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Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
I'm not gonna defend the cheating analogy, but here's the deal dude.

The people who want to avoid or even ban wifi users from fighting games have the community's interests in mind. They want to have good matches and want everyone else to as well.

You just want to have "fun" but unfortunately that will come at the expense of every person you are matched with.

So who in these scenarios is being selfish and who is not?

You are the one who wants to violate the community standard that benefits the majority as long as you have some fun.
Yeah imagine playing a video game to have fun?

I'm sorry for my selfishness. Maybe they should put a big warning label on the box that says, "Don't buy this game if you're using wifi you selfish jackass."

Please kind sir do forgive me for my transgression. I'll never play a game online again.
 

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
Is it so hard for you to acknowledge that some people literally can't use Ethernet? Or the fact that not everyone has fiber internet, and that if someone is playing on DSL it's not gonna matter if it's wired or not?


Uh, I've literally acknowledged it in previous posts. So not that hard?

I've also said multiple times that ideally we'd have filtering options + good rollback netcode.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,107
Yeah imagine playing a video game to have fun?

I'm sorry for my selfishness. Maybe they should put a big warning label on the box that says, "Don't buy this game if you're using wifi you selfish jackass."

Please kind sir do forgive me for my transgression. I'll never play a game online again.
Keep throwing your pity party while people try to explain to you why your individual needs can't always come first.
 

ZeroDotFlow

Member
Oct 27, 2017
928
Is it so hard for you to acknowledge that some people literally can't use Ethernet? Or the fact that not everyone has fiber internet, and that if someone is playing on DSL it's not gonna matter if it's wired or not?
If someone is playing on bad internet, that directly impacts the match and makes the game actively worse for the other player. At that point it's not worth playing online for either player, because they're both playing at the speed of a PowerPoint presentation.

This isn't a shooter where you can have 200 ping and still play the game with others. You actively cannot play a fighting game when there's a ton of lag, full stop. If you've played a fighting game with an especially bad connection, you would know this.

So taking measures to improve the baseline is the best thing you can do. And if a player is stuck with bad internet, then I don't know what you want because they still can't play the game even if they were allowed into the tourney. Having a wired connection is one of the first big steps to make the game stable and you don't need fiber internet to play a fighting game, you just need to not drop packets all over the place.
 

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
Yeah imagine playing a video game to have fun?

I'm sorry for my selfishness. Maybe they should put a big warning label on the box that says, "Don't buy this game if you're using wifi you selfish jackass."

Please kind sir do forgive me for my transgression. I'll never play a game online again.

Can't participate in a ranked mode =/= can't use WiFi
 

Mantrox

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,911
Number of times my wifi has hurt people in CS:GO matches: 0.
Completely different kettle of fish.

99% of people dont know or care what a router is, and have it inside a cabinet on the other side of the house and your console has to go through 3 walls to talk to it. The inherent variations in response time you're gonna have everytime your brother opens the door and stands in front of the console with another object count towards your experience.
Since SFV is not optimally equipped to deal with these variations, the gameplay degradation is much more noticeable in wireless.

Your setup might be fine, but for the other 99% on wireless its a crap shoot.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,717
Is it so hard for you to acknowledge that some people literally can't use Ethernet? Or the fact that not everyone has fiber internet, and that if someone is playing on DSL it's not gonna matter if it's wired or not?
I can't walk, you don't see me entering running competitions.
 

ZeroDotFlow

Member
Oct 27, 2017
928
And I just want to repeat again for posterity:

If you are comparing WiFi on a fps to a fighting game, stop. You have no clue what you're talking about and the two types of games could not be any more different in terms of networking and how connections work.
 

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
Keep throwing your pity party while people try to explain to you why your individual needs can't always come first.
Keep telling me you don't want me to be able to play a video game because of my internet.

Thankfully you don't run the show so I'll continue to play casually online when I want to wifi or no.

Because once more my irritation is entirely at the people saying this should be standard.

But hey don't let me stop you from trying to act superior.
 

Ragnorok64

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
2,955
Nice. It'd be great if all the fighters showed who was or wasn't on wifi so they could be filtered out.
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,703
Number of times aimbots have hurt people in CS:GO matches: Uncountable.
Number of times my wifi has hurt people in CS:GO matches: 0.

