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Biden Suggests Openness to Using Executive Action on Some Student Loan Debt.
- Thread starter ajszenk
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That doesn't sound very fair for people that consolidated their loans...
Yeah, at the same time since I have a lot of small loans with the federal government that I haven't consolidated, I hope I see the 10k used to eliminate the highest interest ones and not evenly distributed.
Oh he did, and it's totally worth it now. He's still in the early career phase where he's doing contract gigs but he's good for most of 2021, and has shipped an AAA game, of course junior level stuff.
thankfully he's still in TX at the moment so cost of living is lower than gigs in other places like California. I appreciate the feedback and advice!
Someone's always going to be burned in this. "Fairness" can only be a consideration up to a point. Do you give a rebate to people who paid off their loans? Do you focus on public or privately held loans? What about people in default? What about the people who take on loans going forward?
This is why any talk of student debt forgiveness has to be in addition to widespread education reform, as well as reforming adjacent financial structures.
I thought the gov't sites always said there were pros and cons to consolidating federal and private loans together, why I never did it, and especially since the fed loan forgiveness program seemed a bit strict with how to qualify.
He could basically do it all and starting day 1. It's backed up by law, and would not be a tyrant thing. It is wholly in scope of what they already do, and if people take issues with it then you point out how easily we allowed the executive to illegally boost its own power when it comes to vaporizing brown children half a world away and sending countries into famine and disease.
prospect.org
So we should definitely be having that debate, comparing the powers of the executive in foreign affairs and the history of that over the last 20 years particularly. And then compare it to forgiving student loan debt.
So question is why not then? Is it because Americans are so indoctrinated to believing that good things like this require decades of bullshit gridlock in a system that wholly resists change to the status quo? That if too much of a good thing happens too quickly would raise too much ire among the conservatives and ruin that fabled bipartisanship going forward?
As for it not being enough, nothing is enough. We're turbo fucked in basically every aspect of society you can think about, which is why you just do the good things you can do while you can and agitate for more in the future. Get the public invested in their government because status quo ain't working, communicate to the public that student debt is 1 piece of the puzzle and that big action can be done, which is when you start pressuring congress for more action. POTUS with their bully pulpit can use that goodwill and tell congress to get on the level.
Executive branch can do more than just start wars on their own and drone bomb to their hearts content in places that we are not even in fake war with (Pakistan...)
All of this. And thank you Bowman for sending Engels to the netherrealm. I shudder to think on the alternate reality where that race stayed status quo.
Cancel Student Debt—Almost All of It
An obscure, decades-old provision called “compromise and settlement” authority could allow the Department of Education to opt out of collecting trillions in debt.
prospect.org
So we should definitely be having that debate, comparing the powers of the executive in foreign affairs and the history of that over the last 20 years particularly. And then compare it to forgiving student loan debt.
So question is why not then? Is it because Americans are so indoctrinated to believing that good things like this require decades of bullshit gridlock in a system that wholly resists change to the status quo? That if too much of a good thing happens too quickly would raise too much ire among the conservatives and ruin that fabled bipartisanship going forward?
As for it not being enough, nothing is enough. We're turbo fucked in basically every aspect of society you can think about, which is why you just do the good things you can do while you can and agitate for more in the future. Get the public invested in their government because status quo ain't working, communicate to the public that student debt is 1 piece of the puzzle and that big action can be done, which is when you start pressuring congress for more action. POTUS with their bully pulpit can use that goodwill and tell congress to get on the level.
Executive branch can do more than just start wars on their own and drone bomb to their hearts content in places that we are not even in fake war with (Pakistan...)
All of this. And thank you Bowman for sending Engels to the netherrealm. I shudder to think on the alternate reality where that race stayed status quo.
Reposting because there seems to be some confusion over what is going on right now. The left and parts of the center aren't tying to argue that "student loan cancellation is good and we should do it" but that "Biden has the legal power to cancel large amounts of federal loan debt based on a law from 1965 and he should use this power to provide immediate debt relief". The counterargument is "Congress would take away this power if he tried", on top of the usual "poors should be forced to bootstrap themselves into paying".
This is not a question of "should we do it?" so much as "how quickly can we do it and for how much and with what method?". Biden, as far as I can tell, thinks it's a question of "should we?".
