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Can we stop blaming Silicon Knights for Twin Snakes?

T002 Tyrant

T002 Tyrant

Member
Nov 8, 2018
8,965
- Nintendo asked for an exclusive Metal Gear Sold game for a Nintendo system since the N64 days, it was Konami's choice to remake MGS and Kojima who gave their blessing
- SK only got involved because Kojima was busy with MGS3
- SK were forced to use the Sons of Liberty Engine
- While gameplay criticisms are on SK's head..It was Kojima who's choice was to remake the cut scenes using Ryuhei Kitamura as director

So I think it's unfair that Silicon Knights got all the flack and Kojima came out of the situation squeaky clean. There were many factors influencing the development, and I think a lot of the criticisms are unfairly put square on Silicon Knights shoulders.

Then again I like The Twin Snakes and it's a shame it'll be forever lost in gaming history.
 

Deleted member 43657

User requested account closure
Banned
May 19, 2018
5,115
Twin Snakes is the best MGS game and SK deserves a ton of credit. I adore this game.

Ok, maybe it's not the best, but it's my favorite by far.
 
LiquidSolid

LiquidSolid

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,731
If anything I think they should get more of the blame, as its a broken mess of a remake. The cutscenes are dumb but they're the least of that game's problems.
 
PettySpirit

PettySpirit

Member
Dec 23, 2018
840
Maybe I'm just clueless, but I didn't even know people hated Twin Snakes.

I thought it was pretty alright.
 
Odesu

Odesu

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,543
Twin Snakes was great. People freaking out about Snake backflipping in a series where a Vampire rides a jet flown by the President of the United States because it's just too out there and out of character always came off as hilarious to me.

MGS is my favorite game franchise of all time and Twin Snakes is the best version of MGS ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Fuck Denis Dyack though.
 
Amnixia

Amnixia

▲ Legend ▲
The Fallen
Jan 25, 2018
10,424
I liked it, not sure why so many people have a problem with it.
 
Bradford

Bradford

terminus est
Member
Aug 12, 2018
5,423
Twin Snakes is a meh interpretation of one of the most tightly designed games ever made, but it's far from the worst thing ever. It's goofy as fuck and first person sorta completely fucks the level and encounter design of MGS1, but at the same time, I don't think anyone blames them for trying to backport a newer game's ideas and presentation into a classic.

It's just best to forget it and move on. It's a weird relic from a weird time.
 
youwei

youwei

Member
Jun 3, 2019
723
i am a MGS fan but sadly i do not own a gamecube back then , and i do not wish to spend a lot of $ on sealed or opened copies

i hope it be remastered or added in Gamecube virtual console in the near future on Switch or SwitchPro/Switch 2

I loved Silicon Knights as i have watched gameplay videos on youtube for TwinSnakes
 
GymWolf86

GymWolf86

Banned
Nov 10, 2018
4,663
What a let down, i basically bought a gc for that game.
Lucky for me the console has so many other games.
 
-shadow-

-shadow-

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,110
I love how overdone the cutscenes are, and it fits just fine with the later games in the series. Neither do I get the complaint about the First Person aiming. It's been there since later ports and if you don't want to use it, than don't?

It's not the best version of the game, I'll absolutely admit that. But the amount of shade thrown at it is quite bizarre.
 
Ninjadom

Ninjadom

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,194
London, UK
T002 Tyrant said:
- Nintendo asked for an exclusive Metal Gear Sold game for a Nintendo system since the N64 days, it was Konami's choice to remake MGS and Kojima who gave their blessing
- SK only got involved because Kojima was busy with MGS3
- SK were forced to use the Sons of Liberty Engine
- While gameplay criticisms are on SK's head..It was Kojima who's choice was to remake the cut scenes using Ryuhei Kitamura as director

So I think it's unfair that Silicon Knights got all the flack and Kojima came out of the situation squeaky clean. There were many factors influencing the development, and I think a lot of the criticisms are unfairly put square on Silicon Knights shoulders.

Then again I like The Twin Snakes and it's a shame it'll be forever lost in gaming history.
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I loved it. Still have it on my US Version. I might need to mod my PAL Wii to be able to play it again.

OP, where did you get your info from?
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
I like the gameplay changes, don't mind the wacky cutscenes, pretty much enjoy the entire game

BUT

the soundtrack is way, way worse than the original, and the soundtrack was one of my favorite parts of the original. Hence, I really prefer vanilla MGS over TTS.

Also, they lied prior to the game coming out. SK specifically. They were asked in interviews if the game would have extra modes, and they said collecting dogtags would unlock secret theater mode, like in MGS3. I went through all of MGS:TTS collecting dog tags specifically for secret theater, only for it not to be in the game. Collecting all the dog tags in the game unlocks nothing.
 
TheMadTitan

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
27,225
SilentRob said:
Twin Snakes was great. People freaking out about Snake backflipping in a series where a Vampire rides a jet flown by the President of the United States because it's just too out there and out of character always came off as hilarious to me.

MGS is my favorite game franchise of all time and Twin Snakes is the best version of MGS ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Fuck Denis Dyack though.
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Metal Gear Solid is generally The Punisher vs The X-Men. People weren't mad about the backflipping, they were mad the Punisher, in his fight against the evil X-Men, turned into Spider-Man.

