So is CDPR not doing anything? Not even taking the ads in question down? How absolutely horrible
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CDPR is a transphobic company. It's time we stop making excuses for them.
- Thread starter Kyuuji
- Start date
They added these with intent. Of course they won't take them down. This is who they are.
And those influencers who jumped on the trans rights bandwagon now happily sit on their Cyberpunk chairs, marvelling at RTX and shit
They did this:
Feels like one of those studios that only hire "pro gamerz" when looking at the writing in the marketing and communication releases. Their entire company culture must be fucked for this to make it past all the rounds of reviews and execs seeing this and them being okay with it too. What a horrible place to work.
He starts talking about it at around 1:23:45
I mean at this point it's more shocking to find out something awful isn't in the game.
(sorry to derail the thread further, I just noticed this comment and wanted to reply but saw the discussion was already over)
It's a bit weird, in where the game does explore sexuality in a non-fetishized way and gets into the more "ugly but human" nature of it, but also does have that male gaze with how the female androids are designed.
I do admit, I find it a breath of fresh air that Yoko Taro himself admits 2B's design and related female android designs are just because he likes girls. No passing it off as "necessary" to the game's themes, it's just something he liked and wanted.
I'm really trying to give them the benefit of the doubt in assuming that they just haven't heard, but idk if thats really likely anymore? I mean Polygon and Kotaku (I think?) both pointed it out and those are definitely some of the higher up review sites, so I have a hard time believing that these influencers aren't aware of the problem.
Yeah like I'm not trying to defend him but Taro's known for being a wacky dude, and he straight up admitted that there wasn't really any meaning behind 2B's design other than his own Male gaze. I can at least get behind him a bit more than CDPR, who's been using "anti PC culture" as a way of marketing.
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I'm anticipating a lot of, "I've read the accusations and issues and I certainly feel bad for everyone offended by this, but damn the game is SO GOOD and PERFECT and CDPR IS GOD."
What the hell? How is stuff like this not making it into any reviews? It really sounds like the developers just built this game around 13 year old Edgelord nonsense.
Honestly? It's probably because they either a) don't consider that kind of language problematic or b) feel like it fits the world and so they can excuse it because lore and world building.
No more excuses at all anymore. Big names like Polygon, Gamespot, GB, etc, have extensively talked about it.
I get that, and you're probably absolutely right, but after everything that was discussed when shows like Game of Thrones were on the air, I had hoped we were past just throwing rape into a franchise to show how edgy and serious it is. Putting something that horrific as just background noise doesn't accomplish anything more then shock value, and at worst, feels like it kind of minimizes the horror of it.
I'm sorry to be dramatic about this, but the more I hear about this game the more amazed I am that more reviewers didn't feel uncomfortable by any of this. You'd think a game featuring heavy transphobia, misogyny, and apparently casual mentions of rape would make at least more then a handful of reviewers feel uncomfortable. They "It's a dystopia" defense only works if the game doesn't make a joke about it's themes and those background elements contribute to the whole. I'm sorry for ranting.
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Even if they did internally agree that they screwed up, and there's no reason to think that's the case, it's 100% guaranteed that they're more worried about the backlash they'd get from their fanbase if they removed the ads than the backlash they've gotten from leaving them in.
Oh no worries lol. An artist named SOPHIE.
100%
Are we expecting them to address the controversy with their fanbase harassing the Polygon and Gamespot reviewers?
Given in the past they tweeted this, I think at most they'll acknowledge it just in a way that validates the fanbase for harassing journos, though that said my money right now is on them just ignoring the harassment since it's not hurting them financially.
blinkingwhiteguy.gif
I think this is the most laughably awful thing I've heard about this game so far.
I can now play it and remember the good wholesome days of Call of Duty on Xbox Live.
Really, they thought cyberpunk meant edgelord shit and that's it.
Yeah I can't say the cybernetic supermodel wrapped in loo roll really sold me on a politically astute vision of the future
What's shocking is that trailer felt completely at odds with what the game turned out to be. The announcement was very dark and intense, despite featuring a sexualized woman. The marketing since then has just been "Wow cool future".We should have seen it coming when this was the reveal
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Well yea, the video seemed mildly promising. Which honestly just leads more into the theory that they really purposely leaned more and more into fullon pandering to gamers as much as possible. Between Gamergate happened soon after, their outright worship for TW3 and what they said about "no MXT bullshit", and then seeing the reactions their transphobic tweets got.
Wonder how things would have went if they actually made the game back then.
User threadbanned, further moderation pending review: inappropriate series of whataboutisms
So, I have been reading and reading. Damn, near a week now.
