Blizzard Is Pathetic (The Jimquisition)

[TheGhost]

They should have revoked all the bans like Jeff Kaplan said. It's contradictory to call your games and your company a safe space for speech while punishing people for speaking out against oppressive governments.

I understand that JAB is nothing more than a figurehead. He doesn't have a board seat and he's not the CEO. Mike Morhaime appeared to actually have some power and commanded a board seat. It's very clear that all of this came directly from the board. I'm not trying to absolve Blizzard's leadership, but aside from quitting in protest (which I personally do not expect anyone to do, even if I do respect the act if it happens), no one within their leadership team has the power to say anything else.

I guess it's really semantics who you want to put this on. You can blame Blizzard as a subsidiary of Activision, but really this is on Activision's board for being spineless. I still cancelled my wow sub and have no intention of buying blizzard games in the near future (becoming free of Activision and doing a complete 180 might get me to consider it).

Click to shrink...

Unfortunately....they can't pull a Bungie and break free of Activision. Because they are Activision.

There was only like 15-20 protesters at Blizzcon (outside the venue)
JaB basically told the audience to go engage with those people and have discourse. That's the best he can do.

I'm curious to know how Morheim would have handled it or Metzen if he was still there

 

[TheRuralJuror]

I'm not going to admit anything because thats not true. I'm on a gaming forum.. here to talk about gaming, and was directly responding to the quote in the OP.

Click to shrink...

Did the quote in the OP ask if you were still buying diablo 4 or is this just a sorry attempt at excusing what was a pointless post? I've never understood the thought behind coming to topics where something is being criticized solely to let others know you're still buying it. I don't care that you're buying whatever and yes this is a video game forum, but coming to basically say you're buying without adding anything else is some straight troll shit and not a good look, imo.

It's sad that the first couple of posts had to be this obnoxious nonsense.

 

[NeroPaige]

Ya but I'm still gonna get Diablo 4!

Click to shrink...

Don't forget Overwatch 2! So hyped for it!

Click to shrink...

I loled too much at these.

 

[Raccoon]

then it's fair to say they care about their entertainment more than they care about the cause in question.

Click to shrink...

Yes, but the cause in question is not human rights. It is instead whether performers (in this case, the tournament participants who were banned) should be free to espouse political views (such as those pertaining to human rights), even if it's at the expense of their employer. Blizzard has plainly communicated that they believe it is their right to protect their bottom line and punish political speech at their events. That, and that alone, is the cause at hand. It is logically reductive to say that "the cause at hand" is human rights outright because, as far as I'm aware, Blizzard has not committed any human rights violations.

 

[Log!]

I'm surprised nobody has brought up the fact that Blizzard is seemingly more okay with homophobia - they only banned xQc for two weeks for his comments - than they are about supporting a fucking human rights movement.

 

[Deleted member 8593]

I'm surprised nobody has brought up the fact that Blizzard is seemingly more okay with homophobia - they only banned xQc for two weeks for his comments - than they are about supporting a fucking human rights movement.

Click to shrink...

That makes buying Overwatch 2 and Diablo IV all the sweeter for some people.

 

[SugarNoodles]

Satire? Nope. I'm gonna support the devs who work their asses off on Diablo 4 and because I enjoy Diablo. Not everyone at blizzard is involved with the Hong Kong incident.

Click to shrink...

Did the devs that got laid off earlier this year just not work their asses off hard enough?

 

[Acidote]

Don't forget that just by playing their games, even if you already own them or are F2P games, you are supporting the company. You are providing a playerbase for others to spend money on the games.

And I say that as someone who's gonna keep buying and playing their games even though I don't like how they're handling all this stuff.

 

[Ashlette]

Did actblizzard give a reason why they banned a homophobe less harshly than a human rights activist?

 

[Deleted member 46948]

Where was your phone built or should I say "assembled"?

Click to shrink...

My phone was very likely still built in China, since it's 2 years old Note 8, but I'll continue buying Samsung since they closed their last factories in China recently.

 

[residentgrigo]

Has Jim ever mentioned that Bobby Kotick has confirmed connections to Jeffery Epstein? That´s the ActiBlizz CEO for you. What a lovely company with lovely values.

