

The one thing people all seem to agree on is it's fun to play, which at least means it's an eventual buy for me.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
Alright, let's say I believe this. Now explain to me why aren't game reviews more chaotic? Reviewers being "very fickle" means we should be seeing the 5-6s reviews about the same as the 9-10s reviews.
Also explain to me how all reviewers went fickle at the same when it's CD3? You said they lack consistency, they sure went consistent with each other in CD3 and Spider-man.

Exactly. Lacking consistency in holding the same issues accountable depending on the game.

Because like I said earlier in the thread. It's a lot easier to drag Crackdown 3 and pour it on for issues it shares with many other games when it lacks the big budget veneer and had constant negative press surrounding it before release. It really just seems like good PR, marketing, and a lot of polish can cover up a lot of blemishes.
 

chobel

Attempting to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,493
Exactly. Lacking consistency in holding the same issues accountable depending on the game.

Because like I said earlier in the thread. It's a lot easier to drag Crackdown 3 and pour it on for issues it shares with many other games when it lacks the big budget veneer and had constant negative press surrounding it before release.

Dude, did you really use my rebuttal to your argument as some kinda of validation to your opinion? There's many sentences after "Alright, let's say I believe this."
 

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,958
But they absolutely are. This isn't reductive whatsoever. Just because one is an action game and the other is a shooter doesn't mean you can't draw parallels between two games that rely on traversal systems through the open-world and have a very similar open world structure and progression system.

Oh, you can draw the parallels, they just don't hold up well.

I've played both and they are fundamentally nothing alike. The core gameplay components are entirely dissimilar and that's before we even get into discussing refinement, visuals, physics, etc.

Like I said, I could compare any number of games using a reductive methodology but I don't see the value. CD3 isn't getting low review scores because critics are fickle or inconsistent but rather because the game has some very glaring issues.
 

Lorul2

Member
Jan 4, 2018
770
Okay I played about an hour and a half of Crackdown 3 and I like it. I don't like it because I like Xbox. I just like it because it's fun. Oddly enough a lot of the critics said the same thing before they trashed the game. To me it's definitely not a six out of ten on my scorecard, at least so far.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
Oh, you can draw the parallels, they just don't hold up well.

I've played both and they are fundamentally nothing alike. The core gameplay components are entirely dissimilar and that's before we even get into discussing refinement, visuals, physics, etc.

Like I said, I could compare any number of games using a reductive methodology but I don't see the value. CD3 isn't getting low review scores because critics are fickle or inconsistent but rather because the game has some very glaring issues.

You can keep saying it's reductive but it's not because the games share many similarities that are evenly comparable, more so than they are dissimilar.

Dude, did you really use my rebuttal to your argument as some kinda of validation to your opinion? There's many sentences after "Alright, let's say I believe this

I guess so because it kind of did and I addressed everything you said afterwards.

The "consistency" doesn't have anything to do with consensus it has to do with delegating criticisms evenly, which a lot of reviewers don't seem to do. In an industry where many are rushing out of the gate to get their review up, it seems like it might even be a lot easier to bookmark and hamper on those issues in a game that isn't as polished or has the same high budget as another. Especially when there's already negative connotations surrounding said game before you even play it.
 

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,958
Exactly. Lacking consistency in holding the same issues accountable depending on the game.

Because like I said earlier in the thread. It's a lot easier to drag Crackdown 3 and pour it on for issues it shares with many other games when it lacks the big budget veneer and had constant negative press surrounding it before release. It really just seems like good PR, marketing, and a lot of polish can cover up a lot of blemishes.

CD3 was marketed as a AAA game and took six years to produce, including a MP component predicated on cloud processing that was vaunted as cutting edge. I don't know what the total budget was for this game but I doubt it was cheap and regardless, plenty of lower-tier releases have scored better.