Cyberpunk 2077 is problematic and is nigh on banned from approved discussion and this situation (the polite term) has been begging the question: Has there been any discourse on how future releases are to be treated moving forward? Surely, if this CD Projekt Red game deserves this amount of scrutiny, most of the upcoming major releases should be treated the same, right? Logic would dictate. Is this enthusiast games forum open to banning discussion of, say, GTA VI? You know that game is going to be a powder keg for this community. Why hasn't discussion of Ubisoft products been banned as well for so, so, so many reasons? Fallout '76 also seemed to be problematic. Shouldn't that have been a prohibited title along with other Bethesda releases? Or on that note should not all Microsoft-published games be banned from discourse what with the ZeniMax acquisition? Guilt by association is convenient; the guillotine silences all.
One interpretation for Cyberpunk 2077 necessitating thousand-word mod posts (and lord knows how much effort and back-and-forth from the poor moderation staff) would be that trans' rights seem to trump misogyny and good, old-fashioned racism on this website, though that is not my take, I see the argument and I see the debate team hats coming out. Isn't Ubisoft an equally hateful company when compared to CD Projekt Red? More so? Harry Potter games are just a given for the ban-pile, I assume, probably releasing with a promised "text-only," mod-written thread, if at all. God forbid we get a Kingdom Come sequel.
If these numerous releases are even approved for discussion, what about the users who play them and comment? Did they happen to get a copy from Amazon.com? This is a company that openly exploits its workers to the point of suicide. This is a company that uses forced-labor camps in Uighur China. Literal slave labor. Surely users who use Amazon, WalMart, Cost Co., Best Buy, LG, Toshiba, Verizon, Apple, TCL, Sony, Microsoft, Ford, Corsair, MSI, Valve, Intuit, FIS, Google, Razer, Qualcomm, Alphabet, Facebook, Instagram, Intel, AT&T, Cisco, Comcast, Toyota, GE, WhatsApp, Adobe, Netflix, nVidia, AMD, Texas Instruments, Samsung, Insignia, General Motors, Philips, Oculus, Hewlett-Packard, or IMB products deserve a permanent ban because using these problematic company's products condones these problematic company's practices? These transgressions should surely be more prominent on this forum than say, a Mix It Up ad, the treatment of prisoner stereotypes, or sexual character designs, right? These are companies who actually make money from slave labor, yet this forum is writing 7,000-word posts about the lack of inclusiveness in a microcosm of a pass-time that requires users to throw money at the companies listed above (though, to be fair, I may have left one or two off that list but surely you get the point). This seems like a double-standard and this seems like hypocrisy and this seems like bullshit.
I guess my question is this: is equality important to the folks who frequent this website? I appreciate the political ramifications of this site's treatment of the year's biggest game release, but it needs to do the same for all titles moving forward or this becomes a hollow, one-note hill to die on, and, congratulations, people here picked a hill to die on, but it was the wrong damn hill.
And I guess my point is this: why does the opinion of a minority group get carte-blanche to dictate policy on this site, when there are issues in play that affect every single person here, not just a percentage? Where are the torches and pitchforks for the death toll a release like the PlayStation 5 induced? If you want to take a stance, good; take that stance, believe in something; fight the power. Good for you. Remember though, there are often much larger issues at play, and your time could be better spent on a street corner protesting the things you believe in rather than cross-checking which ResetERA users cross-post on NeoGAF. Set the bar a bit higher for yourself.
I mean not to belittle the politics of this community but more-so the manner in which it chooses to push them.
So. What do we do about upcoming games? Is there a discussion about this? And more importantly for the average ResetERA user: is there a transparent discussion – perhaps a sticky? - between moderation staff and the general users about what this website is rapidly devolving into that does not involve "trials by Discord," doxxing, or behind the scenes chicanery?
I'd like to know. Maybe a few others would, too.
Much love to every single one of you.
Cyberpunk 2077 is problematic and is nigh on banned from approved discussion and this situation (the polite term) has been begging the question: Has there been any discourse on how future releases are to be treated moving forward? Surely, if this CD Projekt Red game deserves this amount of scrutiny, most of the upcoming major releases should be treated the same, right? Logic would dictate. Is this enthusiast games forum open to banning discussion of, say, GTA VI? You know that game is going to be a powder keg for this community. Why hasn't discussion of Ubisoft products been banned as well for so, so, so many reasons? Fallout '76 also seemed to be problematic. Shouldn't that have been a prohibited title along with other Bethesda releases? Or on that note should not all Microsoft-published games be banned from discourse what with the ZeniMax acquisition? Guilt by association is convenient; the guillotine silences all.
One interpretation for Cyberpunk 2077 necessitating thousand-word mod posts (and lord knows how much effort and back-and-forth from the poor moderation staff) would be that trans' rights seem to trump misogyny and good, old-fashioned racism on this website, though that is not my take, I see the argument and I see the debate team hats coming out. Isn't Ubisoft an equally hateful company when compared to CD Projekt Red? More so? Harry Potter games are just a given for the ban-pile, I assume, probably releasing with a promised "text-only," mod-written thread, if at all. God forbid we get a Kingdom Come sequel.