This is not a question of "should we do it?" so much as "how quickly can we do it and for how much and with what method?". Biden, as far as I can tell, thinks it's a question of "should we?".
No, Joe Biden Can’t Forgive $50,000 Of Student Loans
Cancel student loans is trending on Twitter. Why?www.forbes.com
TL;DR: There is a law from 1965 the Secretary of Education can use to cancel federal loans and the SecEd is beholden to the Prez. However, some people, especially opponents of cancellation, argue that it is not a proper usage of the law and Congress would probably take back that authority as they have authority over matters of federal spending.
Someone needs to clue Biden in on the fact that doing this will be political suicide for Dems in the future. You'll lose the middle and right forever. Biden didn't campaign on this. He separated himself from Bernie and the others as more moderate. If he had run on student loan forgiveness he likely would have lost like Bernie did.
there are plenty of things you can do with student debt besides some terrible freebie shit that the govt should never do. Such as restructuring all student loans to be interest free. Even offer current loans refunds for interest paid.Would ring true to everyone as a solid step forward and not cost billions. Also would keep republicans from saying Dems really do give everything away for free.
I seriously think debt forgiveness instantly re elects a Republican in 2024. It's a huge unpopular mistake.
Edit: every national poll I've seen having student debt forgiveness is unpopular. Vastly so. It cracks me up people are saying "record support" yeah it's still not a majority even among people that voted for Biden. This is not how you unite the country.
there are plenty of things you can do with student debt besides some terrible freebie shit that the govt should never do. Such as restructuring all student loans to be interest free. Even offer current loans refunds for interest paid.Would ring true to everyone as a solid step forward and not cost billions. Also would keep republicans from saying Dems really do give everything away for free.
I seriously think debt forgiveness instantly re elects a Republican in 2024. It's a huge unpopular mistake.
Edit: every national poll I've seen having student debt forgiveness is unpopular. Vastly so. It cracks me up people are saying "record support" yeah it's still not a majority even among people that voted for Biden. This is not how you unite the country.
Isn't the obvious counterargument to "Congress would take away this power," the opposing party controlling both chambers of Congress? Unless this is simply something the Senate has oversight over, use the divided Congress to our benefit for once.
Biden is going to need to explain to me why 50k is not constitutionally permissible to forgive with executive action but 10k is?
Because presumably whatever power he would evoke to forgive 50k, would be the same he would be evoking for 10k
If in fact, like I suspect, it's in reality just a typical galaxy-brained third-way centrist convoluted, Republican-couching, moral hazard bullshit "triangulation"(that's almost certainly tinged by industry pressure their campaigns are beholden to) for why 10k and not 50k, he needs to be honest or made to be honest on this.
Because presumably whatever power he would evoke to forgive 50k, would be the same he would be evoking for 10k
If in fact, like I suspect, it's in reality just a typical galaxy-brained third-way centrist convoluted, Republican-couching, moral hazard bullshit "triangulation"(that's almost certainly tinged by industry pressure their campaigns are beholden to) for why 10k and not 50k, he needs to be honest or made to be honest on this.
Nope. Most middle people think student debt forgiveness is a terrible idea. And like I said Biden didn't run on it so it makes him look pretty shady.
By polls I mean the non liberal ones.
Yeah hopefully they can compromise around $20-$25k minimum
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Tons of people hate the idea of giving a hand to the poor. It's a valid point.
I would argue for at the very least have the federal government waive or absorb the costs of the interest on all student loans, ideally with some level of forgiveness if unwilling to wipe tons of student debt.
You have any evidence of this? Also some form of student loan relief/forgiveness has been part of Biden's platform since the primaries.
I guess what the Democrats should really be doing to try and win Georgia is telling the American people to stop being free-loaders asking for handouts and get them some old-school bootstraps amirite?
$2000 stimulus? That's socialism!! What's next? They gonna want free healthcare?
You're wrong about everything, but I'll start by telling you that Joe Biden actually did run on forgiving college debt.
People like that have become unable to see politics as anything but a sport, and lost sight of why politics matter in the first place. So they just want the party to hedge its bets decade after decade, because doing nothing and winning a little more often is better than taking on any level of risk from doing anything.
His debate speeches where trump accused him of being like Bernie and wanting to give things away and Biden flatly denied it and never brought it up in any debate.
To be fair, if you printed out Biden's published platform, it wouldn't be worth the toner you used.