 

[Lobster Roll]

Satire? Nope. I'm gonna support the devs who work their asses off on Diablo 4 and because I enjoy Diablo. Not everyone at blizzard is involved with the Hong Kong incident.

Click to shrink...

Can we collectively, as a forum, stop throwing around the "devs worked hard" argument? It's a justification that was created by corporate apologists & bootlickers eons ago to shield every corporation on the planet from criticism, sanctions, fines, etc.

"You can't shut down the company for hundreds of millions of tax fraud, what about the factory workers who need to pay rent?"
"Yeah, the entire board of directors is guilty of deceptive and abusive practices, but what about the rideshare driver trying to make ends meet?"
"Sure, Nestle is committing horrific acts around the globe, but I personally know a production line manager who has nothing to do with any of that!"

Blah, blah, blah.

 

[Deleted member 1003]

Yes, but the cause in question is not human rights. It is instead whether performers (in this case, the tournament participants who were banned) should be free to espouse political views (such as those pertaining to human rights), even if it's at the expense of their employer. Blizzard has plainly communicated that they believe it is their right to protect their bottom line and punish political speech at their events. That, and that alone, is the cause at hand. It is logically reductive to say that "the cause at hand" is human rights outright because, as far as I'm aware, Blizzard has not committed any human rights violations.

Click to shrink...

This exactly. Blizzard isn't killing folks for their organs or tamping down on people freedom's in their daily lives. They simply banned folks from playing a game while expressing their beliefs.

Blizzard is hypocritical but they aren't violating human rights (playing videogames is not a human right).

 

[SugarNoodles]

So apparently an Overwatch player only received a month long ban for homophobic speech. Yet here we are with Blitzchung sitting on a 6 month ban after reduction of the original ban, numerous apologies and the VP of Blizzard himself saying he wants Blitzchung's ban washed away. Fuck this company and it's miserable sheep who are willing to sell out their own rights to play a video game. A foreign whiny bitch baby dictator is controlling what content free countries are allowed to have and who is allowed to talk on a free country's platform. "but at least I get to play Diablo 4" Fuck off.

Click to shrink...

Which makes it even worse that J Allen Brack was wearing a pride pin while he delivered his non apology.

Pride was a fucking riot where trans women of color started throwing bricks at police officers. Wearing that pin while licking the boots of a police state is fucking shameful.

 

[Anoregon]

Did the devs that got laid off earlier this year just not work their asses off hard enough?

Click to shrink...

Not super relevant, but wasn't that big round of Acti-blizz layoff focused almost entirely on non-developer positions? Stuff like e-sports support, marketing, etc. I believe that's what the reporting at the time was saying, at least.

 

[Deleted member 46948]

Yes, but the cause in question is not human rights. It is instead whether performers (in this case, the tournament participants who were banned) should be free to espouse political views (such as those pertaining to human rights), even if it's at the expense of their employer. Blizzard has plainly communicated that they believe it is their right to protect their bottom line and punish political speech at their events. That, and that alone, is the cause at hand. It is logically reductive to say that "the cause at hand" is human rights outright because, as far as I'm aware, Blizzard has not committed any human rights violations.

Click to shrink...

Sure, that's a valid way to look at it. I don't agree, but I can see how you could technically see it that way, if you wanted to feel better about buying Blizzard games. Whatever works for you, I'm not judging, just wanted the poster to stop hiding behind bullshit.

 

[SugarNoodles]

Not super relevant, but wasn't that big round of Acti-blizz layoff focused almost entirely on non-developer positions? Stuff like e-sports support, marketing, etc. I believe that's what the reporting at the time was saying, at least.

Click to shrink...

Agreed, not relevant.

 

[residentgrigo]

Not super relevant, but wasn't that big round of Acti-blizz layoff focused almost entirely on non-developer positions? Stuff like e-sports support, marketing, etc. I believe that's what the reporting at the time was saying, at least.

Click to shrink...

https://www.polygon.com/2019/2/16/18226581/activision-blizzard-layoffs-executive-pay-unions

 

[Serule]

Ya but I'm still gonna get Diablo 4!

Click to shrink...

