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Biden administration introduces new ICE guidelines, faces criticism from the ACLU
- Thread starter Sibersk Esto
- Start date
The guidelines reads like someone who's still blinded by the nostalgia of meeting in the middle and the notion we can get things back to the way they used to be. Maybe if we weren't this far gone, these policy changes would make sense. But the US is way too broken for this to improve things much, if at all.
Just neuter and dissolve the agency and be done with it.
Just neuter and dissolve the agency and be done with it.
So people here are ok with going back to the old INS? Because the INS used to perform deportations and immigration enforcement as well.
It isn't, requires more votes than we have, but it can be neutered. Hopefully that's where things end up, was looking to be headed that way.
Agreed.
You don't have to be much of a genius to figure out how this will go.
Everyone they pick up will be labelled a gang member, a terrorist or a criminal and deported accordingly. The discretion will be anything but.
extremely dumb opinions like this one shouldn't be taken seriously.
So you can create them but not get rid of them? Makes sense.
Here's hoping after a few media stories of ICE definitely not following the spirit of the guidelines the hammer is dropped. Wish it didn't come to that.
ICE wasn't created by the presidency.
actually extremely good opinions like that should be the only thing anyone takes seriously.
Gonna be a lot of angry, jobless, racist authoritarians if it ever gets abolished. I can't imagine they or conservatives in general would take it too well. Oh well. Fuck em.
Personally I wasn't, I was a bit hopeful when he basically neutered them with an EO, though.
User banned (5 days): hostility, antagonizing other users over a series of posts
The President can't impose heavier guidelines than those of today or name new heads to DHS and ICE, even in an acting capacity?. Mashing X for big fucking doubt there, you're either talking about something different than I am, or you're feeding me some shit.
I've done some reading up on this, and these explicit guidelines are put in place due to the actual 100 day deportation freeze he signed within his first week is being fought in court by Texas, so ICE isn't abiding by it. These "lesser" restrictions are apparently something that can actually be put in place without much legal objection while that fight is still happening, since a Texas federal judge outright blocked the freeze.
You are aware there is an option abolish DHS and not go back to the INS days, right? It's not an either or scenario.
You two seem to be talking about different things. They're basically pointing out that Biden can't actually fire civil servants without cause, and because ICE guidelines lacked detailed paperwork, it's impossible to find cause for current employees. What you're saying is what Biden's initial EO would have done: fundamentally make ICE employees unable to do anything. They'd still take a paycheck and couldn't be fired, so not ideal, but preferrable.
nope unless your saying you don't want the executive to track those immigrants who have been guilty of violent crime
The pre-approval process allows tracking supervisors and FOs who are not adhering.
otherwise, there's no way to track and justifiably fire as permanent employees can't be fired without explicit proof of misconduct or poor performance.
this forces review and eventually the rotten elements are rooted out and it's fair. It's basically abolishing the current ice as is by giving them their own noose to tighten.
I really don't see your point?
People are criticising him, rightfully
Of course he can.
In fact he promised to!
- End the Trump Administration's historic use of 287(g) agreements. Section 10 of President Trump's January 25, 2017 executive order sought to deputize state and local law enforcement to perform the function of an immigration officer. These types of actions undermine trust and cooperation between local law enforcement and the communities they are charged to protect. As President, Biden will end all the agreements entered into by the Trump Administration, and aggressively limit the use of 287(g) and similar programs that force local law enforcement to take on the role of immigration enforcement.
The Biden Agenda for the Latino Community
Joe Biden believes that the story of America is one of ordinary people doing extraordinary things. The Latino community is a core part of the American community and their contributions are evident in every part of society. Our nation’s ability to draw and welcome hard-working, aspirational...
joebiden.com
User banned (1 week): trolling, multiple prior bans for trolling
personally, i don't think you should call yourself delusional and stupid just because i proved you wrong. it's not good to talk bad about yourself, like i'm not trying to be all "have you tried yoga and the power of positive thinking??", but speaking about yourself more positively can help you feel better about yourself.
So we are not going to the INS either? So we create something new for immigration enforcement?
