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Catalan separatist leaders given lengthy prison sentences
- Thread starter Ferrs
- Start date
It's so sad to see spaniards so brainwashed that even can't talk about that.
That's why I think the CDRs arrested the previous week are ok in prision. That doesn't mean that with batasuna Spain illegalized and not France.
And I'm sure the France people also hate terrorism.
Dude don't try to manipulate my words I repudiate terrorism and violence, all violence.
That's why I think the CDRs arrested the previous week are ok in prision. That doesn't mean that with batasuna Spain illegalized and not France.
And I'm sure the France people also hate terrorism.
Catalan nationalists will go to great lenghts in delusion and gaslighting to deny the fact they are a hopelessly backward and ethnicist movement.
A referendum may or may not be democracy. If the government violates the rights of the opposition, the Constitution and the laws of the regional Parliament to pass a "transition law" that essentially overturns the Constitution and the Estatut, creates a paralell legal framework and then organizes a referendum for their friends with no democratic garantees... That's a sham referendum.
It's also a clear show that the Catalan separatist movement is one of the modern experiments in illiberal, majoritarian democracy. Catalan separatists view the whole world as a conflict between Catalans and between them and the rest of Spain where the winner takes all and the loser has to lose everything.
You do realize Batasuna is black listed as a terror group not only by European Union but also by the United States right?
Defending Batasuna makes me sick. They literally financed with taxpayer money a terrorist group that killed hundreds of people.
That doesn't make sense, a terrorist organization may trow bombs in one country and it still be a terrorist organization in another.
These are the self-proclaimed tolerant and peaceful democrats.
ETA is the terrorist group and it was a disgusting group. Batasuna was a political party.
12 years for a fake independence declaration? Seems excessive to me.
https://web.archive.org/web/20070710174922/http://www.treasury.gov/offices/enforcement/ofac/programs/terror/terror.pdf
When the US included ETA as a terrorist group in their list, and Batasuna as their alias.
Is this the hill you wanna die on?
Which most leaders where ex ETAs scum. Including the assassin Otegui.
I dont think the ETA conversation is on topic btw, so we should probably stop it as it is a different thing. To end it:
Yet it took until the late 80s for France to even allow detention of known ETA members in France, and longer for Spain and France to do cooperation operations to finally end the "french refuge" (as most of the most higher ups hided there).
Batasuna was the political arm of ETA for quite a while. Heck, the Aralar scion from Batasuna which said no to the ETA violence was legal while Batasuna wasnt.
That was about the favor Aznar asked for when he meet with Bush for the Irak war?
But still I want to say that I don't support terrorism of course for god sake, I just said that France didn't illegalized the party and that make me think.
I never did that, I know you want me to be banned.
You are defending the political arm of a terrorist organisation that killed thousands of people. I'm not sure if you know the meaning of terrorism apology.
I'm not defending the party neither the organization, I said that the fucking terrorism could be solved allowing batasuna to be legal much more earlier.
Sure let's legalise the same people who massacred thousands of innocents in order to eradicate terrorism. You sure look brilliant.
And you continue to defend a terrorist organisation.
I repeat, I never defend the party neither the organization. Following your logic, France, the state, having Batasuna as a legal party, was whitewashing terrorism?
Friendly reminder that Oriol Junqueras is a racist asshole. Tacitly, there has always been a subtle, racist component ingrained at the very core of catalan independentist ideology, but he legitimized the sentiment:
He gets no sympathy from me.
Batasuna was legal when they were funding the murders of innocents. Just stop.
He gets no sympathy from me.
Batasuna was legal when they were funding the murders of innocents. Just stop.
ETA continued commiting crimes while Batasuna was legal (and one of them was what sparked the illegalization of Batasuna). The situation could have been solved way earlier if ETA had decided to fully go the democratic way as they had the chance several times before Batasuna was declared illegal. ETA was not well known for taking that chance as even years later they decided to continue the violent way despite having a treaty with the PSOE government to start the legalization process for them, and only really quit because their structure was pretty much broken and had no legitimate reasons (nor money).
In the end, the only way for ETA to end was by the saner parts of the organizations (those that wanted a peaceful democratic way) to stop caring about ETA and giving them money (as Batasuna had done).
France where a bunch of cowards in that front and then they changed their mind. What is exactly your point here?
That terrorist are only terrorist if France says so?
Go tell that to the victims.
If we have Vox which is the direct party of the fascist regime we had 50 years ago, why we shouldn't allow Bildu? Part of the democracy is that.
People like Bush are basically war criminals, and their parties are still there.
We had a government that was behind state terrorism that killed several innocents too.
People like Bush are basically war criminals, and their parties are still there.
We had a government that was behind state terrorism that killed several innocents too.
The GOP is actively trying to subvert democracy. Winning argument you have here. Things would be much more democratic around here if the GOP was squashed. They would be squashed honestly if they had not managed to steal the 2000 and 2016 elections, and the said war crimes of Bush wouldn't have even happened.
About Oriol, for sure their words where not the best, he commented a newyork times study. Saying that for that the whole independence movement is racist, is at least, insulting racism.
About batasuna, look, I really hope that the way the spanish state handled the situation banning the party was the best way to fight terrorism, but it's hard to believe.
Very good, now you are insulting a whole country, please continue.
Huh? You talking about the country where musicians are imprisoned for their song lyrics, right? https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.in...josep-miquel-arenas-beltran-a8226421.html?amp
Bildu is not illegal last time I checked, because they aren't the political arm of a terrorist organization, even if they share many ideas and they are quite apologetic.
Spain not looking much better than England. Someone tell them their imperialistic "glory" faded a century ago. Two centuries in the case of Spain.
What Oriol Junqueras said that time is downright nazi shit. The study didn't say anything like that, he just made it up because it's what he really believes, that Catalans are part of the master, northern race, unlike Spaniards and Portuguese.
The party was an intrinsic part of the terrorist organization dude. I don't know why you keep denying a historical fact.
Somebody should tell "us" that the laws should no longer apply? What does this have to do with the empire? I'm really curious.
Oriol said we are much more like Italians than spaniards that are more likely the celts like Irish people, he never said to be a part of a glorious race.
Even that I don't like him saying that, genetics simply don't care.
Banning commerces for not having their sings in Catalan. That's a very tolerant and no Nazi thing to do.
Yeah, just like Pompeu Gener when he said Catalans were arians and the rest of Spaniards semitic or "even Mongolic", it was all a very innocent comment on population genetics 😂
Do you understand that Bildu is just a renamed Batasuna, right?
I had to search for that guy. Fuck that guy if he said that.
A term much elavorated at forocoches (4chan spanish like) to refer the people who wore yellow ties (I think it's called like that).
Thinking everybody is the same in a group is a nazi thing?
User banned (1 day): hostility and inflammatory accusation against another member over a series of posts in the thread
You don't aprove democracy, having a prejudice on a group of people and vote for VOX?
If so, yes you are a nazi.
I'm neither of those things pal. But watch out with your insults. I won't tolerate anyone calling me a Nazi by not agreeing with his separatist bullshit.
Support for leaving the EU was polling at around 30% among the UK population when it was first announced, and then snowballed from there in to a full on culture war, with one side able to make infinite promises of everything being different, while the other side had to actually account for the downsides of existing in reality.
When you propose a referendum you really risk opening Pandora's box - and given the justifications for Catalan independence that I have heard from Catalan acquaintances, I imagine any referendum would go along similar lines (replacing Brussels with Madrid, and Eastern Europe with regions of Spain such as Andalusia)
It's not as simple or straightforward as your suggestion makes it out to be