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Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night | Official Update Thread

Vamphuntr

Vamphuntr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,301
I backed this at the lower tier and I'm super happy it's finally releasing and that the game could happen. I don't care much about exclusive DLC or whatever I don't get. As for promo items like the steelbook this is more an issue with the fact they've used the Kickstarter as a stepping stone to get a publisher. It's kind of obvious that they would need to make special promotional items for the physical release for the publisher. So the set of items you get is obviously different than the one offered with the 505 release.
 
AztecComplex

AztecComplex

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,371
DraganBlack said:
Angel Corlux posted the following in Discord about the Backer DLC/Steelcase Situation:


Future non backer customers have to pay:

$40 for the game
$10 for the DLC
$10 for the OST

And they don't get anything else that's special/exclusive

The $60 backers instead get:

Game ($40 value)
Curse of the moon ($10 value)
OST and retro booklet or slipcase ($10 value)
DLC ($10 value)

So a total value of $70

$60 Kickstarter backers get $10 more hard value than future purchasers strictly speaking

Regarding the steel cases, we have a duty to promote the game, and to incentivize preorders at retail. Originally they wanted me to peel off content so I was like "lol no", and the compromise was a limited run of these steel cases. After the fact, I still didn't like this compromise so I reached out to my internal teams at 505 and got them to arrange 800 surplus units from around the world to be sent to Fangamer. These will be sold first come, first serve, 1 per backer maximum.

However, I'm also currently investigating doing survey / taking orders and selling them to anyone who wants them, among the backers exclusively. This is difficult to accomplish because of logistics, bandwidth (launch is coming....) and the exclusivity that was offered to retailers.

Once I am able to (or not) I will let everyone know.

I will be communicating all of this in upcoming messaging, but feel free to copy paste this. Hope that clears things up a bit.
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I don't see why anyone should have a problem with this but, alas, this is the internet. You could give a bag of gold to someone and they'll complain the free bag of gold is too heavy to carry.
Mauricio_Magus said:
I backed the game because I wanted to show the world that people still want games like this.

I could not give less of a crap if they even give the DLC for free, also it's money I spent YEARS ago so it almost feels like I'm getting the game for free in 2019.
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You——————> Nail ——————> Head
 
MegaXZero

MegaXZero

One Winged Slayer
Member
Jun 21, 2018
5,079
Couldn't care less if the DLC is released to everyone. I backed this game years ago, I just want it to be good and play it.
 
Muffin Awesome

Muffin Awesome

Member
Oct 30, 2017
908
So I got the 60$ switch edition, from fangamer . Have any updates been sent out recently, first kickstarted buy here.
 
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Ishmae1

Ishmae1

Creative Director, Microsoft
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
539
Seattle, WA
FreezePeach said:
And some people believe it or not value thw money they spend on backing games and if tbey dont need to pay extra they wont becuase they either cant afford it or for a variety of other completely legitimate reasons anyone spending money can have.

This excusing of straight up lying is corporatist schilling at its finest. If people dont hold them to task for being dishoneat and doing shitty things then it gets worse.
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Ignoring the accusations...

KS projects have no guarantee of success. "Valuing your money backing games" is a contradiction. Backing a game is a total risk on KS. You don't value that money at all if you back a game there. There's no completion bonds, no investment security, if the project doesn't work out, you get nothing. If value is truly your principal, it would mean you should wait for the game to be done (if that happens at all) and then on sale, and then buy it if you're that price-sensitive for something that was a risk in the first place.

KS isn't a pre-order plan, it's a (most times risky) funding opportunity to put money towards a dream idea you'd like to see manifest.

The text being wrong or misleading or just false is bad on them, yes 100% agreed. Using KS to find cheap game deals is bad on you, however.
 
BlueManifest

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,330
Preordered switch version at Best Buy and got the metal case plus my Gamers club discount

Is the switch the only one with metal case?
 
Barry Sandwich

Barry Sandwich

Banned
Nov 18, 2017
2,932
Ishmae1 said:
The text being wrong or misleading or just false is bad on them, yes 100% agreed. Using KS to find cheap game deals is bad on you, however.
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Expecting the agreed value proposition of the tier you paid at isn't the same as looking for a cheap deal.

The Discord post values the DLC at $10, when at time of backing it was valued as part of a $32 additional bundle on top of the previous tier.

Obviously backers got a good deal overall with Curse of the Moon, OST and the slipcase etc. I don't feel short changed in the slightest.
 
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Wereroku

Wereroku

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,244
Well there goes the theory that they didn't know about the steel books. Judging by his tone in that message they have no intention of making more steel books. Also have no clue what the upcoming release would have to do with another company making more steel books. Eh will just teach me not to back anything 505 have their game in again.
 
