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Big Brain Time: Is Trump’s presidency worth it if we get Bernie in 2020 instead of Hillary’s hypothetical 2nd term?
- Thread starter ToddBonzalez
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This is the cornerstone of accelerationism. Tons of people were arguing it in 2016, and I've almost ended decades-long friendships over it.
It is the ultimate endgame of the vocal anti-establishment types, be it pure-Greens or Paul-Sanders swing voters.
Controversial opinion: In some regards, YES
Trump is a silver lining. He has exposed the GOP for what it is, a bunch of racist, greedy pieces of shit. They've shown their true colors and intentions. They have nowhere to hide. If Democrats and progressives play their cards right, this could be the catalyst for a new beginning, finally ushering in the social and economic change we need to move foward.
Hillary would have effectively been an extension of Obama's center-left/ moderate policy and presidency. Everything at the surface level may have been okay, but there would be far more underlying hostility and bad blood brewing. The right wing would be even angrier and unhinged than they are now. Now imagine that entire base and movement, lead by a candidate who isn't a dumbass like Trump, who truly knows how to game the system.
Trump is a silver lining. He has exposed the GOP for what it is, a bunch of racist, greedy pieces of shit. They've shown their true colors and intentions. They have nowhere to hide. If Democrats and progressives play their cards right, this could be the catalyst for a new beginning, finally ushering in the social and economic change we need to move foward.
Hillary would have effectively been an extension of Obama's center-left/ moderate policy and presidency. Everything at the surface level may have been okay, but there would be far more underlying hostility and bad blood brewing. The right wing would be even angrier and unhinged than they are now. Now imagine that entire base and movement, lead by a candidate who isn't a dumbass like Trump, who truly knows how to game the system.
Small brain time
Of course not, but I also think you know that and your underlying intent here is to further anger those who are not fully won over by Bernie.
Of course not, but I also think you know that and your underlying intent here is to further anger those who are not fully won over by Bernie.
Hell no. He would have accomplished almost none of his agenda anyway, and 4 years of 'more of the same' from Hillary would have been a hell of a lot better than the clusterfuck that has been the Trump administration.
No.
A Trump presidency is going to lead to Trump 2.0 where we will seriously be at risk of having certain states becoming too dangerous to live in.
A Trump presidency has already helped trigger a cascade of global political parties adapting his regressive tactics and policies and ensures in the future Europe will fighting among each other, again.
A Trump presidency has basically set in motion a situation where Iran will become a definite nuclear power in a decade instead of theoretically one in 20-30 years depending on how we negotiated with them.
The only thing I have my doubts Clinton actually addressing any better than Trump is climate change. Not saying she wouldn't do anything. I'm saying she wouldn't take the problem seriously enough to mitigate its effects. Half assing climate initiatives is practically as worthless as doing nothing.
It's not worth it.
A Trump presidency is going to lead to Trump 2.0 where we will seriously be at risk of having certain states becoming too dangerous to live in.
A Trump presidency has already helped trigger a cascade of global political parties adapting his regressive tactics and policies and ensures in the future Europe will fighting among each other, again.
A Trump presidency has basically set in motion a situation where Iran will become a definite nuclear power in a decade instead of theoretically one in 20-30 years depending on how we negotiated with them.
The only thing I have my doubts Clinton actually addressing any better than Trump is climate change. Not saying she wouldn't do anything. I'm saying she wouldn't take the problem seriously enough to mitigate its effects. Half assing climate initiatives is practically as worthless as doing nothing.
It's not worth it.
Was it worth it to:
- lose 2 (maybe more) SCOTUS seats
- have the Charlottesville attack
- have kids in cages
- slow down action on climate change
- fucking over Puerto Rico
- boost the rise of the far-right all across the US and in the world
- normalizing fake news and anti-journalism
- and more fuckery that I can't be arsed to list right now
....Yeah gee I dunno! Bernie is that good you guys! /s
Seriously, how is anyone even entertaining the idea that Bernie is so magical that he'd be worth having had all of the above? Imagine telling this to everyone fucked over by that conservative SCOTUS or to the children in those cages or the parents of Heather Heyer or the Puerto Ricans affected by Maria, "yeah what Trump did was bad but it's OK, Bernie will make everything better now".
- lose 2 (maybe more) SCOTUS seats
- have the Charlottesville attack
- have kids in cages
- slow down action on climate change
- fucking over Puerto Rico
- boost the rise of the far-right all across the US and in the world
- normalizing fake news and anti-journalism
- and more fuckery that I can't be arsed to list right now
....Yeah gee I dunno! Bernie is that good you guys! /s
Seriously, how is anyone even entertaining the idea that Bernie is so magical that he'd be worth having had all of the above? Imagine telling this to everyone fucked over by that conservative SCOTUS or to the children in those cages or the parents of Heather Heyer or the Puerto Ricans affected by Maria, "yeah what Trump did was bad but it's OK, Bernie will make everything better now".
I don't understand how one could think it was. All the pain, suffering, oppression, hate crimes, and deaths are worth it to you if Bernie is President?
If Hillary won it'd be not as likely at least for a bit. The media narrative after the election would have been drastically different. Republicans would have to do something or show they're trying to do something after 3 straight losses. Just like Trump was kind of the answer to Romney not working, there'd be an answer to Trump not working.
This.
Fucking this.
Not to mention the stolen SCOTUS and the hundreds of federal judge seats.
Single-payer would be great if we get it, but the Trump presidency's damage to Puerto Rico and to an entire generation of refugees (not to mention an immensely effective campaign to pack the federal judiciary with archconservatives) is going to take decades to recover from.
I think the only way this counterfactual hypothetical makes any sense is if you make the extremely faulty assumption that there'd be absolutely no leftist mobilization or protest under a HRC presidency.
I think the only way this counterfactual hypothetical makes any sense is if you make the extremely faulty assumption that there'd be absolutely no leftist mobilization or protest under a HRC presidency.
No. Who knows what future monsters will spawn is Trump's wake. And even if he isn't a potential dark omen of things to come, it would take years/decades to undo his work. If Bernie wins, that doesn't mean the coming years won't still be hard.
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