Awarding discrimination - The Game Awards

[BillFromAccounting]

Nobody's saying there's a legal answer to this, just comparing it to other professions where that attitude would be laughed off the premises.

He won't work with women because it's more hassle than it's worth. This is a shitty way to be, and it's a shitty message to send out to your millions of followers, most of whom are young and impressionable. Do you understand that, Bill with 50 posts and no avatar?

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He talks to women in person and on twitter and interacts with them completely normally. He's streamed with his wife. He's surprised women with raids on twitch. To call him shitty because he doesn't work with women in one specific area of his daily routine is silly when he has very clear reasons for not doing so.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't top women streamers completely understanding of his decision(Edit: Ah, I see someone already linked them earlier in the thread, I had a feeling this was true)? How can even they be cool with it but ResetEra still isn't?

Also wow, did I really just get insulted for not caring about an avatar and for not posting as often as other users? That's a new one.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

No, I'm not, I cannot talk for them, neither do I consider myself a representive of them either. I'm not defending Ninja because he's white or whatever the reason my post could make you judge me. In fact I'm not defending him at all.

I'm just trying to understand how to analyse this situation. Perhaps I was wrong and I truly do apoligize if that's the case, I don't mean to offend anyone.

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When you are being discriminated against, you don't want to hear people handwave it away because "the context" makes it okay.

Can you imagine for a sec, someone tells you, "you aren't invited to the party because people may talk about us if you come because you're a woman. Yeah you did nothing wrong but you know. . . you know"

Why exactly do you think these people should give credence to this bullshit? Why are you even giving credence to this bullshit?

Even if this was about his wife's jealousy and his relationship (and it's not, he's said as much), how does that justify sexism? How does it justify making the wrong decision? How does it justify punishing women for being women? It's not his job to prop anyone up no but the reality of a social world is all it takes is a famous person putting you out there to give you more opportunities. By refusing to work with women he is saying its fine to take those opportunities from them and everyone defending him is saying its fine too.

Why defend this?

 

[It’s Reyn Time!]

Ah I see we're back to the part of the discussion where we're told 'we'll it's not technically a real job so it's not against the law so it's fine!' with no regard for the message it sends out to fully half the population. I'm done, I'm out. God forbid any of you guys have daughters when you grow up.

 

[Steeped in a Sea of Games]

It's illegal in America too. Fortunately this situation isn't the same as your office one.

I really do hope someone sues Ninja one day for this, just so they can lose and so the subsection of ResetEra that hates him can finally realize how silly they seem for calling him a sexist monster.

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You know that it's legal in many states to fire someone simply because they're gay? Does that mean those individuals who choose to fire someone simply for being homosexual aren't being discriminatory?

The law does not define morality or always create equal justice. Get the fuck out of here with that shit you're slinging.

 

[rras1994]

People are not losing jobs due to Ninja's decision. Why are we equating jobs with something as entrepreneurial as streaming, which may not even a around in 5 years? At worse, Ninja is not promoting other channels. This has nothing do with employee discrimination.

You can criticize Ninja for other many other angles, but he's choosing to do what he wants for his personal platform. I know of a women's focused podcaster that has no male guests on her podcast. She doesn't hate men, she just wants to serve a particular audience. She also makes money from it. But we wouldn't say she's being denying men employment by refusing to have men on her podcast.

This is a more complex issue than saying Ninja is a sexist.

Again, I don't agree with Ninja's approach. It think it's a shame, but the employee discrimination comparisons doesn't make sense. It doesn't take into a fact that people are now making money on their own using the internet. They're many time the sole creative force behind it. It's not a movie. He's not an actor working in Hollywood. He's a one man show essentially. He's producer, writer, performer, all wrapped into one.

The realities are different here.

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To be fair, I didn't say that it was illegal, from my understanding of employement law (which for some reason I did have to study some of it as part of my Masters in Mechanical Engineering in the UK), it's kinda grey area, there are some jobs that you can discriminate like priests or having a certain role that requires certain characteristics for actors fro example. That would to your women's focused podcaster for example. It wouldn't apply to Ninja as it's not that the job requires it to be a man, he just doesn't want to work with women for his own personal reasosn. I don't think that would hold up in a civil court. Where it comes blurrer though is while you aren't able to discriminate by sex for hiring contractors or business deals, it's really not clear what the legal terms would be between streamers. The law hasn't really caught up with this industry yet of streaming in general.

