CNN & Corporate Dems Whitewashing Impeachment.

[Ichthyosaurus]

Like clockwork, the neolib defenders come out to defend. I've heard it all before Ichthyosaurus, save the garbage for the ones who are fine with the sad state of things.

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Of course people will come and defend their faction in a political party. You say that as though it's a grand revelation which hasn't occurred on a forum before. You've made it quite clear you're not interested in discussing facts, I guess Schiff wasn't in control of the impeachment committee - must have been some other Justice Democrat. Are you able to give any liberals in the Democratic leadership any credit? Liberals aren't "fine" with the state of things as they are, but you know that.

You should reevaluate your stance being so kneejerk reactionary in defense of these things in literally EVERY single instance without fail. Its enough to make people like me paranoid as fuck in regards to how people can view the world in such a bubble.

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Why is this only bad when liberals defend their politicians and not leftists? That's a double standard. Many are vastly more aggressive than I've been, and I don't see you reacting like this. Is it that hard to believe that the Democratic party has members in it which don't agree with you? We're not hiding who we align with in the party, we don't have to.

It's puzzling why you're doing this when a complaint I was was about how your focusing on the Democrats rather than the media who did this? Shouldn't you be more angry at CNN?

 

[Killthee]

Has even CNN hidden AOC and the other women? I had the impression they've talked a lot about them. This is just one article about one story about the impeachment.

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I think most people dont have a problem with them doing a story about moderate dems and how theyve jumped aboard the impeachment train, what people have an issue with is how CNN went about framing the story as if this group was leading the train and in doing so erasing the work minorities like Maxine Waters, Al Green, and Rashida Tlaib did by calling for impeachment before the rest of party was willing to.

This story should have been told from the angle of why these moderate dems switched to the impeachment side and why this offense committed by the president is different from all the others, but instead CNN is out here calling them leaders and trying to prop them up as the rational "anti-squad" in order to propagate some revisionist history that doesnt include minorities.

 

[wenis]

to all them

 

[Bad_Boy]

Who cares as long as they get him impeached.

 

[Deleted member 6230]

Who cares as long as they get him impeached.

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It matters a lot though.

 

[electroshockwave]

Seem like reluctant followers rather than leaders.

 

[Kirblar]

"Corporate Dems" in the title is completely ridiculous though.

 

[mario_O]

Who cares as long as they get him impeached.

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Corporate Dems won't allow these Reps to have any protagonism. If there's anything they dislike more than Trump, that is progressives and socialists. That's their real enemy, imo. They would rather have Trump in office than a progressive socialist.

 

[Kirblar]

Corporate Dems won't allow these Reps to have any protagonism. If there's anything they dislike more than Trump, that is progressives and socialists. That's their really enemy, imo. They would rather have Trump in office than a progressive socialist.

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How on earth are Dems getting elected in blood-red districts by the skin of their teeth equivalent to "Corporate Dems" simply by the district they're representing.

Hyper-liberal enclaves do not make up a majority of districts in the House, let alone the Democratic caucus.

 

[mario_O]

How on earth are Dems getting elected in blood-red districts by the skin of their teeth equivalent to "Corporate Dems" simply by the district they're representing.

Hyper-liberal enclaves do not make up a majority of districts in the House, let alone the Democratic caucus.

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You are right. I fail to understand what does winning in a swing district has to do with anything. They are what they are. Ex CIA, ex military. The "moderate dems" and the "anti-squad" is what CNN is calling them. I prefer corporate dems. But I get it, you dont like the term.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

Seem like reluctant followers rather than leaders.

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Not every politician can say that and expect to keep their office, and there are more of them than Justice Democrats.

 

[Bad_Boy]

It matters a lot though.

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I dont care who gets the glory for "starting" the impeachment. I worry more about whos trying go against it. Im black, and my bigger worry is that trump and the gop in the senate get reelected. We can worry about all this whitewashing when the job is done. Lets work together please.

