California Propositions Discussion for 2020 Election

crienne · Sep 23, 2020

Figured it wouldn't be a terrible thing get discussions going about the propositions on the ballot for the November election in California.

Official voter guide:

Propositions | Official Voter Information Guide | California Secretary of State

Official Voter Information Guide, November 3, 2020, California General Election.

voterguide.sos.ca.gov

CA Democrat endorsements:

https://cadem.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/State-Propositions-on-the-2020-November-Ballot-.pdf

CA GOP endorsements:

California Republican Party

Official website of the California Republican Party.

www.cagop.org

Progressive voter guide:

Courage California Voter Guide

With Courage we can make sure our democracy works for ALL Californians

progressivevotersguide.com

Summaries:

Prop 14: Expansion of stem cell research funding

Authorizes $5.5 billion state bonds for: stem cell and other medical research, including training; research facility construction; administrative costs. Dedicates $1.5 billion to brain-related diseases. Appropriates General Fund moneys for repayment. Expands related programs. Fiscal Impact: Increased state costs to repay bonds estimated at about $260 million per year over the next roughly 30 years.

Prop 15: Tax commercial and industrial properties based on market value instead of purchase price, increase funding for schools

Taxes such properties based on current market value, instead of purchase price. Fiscal Impact: Increased property taxes on commercial properties worth more than $3 million providing $6.5 billion to $11.5 billion in new funding to local governments and schools.

Prop 16: Reinstate affirmative action for public education, employment, and contracting

Permits government decision-making policies to consider race, sex, color, ethnicity, or national origin in order to address diversity by repealing constitutional provision prohibiting such policies. Fiscal Impact: No direct fiscal effect on state and local entities. The effects of the measure depend on the future choices of state and local government entities and are highly uncertain.

Prop 17: Restores right of parolees to vote

Restores voting rights upon completion of prison term to persons who have been disqualified from voting while serving a prison term. Fiscal Impact: Annual county costs, likely in the hundreds of thousands of dollars statewide, for voter registration and ballot materials. One-time state costs, likely in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, for voter registration cards and systems.

Prop 18: Lets 17-year-olds vote in primaries if they're 18 before the general election

Fiscal Impact: Increased statewide county costs likely between several hundreds of thousands of dollars and $1 million every two years. Increased one-time costs to the state of hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Prop 19: Modifies property tax rules for homeowners that are over 55, disabled, or disaster victims

Allows homeowners who are over 55, disabled, or wildfire/disaster victims to transfer primary residence's tax base to replacement residence. Changes taxation of family-property transfers. Establishes fire protection services fund. Fiscal Impact: Local governments could gain tens of millions of dollars of property tax revenue per year, probably growing over time to a few hundred million dollars per year. Schools could receive similar property tax gains.

Prop 20: Restricts parole for certain non-violent offenses, turns some misdemeanors into felonies, allows collection of DNA samples for certain misdemeanors

Limits access to parole program established for non-violent offenders who have completed the full term of their primary offense by eliminating eligibility for certain offenses. Fiscal Impact: Increase in state and local correctional, court, and law enforcement costs likely in the tens of millions of dollars annually, depending on implementation.

Prop 21: Authorizes local rent control on residential property

Allows local governments to establish rent control on residential properties over 15 years old. Local limits on rate increases may differ from statewide limit. Fiscal Impact: Overall, a potential reduction in state and local revenues in the high tens of millions of dollars per year over time. Depending on actions by local communities, revenue losses could be less or more.

Prop 22: Exempts app-based transport companies from providing employment benefits

Classifies app-based drivers as "independent contractors," instead of "employees," and provides independent-contractor drivers other compensation, unless certain criteria are met. Fiscal Impact: Minor increase in state income taxes paid by rideshare and delivery company drivers and investors.

Prop 23: Modifies state requirements for dialysis clinics

Requires physician, nurse practitioner or physician assistant on site during dialysis treatment. Prohibits clinics from reducing services without state approval. Prohibits clinics from refusing to treat patients based on payment source. Fiscal Impact: Increased state and local government costs likely in the low tens of millions of dollars annually.

