I agree. Especially with the town hall format. Trump will look even worse if he tries to pull this there.
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I agree. Especially with the town hall format. Trump will look even worse if he tries to pull this there.
Wallace had an impossible job although it is kinda hard to imagine Trump's behavior not being predictable. I thought he did an ok job given the circumstances, and he did ask Trump some difficult questions and fact check him at times. Obviously the debate sucked, but without the option to cut mics, this was all we were ever going to get.
They were not too far actually, though Trump spoke about 5 minutes more. However the difference was that Biden was talking about actual policy and answering questions while Trump was just spewing racist garbage and attacking Hunter.
This includes time Trump talked over him? Figured that would skew it Trump's way by a bit.
Anyone who has watched that lunatic go off on a tantrum for the last four years saw this coming a mile away.
I understand that you can't just alter the rules of a debate in the middle of it, but muting the mic should have been a rule from the get go before any of this occurred.
I understand that you can't just alter the rules of a debate in the middle of it, but muting the mic should have been a rule from the get go before any of this occurred.
Yes, but the next debate is also the town hall format, which is going to change the dynamic a bit.
If Trump actively berates the audience...
According to CNN, Trump talked 39 mins and Biden 37. I don't think that counts all the times he talked over Biden.
He telegraphed beforehand that his intention was to "not get in the way" of the candidates and also said beforehand that he wasn't going to do any fact checking. He completely opened the gate and now pretends to be shocked that the bull ran loose.
And he ended up having to do both anyways.
(And I don't think a moderator should be fact checking in a head-to-head debate, unless they lie as egregiously as Trump does. That's partially what the follow up questions are for. And the candidates should be prepared enough to fact check each other, ultimately.)
Eh, I don't think anyone can keep Trump civil during a debate. He just won't do it. I don't blame the moderator at all. And fact-checking him in real-time at a debate is basically impossible considering how much he lies.
In my heart of hearts I think Trump realizes he's got little to no chance of winning the presidency so he's just doing whatever the fuck he wants at this point.
Are people forgetting that Chris Wallace in fact did moderate a debate with Trump in the last election, and did a very good job handling it?
I think it's fair for him to believe that he would be able to handle this debate the same as he had the one in 2016, and to be surprised and frustrated that Trump behaved even more abominably than he had in the past, leaving him with few good options to prevent the President interrupting.
EDIT: The thing I'm most frustrated by his performance in this debate, and something he surely saw coming, was structuring that last question to give Trump two minutes to tee off on the integrity of the election with unfounded bullshit. That's actually harmful.
CNN Business said:
NY Times said:
LA Times said:
I think it's fair for him to believe that he would be able to handle this debate the same as he had the one in 2016, and to be surprised and frustrated that Trump behaved even more abominably than he had in the past, leaving him with few good options to prevent the President interrupting.
EDIT: The thing I'm most frustrated by his performance in this debate, and something he surely saw coming, was structuring that last question to give Trump two minutes to tee off on the integrity of the election with unfounded bullshit. That's actually harmful.
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The problem is Trump doesn't get his facts wrong, Trump lies. He says anything and everything he can, because his point isn't to make points, it's to taunt Biden into verbal fisticuffs.
The topic is on the Supreme Court and Trump's trying to gaslight Biden and Wallace with the idea that Barrett's actually fine with Roe v. Wade. The topic is on the economy and Trump's entire stance is that Obama plunged the economy into shit and he was the one to bring it up. What're you supposed to do with bullshit like this, other than call it bullshit and move on?
Yah total blindside there chris i mean who woulda thunk it?
Like what in the fuck. How about after the first 5 minutes of constant garbage talking over his opponent? 10 mintes? Fucking 15? 30??!!
Literally a child plugging his ears and screaming until he gets his way and you're confused and surprised. Whatever.
Like what in the fuck. How about after the first 5 minutes of constant garbage talking over his opponent? 10 mintes? Fucking 15? 30??!!
Literally a child plugging his ears and screaming until he gets his way and you're confused and surprised. Whatever.
Five minutes in I posted that's exactly what his strategy seemed to be. It was obvious. Regardless, you dont need to know if it was a strategy to enforce the rules. There's no excuse for that.
A lot of people have successfully spun this debate into two old guys yelling at each other rather than Trump just yelling throughout the whole thing. How do they not have a mute button or give time to the other person when they are interrupted it's ridiculous. Chris Wallace was trash, did terrible and got shutdown multiple times.
It's like preparing for a hurricane, no matter how much you prepare ultimately it's out of your control. Wallace could have done a lot better, in this analogy he evacuated but didn't board up his windows, but no amount of preparation was going to stop the tree from falling on the house
Imagine if he pivoted like 8 months ago, did better with covid, and actually put effort into appealing to moderates. But no, he's going berserker chasing that base vote.
He's unfortunately in a lose lose situation.
If he says no more debates then Trump can just call him weak and say stuff like "how's he going to deal with Iran if he can't even handle me interrupting him."
That's why it's really important for the moderator to handle this stuff.
But honestly, I really don't know what they can do. One of the few things Trump is good at is dragging everyone down with him.
Yes. I actually went to college with his niece.
I asked her if I could submit a question to him and she said she could try (I haven't decided what it should be yet).
That was fucking terrible. The most unprofessional part of the whole thing (aside from Trump).
GTFO Chris. Everyone knew this would be his strategy. You'd have to be an idiot or lying to say you didn't
1. Are you kidding? EVERYONE predicted that Trump would act exactly as he did. Maybe the extremity of it was a bit surprising, but nothing else.