Ultimadrago

Ultimadrago

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,142
Barry Sandwich said:
As benevolent and generous as it may be for some high level backers to want to share the exclusive content with everyone, that position isn't actually the reasonable one from a consumer rights perspective.

Company: Support our game for $30!
Backer A: Yes!
Company: Give us $60, we'll give you something time limited and exclusive.
Backer A: Ok I support you guys and will up my pledge for this exclusive content.

Company: Jokes! Everyone else can have the game and exclusive content for, $40-50 whether they supported us or not! Plus they can get a $15 exclusive steelbook.
Backer A: Wait, but... what about?
Backer B: Oh you foolish elitist. I paid $1,000 out of love, and think nothing should be exclusive so stop trying to take things from people, you've had enough value for your $60.

Company: Thanks Backer B! See... you all wanted this! Thanks for giving us permission to backtrack on this one!
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Agreed, if you're okay with the paid DLC generally speaking it's whatever, but these defenses never make sense. As someone that doesn't really mind it, backers that do mind have every right to combat it.
 
AztecComplex

AztecComplex

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,371
Ultimadrago said:
Agreed, if you're okay with the paid DLC generally speaking it's whatever, but these defenses never make sense. As someone that doesn't really mind it, backers that do mind have every right to combat it.
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They have the right to combat it but it's so fucking petty. I only want what's best for this game regardless of me being a $125 backer. I want it to succeed financially as well as critically and i think offering a $10 dlc for everyone instead of nothing in favor of appeasing a vocal minority of backers betters the chances for this game to succeed (because this game still needs to sell a ton to non backers to be a success) then so be it.

My want for a Bloodstained 2 is way bigger than any pettiness I may have about wanting my super exclusive backer only boss fight and weapon, for chrissakes.
Ishmae1 said:
Ignoring the accusations...

KS projects have no guarantee of success. "Valuing your money backing games" is a contradiction. Backing a game is a total risk on KS. You don't value that money at all if you back a game there. There's no completion bonds, no investment security, if the project doesn't work out, you get nothing. If value is truly your principal, it would mean you should wait for the game to be done (if that happens at all) and then on sale, and then buy it if you're that price-sensitive for something that was a risk in the first place.

KS isn't a pre-order plan, it's a (most times risky) funding opportunity to put money towards a dream idea you'd like to see manifest.

The text being wrong or misleading or just false is bad on them, yes 100% agreed. Using KS to find cheap game deals is bad on you, however.
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Quoting for exposure. This is a creative director at Microsoft. I think he knows what he's talking about.
 
FreezePeach

FreezePeach

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,811
Ishmae1 said:
Ignoring the accusations...

KS projects have no guarantee of success. "Valuing your money backing games" is a contradiction. Backing a game is a total risk on KS. You don't value that money at all if you back a game there. There's no completion bonds, no investment security, if the project doesn't work out, you get nothing. If value is truly your principal, it would mean you should wait for the game to be done (if that happens at all) and then on sale, and then buy it if you're that price-sensitive for something that was a risk in the first place.

KS isn't a pre-order plan, it's a (most times risky) funding opportunity to put money towards a dream idea you'd like to see manifest.

The text being wrong or misleading or just false is bad on them, yes 100% agreed. Using KS to find cheap game deals is bad on you, however.
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And yet all evidence of every game i backed on ks and fig points to the contrary that at launch, i in fact got a good deal. So um yeah. Being well aware of the risk of a project failing is a bit different from it succeeding and them changing their terms of an upgrade dlc. I think this is the only game i backed where im paying more than the retail price and only did that for the exclusive dlc, hence the obvious criticisms of their handling.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
I mean, the 28 dollar tier also got Curse of the Moon free of charge, right? Basically it's 32 dollars more for the special digital backer edition. 10 bucks for the no longer exclusive content, so 22 bucks for a pdf and a digital soundtrack (or a slipcase and physical instead of digital). If you came right out with that in the beginning how many would have downgraded their pledges?
 
Ardiloso

Ardiloso

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,368
Brazil
So people who bought a content first are so entitled they are outraged because other people will be able to buy it too.
Amusing.
 
FreezePeach

FreezePeach

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,811
Ardiloso said:
So people who bought a content first are so entitled they are outraged because other people will be able to buy it too.
Amusing.
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No, if you've bothered to read you would see people seem upset with a physical issue that i cant speak to, and the dlc they sold at a 32$ premium during the campaign as the only way to get that content. I only upgraded to 60$ after it was very successful and they were saying you couldnt buy it after. I honestly would not even have been bothered to respond if the news was they are offering a 60$ special edition which contained the DLC they first said would be backer only. I really wouldnt have cared. I never participated in a poll because i didnt know about it but from what i hear the poll from everyone actually decided on that.