CS:GO uses dedicated servers and aren't peer to peer like a fighting games. You have no idea what you're talking about.

You are one of the most dishonest people I've met in a while.

The comparison was stupid for many reasons, and it was quoted multiple times because it's absurd.

The comparison was just fine. You seem to have a hard time understanding that comparisons are just that comparisons, they aren't saying these things are 100% like each other but that they're comparable in that they both harm the experience for other players. Yet you seem so stuck on that very concept and are now lashing out.
 

Deleted member 13560

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,087
I'm not running a cable through my house for this. My partner would throat punch me. I'll have to figure something out.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,431
Yeah imagine playing a video game to have fun?

I'm sorry for my selfishness. Maybe they should put a big warning label on the box that says, "Don't buy this game if you're using wifi you selfish jackass."

Please kind sir do forgive me for my transgression. I'll never play a game online again.

Dude you literally posted this thread the other day.


Playing against someone with a bad connection is exactly the kind of thing that can ruin a moment in a game for them. It is fair to assume that a lot of people with bad connections are playing on wifi, and there are people who want to be able to filter that from their experience of playing the game.
 

krazen

Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,159
Gentrified Brooklyn
Yeah imagine playing a video game to have fun?

I'm sorry for my selfishness. Maybe they should put a big warning label on the box that says, "Don't buy this game if you're using wifi you selfish jackass."

Please kind sir do forgive me for my transgression. I'll never play a game online again.

What's great about this post is the poster firmly believe they arent the asshole.

I get it. I got big job to afford to live in big city with expensive fiber optics and my place is easy enough to wire ethernet to my consoles. I too can say 'Fuck U, bitch' to people who have wifi under the assumption they hate me, lol. Ive hit peak connectivity, so everyone else should too!

But its not reality man, some people are teens on their parents wifi in the basement, some are in the Boonies, USA where the internet sucks even if you're plugged directly into a gigabit ethernet router. Etc. Its up for the code to be up to task so the games playability is solid for both and many games do just a fine job. But to think they are all 'lazy' well that's some privilege my dude
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
The goal of making WiFi isn't to ban WiFi users, it's to put you in your own pool of users that wired users can opt into so that they're not subject to those connections if they don't want to be. If you're playing a 16-player FFA deathmatch on an external server on a wired connection, the only person you hurt with a WiFi connection is yourself since other players will have an edge over you. If it's a team game, this will extend to your teammates as well. But with P2P connections, since an external server isn't used, that self-inflicted wound gets shared to your opponent and results in making their experience worse as well. Good Netcode can help smooth out some of the bumps, but it can't fix the underlying problem.
 

Theswweet

RPG Site
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
6,419
California
I'll say "good", but I do have a question - isn't WiFi 6 supposed to be a lot better about signal integrity and consistency? I'm curious if someone playing on WiFi but using a WiFi 6 connection (both router and client) might actually be decent. Obviously that kinda disqualifies consoles, though.
 

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
So run it from my living room, through the front of our kitchen,in front of the front door, down the hall past the bathroom,into my room, around my bed, and then finally the back of my TV.


Yeah nothing can go wrong there.

You....realize people have wired ethernet cords along walls for ages, right? Of course in your situation a powerline adapter would probably suit your needs more easily if it works better.
 

SkoomaBlade

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,054
Keep throwing your pity party while people try to explain to you why your individual needs can't always come first.
Oh God, the irony.

I've been reading this thread for a while now and the hostility here bewilders me on so many levels.

For an official tournament sure, make the connections as 100% full proof as possible. But for those asking for a complete ban of all wifi users from online fighting games as some sort of remedy for shitty netcode is just arrogant gatekeeping.
 
Last edited:

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,980
The comparison was just fine. You seem to have a hard time understanding that comparisons are just that comparisons, they aren't saying these things are 100% like each other. Yet you seem so stuck on that very concept and are now lashing out.
No, it wasn't fine.

The comparison was pointing out thay people who harm the game using aimbots make the same excuse as the person here, but as that harm is on a completely different level in multiple ways the comparison was useless.

Hence why it was quoted by others.
 

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
Dude you literally posted this thread the other day.