Fuck blizzard. I have more games in my backlog than I can finish in my lifetime; I don't need theirs.

 

[sandweed]

So apparently an Overwatch player only received a month long ban for homophobic speech. Yet here we are with Blitzchung sitting on a 6 month ban after reduction of the original ban, numerous apologies and the VP of Blizzard himself saying he wants Blitzchung's ban washed away. Fuck this company and it's miserable sheep who are willing to sell out their own rights to play a video game. A foreign whiny bitch baby dictator is controlling what content free countries are allowed to have and who is allowed to talk on a free country's platform. "but at least I get to play Diablo 4" Fuck off.

Click to shrink...

Woke Corporations will never be your friends.

 

[Raccoon]

Sure, that's a valid way to look at it. I don't agree, but I can see how you could technically see it that way, if you wanted to feel better about buying Blizzard games. Whatever works for you, I'm not judging, just wanted the poster to stop hiding behind bullshit.

Click to shrink...

oh yeah absolutely there's no way the guy who conveniently popped in to "talk about gaming" isn't a troll

IMO the real moral of the story is that we all need to participate in political activism to compel our governments to oppose the corrupt nation that basically owns the world with strong regulation and government sanctions. While admirable, we cannot presume the onus of opposing china falls on consumers, as it's just not practical.

 

[Reinhard]

4 or 5 years is a long time, maybe Blizzard's policies will have changed by the time Diablo 4 comes out. But with their toothless apology, I'm for sure passing on Overwatch 2 which might actually come out in 2020 or early 2021.

 

[JimD]

Yes, but the cause in question is not human rights. It is instead whether performers (in this case, the tournament participants who were banned) should be free to espouse political views (such as those pertaining to human rights), even if it's at the expense of their employer. Blizzard has plainly communicated that they believe it is their right to protect their bottom line and punish political speech at their events. That, and that alone, is the cause at hand. It is logically reductive to say that "the cause at hand" is human rights outright because, as far as I'm aware, Blizzard has not committed any human rights violations.

Click to shrink...

It's not logically reductive at all. The topic of this thread is a video in which a central argument from Jim is that Blizzard is still actively suspending Blitzchung and that an apology that doesn't address that is "pathetic." That active suspension that they continue to uphold isn't just a suppression of political speech to protect their bottom line, it IS political speech. Blizzard is using their political speech to support a regime that commits human rights violations (preemptive response to whataboutism: No, that doesn't ignore the many, many other regimes around the world who commit human rights violations). Just because their primary motivation for doing so is profit-motivated doesn't mean they can't be called out for the end result of their ongoing actions.

This isn't just a thread talking about Diablo 4, it's a thread talking specifically about the criticism of Blizzard in the video. Posting that you're still going to buy the game anyway is making a direct correction to ignoring their support of the regime. People reacting negatively to that kind of sentiment is certainly on topic.

 

[Deleted member 8852]

Fuck Blizzard, I'm sure in their minds they've managed to PR/hype their fuckups under the carpet but I haven't forgotten.

I will re-evaluate with upcoming games, but as it stands I'm not supporting them in any way.

 

[Raccoon]

It's not logically reductive at all. The topic of this thread is a video in which a central argument from Jim is that Blizzard is still actively suspending Blitzchung and that an apology that doesn't address that is "pathetic." That active suspension that they continue to uphold isn't just a suppression of political speech to protect their bottom line, it IS political speech. Blizzard is using their political speech to support a regime that commits human rights violations (preemptive response to whataboutism: No, that doesn't ignore the many, many other regimes around the world who commit human rights violations). Just because their primary motivation for doing so is profit-motivated doesn't mean they can't be called out for the end result of their ongoing actions.

This isn't just a thread talking about Diablo 4, it's a thread talking specifically about the criticism of Blizzard in the video. Posting that you're still going to buy the game anyway is making a direct correction to ignoring their support of the regime. People reacting negatively to that kind of sentiment is certainly on topic.

Click to shrink...

Yes, and everything you're saying I agree with; I'm making the very narrow argument that buying a Blizzard game does not mean you value entertainment more than human rights. It can (and imo does) mean that you value entertainment more than a corporation's public relationship with human rights issues. Whether those are the same thing to you is your own business (to which I think there is no invalid conclusion), but surely you'd agree that this jump (edit: or at least step) is (edit: at least somewhat) reductive.