They went with just deciding they were gonna say 'oh well' to the people that spent way more than they needed so they can sell it separately for 10$.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
That steel case might be more exclusive than the slipcover, I wonder how many they produced. And then they shamelessly feature and gush about it in the update, while the slipcover is nowhere to be seen. If they just showed the slipcover and gushed about it I wonder if it would have quelled at least some of this reaction.
 
Ardiloso

Ardiloso

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,368
Brazil
FreezePeach said:
No, if you've bothered to read you would see people seem upset with a physical issue that i cant speak to, and the dlc they sold at a 32$ premium during the campaign as the only way to get that content. I only upgraded to 60$ after it was very successful and they were saying you couldnt buy it after. I honestly would not even have been bothered to respond if the news was they are offering a 60$ special edition which contained the DLC they first said would be backer only. I really wouldnt have cared. I never participated in a poll because i didnt know about it but from what i hear the poll from everyone actually decided on that.

They went with just deciding they were gonna say 'oh well' to the people that spent way more than they needed so they can sell it separately for 10$.
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I backed the 60 usd tier too but I don't give a rat ass about what they are selling now. I backed because I wanted to show support and play a new Igavania but this is just me.
 
Aftervirtue

Aftervirtue

Banned
Nov 13, 2017
1,616
As a day one backer for the $150 tier, who wished he had the money for the $300 tier.... I give no fucks about exclusive access. If anything I'm opposed to it from a game preservation perspective. For every Kickstarter you stumble upon there are countless people who don't know about or cannot afford to back at the time.

But I want that steelcase.... As a day one backer if I miss out on opportunity to get that, I'll be fucking pissed/sad/disappointed. They should do their best to have an option for backers and if they could somehow get IGA to sign them..... (just saying Aztec).... that would be amazing.
 
BlueManifest

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,330
Can someone explain the IGA boss to me, is it dlc or it available day one in the base game? Or is it dlc that's available day one as a separate purchase?
 
MegaXZero

MegaXZero

One Winged Slayer
Member
Jun 21, 2018
5,079
Ishmae1 said:
Ignoring the accusations...

KS projects have no guarantee of success. "Valuing your money backing games" is a contradiction. Backing a game is a total risk on KS. You don't value that money at all if you back a game there. There's no completion bonds, no investment security, if the project doesn't work out, you get nothing. If value is truly your principal, it would mean you should wait for the game to be done (if that happens at all) and then on sale, and then buy it if you're that price-sensitive for something that was a risk in the first place.

KS isn't a pre-order plan, it's a (most times risky) funding opportunity to put money towards a dream idea you'd like to see manifest.

The text being wrong or misleading or just false is bad on them, yes 100% agreed. Using KS to find cheap game deals is bad on you, however.
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Pretty damn good post.
 
Wereroku

Wereroku

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,244
mrmoose said:
That steel case might be more exclusive than the slipcover, I wonder how many they produced. And then they shamelessly feature and gush about it in the update, while the slipcover is nowhere to be seen. If they just showed the slipcover and gushed about it I wonder if it would have quelled at least some of this reaction.
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When I asked they said they didn't plan to show the slipcase at all until release. Also that it had just been approved today.
 
Mr_Antimatter

Mr_Antimatter

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,571
They might be in a rough spot where they'd love to get more of them for sale, but that risks pissing bestbuy off as they no longer have their exclusive.

I wonder if they couldn't just make and offer a different steelcase.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
Wereroku said:
When I asked they said they didn't plan to show the slipcase at all until release. Also that it had just been approved today.
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Wait, so is it not coming along with the actual case and game when they ship it? It's going to be with the other extras at a later undefined date?

The funny thing is, there's an exclusive PS4 theme if you preorder digitally, and nobody is up in arms, because it's just a PS4 theme.
 
ArjanN

ArjanN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,114
As a backer I have no issue with them selling the exclusive DLC stuff, IMO that's preferable to it not being available later.
 
VariantX

VariantX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,890
Columbia, SC
Ishmae1 said:
Ignoring the accusations...

KS projects have no guarantee of success. "Valuing your money backing games" is a contradiction. Backing a game is a total risk on KS. You don't value that money at all if you back a game there. There's no completion bonds, no investment security, if the project doesn't work out, you get nothing. If value is truly your principal, it would mean you should wait for the game to be done (if that happens at all) and then on sale, and then buy it if you're that price-sensitive for something that was a risk in the first place.

KS isn't a pre-order plan, it's a (most times risky) funding opportunity to put money towards a dream idea you'd like to see manifest.