 

[Kirblar]

You are right. I fail to understand what does winning in a swing district has to do with anything. They are what they are. Ex CIA, ex military. The "moderate dems" and the "anti-squad" is what CNN is calling them. I prefer corporate dems. But I get it, you dont like the term.

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The far flank of the party can't win those districts. It's what they have in common- they're freshman who won in R-leaning areas aided by the wave election. The term just makes absolutely no sense in context. If it was like, someone being a stooge for business, I'd get it, but these are just your boring purple-red district Dems.

 

[sfortunato]

I think most people dont have a problem with them doing a story about moderate dems and how theyve jumped aboard the impeachment train, what people have an issue with is how CNN went about framing the story as if this group was leading the train and in doing so erasing the work minorities like Maxine Waters, Al Green, and Rashida Tlaib did by calling for impeachment before the rest of party was willing to.

This story should have been told from the angle of why these moderate dems switched to the impeachment side and why this offense committed by the president is different from all the others, but instead CNN is out here calling them leaders and trying to prop them up as the rational "anti-squad" in order to propagate some revisionist history that doesnt include minorities.

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...no?

It just tells a story of these congresswomen who changed idea about the impeachment after the Ukraine affair, even if they politically risk a lot by doing so. The video presents a different approach (totally respectable one too!) to politics by a minority (in politics) group.

CNN has rightfully given a lot of space to AOC & co.

 

[Doc Holliday]

I get why people are pissed but let's be lets be honest about one thing. The squad coming out for impeachment early was way easier for them politically considering they come from liberal districts.

These women here all ran in red districts and ran campaigns that for the most part didn't mention trump. Without these "corporate dems" we didn't have the votes to impeach in the first place.

All this bullshit infighting is so frustrating.

 

[Deleted member 2625]

You should reevaluate your stance being so kneejerk reactionary in defense of these things in literally EVERY single instance without fail. Its enough to make people like me paranoid as fuck in regards to how people can view the world in such a bubble.

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You didn't address any of Ichthyosaurus points though, honestly you look like the one knee-jerking here. It's a bad CNN tweet. Which yes probably does reveal some shitty bias but call it what it is.

This place is like a case study in how lefty circular firing squads arise, I swear to my various gods.

 

[Hey Please]

I dont care who gets the glory for "starting" the impeachment. I worry more about whos trying go against it. Im black, and my bigger worry is that trump and the gop in the senate get reelected. We can worry about all this whitewashing when the job is done. Lets work together please.

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So you are status quo with minorities bearing the brunt of abuse for who and what they are and not receiving commensurate recognition when things finally start to turn around.

 

[SurrenderDorothy]

This is how it always is. Fuck these Dems.
Mayo Libs look at minorities and despise them, only used when convenient and thrown away right after..
They are not our allies. We only rely(lol) on them reluctantly.

 

[Jade1962]

Of course people will come and defend their faction in a political party. You say that as though it's a grand revelation which hasn't occurred on a forum before. You've made it quite clear you're not interested in discussing facts, I guess Schiff wasn't in control of the impeachment committee - must have been some other Justice Democrat. Are you able to give any liberals in the Democratic leadership any credit? Liberals aren't "fine" with the state of things as they are, but you know that.



Why is this only bad when liberals defend their politicians and not leftists? That's a double standard. Many are vastly more aggressive than I've been, and I don't see you reacting like this. Is it that hard to believe that the Democratic party has members in it which don't agree with you? We're not hiding who we align with in the party, we don't have to.

It's puzzling why you're doing this when a complaint I was was about how your focusing on the Democrats rather than the media who did this? Shouldn't you be more angry at CNN?

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Maybe I'm reading this wrong but are you saying moderates are your "team" and you will defend them?

 

[sapien85]

How can you lead something if you're the last to join? Even now these women are not the most vocal in the media on impeachment. They did tip the scale with Democrat leadership though.