To be absolutely clear, I certainly don't advocate for the thread's obvious troll.

Spoiler

(I advocate for Hobbes dammit)

 

[Anoregon]

4 or 5 years is a long time, maybe Blizzard's policies will have changed by the time Diablo 4 comes out. But with their toothless apology, I'm for sure passing on Overwatch 2 which might actually come out in 2020 or early 2021.

Click to shrink...

A lot can happen/change in a few years, but I doubt Acti-blizz's overall goals/policy towards making as much money in China will be one of those things. Kotick don't give a fuck.

 

[Coyote Starrk]

Blizzard won't be getting any money from me anytime soon, but the video that was put out in response by T&E on YouTube really changed the way I view the situation surrounding Hong Kong and Blizzard. I thought Tali raised a few good points even though I don't agree with him on some others.

Link for anyone interested in it btw.





So Blizzard won't be getting my money anytime soon at least, but I don't think I am gonna be done with them forever. Not sure when I will go back to Overwatch or WoW though.

 

[Deleted member 56752]

EVERYTHING IS AWFUL! Tbh tho I agree that this take needs to happen. This take matters.

 

[Deleted member 18944]

(I advocate for @Hobbes dammit)

Click to shrink...

<3

 

[fanboi]

I find it strange that Blizzard gotten so much heat due to this compared to, let say, Google and the like (who did way more nefarious shit IIRC).

 

[Iori Fuyusaka]

Blizzard won't be getting any money from me anytime soon

Click to shrink...

Except for Modern Warfare, right?

 

[rsfour]

Except for Modern Warfare, right?

Click to shrink...

oh shit

 

[Coyote Starrk]

Except for Modern Warfare, right?

Click to shrink...

Yeah I'm not gonna lie when I bought CoD I completely forgot that ActiBlizz was a thing. I felt really stupid afterwards when my buddy reminded me.

But I still cancelled my WoW sub that I had just got before the HK situation because i was gonna dive into Classic and i also uninstalled Overwatch. And i have no idea when I will be going back to them.


Solid attempt at a gotcha though. A for effort.

 

[8byte]

You're not doing them any favors by supporting the company they work for when, by several accounts, even the employees aren't exactly happy with the direction it's taking. But honestly, just admit that human rights aren't as important for you as entertainment, that's fair.

Click to shrink...

Life isn't this black and white. This is an unfair statement to make, and frankly has some really gross undertones.

With this statement, you're also implying that people who are currently working for Blizzard ALSO don't care about human rights as much as...feeding their families? Your stance seems to be black and white, so using your logic here, anyone still working for Blizzard doesn't care about human rights, because they're still supporting the company through creating product (which is the job they have to support themselves or their family).

It's not a fair conclusion to say someone who buys a video game doesn't care about human rights. There are other ways to fight for human rights, and as much as anyone wants to believe it, Blizzard ultimately has zero impact on China or Hong Kong, politically, or their human rights. Boycotting Blizzard doesn't help Hong Kong, and Blizzard standing by Hong Kong doesn't help Hong Kong. It is okay to boycott, and it is okay to not boycott. It is not okay to tell someone they are oppressing other peoples through buying a video game.

Blizzards actions were and still are wrong, and reprehensible, but to reduce this to a black and white "you support human rights or you don't" is entirely unfair to a lot of people. There are better ways to have this discussion than to paint people as soulless villains who don't have empathy just because they buy a video game.

 

[SwitchedOff]

Blizzard did the best they can do given all the major players and moving pieces involved.

Will definitely still be picking up Diablo 4, those devs shouldn't be punished just because Blizzard China's arm is crazy. If the some of the protesters from outside blizzcon can enjoy the games inside blizzcon. If Blizz were ok withpro Hong Kong cosplay there. Well that's good enough for me.

Blitz Chung just got signed by Tempo Storm he will be fine. His return will be massive.

Click to shrink...

How about the casters, what is their status?

Quite honestly, I remain firm in my opinion of all this: Fuck Blizzard.