Playing against someone with a bad connection is exactly the kind of thing that can ruin a moment in a game for them. It is fair to assume that a lot of people with bad connections are playing on wifi, and there are people who want to be able to filter that from their experience of playing the game.
For cripes sake I don't care if there's a filter.

One. More. Time. My frustration is at the people saying this should be universal up to banning wifi players from everything.
 

Cordy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,352
I don't think there are that many casual players entering online tournaments in SFV of all games if they're not cognitive of their networking.
Most casuals won't even play Online at all. Not even Casual Mode. Certainly not Ranked or a Tournament.
No they dont
Casual online maybe at best
It doesn't matter if people have seen casuals play in a tournament with wifi or not, having an option to play "Cable Only" is better than a requirement. Nothing wrong with having more options for players. Besides that, say someone's cable randomly breaks and they can't really play again until their next paycheck hits but they wanted to spend time playing a tournament. Giving them an option to make a "Wifi Accessible" tourney would work rather than having them say "crap, I get paid again in 10 days, guess I can't do anything until then."

Nothing wrong with options.
 
Last edited:

ItIsOkBro

Happy New Year!!
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
9,518
So run it from my living room, through the front of our kitchen,in front of the front door, down the hall past the bathroom,into my room, around my bed, and then finally the back of my TV.


Yeah nothing can go wrong there.
yes nothing can go wrong because you'd run it along the ceiling/baseboards
 

Mantrox

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,911
Stand out of range and whiff punish
I laughed.


Again, this comes off as a tournament management decision. You have a limited amount of time to run an event, and you dont have a 100% surefire way to prevent bad connections.

As a hard ruling for casual/ranked. No.
A filter is more than enough.
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,703
No, it wasn't fine.

The comparison was pointing out thay people who harm the game using aimbots make the same excuse as the person here, but as that harm is on a completely different level in multiple ways the comparison was useless.

Hence why it was quoted by others.

So WiFi users in fighting games don't harm the experience for others? Because those connections can make the game downright unplayable.
 

closer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,170
For cripes sake I don't care if there's a filter.

One. More. Time. My frustration is at the people saying this should be universal up to banning wifi players from everything.

I think that's fair and no one really disagrees with you imo. Hyperbole about wifi is part and parcel w the fgc, like it is definitely a big issue and can absolutely ruin the game for tons of ppl but ppl are also prone to blaming it for their own bad play as well. But i dont think anyone is saying that wifi users should be prevented from buying fighting games in a serious way, i think...
 

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
You....realize people have wired ethernet cords along walls for ages, right? Of course in your situation a powerline adapter would probably suit your needs more easily if it works better.
Even if I ran it entirely on the wall it'd still need to pass at least two doors to get to my room.

I already even said I might look into a powerline adapter but that's just an if.

Look it's honestly not that big a deal for me, really. I just found some of the attitudes in this thread frustrating.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,980
So WiFi users in fighting games don't harm the experience for others? Because those connections can make the game downright unplayable.
Not in the same way that making that comparison makes any sense, no.

For multiple reasons... you honestly can't understand why?

So run it from my living room, through the front of our kitchen,in front of the front door, down the hall past the bathroom,into my room, around my bed, and then finally the back of my TV.


Yeah nothing can go wrong there.
You would either run it along the skirting, under the floor boards, or both where possible.

It will take some effort, but it will greatly improve your OWN experience which is the main selling point for you. Knock on effect is it will better others, too.

It's not too expensive to pay someone to do this for you, too.
 

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
It doesn't matter if people have seen casuals play in a tournament with wifi or not, having an option to play "Cable Only" is better than a requirement. Nothing wrong with having more options for players. Besides that, say someone's cable randomly breaks and they can't really play again until their next paycheck hits but they wanted to spend time playing a tournament. Giving them an option to make a "Wifi Accessible" tourney would work having them say "crap, I get paid again in 10 days, guess I can't do anything until then."

Nothing wrong with options.

If my stick breaks before a tournament, I either get a or borrow a new stick or don't participate.

Even if I ran it entirely on the wall it'd still need to pass at least two doors to get to my room.

I already even said I might look into a powerline adapter but that's just an if.

