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British era, I have a question about pronunciation

Cheesebu

Cheesebu

Wrong About Cheese
Member
Sep 21, 2020
6,177
So I've been watching some British TV and I was curious about something. Occasionally when a word ends with an A, it will be pronounced er instead.

An example of this is in Wild China. Every once in a while the guy will say Chiner instead of China. It seems like it's possibly when the next word starts with a vowel. Is there a reason for this?
 

Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586
Same. Obama-rr was also something.
 
Ra

Ra

Rap Genius
Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
12,207
Dark Space
You are posing this question like accents don't exist in America too.

Why are you even asking for a reason lmao
 
UltraMagnanimous

UltraMagnanimous

Member
Oct 28, 2017
837
Cheesebu said:
It's an accent to usually say it with an a but occasionally say it with an er? Are you sure you read my whole post?
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Accents are not always 100% consistent, that's how languages and accents change over time and ultimately how English in the british isles became non-rhotic over some time. See my slightly more detailed response.
 
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Cheesebu

Cheesebu

Wrong About Cheese
Member
Sep 21, 2020
6,177
K.Jack said:
You are posing this question like accents don't exist in America too.

Why are you even asking for a reason lmao
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...again, I'm asking why it happens sometimes and not always, with the same speaker pronouncing it both ways. Someone answered it, feel free to read the linked wiki page if you're confused.
 
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Cheesebu

Cheesebu

Wrong About Cheese
Member
Sep 21, 2020
6,177
Thanks all, I probably should have just googled it. I didn't think it would trigger anyone lmao
 
Ze_Shoopuf

Ze_Shoopuf

Member
Jun 12, 2018
3,937
I'm also bemused when I hear in the UK something like "I'm gavering on Fursdays".

Like, you know it's spelled "gathering" and "Thursdays", right?
 
Rats

Rats

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,112
This definitely happens in certain American accents, it's not just a British thing.
 
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Cheesebu

Cheesebu

Wrong About Cheese
Member
Sep 21, 2020
6,177
Rats said:
This definitely happens in certain American accents, it's not just a British thing.
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I think you're right but I've never lived anywhere but Cali and Oregon, so I haven't heard it as much. I think it's mostly a New England thing, which doesn't get a ton of attention in US TV and film.
 
DBT85

DBT85

Resident Thread Mechanic
Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,280
Ze_Shoopuf said:
I'm also bemused when I hear in the UK something like "I'm gavering on Fursdays".

Like, you know it's spelled "gathering" and "Thursdays", right?
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and Americans apparently say twot instead of twat. Huge swathes of the english speaking world speak differently, even just in a 100 mile radius in the UK.
 
Tanaka

Tanaka

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,054
I've noticed this too. It makes it really obvious when an actor from the UK is doing an American accent. Words like idea always end with a very subtle r sound.
 
Aske

Aske

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,578
Canadia
Ze_Shoopuf said:
I'm also bemused when I hear in the UK something like "I'm gavering on Fursdays".

Like, you know it's spelled "gathering" and "Thursdays", right?
Click to expand...
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I'm from the UK and I don't understand this. I believe that it's an accent, but I was raised in England, lived there for over two decades before I gtfo, and I thought this was a speech impediment that I should politely pretend didn't exist; like pronouncing 's' as 'th' ("yeth, I'll altho have a bowl of thoup").

I lived in the north, and it's more of a southern phenomenon, so I didn't realise it was so widespread. Now I feel like every English YouTuber does it.
 
matrix-cat

matrix-cat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,284
Cheesebu said:
It seems like it's possibly when the next word starts with a vowel.
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This is it. If you end a sentence with a word ending in an 'ah' sound you wouldn't put an 'r' on the end, only when you're immediately following it up with another word that starts with a vowel. For example, 'Pamela Anderson' becomes 'Pamelaranderson'. It's just an accent thing, easier to slur the words together than stop your breath between them.

Pamelaranderson went to Chinarand then Jamaica.
 
Aske

Aske

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,578
Canadia
matrix-cat said:
This is it. If you end a sentence with a word ending in an 'ah' sound you wouldn't put an 'r' on the end, only when you're immediately following it up with another word that starts with a vowel. For example, 'Pamela Anderson' becomes 'Pamelaranderson'. It's just an accent thing, easier to slur the words together than stop your breath between them.

Pamelaranderson went to Chinarand then Jamaica.
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Bang on. This is a thing most English people do, regardless of regional accent, afaik. It's got nothing to do with the Westcountry accent that incorporates the NA style hard 'r'.

'Pamela Anderson' is a great example, because when she first slow-mo jogged into the spotlight back in the 90s, she was credited as 'Pamela Denise Anderson'. There's no room for the intrusive 'r' there. We only bestowed it upon her when she stopped using her middle name.
 
345

345

Member
Oct 30, 2017
7,379
and yeah, the intrusive r only happens in the middle of sentences before vowels. if you ask a british person who was elected US president in 2008, they're not going to say "barack obamar", but they might say "obamaris an american politician".
 
Trigonometrize

Trigonometrize

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,143
When I walk into the first day of class and the professor says "idea-er" instead of "idea" my whole semester is ruined.
 
Navidson REC

Navidson REC

Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,425
V23 said:
It's also spelled 'inTernet' but most Americans say "innernet".
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Yeah, this is why I love phonetics. The English language is super weird and inconsistent, no matter which accent. The GenAm flapped /t/ can be super confusing to language learners also.

And, I mean, let's not even talk about the pronunciation of "-ough".
 
Sanctuary

Sanctuary

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,226
Cheesebu said:
So I've been watching some British TV and I was curious about something. Occasionally when a word ends with an A, it will be pronounced er instead.

An example of this is in Wild China. Every once in a while the guy will say Chiner instead of China. It seems like it's possibly when the next word starts with a vowel. Is there a reason for this?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Heard this all of the time on The Vampire Diaries. Klaus always pronounced Rebecca as Rebeccer.
 
Eren Jäger

Eren Jäger

Member
Jul 19, 2020
765
Ze_Shoopuf said:
I'm also bemused when I hear in the UK something like "I'm gavering on Fursdays".

Like, you know it's spelled "gathering" and "Thursdays", right?
Click to expand...
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Note: I'm neither a Brit nor a native English speaker. I just have a casual interest in languages and how languages change.

Someone already commented that this is a case of th-fronting, but I would like to add that it's spreading relative fast all over England, Scotland and New Zealand in the (not so) young age group.
In fact, the th-sounds, which are dental fricatives, are quite rare among the languages of the world and not easy to pronounce. Only European Spanish, Icelandic, Albanian, Welsh and Greek have them. German had these sound, but lost them during the High German Consonant Shift, which resulted in a /d/.
Some interesting discussions/facts about this (totally non-scientific, of course):

https://www.reddit.com/r/linguistic...ome_ongoing_sound_changes_in_english/e0tgk4y/

https://www.babbel.com/en/magazine/th-fronting

Regarding your last sentence:
1) orthography always reflects the pronunciation of the past (take the now silent k in knight as example)
2) English is a polycentric language, ie. not one standard exist from which errors can be made
3) people speak as they please, writing is just a representation. Otherwise, languages wouldn't have evolved and would not evolve in the future.
 
Calderc

Calderc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,964
Americans in here giving it the big one while completely bastardising the English language lmao
 
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Rotobit

Rotobit

Editor at Nintendo Wire
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
10,196
honestly I see myself subtracting "er" more than adding it. You Americans don't want to hear how some people say "water" in this country.

Then again I'm from Cumbria which is the most baffling melting pot of accents
 
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