 

[Kittens McMittens]

History is made by those who prevaricate and then follow when it's clearly safe to do so.

 

[Bad_Boy]

So you are status quo with minorities bearing the brunt of abuse for who and what they are and not receiving commensurate recognition when things finally start to turn around.

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I'm saying we are so used to this, I'm not even surprised. To me this is like fighting over the tv remote when the house is on fire. I dont care whos getting the glory right now. Lets just get it done.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

Maybe I'm reading this wrong but are you saying moderates are your "team" and you will defend them?

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This is a very strange post. I'm a liberal, and while I may not agree with Democrats like this I will defend them when they're not doing anything wrong since they our allies and we do need them in this coalition to survive. I'm concerned that if I say yes to this the implication would be that it was bad. Am I right?

History is made by those who prevaricate and then follow when it's clearly safe to do so.

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No, but it helps. You can't change history if you don't have the votes for the bills you want to pass or don't get elected.

 

[Kittens McMittens]

This is a very strange post. I'm a liberal, and while I may not agree with Democrats like this I will defend them when they're not doing anything wrong since they our allies and we do need them in this coalition to survive. I'm concerned that if I say yes to this the implication would be that it was bad. Am I right?



No, but it helps. You can't change history if you don't have the votes for the bills you want to pass or don't get elected.

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The fact that some liberals who lacked the courage to lead on impeachment have decided that it's safe for them to do so is neither news nor headline worthy.

Edit: also, to describe them as 'leaders' as CNN does is manifestly untrue.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

The fact that some liberals who lacked the courage to lead on impeachment have decided that it's safe for them to do so is neither news nor headline worthy.

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What makes you think these are liberals? They're in purple states, not California. There's more to the party then liberals and leftists, these are conservative Democrats.

It is too CNN. I don't like the framing, either.

Edit: also, to describe them as 'leaders' as CNN does is manifestly untrue.

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Agreed.

 

[Just_a_Mouse]

This is beyond infuriating

 

[Hey Please]

I'm saying we are so used to this, I'm not even surprised. To me this is like fighting over the tv remote when the house is on fire. I dont care whos getting the glory right now. Lets just get it done.

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Firstly, perhaps we ought not to be so "used to this" at a time when xenophobic and racist attacks are seeing a resurgence in US esp, where in those places where that orange fuck face does did and does his rallies.

You keep saying 'glory' but it is not about fame at all. It is about balancing the scale for those who have been victimized by the right wing media every day, including being called, Savages and told to "go back to where they came from" for doing their jobs and having aspirations for a better future for all residents as well as the environment, when the other white moderates sat back in hopes that 2020 election was going to be the panacea and not rock the boat too hard.

 

[Bad_Boy]

Firstly, perhaps we ought not to be so "used to this" at a time where xenophobic and racist attacks are seeing a resurgence in US esp, where in those places where that orange fuck face does did and does his rallies.

You keep saying 'glory' but it is not about fame at all. It is about balancing the scale for those who have been victimized by the right wing media every day, including being called, Savages and told to "go back to where they came from" for doing their jobs and having aspirations for a better future for all residents as well as the environment, when the other white moderates sat back in hopes that 2020 election was going to be the panacea and not rock the boat too hard.

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1. all this resurgence (that i agree is happening) you mention will continue on unless we all win. None of this means jack if the impeachment doesnt get trump and gop senators out of office.

2.
those Congress women are being glorified as leaders in the orginal tweet. Idgaf about any of that.

This is like glorifying mueller again. Okay thats cool whatever, but lets see if it works.

 

[Kittens McMittens]

What makes you think these are liberals? They're in purple states, not California. There's more to the party then liberals and leftists, these are conservative Democrats.

It is too CNN. I don't like the framing, either.

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I think what you call conservative Democrat would still be considered a form of liberal capitalist in the UK, so just write that off as a cultural difference. The political labels attached to them aren't really that important; the issue is that these people aren't leading anything.