Valid complaint. I thought it was annoying, but some of it is lol worthy.
 
The Boat

The Boat

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,871
Not sure why this came up now, but I don't think it's that common to see people blaming SK. I love the game anyway.
 
Gold Arsene

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
What is there to hate about Twin Snakes exactly? I know some don't like the over the top cutscene direction(which is funny in hindsight given we got MGR) and the first person mode can make it to easy at times. But it doesn't strike me as being so bad you'd feel the need to blame someone for it.
 
bane833

bane833

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
4,530
Blame for what? The game might not live up 100% to the original but it´s certainly much better than anything that followed (inlcuding MGS 2).
 
The Unsent

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,435
Gold Arsene said:
What is there to hate about Twin Snakes exactly? I know some don't like the over the top cutscene direction(which is funny in hindsight given we got MGR) and the first person mode can make it to easy at times. But it doesn't strike me as being so bad you'd feel the need to blame someone for it.
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The other criticism were new voice acting, a few new lines here and there, different music and controls making it easier, and probably was exaggerated at the time because of console wars.
 
EinBear

EinBear

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,669
Honestly, I massively prefer Twin Snakes over the original MGS. I wish it had been included in the HD Collection.
 
TechnoSyndrome

TechnoSyndrome

Member
May 15, 2019
2,452
Krejlooc said:
Also, they lied prior to the game coming out. SK specifically. They were asked in interviews if the game would have extra modes, and they said collecting dogtags would unlock secret theater mode, like in MGS3. I went through all of MGS:TTS collecting dog tags specifically for secret theater, only for it not to be in the game. Collecting all the dog tags in the game unlocks nothing.
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Doesn't Twin Snakes release predate MGS3 Subsistence/Secret Theater by line a year and a half? Or did you mean the casting theater from MGS2 Substance.
 
Gold Arsene

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
I consider the Cyborg Ninja cutscenes and new voice canon. I think they work better then rocket flipping Snake. I also think Mei Ling works better without the accent but I don't want to step on anyone's toes there so I wouldn't know which was is considered "proper."

I do agree that the voice acting for everyone else is better in the original.
 
The Unsent

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,435
Krejlooc said:
I like the gameplay changes, don't mind the wacky cutscenes, pretty much enjoy the entire game

BUT

the soundtrack is way, way worse than the original, and the soundtrack was one of my favorite parts of the original. Hence, I really prefer vanilla MGS over TTS.

Also, they lied prior to the game coming out. SK specifically. They were asked in interviews if the game would have extra modes, and they said collecting dogtags would unlock secret theater mode, like in MGS3. I went through all of MGS:TTS collecting dog tags specifically for secret theater, only for it not to be in the game. Collecting all the dog tags in the game unlocks nothing.
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Did they tell porkies like Colonial Marines/No Man Sky, or was it cut to reach dead lines?
 
Mzen

Mzen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
578
Portugal
So people hate Twin Snakes now? lol What the heck did I miss?

It's was alright. I still prefer the original, but those wacky cutscenes alone are enough of an incentive to give it another go. For me, the worst part was when the framerate dropped abysmally in certain areas and the weird inputs they've used for certain actions because the Gamecube controller didn't have pressure sensitive buttons, but other than that... I'm really glad Twin Snakes is a thing.

Haters gonna hate I guess.

Or maybe it was the cover art haha
mgsttsbox.jpg


I'm from Europe, so no complaints here :P Apologies to my fellow American members for that eyesore you've got stuck with.
 
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Midgarian

Midgarian

Alt Account
Banned
Apr 16, 2020
2,619
Midgar
Ok that's it. This thread has convinced me to try this game again.

My last attempt didn't go well and I didn't like it. The aesthetic is so so different from MGS1.

But so many people are praising it, I'm going to go in with an open mind this time.
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
TechnoSyndrome said:
Doesn't Twin Snakes release predate MGS3 Subsistence/Secret Theater by line a year and a half? Or did you mean the casting theater from MGS2 Substance.
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the theater mode from the MGS2 european release, prior to MGS3. It was supposed to be an unlockable in MGS TTS tied to dog tags according to pre-release interviews. I spent SOOO much time grabbing all the dog tags.
 
Ushojax

Ushojax

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,929
Who is blaming them? They made the game they were told to make and did a good job. Twin Snakes is still a quality product even though it has many strange deviations from the original, but Kojima has to take the blame for those. Twin Snakes is leagues better than awful games like MGS4, V and Peace Walker.
 
Zalman

Zalman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,896
Twin Snakes is better in every way except soundtrack. The over the top cutscenes actually fall more in line with the rest of the series.
 

Deleted member 16876

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
Kojima and Konami do share the blame.

That said, I doubt they said to get rid of the atmosphere and asthetic, drop MGS2's gameplay on MGS1's levels without retouching them, to change the music into a much worse soundtrack.

Only thing it does better than the original is Mei Ling's voice. That's it.

MGS1 still the best.
 
HeRinger

HeRinger

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,303
My biggest issue with Twin Snakes is the weird input lag when moving. The original felt so snappy and responsive to play.
 
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