While it may not legally be employment discrimination, the effects on women streamers are similar in that they are denied opportunities in their own industry not based on their skill or merit but based on their sex. It has similar consequences to employment discrimination on women in that industry, they just don't have strong legal avenues against unlike their counterparts in other industries. That doesn't mean it's not sexist though as you don't need the law to determine what's sexist or not.

 

[Deleted member 3010]

When you are being discriminated against, you don't want to hear people handwave it away because "the context" makes it okay.

Can you imagine for a sec, someone tells you, "you aren't invited to the party because people may talk about us if you come because you're a woman. Yeah you did nothing wrong but you know. . . you know"

Why exactly do you think these people should give credence to this bullshit? Why are you even giving credence to this bullshit?

Even if this was about his wife's jealousy and his relationship (and it's not, he's said as much), how does that justify sexism? How does it justify making the wrong decision? How does it justify punishing women for being women? It's not his job to prop anyone up no but the reality of a social world is all it takes is a famous person putting you out there to give you more opportunities. By refusing to work with women he is saying its fine to take those opportunities from them and everyone defending him is saying its fine too.

Why defend this?

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Please read my previous post.

Also, I did not mean to defend this, per definition, but to better understand how to analyse it. This comes from a good place honestly, I'm looking to learn. As I said, my initial analysis was based on my perceptions on it.

I got corrected and explained better how things really are, as you did. I apologized for it, I learned. I don't know what more I can say. :/

 

[Johnny Cage itS]

He doesn't play games with women.

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Is that because he has something against women or is it because he fears the line of work he is involved in, (being live streamed to the world without 5 second delay, while playing a game that may cause sudden, knee jerk emotional reactions towards peers, opponents etc.) can make him very open and vulnerable to criticism and accusations thus damaging his reputation and career etc?

Maybe he cannot handle the pressure at this stage in his life, maybe he alone did not come to this "No playing with women" decision, maybe it was joint decision between his wife, lawyers, financial/business strategists etc.

The reality is, he isn't just some young (kid) playing games live online, he's a part of a multi-million dollar brand that wants things operated in an air tight, vacuum sealed environment.

Maybe it's not the same comparison, (for the right reasons) but I see so many male dominant , very popular, famous Youtubers who hardly if ever have any female presence on their super popular YT channels, and when they do have a lady on, it's most likely their wife or another famous YT celeb as a one time guest etc. Taking in consideration most Youtube shows are NOT live, and heavily edited and manipulated before they are uploaded. etc.

 

[entremet]

To be fair, I didn't say that it was illegal, from my understanding of employement law (which for some reason I did have to study some of it as part of my Masters in Mechanical Engineering in the UK), it's kinda grey area, there are some jobs that you can discriminate like priests or having a certain role that requires certain characteristics for actors fro example. That would to your women's focused podcaster for example. It wouldn't apply to Ninja as it's not that the job requires it to be a man, he just doesn't want to work with women for his own personal reasosn. I don't think that would hold up in a civil court. Where it comes blurrer though is while you aren't able to discriminate by sex for hiring contractors or business deals, it's really not clear what the legal terms would be between streamers. The law hasn't really caught up with this industry yet of streaming in general.

While it may not legally be employment discrimination, the effects on women streamers are similar in that they are denied opportunities in their own industry not based on their skill or merit but based on their sex. It has similar consequences to employment discrimination on women in that industry, they just don't have strong legal avenues against unlike their counterparts in other industries. That doesn't mean it's not sexist though as you don't need the law to determine what's sexist or not.

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How do we know he doesn't hire women? He could presumably have a female business accountant, female lawyer, agent, and what not.

The stance he's taking is specifically with collaboration on Twitch and he's not paying collaborators. They're not employees. They're not coworkers. There is no legal contract anyone is entering here, unlike an employment contract.

