Then why does the CCP have one in the East Chinese Sea that covers the Senkaku Islands and the Socotra Rock?
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China sends largest incursion of warplanes into Taiwan defence zone since October
- Thread starter Bionicman
- Start date
The CCP has already invaded and occupied Tibet and islands in the South Chinese Sea. And they had border skirmishes with India recently.
Taiwan's ADIZ extends over the Chinese mainland. They can be upset all they want but this is literally not an incursion of Taiwan and the ADIZ itself is illegitimate.I wonder why Taiwan would protest these sorts of incursions, then?
Taiwan slams largest-ever incursion by Chinese into air defence zone
Taiwan sharply criticised China on Saturday after Beijing marked the founding of the People's Republic of China with the largest ever incursion by the Chinese air force into the island's air defence…amp.france24.com
Does Taiwan have any sort of agency in these scenarios, in your mind?
and not a single bomb dropped or bullet fired. miraculous. scaremonger gonna scaremonger.
Taiwan has been preparing for a Chinese invasion for decades. They have all of that.
The invasion you're referring to is part of the Chinese civil war and has no relevance to the current situation with Taiwan during peacetime.
It's not illegitimate. They don't scramble for air space concerns when it's on the China side of the straight.
These flight patterns are only to intimidate Taiwan, they serve no other purpose. To minimize or reduce to anything else is missing the point.
Good to know those 180 Tibetan soldiers killed were not from bullets or bombs
i mean
Wow. It shows that they are willing to use force to colonize countries they claim to be part of China.
TBH I consider what happened with Tibet to be a form of invading, occupying, and absorbing, but that's sort of my point. The current Chinese government isn't going to do it American-style with bombing elementary schools and weddings and wanton murders at checkpoints.
They're going to be the ones building elementary schools and promoting weddings. It's not going to be military the way Western people think. That's why I said people in here are crazy if they think it's going to be the same as what the US does or what Russia does.
So colonization without force is just fine? That's quite a take.
Not a single bomb dropped or bullet fired to colonize Tibet? Go educate yourself.
The families of those that died are sure relieved that they didn't die due to bullets!
Or maybe they'll build factories and put minority populations in slave camps for our gaming hardware . Who knows?
are we completely ignoring the actions of the ruling party in China over the past few years?
When I say military, I am referring to US-style military antics, which so far in this thread prior to my posts is also what people seemed to be referring to.
Do you consider that a military invasion?
Like the schools they built in Tibet to destroy Tibetan culture? It's literally copying what Canada and the US did.
Chinese boarding schools in Tibet an ‘explicit tool’ to assimilate students: Report - Phayul
Phayul.com is one of the most popular & successful Tibetan news website in English. With daily readers touching over 12,500 and still growing. It features news and views on Tibet.
www.phayul.com
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User Banned (2 Weeks): Dismissing Concerns of Imperialism over a Series of Posts
Tibet was not a separate country but part of China. You may support Tibetan nationalism but let's not rewrite history.
The Chinese Air Force does this in response to US military exercises.
Tibetans are suffering under CCP oppression at this very moment.
This is from a few weeks ago.
“Cultural Revolution like crackdown”: China demolished a sky-high Buddha statue and 45 huge prayer wheels in Drakgo, Tibet - Central Tibetan Administration
Dharamshala: The Chinese government has demolished a 99-foot-tall Buddha statue in Kham Drakgo, incorporated into Sichuan Province, according to our sources. Additionally, 45 huge prayer wheels erected near Drakgo Monastery have also been removed and prayer flags burned down. The bronze statue...
tibet.net
Around a dozen Tibetans arbitrarily detained and tortured, second Buddha statue dismantled in Drakgo crackdown - Central Tibetan Administration
Dharamshala: Following the Chinese authorities’ demolitions of a giant Buddha statue, 45 huge prayer wheels, and a monastic school in Tibet’s Drakgo (Ch: Luhuo County) in Kham Karze recently, the crackdown in the region continues as a second Buddha statue is dismantled. Moreover, around a dozen...
tibet.net
Even our little corner of the world is still subject to CCP propaganda apparently.
Are you not counting the Chinese military invasion of Vietnam for some reason?
they're also going to be taking actions traditionally associated with military with ground force invasions (air will be used predominantly for tracking and transportation) same as they've always done with independent countries they consider part of China. Then, later they will jail dissidents and replace schools with those that seek to eliminate the local culture. That's not different from western imperialism and is literally what was done to Native American populations.
Sure let's pretend rational discussion of this issue is even possible on ResetEra when everyone who disagrees with you is labelled a "CCP lackey". I for one am going to steer clear of discussing Xinjiang for that sole reason.
Do you not believe that peoples have a right to self-determination, as outlined in the UN's charter?
User Banned (1 Month): Inflammatory Commentary Around Colonialism; History of the Same
it is my opinion that hawaii has a more credible claim for independence than tibet as tibet has had 'governmental' relations with china since the time of the ming.
No need to strawman. I say all the talk about how the invasion is going to come with bombs and guns is totally not their MO. The planes aren't going to be dropping bombs to destroy towns/roads/hospitals/whatever. Taipei isn't going to be reduced to rubble. Hualien isn't going to be a pile of smoking tea leaves. People are crazy if they think that's what will happen. You'll still be able to get suncakes from Taizhong.