Prop 24: Expands CCPA privacy laws

Permits consumers to: prevent businesses from sharing personal information, correct inaccurate personal information, and limit businesses' use of "sensitive personal information," including precise geolocation, race, ethnicity, and health information. Establishes California Privacy Protection Agency. Fiscal Impact: Increased annual state costs of at least $10 million, but unlikely exceeding low tens of millions of dollars, to enforce expanded consumer privacy laws. Some costs would be offset by penalties for violating these laws.

Prop 25: Removes the current money bail system in California

A "Yes" vote approves, and a "No" vote rejects, law replacing money bail with system based on public safety and flight risk. Fiscal Impact: Increased costs possibly in mid hundreds of millions of dollars annually for a new process for release from jail prior to trial. Decreased county jail costs, possibly in high tens of millions of dollars annually.

Silver-Streak · Sep 23, 2020

Prop 20 and 22 sound like HUGE steps back. Why are they even under consideration?

RastaMentality · Sep 23, 2020

These propositions are massively stupid. I can't believe this state lets people vote on this shit. Direct democracy on civil rights is stupid.

StopMakingSense · Sep 23, 2020

Silver-Streak said:
Prop 20 and 22 sound like HUGE steps back. Why are they even under consideration?

All it takes is signatures.

TheKeipatzy · Sep 23, 2020

Silver-Streak said:
Prop 20 and 22 sound like HUGE steps back. Why are they even under consideration?

Prop22? Money. Trust me Uber and doordash are pumping in the big bucks to not have to give medial coverage! They market to me, a former driver as "choice and freedom!" When they are paying LESS as deliveries are in demand.

23 is DaVita being greedy again. Not wanting to pay for an on staff doctor or nurse. Lord forbid they stop making billions off of the Feds though

crienne · Sep 23, 2020

Silver-Streak said:
Prop 20 and 22 sound like HUGE steps back. Why are they even under consideration?

If you check out the Progressive's guide, you can find who the big funders are for both sides of these things.

For 20:

Top Funders of Prop 20:

Three police unions are the top funders in support of Prop 20, including the CA Correctional Peace Officers Association, the Association for LA Deputy Sheriffs, and the LA Police Protective League Issues PAC.

Philanthropists are the top funders of campaigns against Prop 20, including the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative, Patty Quillin, and Stacy Schusterman.

For 22:

Top Funders of Prop 22 include:

Lyft, Uber, and DoorDash are leading contributions in support of Prop 22, with over $30 million each. Both InstaCart and Postmates have contributed $10 million each, for a grand total of over $110 million.

Transport Workers Union of America, SEIU California State Council, Working Families Issues Committee, Service Employees International Union, and District Council of Ironworkers PIC have contributed a total of $842,850 in opposition to Prop 22.

For 22 in particular, the amount of money donated to the YES side is disgusting.

99nikniht · Sep 23, 2020

Thanks for the thread OP, I've been meaning to check out the propositions that will be on the ballot.

Also thanks for the links for the CA GOP endorsements. I'm basically gonna vote the opposite of every endorsement they have. There are times that CA Dems may have some suspect purposes for their endorsements, but fuckery is abound for every CA GOP endorsement.

sabertoothzombie · Sep 23, 2020

How does Prop 19 affect people? Is it more bad news for home buyers?

Deleted member 39374 · Sep 23, 2020

prop 20 is fascist garbage

prop 18 is playing with fire. theres a huge difference between 17 and 18 year olds. One of them is in college (usually a progressive environment) and the other is still at home and high school getting yelled at by parents and teachers

SquirrelSr · Sep 23, 2020

Silver-Streak said:
Prop 20 and 22 sound like HUGE steps back. Why are they even under consideration?

If it gets signatures, it gets on the ballot.

RobertM · Sep 23, 2020

You get a lot of Props in Cali huh. Prop 18 is an interesting one :D

Cat Party · Sep 23, 2020

RastaMentality said:
These propositions are massively stupid. I can't believe this state lets people vote on this shit. Direct democracy on civil rights is stupid.