Again, criticize him all you want on his stance, but using the employment law angle is a huge stretch. I don't know why are treating collab streaming as an economic exchange.

A better and more clearly illegal analogy would be Twitch discriminating against female streamers--although they kinda did to their detriment.

 

[rras1994]

I'm aware of the potential outcome (which would only take place if the coworker knows why the other person doesn't want to meet her), but that doesn't make the situation the same as blatant racism, which the other poster is claiming.

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You're right it's not blatant racism that the co worker is facing, it's blatant sexism. And the co-worker doesn't need to know exactly why he's avoiding her, she just needs to notice that he's doing it to her and not her male colleagues. Actually she doesn't even have to notice that, she can just bring it to the manager that she can't do her work properly cus he won't work with her and it's hampering her. That will have consequences.

 

[ergoakari]

Ninja isn't hateful at all. He's a safe, children's streamer. Not sure what he's done wrong.

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Not sure what Ninja you watch, but.

https://youtu.be/r7hsv7size4

 

[Wamb0wneD]

You're right it's not blatant racism that the co worker is facing, it's blatant sexism. And the co-worker doesn't need to know exactly why he's avoiding her, she just needs to notice that he's doing it to her and not her male colleagues. Actually she doesn't even have to notice that, she can just bring it to the manager that she can't do her work properly cus he won't work with her and it's hampering her. That will have consequences.

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But how do you solve that sexism? If every couple where the woman doesn't want her boyfriend to meet women she doesn't know breaks up because the boyfriend thinks it's sexist bullshit we'd have alot less couples in this world. And this is going both sides as well, where men can't handle their girlfriend meeting other men. They'd rather adhere to the wish. Sometimes (like in Ninja's case) they'll even do it out of some false chivalrousness without even being asked to do so. Do you really just tell all these women who don't trust their boyfriend and the women these boyfriends meet they are being misogynistic? How is telling a black republican he's being racist working out so far?
Not sure why you keep telling me there will be consequences. I already told you I'm aware of that.

 

[Ploid 6.0]

Not sure what Ninja you watch, but.

https://youtu.be/r7hsv7size4

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The new Ninja most likely. I recall people being mad that he stopped cursing because someone told him they wish they could watch his streams with their kids but can't because of the profanity. He changed that and probably grew even more because of it.

 

[doof_warrior]

the amount of people in here defending blatant discrimination is so frustrating and infuriating, i honestly can't believe most of these posts are real. i feel like i'm in the fucking twilight zone

 

[Brinksman]

Let's apologise for someone's categorical exclusion of women to credit Geoff Keighley for how far he's brought The Game Awards.

 

[jem]

I'm asking where the line is as far as adhering to irrational wishes of a significant other. What if they're uncomfortable with you working with gay people? How is any of this not comparable?

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It's hardly irrational to not want to be harassed by the internet rumour mill.

 

[Budi]

Not sure what Ninja you watch, but.

https://youtu.be/r7hsv7size4

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I mean, in the first clip the kid called him a faggot. It was just omitted from that clip. If you think that's inappropriate reaction to homophobic slurs, be my guest.

 

[rras1994]

But how do you solve that sexism? If every couple where the woman doesn't want her boyfriend to meet women she doesn't know breaks up because the boyfriend thinks it's sexist bullshit we'd have alot less couples in this world. They'd rather adhere to the wish. Sometimes (like in Ninja's case) they'll even do it out of some false chivalrousness. Do you really just tell all these women who don't trust their boyfriend and the women they meet they are being misogynistic? How does telling a black republican he's being racist work so far?
Not sure why you keep telling me there will be consequences. I already told you I'm aware of that.

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You solve it by having consequences - which is losing your job. It's not on the female co-worker to have to put up with a guy discriminating against her and hampering her job and possible opportunities. Those couples will change their tune pretty quickly if they have no income, they will have bigger problems to deal with then jealousy. Racism at work didn't go away cus people suddenly weren't racist, it changed cus laws protect PoC and gave them legal recourse. Women can be sexist, balck people can be racist but those laws give protection to other women and PoC and other minorities so they aren't negatively affected by them.