I am indeed talking about top-down, the leadership who are explicitly political appointees and carry out his mandate for their given agency. If individual agents being paid to sit at their desks is on the table, that'd also be worlds better than what they're currently doing.
Because we have to demand more of our politicians.
Abolish ICE. Anything less is not enough.
I agree. Let the FBI take the violent crimes angle like they used to, at least it wouldn't be done by people that specifically sign up to hunt down brown people.
LOL. You use that word, but you don't seem to know what it means. Go ahead, post a stupid retort because you sure as hell can't justify your own opinions.
You don't have to be a genius, but you do have to not be an old dude stuck in his old ways. Biden is one of those Democrats who seems to think that post-Katrina American politics is the same as pre-Katrina. Their mentalities aren't tuned toward the drastic motions that are actually needed to rectify things and they think they think they know better because things worked when they did it that way the last time.
Note in that scenario since the charter for ICE is in immigration enforcement choosing not to sit could not be explicitly punished and thus they could act complete counter to what the appointed director wants and not get fired.
this actually codifies what a fire able offense is for both supervisors and FO.
its far less limp than what it seems but it could be better. It should also require judicial oversight prior and require a prior violent felony conviction and a current violent felony offense.
Depends on how those court cases for the EO go (are they even ongoing with this guideline change?), but considering the court packing, outlook doesn't look great, yeah.
Again, if gutting it top to bottom isn't immediately achievable, the entirety of ICE thrown into disarray, disaffection, and paralysis is infinitely preferable to this. And given how they bristle at the slightest thing like police departments the nation over, they're liable to protest in ways that further estrange them from the rest of us.
This is such bullshit strawman from wannabe extreme leftists I guess you'd call them?
Biden is not and never has been liberal. I havent seen any of these so called liberals as defined by leftists stop complaining about ice and stating ice should be abolished.
Like just because someone posta or tweet about other shit for once instead of all being anti trump all the time they need a break. It's been non stop 4 years constant stream of bullshit, not to mention a year long pandemic now. Biden isn't even 2 months into his admin and we have performative bullshit about how liberals are done with the facade.
Biden also cannot just abolish ice on his own. Nor can liberals just make him do it.
anyway maybe you should stream bree runway's hit single atm, featuring missy elliot, and it'll get you feeling yourself a little more?
The reason the former ICE director doesn't like this is because it enables them to paralyze ice since it makes them subject to termination for not following the cabinet director
kinda seems like you're a little heated about something else, tbh.
life, in general, must a chore because you clearly seem to incapable of forming a rational chain of thought. Anyway if you can't stay on topic, I suggest not muck up this thread.
Your "witty" comebacks are not adding to anything.
Way I see it, you're the one that started things off by calling tfritz an idiot instead of actually, you know, engaging and finding out the why they think open borders are actually not the worst thing.
Americans are going to want some sort of immigration enforcement. that's just the reality. he may have a high approval right now but it would quickly evaporate if he went too far one way sad to say. let's fix the dreamer problem first and asylum seekers.
just tired of people acting like A) biden can do whatever he wants as king B) liberals control everything from tweeting. C) these people that post that stuff, especially the andy throwing woody out meme act like they are so much more woke and smarter than everyone else. Its tiresome and stupid. We're all on the same team and largely all want the same goals.
Look, I agree that Biden isn't exactly a crusader, but he legitimately can't just stop ICE from operating. I wish he could, but what I really wish is that we could be a united fucking party and be able to just legislate ICE into oblivion as the system was intended to work.
ICE apparently isn't going listen to any directive from the White House, which was the reason for my suggestion.
Admittedly, if they're not going to listen, Biden may as well put out the strongest messaging possible. However, the Biden team has been exceedingly cautious about these things and that has borne fruit politically, so I can believe action will be slow.
Well it was the entirety of the post and not just the open borders part. But he is free to post why it wasn't stupid. Nobody is holding him hostage.
Biden can do what the ACLU is proposing he (and what he pledged to do) do via Executive Order. So until he does so, I would say any talk of teams and shared goals is premature.