The text being wrong or misleading or just false is bad on them, yes 100% agreed. Using KS to find cheap game deals is bad on you, however.
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Yep. Its a total risk. You're giving the money in the first place to get the game made at all. If you want to treat it like a pre-order, then don't back any future crowd funding projects because that simply not what they are.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
It is a total risk, it's not guaranteed, I get it. If they came out and said "hey, you know all that physical stuff we promised you? Yeah, we're not doing it. You pledged 300 bucks for an autograph by Koji Igarashi, well, here's a napkin I had my son sign." there probably would be little you could do about it, but I bet the sentiment here and elsewhere would be pretty one sided. I'm not sure how wanting what was promised makes the backers entitled.
 
BlueManifest

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,330
The Kickstarter update doesn't say anything about the harder difficulties being available day 1 or later? I don't see it mentioned anywhere in the update
 
Wereroku

Wereroku

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,244
mrmoose said:
Wait, so is it not coming along with the actual case and game when they ship it? It's going to be with the other extras at a later undefined date?

The funny thing is, there's an exclusive PS4 theme if you preorder digitally, and nobody is up in arms, because it's just a PS4 theme.
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No clue they said they want to keep something as a surprise. Seems like it will be ready for shipping from the way they talked.

Actually digital backers already get the theme and they are trying to get it for physical backers. The only thing they are having trouble with is the steel book.

Mr_Antimatter said:
They might be in a rough spot where they'd love to get more of them for sale, but that risks pissing bestbuy off as they no longer have their exclusive.

I wonder if they couldn't just make and offer a different steelcase.
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They are saying the timing is an issue as well so I doubt approving a whole new design is any more feasible. What's funny is they knew it was going to cause issues otherwise they wouldn't have even tried to get the 800 they did. Apparently originally best buy wanted an exclusive costume this was the counter offer. I doubt they will be allowed another run.
 
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mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
Wereroku said:
No clue they said they want to keep something as a surprise. Seems like it will be ready for shipping from the way they talked.

Actually digital backers already get the theme and they are trying to get it for physical backers. The only thing they are having trouble with is the steel book.
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Oh, I have the switch version backed so I didn't realize they were giving the theme to backers. That's cool.
 
Rob

Rob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,081
SATX
I have a PS4 copy coming of the game, but I think I'm going to keep that sealed and just buy a Steam copy+DLC.
 
Mr_Antimatter

Mr_Antimatter

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,571
Would love the PS4 theme.

Also the KS comments are hilarious now. Apparently the dlc not being 100% exclusive means 505 committed fraud and everyone should just pirate the game.
 
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Wereroku

Wereroku

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,244
mrmoose said:
Did they say this somewhere? Because usually those preorder bonuses are only if you preorder through PSN, I'm not sure if it comes by default with all digital codes.
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Yep said it in the discord. The ps4 digital backer keys come with it and they were working in getting it for the PS4 physical folks.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
AztecComplex said:
Fucking imbeciles threanting outright theft. Talk about a tantrum. Fuck them.
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To give it context, it's because of this part of the update:

As someone who's pirated games because of bull**** anti-consumer practices, or as a demo to try and then buy (something largely made obsolete by modern refund systems), I wanted to eliminate as many reasons to pirate Bloodstained as possible. All of the above = the "Iga's Back Pack" DLC. Hope that makes sense. I understand that not everyone will be 100% happy with this decision, but hopefully this helps in understanding the reasoning behind it. And of course all backers entitled to this content will receive the DLC for free.
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Roberto is basically saying one of the main reasons to make the formerly exclusive DLC free is because if it weren't people would pirate it. In saying that, he admits that he's pirated because of what he considers BS anti-consumer practices. People are joking (I hope) saying that this situation is an anti-consumer practice that justifies pirating using this logic.

That's just a really weird paragraph to put into an official update notification, but that's what he put.

I mean, these are people that backed the project, there's no reason for them to pirate the game.
 
AztecComplex

AztecComplex

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,371
mrmoose said:
To give it context, it's because of this part of the update:



Roberto is basically saying one of the main reasons to make the formerly exclusive DLC free is because if it weren't people would pirate it. In saying that, he admits that he's pirated because of what he considers BS anti-consumer practices. People are joking (I hope) saying that this situation is an anti-consumer practice that justifies pirating using this logic.

That's just a really weird paragraph to put into an official update notification, but that's what he put.

I mean, these are people that backed the project, there's no reason for them to pirate the game.
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Yes that was definitey a very weird paragraph. It stood out like a sore thumb when I read it this morning. Did the publisher's brand manager just admitted to pirating games and justified it? Yes he did. He could've said the part about wanting to reduce as muchboiracy as possible without admitting to pirating himself and giving a justification for it.

Needless to say that wasn't handled well. But it's even worse whoever is saying they will pirate this game because of a stupid dlc being able to be purchased by anyone.
 
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