 

[OrdinaryPrime]

His wife is not jealous and didn't ask for this. It's all HIS decision and it's not even based on what she wants.

How many times will I have to repeat myself

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I know that's rhetorical but I'd say at least once every time this subject comes up. People defend people they find entertaining even if they're shitheads.

I mean, in the first clip the kid called him a faggot. It was just omitted from that clip. If you think that's inappropriate reaction to homophobic slurs, be my guest.

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I think it's an inappropriate reaction. Tell the person to grow up and mute.

It's hardly irrational to not want to be harassed by the internet rumour mill.

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He had the chance to come out against the toxicity of his chat. He did not. Acting like he's a victim is really misleading.

 

[RedMercury]

Ninja's stance to stream only with male streamers falls into the bucket that is not intentionally designed to harm anyone, and doesn't really harm anyone.

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He's denying opportunities on their face based on gender, which is shitty, and he's also perpetuating an atmosphere of discrimination to his fans and peers. Look at all the people who have been banned for defending the guy across various threads. He's injecting something harmful into our culture, you can't dismiss that as harmless.

It's hardly irrational to not want to be harassed by the internet rumour mill.

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When will the excuses for the guy end. He's just a poor victim who's forced and only recourse is to discriminate I guess.

 

[kurahador]

the amount of people in here defending blatant discrimination is so frustrating and infuriating, i honestly can't believe most of these posts are real. i feel like i'm in the fucking twilight zone

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Reminds me of defenders in a thread where PewDiePie used the N word. What makes me sad was how the defenders turns out to be one of these impressionable young minds --- 10-15 years old who are a fan of his.

 

[Wamb0wneD]

You solve it by having consequences - which is losing your job. It's not on the female co-worker to have to put up with a guy discriminating against her and hampering her job and possible opportunities. Those couples will change their tune pretty quickly if they have no income, they will have bigger problems to deal with then jealousy. Racism at work didn't go away cus people suddenly weren't racist, it changed cus laws protect PoC and gave them legal recourse. Women can be sexist, balck people can be racist but those laws give protection to other women and PoC and other minorities so they aren't negatively affected by them.

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Yeah, the SO being in danger of losing their job will cure the other persons's jealousy. For sure.
I never said anything is on the female coworker.
I met way too many people being jealous in their relationship, some to a more severe extent than others and you can't draw a clear line on where the sexism begins. Your example works because it is job related. You can't even use it in a social setting where this shit happens on a daily basis. Or is it only sexist if it happens in a working environment?

 

[Morrigan]

It's hardly irrational to not want to be harassed by the internet rumour mill.

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"I don't stream with <insert marginalized group here> because I'm afraid of rumours of <insert potential rumours from asshole fans here>"

...Yeah, no, it's not only irrational, it's cowardly, especially coming from a millionaire who wants to be a role model to kids.

 

[Budi]

I think it's an inappropriate reaction. Tell the person to grow up and mute.

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Civility prevails.

Let's apologise for someone's categorical exclusion of women to credit Geoff Keighley for how far he's brought The Game Awards.

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We can credit Keighley for the show being inclusive and promoting it too.

 

[Dream_Journey]

So other womens than his wife might try to seduce him (like this is what only they do all the time right?) and he is scaring to play game with them, as like they are devil like how all misogynistic person saying?.. What a gross statement even more gross they gave him reward for it.

 

[rras1994]

Yeah, the SO being in danger of losing their job will cure the other persons's jealousy. For sure.
I never said anything is on the female coworker.
I met way too many people being jealous in their relationship, some to a more severe extent than others and you can't draw a clear line on where the sexism begins. Your example works because it is job related. You can't even use it in a social setting where this shit happens on a daily basis. Or is it only sexist if it happens in a working environment?

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I mean it is sexist if it happens in a social setting but the consequences are going to be make the women feel shitty for not having done anything wrong but at least won't affect her livelihood. The guy also loses out on a friend and is something that will likely cause issue with the couple further down the line. Plenty of things are sexist that you can't have legal repersussions for , but that doesn't make it okay? I would hope that we also teach our children that it's perfectly fine to have friends of the opposite gender and it not be a sexual relationship. The idea that a man and a woman together must be having sex is sexist.