 

[Deleted member 46948]

Life isn't this black and white. This is an unfair statement to make, and frankly has some really gross undertones.

With this statement, you're also implying that people who are currently working for Blizzard ALSO don't care about human rights as much as...feeding their families? Your stance seems to be black and white, so using your logic here, anyone still working for Blizzard doesn't care about human rights, because they're still supporting the company through creating product (which is the job they have to support themselves or their family).

It's not a fair conclusion to say someone who buys a video game doesn't care about human rights. There are other ways to fight for human rights, and as much as anyone wants to believe it, Blizzard ultimately has zero impact on China or Hong Kong, politically, or their human rights. Boycotting Blizzard doesn't help Hong Kong, and Blizzard standing by Hong Kong doesn't help Hong Kong. It is okay to boycott, and it is okay to not boycott. It is not okay to tell someone they are oppressing other peoples through buying a video game.

Blizzards actions were and still are wrong, and reprehensible, but to reduce this to a black and white "you support human rights or you don't" is entirely unfair to a lot of people. There are better ways to have this discussion than to paint people as soulless villains who don't have empathy just because they buy a video game.

Click to shrink...

Well, I suggest you read my post again. Nowhere in it did I imply the employees don't care about human rights. Also it wasn't my intention at all to paint anyone as a soulless villain for buying a video game.
It doesn't take a lot of courage to say "I don't care about Blizzard doing this thing enough to deny myself entertainment", yet some are clearly unable to do it.

 

[Deleted member 46948]

I find it strange that Blizzard gotten so much heat due to this compared to, let say, Google and the like (who did way more nefarious shit IIRC).

Click to shrink...

Oh here we go with the whataboutism again.
Care to share you thoughts about Blizzard in a thread about, you know, Blizzard? We can talk about Google and Apple and NHL somewhere else. What do you say?

 

[Scuffed]

They really are. The only game they are making that is at all somewhat exciting is D4 and that is so far off that who even knows what it will look like when it's finished.

 

[fanboi]

Oh here we go with the whataboutism again.
Care to share you thoughts about Blizzard in a thread about, you know, Blizzard? We can talk about Google and Apple and NHL somewhere else. What do you say?

Click to shrink...

it isn't about them it is about how much flak and coverage this has gotten compared to others here in era and news outlets when you compare the different actions. I just find it interesting why that is (especially here).

 

[.exe]

Satire? Nope. I'm gonna support the devs who work their asses off on Diablo 4 and because I enjoy Diablo. Not everyone at blizzard is involved with the Hong Kong incident.

Click to shrink...

1. The developers working their asses off already got paid whether you buy their game or not. It isn't like they're given an IOU until the game's out. The only pockets you're lining are the top brass's.

2. Acti-Bliz treat their employees like expendable assets regardless of how successful their games are. Just look at this year's mass firings despite them doing record financial numbers.

I'm not hoping to change your mind, but I see this reasoning here and there, and I can't really agree with it personally.

 

[8byte]

Well, I suggest you read my post again. Nowhere in it did I imply the employees don't care about human rights. Also it wasn't my intention at all to paint anyone as a soulless villain for buying a video game.
It doesn't take a lot of courage to say "I don't care about Blizzard doing this thing enough to deny myself entertainment", yet some are clearly unable to do it.

Click to shrink...

Your point, as I read it, was that the poster didn't care as much about human rights as they did their entertainment because they're still going to buy the game, correct? So, in effect, supporting the company (in any manner) means you care more about personal gain than you do human rights. Correct me if I'm not following here.

Through that statement, it isn't a stretch to see the implication that any support for Blizzard is flag to wave saying "I don't value human rights". People who work there are supporting the company (not their actions or standing by them, but supporting the company in producing the product that will keep the company alive & profitable). Literally through the logic you've applied to that poster, you're saying any support of Blizzard is an admittance that human rights aren't important to that person.

It's not a fair statement to make, nor is it true in most cases. It is possible to support human rights and still be a consumer of products that may be in opposition to those beliefs. In fact, it is nearly IMPOSSIBLE to NOT support companies that deal with China. I'll wager you own a car, a phone, a computer, household appliances, clothes, and novelty accessories like headphones, alarm clocks, or any other number of things that almost certainly have materials, components, or labor that was sourced from China.