If these numerous releases are even approved for discussion, what about the users who play them and comment? Did they happen to get a copy from Amazon.com? This is a company that openly exploits its workers to the point of suicide. This is a company that uses forced-labor camps in Uighur China. Literal slave labor. Surely users who use Amazon, WalMart, Cost Co., Best Buy, LG, Toshiba, Verizon, Apple, TCL, Sony, Microsoft, Ford, Corsair, MSI, Valve, Intuit, FIS, Google, Razer, Qualcomm, Alphabet, Facebook, Instagram, Intel, AT&T, Cisco, Comcast, Toyota, GE, WhatsApp, Adobe, Netflix, nVidia, AMD, Texas Instruments, Samsung, Insignia, General Motors, Philips, Oculus, Hewlett-Packard, or IMB products deserve a permanent ban because using these problematic company's products condones these problematic company's practices? These transgressions should surely be more prominent on this forum than say, a Mix It Up ad, the treatment of prisoner stereotypes, or sexual character designs, right? These are companies who actually make money from slave labor, yet this forum is writing 7,000-word posts about the lack of inclusiveness in a microcosm of a pass-time that requires users to throw money at the companies listed above (though, to be fair, I may have left one or two off that list but surely you get the point). This seems like a double-standard and this seems like hypocrisy and this seems like bullshit.
I guess my question is this: is equality important to the folks who frequent this website? I appreciate the political ramifications of this site's treatment of the year's biggest game release, but it needs to do the same for all titles moving forward or this becomes a hollow, one-note hill to die on, and, congratulations, people here picked a hill to die on, but it was the wrong damn hill.
And I guess my point is this: why does the opinion of a minority group get carte-blanche to dictate policy on this site, when there are issues in play that affect every single person here, not just a percentage? Where are the torches and pitchforks for the death toll a release like the PlayStation 5 induced? If you want to take a stance, good; take that stance, believe in something; fight the power. Good for you. Remember though, there are often much larger issues at play, and your time could be better spent on a street corner protesting the things you believe in rather than cross-checking which ResetERA users cross-post on NeoGAF. Set the bar a bit higher for yourself.
I mean not to belittle the politics of this community but more-so the manner in which it chooses to push them.
So. What do we do about upcoming games? Is there a discussion about this? And more importantly for the average ResetERA user: is there a transparent discussion – perhaps a sticky? - between moderation staff and the general users about what this website is rapidly devolving into that does not involve "trials by Discord," doxxing, or behind the scenes chicanery?
I'd like to know. Maybe a few others would, too.
Much love to every single one of you.
Cyberpunk 2077 is everything I hate about games culture. Utterly toxic, misanthropic, bloated and self-aggrandizing. This game has this miasma of hatred.
This feels like a case of you're not allowed to complain about society because you exist in society. Pure whataboutism. Maybe try to understand why a group that is frequently victimized and dehumanized by this company and industry would want to try and have their voices heard, especially after moderators, by their own admission, kind of failed the trans users here. Also carte-blanche? Are you serious? In what world has the trans community been given carte-blanche?
Oh brother the fucking whataboutism is off the charts.
You seriously don't think this issue should be discussed because other companies are horrible as well?
Holy shit this is the best response to that whataboutism post
If other users have issues with other games, companies, people.. they can make the case for those separate situations and the community can discuss any relevant action.
Really not sure why you had to type all that for something so simple...
I can't speak for others here, but personally I'd love it if this site did a similar treatment for Ubisoft game threads. Limit to one OT, giant ass warnings at the top of every page, link to a well-written OP about the issues at hand. I'd sign that petition in blood right now.
Same. Except did they actually follow through on the "top of every page" promise for CP's OT finally? Last I checked they flat out ignored that promise, but to be fair I ignored the thread soon after.
yup, the first post is repeated on each page. Cant be missed.
To give that the response it doesn't deserve, for the sake of anyone who really wants an answer:
"Capitalism has a lot of seriously fucked up practices underpinning it" is not an adequate reason to handwave away "this particular enthusiast games company has been actively and consistently shitty towards a specific marginalized group", i.e. the sort of people this enthusiast games forum was founded to represent first and foremost.
To give this the response it does deserve, good job telling minorities that A, they don't matter as much as the majority, B, their concerns are irrelevant, and C, that they're voicing their concerns the wrong way, while being as condescending about it as you possibly could have been.
Civility at its finest, goddamn.
"Capitalism has a lot of seriously fucked up practices underpinning it" is not an adequate reason to handwave away "this particular enthusiast games company has been actively and consistently shitty towards a specific marginalized group", i.e. the sort of people this enthusiast games forum was founded to represent first and foremost.
To give this the response it does deserve, good job telling minorities that A, they don't matter as much as the majority, B, their concerns are irrelevant, and C, that they're voicing their concerns the wrong way, while being as condescending about it as you possibly could have been.
Civility at its finest, goddamn.