I get that people who are only familiar with Western style imperialism may think that, but I stand by my statement that it will not happen. I'm not saying not a literal bullet will be fired (like that's not even realistic for anything??????), but lol @ people in here thinking it's going to look like a Middle Eastern country after the US is done with it.
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I do, which has nothing to do with ethnostates, balkanization, and undermining the territorial integrity of sovereign states.
I'd love to hear what you think counts as "rational discussion" as it pertains to Xinjiang and China's ongoing genocide and ethnic cleansing of its Uighur minority.
You are literally parroting CCP talking points and propaganda in this thread.
China will invade in the future, but probably not anytime soon. The preparations for the invasion would take time and be clearly visible. Look at how much work Russia has had to do to mobilize 100,000 troops for a land invasion of their neighbour.
A naval landing will require much more build up. Different era, but the D-Day invasion across the English Channel required nearly 7000 vessels. An airborne invasion of Taiwan would be suicidal.
A naval landing will require much more build up. Different era, but the D-Day invasion across the English Channel required nearly 7000 vessels. An airborne invasion of Taiwan would be suicidal.
Now this is impressive....
China would do their best to obsfucate though because they don't want to leave time for the US to deploy attack subs in the area. One area China is actually still very behind on is submarine warfare. But yes, China would need way more hardware than Russia has to invade Taiwan as your point stands.
What incredibly sinophobic ahistoricism by trying to paint the Sino-Vietnam war as one of Chinese aggression and imperialism. Completely devoid of context. Please expain to the thread why China went to war with Vietnam in 1979, I beg.
But it has been... With Vietnam, Kashmir (which they still occupy), etc.
And considering their Nazi like behavior to their current minorites and populations it strikes me as odd to give them as much credit as you do.
Although I do think a military invasion of Taiwan is unlikely in the near-term, one has to wonder to what extent their "wait it out" strategy is predicated on a belief that time was always on their side, and whether that thinking has changed given slowing economic growth and the demographic crisis coming into view.
It may very well be the case that the calculus in Chinese leadership's minds has changed and that they no longer feel time is on their side.
It is also worth acknowledging that both foreign and domestic policy under Xi Jinping is characteristically different than under the previous generations of mostly technocratic, consensus-driven governing, so any assumptions about what is or is not the Chinese MO may be somewhat out-of-date. We have not seen this level of consolidation of power and cult of personality since the days of Mao.
So you don't even believe invasion claims are substantiated but you just want to scaremonger?
Eh, the Sino-Vietnam war was the aftermath of a proxy war between Soviet Union backed Vietnam and China backed Democratic Kampuchea in which the latter was committing genocide and the primary motivator for Vietnam to invade due to ethnic Vietnamese being a target of the Khmer Rouge.
They didn't say that. They said "near term". And it's more a matter of time, only China knows that timeline. With their demographic issues, and other internal pressures that seems to been sooner than not, but keeping a skeptical eye out for their actions is warranted and not scaremongering.
From what I've heard from my relatives in Taiwan, mainland China has already been sinking its claws deeper and deeper into the country. If anything I think that Taiwan's reaction/resistance to that sort of takeover is probably what will be more likely to push China to military action, though I still don't think we will see official bombs in Taipei for decades.
And I understand what you're saying about Mao cult of personality power but he isn't that many people before Xi. After Xi, I expect it's possible we'll see one or two Xi-lackey leaders before another popular/powerful figure emerges and rules China for another forty years. So far Xi doesn't strike me as the type of person to go all bombs away. That sort of action would be a huge departure from how they govern now.
And really, it's not fair imo to say policy is different now than before. Fifty/sixty years ago, China was basically a third world country fighting a civil war with tens of millions of its own people dying. There wasn't any real foreign policy involving invasion that mattered, lol. I mean, Taiwan was more likely to be militarily "invaded" back then than now, and back then Taiwan wouldn't be considered a "foreign" policy issue but a domestic one anyway.
Anyway, I guess I'm not totally disagreeing with you and I think there's a real possibility you may be right and I'll eat my words. I hope I'm wrong though, if anything because I dislike blatant, open faced warfare/violence a bit more than other kinds of imperialism. Personally I would be really upset if someone came in my house and told me I wasn't allowed to speak English or celebrate Christmas anymore, but I'd prefer that than my son being murdered at school with a bomb 🤷♀️.
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I don't think it's imminent, but I do think it's on the table, something Chinese leadership themselves readily admit. What part of that is scaremongering?
because we've seen it all before with the 'yellow cake' and the 'imminent threat of weapons of mass destruction'.
'oh and then we need another 20 billion for defense.' 'what about healthcare?' 'nah, defense spending NOW, there is a credible threat after all, i proved it.'
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There's no indication that China are planning to invade, even in the long term. Being "on the table" doesn't signify intent, in fact the very same speech you're basing this claim off goes on to emphasize a strategy of peaceful reunification.
He also clearly says he would not tolerate any dissidents that would say Taiwan should be internationally recognized. It's pretty clear what "peaceful" means in this context. It means the governing party of China will invade the second any other country recognizes Taiwan as separate from China or the majority of Taiwan votes for complete independence.