Yes, the poster you quoted was behaving in a manner that was childish and very clearly taunting people, and I'm not necessarily defending that person in particular. I am, however, defending the people who genuinely still want to support the employees who work hard on these games, or the employees themselves. Participating in consumerism doesn't make you a bad person who doesn't care about human rights, because frankly, almost none of us are ready to give up our creature comforts for TRUE human equality around the globe, and that is an absolute fact.

So yea, Blizzards corporate actions here are dog shit, and they deserve to get dragged for it, but lets not jump on people for just being consumers.

 

[Sandstar]

Am in the only one who's tired of him using pictures to illustrate everything he's talking about that's not a direct quote, or a shot of him? It's like he thinks we have ADHD, and need pictures to stay engaged with his content.

 

[Deleted member 46948]

it isn't about them it is about how much flak and coverage this has gotten compared to others here in era and news outlets when you compare the different actions. I just find it interesting why that is (especially here).

Click to shrink...

A lot of people on Era only read the gaming side.
A (formerly) beloved gaming company will always get more exposure on a gaming forum than Google.

 

[Sanctuary]

Ya but I'm still gonna get Diablo 4!

Click to shrink...

Same.

 

[Messofanego]

"Boycotting Blizzard doesn't help Hong Kong, and Blizzard standing by Hong Kong doesn't help Hong Kong."

This is disingenuous. And the latter is wrong. Standing by Hong Kong raises awareness to the cause, which does help.

 

[fanboi]

A lot of people on Era only reads the gaming side.
A (formerly) beloved gaming company will always get more exposure on a gaming forum than Google.

Click to shrink...

That is true but we still have the stadia thread and similar stuff going without this. Not that Blizzard deserves it, more how they got it more then the others. Might be that HK issue is currently hot news topic I guess.

 

[Deleted member 46948]

Your point, as I read it, was that the poster didn't care as much about human rights as they did their entertainment because they're still going to buy the game, correct? So, in effect, supporting the company (in any manner) means you care more about personal gain than you do human rights. Correct me if I'm not following here.

Click to shrink...

No.
Look, no one is saying you have to care at all, or that you have to care about this specific case, or that you have to show your activism through not buying Blizzard games. Maybe you do something that you see as more effective. Maybe you care about other issues. I can't know.
But coming into a thread like this with a first post saying "Yeah but I'm gonna buy Diablo IV anyway" means 1) you recognize the issue and 2) you've chosen to publicly state it doesn't matter enough to you to deny yourself entertainment (which cannot be by any means construed to be a thing you _need_).
In this light, no, it's not unfair.

 

[Serule]

it isn't about them it is about how much flak and coverage this has gotten compared to others here in era and news outlets when you compare the different actions. I just find it interesting why that is (especially here).

Click to shrink...

1- this is a gaming forum; gaming company will get more discussion
2 - nobody is shocked when giant tech company is evil. blizzard pretended to be good guys and did some progressive stuff, which made this feel more like a betrayal
3 - boycotting a gaming company is far more feasible than boycotting one of the tech giants
4 - who gives a shit; if you want to complain about apple or amazon or google, feel free to start a thread. Just because someone else is also evil doesnt mean Blizzard gets a free pass

 

[TheGhost]

How about the casters, what is their status?

Quite honestly, I remain firm in my opinion of all this: Fuck Blizzard.

Click to shrink...

I don't know who the casters are, I'm sure they can cast other games, but if you expect Blizzard to say fuck the Chinese government it's never going to happen.

 

[fanboi]

1- this is a gaming forum; gaming company will get more discussion
2 - nobody is shocked when giant tech company is evil. blizzard pretended to be good guys and did some progressive stuff, which made this feel more like a betrayal
3 - boycotting a gaming company is far more feasible than boycotting one of the tech giants
4 - who gives a shit; if you want to complain about apple or amazon or google, feel free to start a thread. Just because someone else is also evil doesnt mean Blizzard gets a free pass

Click to shrink...

4) where have I stated that?

And it isn't a complaint to them it is how Blizzard got the fire up there asses more then others. You listed some points which I can agree on.