 

[LogicAirForce]

If your SO has something against you having a dinner with a woman from work, is that her discriminating other women? Or is it just you discriminating because you adhere to her wish? Or both?
And would you tell her to her face that she is having misogynist thoughts that help disciminate women when she tells you she doesn't like you meeting that other woman?

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y'all realize women can discriminate and be sexist towards other women right? internalized misogyny is a thing that exists. yes, if your wife doesn't want you having dinner with a female coworker, but is fine with you having dinner with male coworkers then she is being sexist. And I would hope you would confront her about those views as she could be spreading them to any children you may have. I certainly wouldn't want my spouse spreading bigoted views like that to my kids, but I also wouldn't marry someone with those views in the first place.

 

[Budi]

So womens might try to seduce (like this is what only they do all the time right?) him and he is scaring to play game with them, as like they are devil like how all misogynistic person saying?.. What a gross statement even more gross they gave him reward for it.

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No that's not what he is saying. And that's not what he got rewarded for, you are wrong on both accounts. He doesn't want to make himself or his wife a target of trolls, rumours/gossip and harassment. And he won a popularity contest, not good guy of the year or something.
https://www.pcgamer.com/ninja-defends-his-decision-to-avoid-streaming-with-women/

 

[Windrunner]

Even if we all somehow agree that Ninja's stance wasn't misoginistic and harmful (it was both), are we just gonna ignore that the dude just cracked out the n word as well? And if we go further and also give a pass to that (many people will), should we also ignore Keighley's endorsement of the complete shitbag called Boogers? And this relates to this year alone. The VGAs have been a constant stage for bigots to be awarded and celebrated for 5 straight years. Which is what this thread is about. This misdirection about Ninja's wife's wishes and imaginary evil coworkers is just that, misdirection.

The issue here is that the VGAs are a perfect encapsulation of this industry: women and minorities don't matter for shit unless there's a angle for PR to exploit them at any given time. And after that is done with, into the silent box they go again, there's bigots to sell games to.

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Well said.

 

[Deleted member 41271]

God forbid any of you guys have daughters when you grow up.

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I hope these guys don't. Being a woman in their family would be a horrible experience.

It's hardly irrational to not want to be harassed by the internet rumour mill.

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"Harassed" by the rumor mill.

In this situation, harassment is not what he is facing. Harassment is what women in gaming are facing constantly. That you try to swap this is... it's really awful.

 

[Mugen X]

If it's true that he's not doing it to avoid conflict and jealousy issues from his wife, then it's understandable why he wouldn't make that public. However if he just simply doesn't like playing with girl gamers, than he's a prick imo.

 

[jem]

I know that's rhetorical but I'd say at least once every time this subject comes up. People defend people they find entertaining even if they're shitheads.



I think it's an inappropriate reaction. Tell the person to grow up and mute.



He had the chance to come out against the toxicity of his chat. He did not. Acting like he's a victim is really misleading.

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He's denying opportunities on their face based on gender, which is shitty, and he's also perpetuating an atmosphere of discrimination to his fans and peers. Look at all the people who have been banned for defending the guy across various threads. He's injecting something harmful into our culture, you can't dismiss that as harmless.

When will the excuses for the guy end. He's just a poor victim who's forced and only recourse is to discriminate I guess.

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"I don't stream with <insert marginalized group here> because I'm afraid of rumours of <insert potential rumours from asshole fans here>"

...Yeah, no, it's not only irrational, it's cowardly, especially coming from a millionaire who wants to be a role model to kids.

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I hope these guys don't. Being a woman in their family would be a horrible experience.



"Harassed" by the rumor mill.

In this situation, harassment is not what he is facing. Harassment is what women in gaming are facing constantly. That you try to swap this is... it's really awful.

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I'm not talking about Ninja being harassed.

Learn to read the context.

Not sure what Ninja you watch, but.

https://youtu.be/r7hsv7size4

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Well that first clip conveniently cuts out the fact that the kid calls him a faggot.