Republicans don't like the idea of helping people that need it is not a valid point.
You lose Republican voters at even the meager incremental change Biden proposes. How about we help people and prove those policies are popular instead of maintaining the status quo for power's sake.
I watched every debate and read a lot of Biden's plans never saw a word about it. Just googled "Biden promised to forgive student loans" and saw nothing pre that Schumer statement after he got elected. If he did promise it he buried it. I never would have voted for blanket student loan forgiveness. It sets a bad precedent for the govt to pick winners and losers when it comes to debt.
Go back and watch the Vice Presidential Debate. Also, damn, between going from the hopes of 50k to 10k. And hopes of 2k stimulus over $600. My spirit is just taking hit after hit.
I'm sorry but...we shouldn't forgive student loans? Why shouldn't we? Nothing you say makes any sense. We shouldn't get rid of one of the biggest things that prevents the newer generation from moving on with their lives?
"Someone is always going to be burned" is no excuse to burn people unnecesarily. Having some people with the exact same financial burden get a third of what others get because they consolidated is a trivially preventable "burn". Giving a flat amount to people in debt is fair; giving a percentage of their total debt is also fair. Giving a flat amount to people for each individual loan they have is just silly.
What precedent? If it's a blanket loan forgiveness there are no winners or losers. It's simply an all encompassing way of dealing with an unjust system that burdens the non-wealthy with crippling debt for something that is about as important as a high school education in today's world.
It would(or could) essentially be a back door way of giving Americans $50,000 in credit toward college education.
Why 10k is acceptable to you but not 50k is you logical contortionist act to explain. Because if you are trying to make the moral hazard argument you are going to be in a difficult bind justifying one but not the other.
Furthermore, this is like saying I would never accept universal healthcare because it sets a bad precedent for picking winners and losers when it comes to healthcare debt
Going even another step, if you look at Biden's actual plan, picking winners and losers is exactly what he proposes: if you work in public service or for a non profit for x years you will be entitled to loan forgiveness up to 12k depending on final duration of service....Which is a nice way of saying basically if you graduate run debt and are fortunate enough or wealthy enough to not have to chase money, you can have some money forgiven if you jump these hurdles. It's literally a Rube Goldberg excercise of picking winners and losers
Poll: 60 percent support Biden canceling up to $50K of student loan debt per person
A majority of voters support President-elect Joe Biden cancelling up to $50,000 of student debt per person, a new Hill-HarrisX poll finds.Sixty percent of registered voters in the Nov. 17-19 survey…
thehill.com
Student loan debt takes it a step further too. You're not helping the poor at that point, but rather "college-indoctrinated liberals." Poor conservatives (i.e. most conservatives) would flip their shit.
Help everyone. Pair it with some sort of mass payment to every american. Thing is, you are punishing the Americans who didn't go to college, who didn't get that education. Biden needs to pair this with public broad action for these Americans. Problem is how? He can't give money like that out, it's thru congress.
Why he needs to be cautious. Instead of all debt, or 50k, do 15-20k, cancel the interest on the rest.
As someone else pointed out the vast majority of student debt per invidudual borrower is either wiped out or significantly reduced by that measure. Do more than 20k and the amount is something Republicans can use to significantly make people angry at others getting a huge jump ahead while they are stuck.
I know jealousy is bad but it's a valid emotion and ignoring those left behind does damage to us in the elections proceeding.
Would this fall under "income" when filing taxes? I know in some cases debt forgiveness is taxed this way.
You are all kidding yourselves if you think Joe fucking Biden is going to do something like forgiving tens of thousands of debt. Biden is not for giving away significant free things to people. Universal healthcare is another one. Biden doesn't believe in handouts and a strong social safety net.
I was assuming that they'd let you choose, but of course that'd be too convenient, rational and straightforward for how economic politics work in the US... :P
Federal student loan debt is fiction. It's merely a boat anchor on an entire generation.
C'mon forgive it all. I've been repaying for 16 years and barely made a dent. And I make a decent living, but the loans have been an anchor.
Ok cool, forgive debt and make college free. Everyone can get an education now.
The idea that we can't help anyone without bribing everyone outside that group doesn't track. We can keep giving rich people and corporations handouts while everyone else goes broke, but when you're helping someone that needs it, suddenly that's a problem?