Also, I clicked on that CNN article and read some of it. It's nauseating.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

I think what you call conservative Democrat would still be considered a form of liberal capitalist in the UK, so just write that off as a cultural difference. The political labels attached to them aren't really that important; the issue is that these people aren't leading anything.

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Of course the labels politicians belong to are important, it's why many in this thread are angry about these Democrats taking the spotlight of the Justice Democrats, like AOC. This is intra-party rivalry playing out in real time in this thread, between liberals and leftists. We liberals may not be in the conservative faction but you don't need to be to defend them from nonsense. The issue is that they are a valuable part of the party, that we need to keep happy occasionally and that they are legitimate members of the party.

Also, I clicked on that CNN article and read some of it. It's nauseating.

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Sadly, sometimes we need that to keep the conservative constituencies engaged. Everyone likes having positive attention every once and a while.

 

[Kittens McMittens]

Of course the labels politicians belong to are important, it's why many in this thread are angry about these Democrats taking the spotlight of the Justice Democrats, like AOC. This is intra-party rivalry playing out in real time in this thread, between liberals and leftists. We liberals may not be in the conservative faction but you don't need to be to defend them from nonsense. The issue is that they are a valuable part of the party, that we need to keep happy occasionally and that they are legitimate members of the party.

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I mean the labels aren't important because we're talking across a cultural barrier, so we both need to make an accommodation for that fact. The main focus should be that this CNN article is garbage and is basically whitewashing the representatives who've really been leading on impeachment for years.

 

[Zelas]

"The Leaders on Impeachment"

What happened to AOC, Ilham, Rashida, Maxine?

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Nothing happened to them. Their influence is limited the same as its always been, this is a completely different impeachment push, and Dems in seats that matter have more power and always remained the gatekeepers on the issue.

Moderate dems continue have zero reason to pay any attention to representatives in the most safe districts. They look to Pelosi, other moderates, and their moderate constituents who voted them in to be moderates for direction. "Voice of the party" is a lie that the far left and republicans tell themselves.

 

[Zombegoast]

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

I mean the labels aren't important because we're talking across a cultural barrier, so we both need to make an accommodation for that fact. The main focus should be that this CNN article is garbage and is basically whitewashing the representatives who've really been leading on impeachment for years.

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Except the context for both the article and the reactions to it relate to the factions within the party, as I've explained.

The factions between the Democrats we're discussing are simple, as well. Leftists = Justice Democrats/Bernie Sanders, Liberals = Pelosi's wing, while the conservative wing are exactly it means. Right leaning Democrats who are vastly to the right of both of the other factions, the UK's conservatism isn't that alien to US conservatism - they retain the same racism, and xenophobia and backward ideas to get the gist of what side these politicians represent. This is why it's important that the context be about conservative Democrats, not liberal ones.

 

[Kittens McMittens]

Except the context for both the article and the reactions to it relate to the factions within the party, as I've explained.

The factions between the Democrats we're discussing are simple, as well. Leftists = Justice Democrats/Bernie Sanders, Liberals = Pelosi's wing, while the conservative wing are exactly it means. Right leaning Democrats who are vastly to the right of both of the other factions, the UK's conservatism isn't that alien to US conservatism - they retain the same racism, and xenophobia and backward ideas to get the gist of what side these politicians represent. This is why it's important that the context be about conservative Democrats, not liberal ones.

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None of that has anything to do with the fact that the people highlighted in the article aren't leaders on impeachment.

 

[Jade1962]

This is a very strange post. I'm a liberal, and while I may not agree with Democrats like this I will defend them when they're not doing anything wrong since they our allies and we do need them in this coalition to survive. I'm concerned that if I say yes to this the implication would be that it was bad. Am I right?



No, but it helps. You can't change history if you don't have the votes for the bills you want to pass or don't get elected.

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Just find it weird to blindly defend things/people based on team letters. Just wanted clarification on your previous post.