Pretty much all the western states allow this. I don't like it at all. For every good law created by direct democracy, there are probably five bad ones. California has been knee-capped by Prop 13 for more than 40 years.

Loan Wolf · Sep 23, 2020

Prop 20 and 22 are easy NO brainers

Adder7806 · Sep 23, 2020

Getting massive amounts of ads for yes on 22. Have not seen a no.

Crashnburn85 · Sep 23, 2020

I miss the fun ones like legalization of pot....

mrmoose · Sep 23, 2020

TheKeipatzy said:
Prop22? Money. Trust me Uber and doordash are pumping in the big bucks to not have to give medial coverage! They market to me, a former driver as "choice and freedom!" When they are paying LESS as deliveries are in demand.

23 is DaVita being greedy again. Not wanting to pay for an on staff doctor or nurse. Lord forbid they stop making billions off of the Feds though

Both are spending big money too, if the frequency of ads are any indication. Also 21.

I don't understand how 15 wasn't passed long ago, it's such an advantage to have bought commercial property a long time ago. But I'm sure there's some catch in the actual bill.

chefbags · Sep 23, 2020

Lol I saw lyft and Uber sending me emails on 22. So thats an automatic fuck no.

Choppasmith · Sep 23, 2020

Thanks a lot for this OP, I was waiting for my union (SEIU) to do their voting guide but this works just as well.

Loan Wolf said:
Prop 20 and 22 are easy NO brainers

Sadly the ads they push for Yes on 22 I fear will really convince people because "Oh no poor working families". Maybe it's because I watch a lot of ad supported steams but I'm seeing the ads CONSTANTLY. Wish we could get some No ads. 21 has an equal amount of Yes/Mo ads.

Dr. Feel Good · Sep 23, 2020

I'm no on Prop 21, which may be an unpopular opinion. We can't fix the housing crisis through expanded rent control, it only further disincentives builders and development. Zoning and bureaucratic bullshit needs to be eliminated to ensure unfettered density across every neighborhood. Without it California is doomed to become a further dystopian hellhole.

devSin · Sep 23, 2020

Yes: 14-17, 24-25
No: 21
Unsure: 18-19, 23
Hell No: 20, 22

John Harker · Sep 23, 2020

My wife has a rare brain-related disease. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Yes to 14 plz!

Hound · Sep 23, 2020

What about Prop 19 guys? An exemption of new property taxes seems fair for wildfire victims, but letting all the rich 55 and over boomers buy whatever they want with a lower property tax base seems like 200% pure bullshit to me.

Murder She Wrote · Sep 23, 2020

I still haven't done my research yet but I saw a commercial of a dialysis patient saying they'll die if a certain prop passes and I will vote the opposite of that stupid ad.

crienne · Sep 23, 2020

Murder She Wrote said:
I still haven't done my research yet but I saw a commercial of a dialysis patient saying they'll die if a certain prop passes and I will vote the opposite of that stupid ad.

I'm assuming it was a No on 23 ad, which makes no sense to me other than the pure greed of for-profit clinics.

Hound said:
What about Prop 19 guys? An exemption of new property taxes seems fair for wildfire victims, but letting all the rich 55 and over boomers buy whatever they want with a lower property tax base seems like 200% pure bullshit to me.

This feels like one of those easy "gotchas" for the people that wrote the proposition. It is bullshit for the 55+ part of it, but you look like a bad guy if you oppose the help it would give to victims and disabled owners.

Bebpo · Sep 23, 2020

I hear Prop 15 is going to pass most likely because they're selling it as a tax the rich big corps thing.

But as a real estate attorney in CA, this is going to fuck a lot of low income/middle class people hard. Not only are most commercial properties owned by single families who've had small 1-2 unit properties passed down through generations. a lot which have little to no equity and right now during covid more often than not tenants paying $0 rent or empty spaces, but more importantly, any commercial landlord who is using a decent lease form and not just something written on a napkin, has a passthrough section in the lease which means as increase in property taxes are passed on to the tenants.

What this means is one of my clients has a 3 tenant property center where the taxes are going to jump up $120,000 or so because of this, that means splitting it threeway, the tenants are now all suddenly having their yearly rent increased $40,000 each if this passes.