Look it's honestly not that big a deal for me, really. I just found some of the attitudes in this thread frustrating.

People have done this in offices for ages, two doors is nothing. You can get 100 ft of ethernet cord for like $11 nowadays, and just buy some tacks to put on the wall to clean it up if you want.
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,703
Not in the same way that making that comparison makes any sense, no.

For multiple reasons... you honestly can't understand why?

Have you never played a match in a fighting game where the other persons connect was so bad that every input was delayed, the game slows down, and at times straight up freezes? That isn't fun and not is it playable.
 

Mantrox

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,911
Even if I ran it entirely on the wall it'd still need to pass at least two doors to get to my room.

I already even said I might look into a powerline adapter but that's just an if.

Look it's honestly not that big a deal for me, really. I just found some of the attitudes in this thread frustrating.
For people considering powerlines, try to test them first, before buying.

The eletrical installtion of the house itself and what eletrical appliances are connected to it can have an adverse effect on the performance.
 

Cordy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,352
If my stick breaks before a tournament, I either get a or borrow a new stick or don't participate.
You're speaking from the perspective of someone who plays with a fighting stick in a tournament compared to someone who's at home who doesn't play that way and likely hasn't been in a fighting game tournament. Not everybody plays the game way when it comes to games.

This thread is wild because it sounds like the "Wifi Only" people are acting like everyone must play like them when the reality is everyone games different, everyone doesn't live the same life and everyone has the right to play any game the way they want.

I don't know what to tell some of yall because a lot of these comments are shitting on people who's game setup is different. Nobody should be against an option compared to a requirement.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,980
Have you never played a match in a fighting game where the other persons connect was so bad that every input was delayed, the game slows down, and at times straight up freezes? That isn't fun and not is it playable.
Yes.

And you honestly can't understand the multiple ways making the aimbot comparison was stupid?
 

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
You're speaking from the perspective of someone who plays with a fighting stick in a tournament compared to someone who's at home who doesn't play that way and likely hasn't been in a fighting game tournament. Not everybody plays the game way when it comes to games.

This thread is wild because it sounds like the "Wifi Only" people are acting like everyone must play like them when the reality is everyone games different, everyone doesn't live the same life and everyone has the right to play any game the way they want.

I don't know what to tell some of yall because a lot of these comments are shitting on people who's game setup is different. Nobody should be against an option compared to a requirement.

Then they should stay in casual matches, and not in ranked?

Also ethernet cords are super super cheap nowadays, if theirs somehow breaks, they can just get a new one...or if they're that broke, they probably should worry about other stuff than participating in an online SFV tournament lol
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,703
Yes.

And you honestly can't understand the multiple ways making the aimbot comparison was stupid?

I understand that both can make the games unplayable for the users on the receiving end.

Again no is saying a WiFi user is as bad as aimbotter but in their respective contexts. Fighting games and Shooters, the experience for the other player can be ruined.
 

Mars People

Comics Council 2020
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,197
No, the not-great netcode makes this even more of a problem than in games with good netcode that hides some of the issues better.
So instead of fixing their crap netcode they go for the sledgehammer approach of just banning people with less good connections?

Classy act Capcom, fucking classy.
 

FSLink

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,262
So instead of fixing their crap netcode they go for the sledgehammer approach of just banning people with less good connections?

Classy act Capcom, fucking classy.

To be fair, implementing rewriting netcode is costly and timely. NRS took about 2 years to properly implement it in MKX:

They have done a much much better job in MvCI but it's probably too expensive to rewrite SFV to implement that version of their netcode.
 

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
I don't care nearly enough to keep arguing this shit.

Look for a variety of reasons that I frankly don't feel I need to justify I'm probably stuck with WiFi for the foreseeable future.

I don't care if there are filters or tournaments that don't let me play because they're high stakes.

But don't tell me I shouldn't be allowed to play period or that I'm doing the equivalent of using a cheating device. That's bullshit.

I'm done.
 

Sephzilla

Herald of Stoptimus Crime
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,493
Zero problem with this. The only hangup is that most people with bad wifi connections probably have bad internet in general, so a cable connection probably isn't fixing much.

If they don't care enough to play fighting games on an ethernet connection do you honestly think they care enough to have a good ISP?