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Omegasquash

Member
Oct 31, 2017
6,168
I've started down the whole hardware modification route because of this.

I still have my original dreamcast, but I know both it and the games I have for it are becoming old/worn and things like the laser probably needs replacing soon, so I bought a Dreamcast with GDEmu installed so I can back up and play my games on an sd card.

I'm hoping to get similar mods on other consoles - particularly ones that use cds/dvds, but its an expensive solution.


I do think with what microsoft have started doing with this generation is the beginnings of something industry wide, but I fear much like the early days of film and of television, will to a large extent just be lost to time

This is something I'm looking into, just need to work on my soldering skills. Everything I've read about ODE's seems fantastic.

Regarding BC, I'd like to see it happen more broadly, and MS has been pioneering it. Let people play what they own, keep their library, and expand on it. I'm very, very interested in Sony this gen too, since I have a large PS1/2/3/4 library, let alone what I amassed on PSP/Vita. Being able to play SotN off disc in a next gen system would be fantastic.
 

Deleted member 37739

User requested account closure
Banned
Jan 8, 2018
908
This has been an issue for some time now. Preserving culture for future generations is going to be increasingly difficult as we move forward because so much of what constitutes culture today is privately owned and protected by incredibly complex law - often for hundreds of years. This means it will fall to copyright holders to make culturally significant works available over longer periods of time, which they're not obliged to do and might actually take pains to prevent.

Consider that things like Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue (1925) and F. Scott Fitzgerald's The Great Gatsy (1921) are still under copy protection (due to lift in the coming years) and then wonder how long it'll be before well-meaning archivists can legally start redistributing seminal gaming works created in the eighties and nineties.

With video games, it's even more complicated on account of the fact that the end product is compiled and can't be easily translated into modern mediums without reverting to the source code. Software emulation can often bridge that gap, but the quality of emulation varies wildly depending on the software/hardware.

Will companies be forced to release source code when copyright expires? What if it's been lost or destroyed? It's a big murky area, but two hundred years from now, I find it hard to imagine that we'll have the same ease of access to - say - The Legend of Zelda series that we have to the published works of Henry James, Johannes Brahms or Percy Shelley.
 
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RedSwirl

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,058
This has been an issue for some time now. Preserving culture for future generations is going to be increasingly difficult as we move forward because so much of what constitutes culture today is privately owned and protected by incredibly complex law - often for hundreds of years. This means it will fall to copyright holders to make culturally significant works available over longer periods of time, which they're not obliged to do and might actually take pains to prevent.

Consider that things like Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue (1925) and F. Scott Fitzgerald's The Great Gatsy (1921) are still under copy protection (due to lift in the coming years) and then wonder how long it'll be before well-meaning archivists can legally start redistributing seminal gaming works created in the eighties and nineties.

With video games, it's even more complicated on account of the fact that the end product is compiled and can't be easily translated into modern mediums without reverting to the source code. Software emulation can often bridge that gap, but the quality of emulation varies wildly depending on the software/hardware.

Will companies be forced to release source code when copyright expires? What if it's been lost or destroyed? It's a big murky area, but two hundred years from now, I find it hard to imagine that we'll have the same ease of access to - say - The Legend of Zelda series that we have to the published works of Henry James, Johannes Brahms or Percy Shelley.

I think people who work at the Internet Archive or Gutenberg Project or something talk about "the 20th century gap" or something like that. There are even charts showing the number of current public domain works by date of creation or original copyright going back centuries, and there's a huge drop-off around the beginning of the 20th century. Oddly though, that "gap" ends around the emergence of the internet, I'm guessing because of cultural things like memes and fan works and other online things that aren't strictly copyrighted.
 

Deleted member 37739

User requested account closure
Banned
Jan 8, 2018
908
I think people who work at the Internet Archive or Gutenberg Project or something talk about "the 20th century gap" or something like that. There are even charts showing the number of current public domain works by date of creation or original copyright going back centuries, and there's a huge drop-off around the beginning of the 20th century. Oddly though, that "gap" ends around the emergence of the internet, I'm guessing because of cultural things like memes and fan works and other online things that aren't strictly copyrighted.

Yeah, the internet is a really strange paradigm in all of this and I'm interested to see where it goes. The cultural meat of what it generates is broad, but often has very specific uses and it's doesn't often favour long-form work. Not to denigrate it in any way, but it's interesting how it's powered a 'short and often' relationship with cultural work over the traditional long-form one.
 

RedSwirl

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,058
By the way, when it comes to online games, just letting people host private dedicated servers (releasing server keys I guess) is a good way to extend the game's lifetime. I think that's why you can still play Bad Company 2 online.
 

Angst

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,425
This has been an issue for some time now. Preserving culture for future generations is going to be increasingly difficult as we move forward because so much of what constitutes culture today is privately owned and protected by incredibly complex law - often for hundreds of years. This means it will fall to copyright holders to make culturally significant works available over longer periods of time, which they're not obliged to do and might actually take pains to prevent.

Consider that things like Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue (1925) and F. Scott Fitzgerald's The Great Gatsy (1921) are still under copy protection (due to lift in the coming years) and then wonder how long it'll be before well-meaning archivists can legally start redistributing seminal gaming works created in the eighties and nineties.

With video games, it's even more complicated on account of the fact that the end product is compiled and can't be easily translated into modern mediums without reverting to the source code. Software emulation can often bridge that gap, but the quality of emulation varies wildly depending on the software/hardware.

Will companies be forced to release source code when copyright expires? What if it's been lost or destroyed? It's a big murky area, but two hundred years from now, I find it hard to imagine that we'll have the same ease of access to - say - The Legend of Zelda series that we have to the published works of Henry James, Johannes Brahms or Percy Shelley.
This last paragraph honestly makes me so sad.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
I know people don't like piracy and ROMs for various reasons but imo ROM makers and emulator developers are preserving video game history and i thank them for it
 

Nanashrew

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,328
There's also the fact that a ton of master copies from Sega and others that have just been completely lost for one reason or another. Not every medium is preserved like film is, sadly.

Oh, and contracts/licensing are also a lot different with games, I'm sure.
To be fair, it took awhile before film was officially recognized and given the status it deserved to better backup film. Many trashed the master copies, many lost to fires, many lost to film decay, many just simply lost. Film has actually lost quite a lot of movies from 1920s to the 1950s. And though film preservation has been around since the 30's, it wasn't until 1980 did film preservation get its official status.

It's important that games don't reach such a terrible fate like that, but the further we get from the early days of the gaming industry, the more is getting lost.
 

Deleted member 176

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
37,160
It's funny you say GameCube specifically, because that's my example of the ideal scenario. Gamecube and Wii are perfectly preserved. Nintendo fans put so much work into emulation that even games like Wii Sports Resort work flawlessly on PC. The biggest issues will come with Xbox and Playstation consoles I think, because there just isn't that same level of fanaticism there to make the emulators work. It's good that Xbox is mostly on the ball, but games like Nier for example you have to hunt down.