Especially right now and for the next few years while businesses are struggling and going to struggle hard as the economy crashes and solely recovers, this is going to fuck lots of people.

But will probably pass.

mrmoose · Sep 23, 2020

Bebpo said:
I hear Prop 15 is going to pass most likely because they're selling it as a tax the rich big corps thing.

But as a real estate attorney in CA, this is going to fuck a lot of low income/middle class people hard. Not only are most commercial properties owned by single families who've had small 1-2 unit properties passed down through generations. a lot which have little to no equity and right now during covid more often than not tenants paying $0 rent or empty spaces, but more importantly, any commercial landlord who is using a decent lease form and not just something written on a napkin, has a passthrough section in the lease which means as increase in property taxes are passed on to the tenants.

What this means is one of my clients has a 3 tenant property center where the taxes are going to jump up $120,000 or so because of this, that means splitting it threeway, the tenants are now all suddenly having their yearly rent increased $40,000 each if this passes.

Especially right now and for the next few years while businesses are struggling and going to struggle hard as the economy crashes and solely recovers, this is going to fuck lots of people.

But will probably pass.

this is like an amendment to prop 13 to basically take out commercial and industrial properties, right? I thought there's a provision where business owners with less than a certain amount of holdings are still covered (that doesn't help the pass through you mentioned, but at least the truly small businesses that own their property should be helped).

I think prop 19 is similar where the over 55 thing is basically letting them take their lowered tax assessment with them when they move to a new place 3 times (they can currently do it once) but also makes it so that the lowered tax base can only be passed on to relatives if the home is a primary residence for those relatives. That seems ok to me, though I haven't done my studying of all the measures yet.

kIdMuScLe · Sep 23, 2020

Hound said:
What about Prop 19 guys? An exemption of new property taxes seems fair for wildfire victims, but letting all the rich 55 and over boomers buy whatever they want with a lower property tax base seems like 200% pure bullshit to me.

I'm voting yes on 19. My parents really need to downsize their house but the property tax for the new home would be more than they could afford because of their small SSI

Strider_Blaze · Sep 23, 2020

Thanks for the thread, OP.

Will definitely be looking into those props. But reading those excerpts, definitely going no on 20 or 22.

xir · Sep 25, 2020

sqwarlock said:
CA Democrat endorsements:
https://cadem.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/State-Propositions-on-the-2020-November-Ballot-.pdf

are these all legit?

crienne · Sep 25, 2020

xir said:
are these all legit?

I'd assume so since it's hosted on the CA Democrat party's official site. I'm not sure how they decide which ones to support or oppose (committee, most likely?) but this seems as legit as it gets.

xir · Sep 25, 2020

sqwarlock said:
I'd assume so since it's hosted on the CA Democrat party's official site. I'm not sure how they decide which ones to support or oppose (committee, most likely?) but this seems as legit as it gets.

dems aren't always picking the most liberal option, so just checking

Deleted member 11637 · Sep 25, 2020

NO ON 22! Uber and Lyft can fuck right off.

I didn't realize parolees couldn't already vote here, so 17 is an easy YES.

Rad Bandolar · Sep 25, 2020

mrmoose said:
I don't understand how 15 wasn't passed long ago, it's such an advantage to have bought commercial property a long time ago. But I'm sure there's some catch in the actual bill.

It's usually seen as prying open the door to repeal or weaken Prop 13, which is what a lot of ads opposing it used to defeat it when it came up last time. If Prop 13 were repealed, you'd see a massive wave of home sales from what's left of the middle class to wealthy buyers, who would then charge whatever they want for rent.

HarryDemeanor · Sep 25, 2020

Thank you for this OP! Been seeing the ramp up in Proposition commercials lately and I've needed a good central spot for all that information.

Particle Physicist · Sep 25, 2020

Can someone explain 25? What would
The new bail system be changed to? It's a bit confusing.

jokingbird · Sep 25, 2020

Particle Physicist said:
Can someone explain 25? What would
The new bail system be changed to? It's a bit confusing.

