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This is beyond fucked up. From this article:
"Zheng Qiaozhi — we will call him George — still has nightmares. He was interning at China's Shenyang Army General Hospital when he was drafted to be part of an organ-harvesting team.
The prisoner was brought in, tied hand and foot, but very much alive. The army doctor in charge sliced him open from chest to belly button and exposed his two kidneys. "Cut the veins and arteries," he told his shocked intern. George did as he was told. Blood spurted everywhere.
The kidneys were placed in an organ-transplant container.
Then the doctor ordered George to remove the man's eyeballs. Hearing that, the dying prisoner gave him a look of sheer terror, and George froze. "I can't do it," he told the doctor, who then quickly scooped out the man's eyeballs himself."
"Zheng Qiaozhi — we will call him George — still has nightmares. He was interning at China's Shenyang Army General Hospital when he was drafted to be part of an organ-harvesting team.
The prisoner was brought in, tied hand and foot, but very much alive. The army doctor in charge sliced him open from chest to belly button and exposed his two kidneys. "Cut the veins and arteries," he told his shocked intern. George did as he was told. Blood spurted everywhere.
The kidneys were placed in an organ-transplant container.
Then the doctor ordered George to remove the man's eyeballs. Hearing that, the dying prisoner gave him a look of sheer terror, and George froze. "I can't do it," he told the doctor, who then quickly scooped out the man's eyeballs himself."
First, you're acting like there's an equivalent amount of people dying. There aren't. The people in the internment camps are in HORRIBLE conditions, but they're not dying. As far as I know there hasn't been anyone that's died in one of those shitty as fuck camps (It wouldn't surprise me if there have been some that I unfortunately missed, but they'd at most be in the double digits compared to orders of magnitude more in China) and I HATE the fact that your disingenous whataboutism is making me even slightly seem like I'm defending anything about this (because it is entirely shit and the worst thing happening in the domestic U.S. at this instant and is abhorrent), but your take is so monumentally unequal that you leave no choice. They're NOWHERE NEAR alike. Your post is the VERY definition of whataboutism: you're comparing the ills of one thing to another and calling it the same or comparable to redirect the conversation away from the ills of the main subject.
You can call Trump's policies miserable shitty racist (it deserves worse) and say they cause massive human suffering, but your comparison is still nowhere near the same SCALE.
Like, think about this for a second. Say we have a thread about Trump throwing kids in cages. Then someone comes in and says "But China is mass murdering people!". What would you think?
The conversation of what can/can't be done about it is completely separate from making this shitty unrelated whataboutism type argument. Yes, sanctioning China would both hurt the people sanctioning and billions in China, I agree. Yes, military action is off the table. What the fuck does that have to do with calling this shit what it is?
We already know that sanctions don't work so maybe we can pay them instead and wrap it up in conciliatory language like apologizing for flooding the country with opium and keeping it in poverty for over a century. You don't have to actually be apologetic of course and it shouldn't matter if the goal is to actually help those people.
You should read up on the refugee camps after WW2 and how the British purposely fucked those refugees.
China wouldn't accept a lump sum of money to change internal policy that they outwardly don't recognize as even happening. To their government, their authority is worth more than any lump sum a country could give them. They'd take your money and then continue to murder people in "secret". Hell, they'd use your money to do it.
There have been a few who got sick and died. For the other poster to try to compare it to a death camp that harvests organs from the living, however, is the height of BS and seems hard to justify for someone that doesn't have an agenda. As you say, that is not a defense of camps in the US, but a recognition that they are not at all comparable to what is described by the China Tribunal.
Giving money to the Chinese government is not going to result in them stopping the persecution of the Uighurs. The persecution of Uighurs is based on the specific ideology the Chinese government has. I'm aware of how Jewish refugees were treated, it's a complete non-sequiter to what I was talking about though.
What the fucking fuck
This is horrifying. Fuck the Chinese government.
This position is not as smart as you think. Firstly, yeah the magnitude is different both in intent, cruelty, scale and visibility. If there's anything posting on Era can do it's not letting you or anyone else try this nonsense.
Secondly, asylum is literally impossible for them. They are indefinitely imprisoned in a survellance state, unable to travel, leave or communicate
The Chinese government only maintains support because they are boosting the economy (often artificially). If shaken, people ask question, rich forgeiners stop investing and people taking loans get skeptical. It's a different power structure than say North Korea or various middle eastern dictatorships because people can attain seeing the outside world, basically once a certain quality of life is reached, they can't go back without pissing people off.
Wait, what, they don't even sedate the victims?
Like, how can anyone lack the empathy to go ahead with this?
Like, how can anyone lack the empathy to go ahead with this?
Is Donald Trump trying to rely less on China? I have heard about the trade war but I don't know how that's turning out. I just remember him saying he wanted to revitalise industries in the USA.