I don't personally find it commendable to only do what's right when polling data supports it. I agree though the headline isn't their fault but more American society filtered through CNN.

 

[TheGhost]

I mean ....it was expected, Dem's use people like chess pieces. It's usually people that see through the bullshit too, but since it's the only party that doesn't look like it's run by a Grand Dragon and his Klansmen they are kind of stuck with them., which sucks.

when i think of impeachment i think of the squad. With out them, would we even be where we are today? Would Nancy ever uttered the word impeachment? Probably not.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

None of that has anything to do with the fact that the people highlighted in the article aren't leaders on impeachment.

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It has everything to do with that.

Just find it weird to blindly defend things/people based on team letters. Just wanted clarification on your previous post.

I don't personally find it commendable to only do what's right when polling data supports it. I agree though the headline isn't their fault and more American society filtered through CNN.

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Nobody's doing anything here blindly. The fact that there are people who aren't in your political faction isn't proof that what they are defending is doing so based purely on blind obedience rather than their own conviction. It's best not to assume that simply because someone isn't on your "team." Everyone has a team they're in, as well. This isn't sports but there are definite factions in the party.

I agree, but every politician relies on polls or they're operating in the dark about how the public view them. Every single candidate running for president has professional who do this for them.

 

[TheOMan]

Gotta sell it to White America(tm).

Those faces might do it. Dem colored folk that Donald has already convinced people of being anti-Murican and anti-Israel are less convenient for the packaging of the message they want to sell.

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Correct. CNN is playing the game that needs to be played unfortunately.

 

[Christian]

And the American obsession with White Mediocrity continues.

 

[steveovig]

This thread is a bit reaching, isn't it? It was a different fluff piece on a group of Congresswomen, big deal. It's not like the Squad were the only group to want and call for impeachment. This is silly, guys.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

This is how it always is. Fuck these Dems.
Mayo Libs look at minorities and despise them, only used when convenient and thrown away right after..
They are not our allies. We only rely(lol) on them reluctantly.

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Truth. And if we complain, they get very, very angry with us. All they want to do is use us, not help us.

 

[Kittens McMittens]

It has everything to do with that.

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OK, here's my comment edited to suit your labels:

The fact that some conservative democrats who lacked the courage to lead on impeachment have decided that it's safe for them to do so is neither news nor headline worthy.

Edit: also, to describe them as 'leaders' as CNN does is manifestly untrue.

So, the fact that I mis-labelled their political affiliation has nothing to do with anything.

 

[Trup1aya]

"The Leaders on Impeachment"

What happened to AOC, Ilham, Rashida, Maxine?

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Lol they want credit as leaders for sitting on the fence? Even throwing shade at the women who actually got to this point.

Not the loudest in the room, but most effective? Effective at Jumping on the bandwagon when it's convenient

 

[Deleted member 2625]

OK, here's my comment edited to suit your labels:

The fact that some conservative democrats who lacked the courage to lead on impeachment have decided that it's safe for them to do so is neither news nor headline worthy.

Edit: also, to describe them as 'leaders' as CNN does is manifestly untrue.

So, the fact that I mis-labelled their political affiliation has nothing to do with anything.

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but this ignores the whole Ukraine development. that's what moved the needle (which is sad, but it is what it is)

I don't like "leaders" either - patently untrue - but "risk takers" would be fair

 

[Emmert]

"I don't think any of us want to be the loudest voice in the room, we want to be the most effective."

Delusional. Not to mention the tropes.

 

[Geist 6one7]

If other people went somewhere and you then followed them you're not a leader.

 

[Royalan]

"I don't think any of us want to be the loudest voice in the room, we want to be the most effective."

Delusional. Not to mention the tropes.

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Yeah, that line was especially GTFO.

 

[Figgles]

Pretty gross, but because of where they come from, they really do have to play the fence sitting game.

 

[makonero]

History is made by those who prevaricate and then follow when it's clearly safe to do so.

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I want this on a T-shirt