2. Missed opportunity for what? For people to hear actual positions or policy? With Trump on the stage?
3. Even so, I don't know what Wallace could have done much differently. Argue with Trump sooner, and more often?
2. Missed opportunity for what? For people to hear actual positions or policy? With Trump on the stage?
3. Even so, I don't know what Wallace could have done much differently. Argue with Trump sooner, and more often?
"I've read the reviews, I've heard some people saying..." "... no one could have, hindsight being 20/20..." goddamn son, you've sure been hanging around the FOX newsroom a long time if you just naturally fall back into making-excuses-for-Trump vernacular when you're trying to apologize, huh?
Can't even straight up say, "I did a poor job, and that's on me." The ability to accept or assign responsibility has been trained out of his ass. He just defaults to, "It's a failing of society, collectively, and I'm the victim."
Can't even straight up say, "I did a poor job, and that's on me." The ability to accept or assign responsibility has been trained out of his ass. He just defaults to, "It's a failing of society, collectively, and I'm the victim."
I stand by my original take of he's rather terrible at his job, not as smart as his position and career has made him out to be, or he's fine abetting a fascist.
Literally pick one Wallace. I'm also not keen to give anyone a pass in the following 4 months, democracy is literally on the line so if you're not doing a good job in holding that at bay then fuck off.
Literally pick one Wallace. I'm also not keen to give anyone a pass in the following 4 months, democracy is literally on the line so if you're not doing a good job in holding that at bay then fuck off.
It's like any shouty person in politics, nothing much you can do but let them spin their wheels, interrupt, counter or cut them off air. Nothing is really smooth because the shouty person has no intention of being raked over the coals with facts or wants to let the other person tell facts.
Only thing I could see maybe working is fall foul of the rules, the opponent gets full time to say what they want and absolute fire from the moderator, call out Trump like a teacher or parent would, explain clearly what he is doing is unacceptable, keep quiet until the other person is finished and if he steps out of line, hammer it home forcibly and Biden gets another free go at talking.
Only thing I could see maybe working is fall foul of the rules, the opponent gets full time to say what they want and absolute fire from the moderator, call out Trump like a teacher or parent would, explain clearly what he is doing is unacceptable, keep quiet until the other person is finished and if he steps out of line, hammer it home forcibly and Biden gets another free go at talking.
Two reasons.
One is that backing out of debates, even under these circumstances, makes Biden look weak.
The other is that Trump's behavior, while a nightmare to watch and an even bigger nightmare to put up with as his opponent, isn't something voters like. Post-debate polling suggests that it doesn't bring him new voters, and turns off more people on the fence than it attracts. If Trump drags every debate into an unwatchable mess, Biden maintains his current advantage. So there's nothing lost by showing up.
Biden's campaign may have asked for more controls on the next debate, but I'd believe it if he didn't (because his campaign will be fine either way), and they're considering a stricter format just because debates like this are actually awful TV.
Because Trump shouting over him, as painful as it is for everyone watching, isn't a good strategy. I sincerely doubt anyone who isn't already firmly on the trump train is impressed by that at all, it just makes him look like a bore. So if he does it again it will probably help Biden more than Trump.
SNL should do a skit depicting a comical (if entirely possible in 21st century America) evolution of Presidential debates in future elections: the candidates, after spending all election season practicing intense vocal calisthenics, square off in a cage match-style debate where the object is simply to outscream each other. Winner is determined not by polls, but decibels.
Nah. SNL should quit doing PR work for Trump and presenting his actions as comical. Entertainment shows need to stop positioning him as a comedic character, rather than the existential menace he personifies.
If you didn't think that was going to be Trump's strategy, I have to question your ability as a journalist and your basic common fucking sense.
he did a few interviews which weren't as laughably shitty as the others on Fox News and people were like WOW HE'S GOOD. It's a joke.
Actually, I agree, as I didn't intend my "suggestion" to be a serious one. It was just my exasperated, sardonic way of remarking on what a shitshow Presidential debates (or anything "Presidential", really) have become in the age of Trump.
Glad I didn't waste brain cells subjecting myself to last night's fiasco.
Trump's just gotten so much worse as a person in the last four years. His campaign is going tremendously worse than it was four years ago, and there may simply not be enough undecided voters for him to catch up.
1) Biden won this debate according to every scientific poll so far, which helps him just run down the clock with his significant lead and perhaps even grow it.
2) The next debate is a Town Hall format, which has been Biden's strength this entire cycle.
Husband of Charleston shooting victim shares emotional moment with Joe Biden - CNN Video
During a CNN Democratic town hall in Charleston, South Carolina, former Vice President Joe Biden addresses how he would use his faith to make decisions for the United States.
4) Biden will be better prepared for being talked over and have a more deliberate strategy when to basically cede the floor and when to bicker. I don't think anybody expected Trump to just talk and talk and rant for 80 of the 90 minutes.
You guys are way too harsh on Wallace. He concedes he was too accomodating towards Trump's antics (although I think Wallace adapted to the situation in the latter half of the debate) and I think it's credible that he didn't expect this strategy of Trump. He performed poorly and it sucks but there isn't more to it.
I don't buy into the idea that Chris Wallace had an "impossible job."
It's an excuse that rings hollow considering the basic fucking shit he did not do.
The sitting President of the United States told white supremacist groups to "stand down and stand by."
You don't...you know, have a follow up question for that? I know a Black journalist would have.
It's an excuse that rings hollow considering the basic fucking shit he did not do.
The sitting President of the United States told white supremacist groups to "stand down and stand by."
You don't...you know, have a follow up question for that? I know a Black journalist would have.
You really thought he was going to be way more amped up than he has in every debate? Most people were expecting him being the level of douche he was in the Clinton debates, not amped up multiple tiers.