I feel like actually, he might be the only person doing something. I wouldn't count on the UN, especially with not the way Greta put them to shame with her speech which highlighted their inaction.
I feel like actually, he might be the only person doing something. I wouldn't count on the UN, especially with not the way Greta put them to shame with her speech which highlighted their inaction.
I will write more later - but seriously - every single product we bought from the last 40 years (or more) has lined the pockets of China in some way. Now imagine every body in every country around the world. I'm massively guilty of buying tons of stuff.
At some stage they're just going to buy everybody out and ill probably no longer be around to see that happen, but my kids will and that's a scary thought.
They'll own you and you'll do what they say or else.
At some stage they're just going to buy everybody out and ill probably no longer be around to see that happen, but my kids will and that's a scary thought.
They'll own you and you'll do what they say or else.
What? After being sliced open and getting the kidneys removed? I always thought you are unconscious when someone does cruel stuff like this to you.
All his own products/trade come from China he aint doing shit.
Entirely believable based on everything we already know about Xinjiang.
This is also part of why it sucks we've had an absentee PotUS for the last few years, it's not clear who or how any justice is imposed on China from the outside for this shit.
This is also part of why it sucks we've had an absentee PotUS for the last few years, it's not clear who or how any justice is imposed on China from the outside for this shit.
That's a bit hyperbolic. The average GDP per capita for Europe/Japan/South Korea, etc... is about 31,000 - 82,000. China is at less than 10,000. It's economic strength is based on its massive size and scale. The population there will be getting old in a hurry due to the one child policy. Its population, as it ages, will go from a strength to a massive burden in the coming years.
I hate Trump too, but yeah this is so much worse.
In some ways it beats the Nazis. Not in scope, but on the brutality. Harvesting organs on a live, conscious human being without any pain meds? I'm not religious but if I were this would be Hell. Slaughterhouses treat animals better. So fucking gross.
Probably too expensive, and takes too long. By their standards. After all, they have a horrific delivery industry to support.
Although I could be too clinical about this, thinking it's mainly about money. It might be down to the reinforcement of culture through industrialization of cruelty. Y'know, with a side of money.
I'd love to hear your actionable ideas to stop China from HARVESTING ORGANS in a thread about China HARVESTING ORGANS. I'm not up on how the average Chinese citizen interacts with their government, but is a citizen able to vote out those who sanction harvesting organs? I believe I understand how obfuscating bureaucracy can be, so I'll continue to look into a few layers of Chinese government and organ harvesting on my end.
It blows my mind that they don't even sedate them first. Or just kill them and then cut them open? Jesus fucking christ
Let's not pretend that we don't suck on human rights, especially currently, or minimize the horrific shit our government is currently doing while talking about this, but yeah. China's on a whole other level of fucking monstrous.
What the fuck!? Besides the obvious atrocity of forcibly taking someone's organs, what the hell is the point in doing it while they're alive?
I remember assuming China Tribunal was Falun Gong affiliated when they announced formation a few months ago. Can't read the report on their dead website but the summary...rehash of the ancient Falun Gong prisoner trope but it's happening to Uighurs now - yeah, bullshit. Don't assume this is real just because they were standing in the UN when they said it.
The cruelty is the point. The gov don't care at all about human lives
Actually isn't this pretty close to North Korea? Maybe different utility, but similar mindset towards human beings.
It's probably cheaper. Greed and money is almost always the answer.
I suppose this could be the, but they must be saving nickles per person. Which then might indicate how wide scale it is because nickles can become millions saved pretty fast...
Even Muslim countries don't care. This world is so cruel.
I would say that there is too much economic stakes for a lot of rich people in China and we would rather not drop their profits for silly human rights.
This isn't even a thing in North Korea, since most of people who escaped North Korea has never said anything about the regime harvesting their organs while victims are alive like Unit 731 or Josef Mengele style.
I suppose scarcity of human resources makes it untenable? And they aren't trading with anyone, really.
Note: It may or may not be an accurate account, as the New York Post is not a reputable publication.
User Banned (1 day): Inflammatory Commentary
Fuck the Chinese government and fuck anyone that supports them.
Honestly. I'd be okay if we started world war 3. Humanity was a mistake and should be punished.
Honestly. I'd be okay if we started world war 3. Humanity was a mistake and should be punished.
The problem with trumps trade policy isn't his antagonistic approach to China
It's failing to understand we were negotiating with other countries to be less reliant on them
That was the ENTIRE point of the TPP, which he didn't even know China wasn't apart of. Rand Paul humiliated him for not getting that in one of the 2016 gop debates
China has both thriving state sanctioned and black markets of human organ trade. The earliest I've heard about this is that 10 years ago, they were only doing this to prisoners who were executed.
I really can't imagine why a "doctor" would do the operation without sedation. I guess they do that sometimes when they run out of drugs. Let's just hope they use some very cheap and effective stuff.
This is so awful.