It would be a risk assessment based on the crime and individual. They would look at using an algorithm to determine groups. The current system is flawed, and this one might be a little better, but I could also see it being bad depending on how it is implemented.

This has a good breakdown:

California Proposition 25, Replace Cash Bail with Risk Assessments Referendum (2020) - Ballotpedia

Ballotpedia: The Encyclopedia of American Politics

ballotpedia.org

Septimus Prime · Sep 25, 2020

Thanks for this. These always get confusing if you try to parse them by just their original wordings.

elLOaSTy · Sep 25, 2020

Does the DSA have one yet, I can't find their guide for the props, might not be available.

Vardhan · Sep 25, 2020

Chooms said:
Does the DSA have one yet, I can't find their guide for the props, might not be available.

Was looking for this as well, but I don't think they have it up yet.

crienne · Sep 25, 2020

Chooms said:
Does the DSA have one yet, I can't find their guide for the props, might not be available.

Looks like the only one they've endorsed is Yes on 15: https://electoral.dsausa.org/our-endorsements/

Ditto for DSA-LA: https://dsa-la.org/endorsements/

mrmoose · Sep 25, 2020

Rad Bandolar said:
It's usually seen as prying open the door to repeal or weaken Prop 13, which is what a lot of ads opposing it used to defeat it when it came up last time. If Prop 13 were repealed, you'd see a massive wave of home sales from what's left of the middle class to wealthy buyers, who would then charge whatever they want for rent.

I don't think Prop 13 for residential would be repealed, but I don't get why people want to champion commercial/industrial properties continuing to fall into that, besides the possible effects to small business, which this bill seems to address.

Grym · Sep 25, 2020

Why does CA always have soooooo many Props? My ballot is overly long and annoying when there are 2. I think I would need an hour or 2 to vote

Sonuis · Sep 25, 2020

Prop 15 isn't really beneficial in the present with businesses struggling, so I'm voting no on it. If Prop 15 returns in the future post a vaccine and quarantine truly over, then I'd be willing to vote yes on it.

Septimus Prime · Sep 25, 2020

Sonuis said:
Prop 15 isn't really beneficial in the present with businesses struggling, so I'm voting no on it. If Prop 15 returns in the future post a vaccine and quarantine truly over, then I'd be willing to vote yes on it.

Prop 15 reverses Prop 13, which allows businesses and homeowners to keep paying tax rates from the 70's.

Joseph Elsbernd · Sep 25, 2020

Grym said:
Why does CA always have soooooo many Props? My ballot is overly long and annoying when there are 2. I think I would need an hour or 2 to vote

If memory serves you just need 600,000-700,000 signatures from any Californian to get something onto the ballot. CA is a direct and representative democracy.

zoku88 · Sep 25, 2020

Septimus Prime said:
Prop 15 reverses Prop 13, which allows businesses and homeowners to keep paying tax rates from the 70's.

I wish it would repeal it in whole.

13 really messed up housing incentives and it puts more of the tax burden on people without property...

Deleted member 11413 · Sep 25, 2020

Prop 20 is fucking garbage

Rad Bandolar · Sep 25, 2020

mrmoose said:
I don't think Prop 13 for residential would be repealed, but I don't get why people want to champion commercial/industrial properties continuing to fall into that, besides the possible effects to small business, which this bill seems to address.

It wouldn't, but the slippery slope argument is made to make sure people vote against it.

Basically they say, "If they come for us now, they'll come after you next."

Septimus Prime · Sep 25, 2020

zoku88 said:
I wish it would repeal it in whole.

13 really messed up housing incentives and it puts more of the tax burden on people without property...

Yeah. It's a step in the right direction, and I'm seeing lots of Facebook ads against it for obvious reasons.

Swiggins · Sep 25, 2020

Septimus Prime said:
Prop 15 reverses Prop 13, which allows businesses and homeowners to keep paying tax rates from the 70's.

It only reverses it on commercial property, which is a nice step forward, but a small one.

California Propositions Discussion for 2020 Election

One Winged Slayer

Knows things...

Deleted member 11637

EA

EA

User requested account closure

EA

was promised a tag