 

[Jeffram]

He's denying opportunities on their face based on gender, which is shitty, and he's also perpetuating an atmosphere of discrimination to his fans and peers. Look at all the people who have been banned for defending the guy across various threads. He's injecting something harmful into our culture, you can't dismiss that as harmless.

When will the excuses for the guy end. He's just a poor victim whose forced and only recourse is to discriminate I guess.

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I understand to have a discussion we have to bucket behaviour to contextualize, but i think the ones your drawing are stretching as much as possible to villianize.

"Denying opportunity" Let's be clear, it's not a job. The opportunity here is allowing people to attach themselves to his celebrity/popularity. It's not nothing, as more exposure means more viewers and more viewers does equal more money, but there is no direct job, no direct compensation here. It's not an open try out, he's mostly streaming with his friends.

"atmosphere of discrimination" is a big stretch as well. he's been very clear of his reasons, and they have nothing to do with misogyny. He features his wife on camera and speaks very highly of her, describing how important she is to him and how important she is to his business. How many streamers actually talk about their SOs? He may not stream with women, but he does more than any streamer I've seen to talk about how important a women in his life is in a real and tangible way.

I don't see anyone here calling him a victim either. His stance is not great, it's weird, it only loosely makes sense, but at most people don't see it as a big problem, not directly harmful, and has enough justification to be passable.

 

[Morrigan]

I'm not talking about Ninja being harassed.

Learn to read the context.

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In that case I don't know what you're talking about. I've read up the quote chain and it was about Ninja making excuses to exclude people.

 

[OrdinaryPrime]

I'm not talking about Ninja being harassed.

Learn to read the context.

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When three or four different people misread a post, perhaps the onus is on you and not everyone else.

 

[Deleted member 41271]

I'm not talking about Ninja being harassed.

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The context is you defending misogyny by using a very specific word with a very specific meaning.

You do not get "harassed" by rumors.

Women do get harassed, in part due to actions like ninjas, who keeps adding to the long line of "women are inherently trouble" shit women in gaming have to deal with constantly.
Learn to understand that your word choice matters.

he's been very clear of his reasons, and they have nothing to do with misogyny

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They are actually textbook examples of misogyny. The "women are bad for me by being near me, so there won't be any women" is a classic case that is used against women a lot.
In fact, we see this exact argument *right now* with wallstreet execs.

 

[jem]

In that case I don't know what you're talking about. I've read up the quote chain and it was about Ninja making excuses to exclude people.

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Really?

What if her wishes were that he not stream with black people? If he respects hose wishes is that not racist?

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I'm asking where the line is as far as adhering to irrational wishes of a significant other.

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These are the posts in question. I was saying that it's not irrational for his wife to not want to be the constant centre of internet drama and rumours.

When three or four different people misread a post, perhaps the onus is on you and not everyone else.

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Well if you jump into a discussion without reading any of the context it can be quite hard to actually understand what's being said.

 

[RedMercury]

"atmosphere of discrimination" is a big stretch as well.

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Are you familiar with sexism and misogyny? I assume so. So, when you engage in those things, especially when you have a large platform, and especially when a lot of that platform are impressionable kids, it absolutely perpetuates those things. I don't get how you can reasonably argue against that. You can see the results of that sort of thinking in the defenses to him in this very thread.

He features his wife on camera and speaks very highly of her, describing how important she is to him and how important she is to his business. How many streamers actually talk about their SOs? He may not stream with women, but he does more than any streamer I've seen to talk about how important a women in his life is in a real and tangible way.

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Do you believe someone who has a black friend cannot be racist? Because he treats his wife well doesn't mean what he's doing isn't discrimination or misogyny.

I don't see anyone here calling him a victim either. His stance is not great, it's weird, it only loosely makes sense, but at most people don't see it as a big problem, not directly harmful, and has enough justification to be passable.

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I mean, if someone is saying he has no choice but to discriminate for the sake of his privacy or marriage, they are implying he's a victim of those things.

 

[OrdinaryPrime]

These are the posts in question. I was saying that it's not irrational for his wife to not want to be the constant centre of internet drama and rumours.

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It's a good thing that the wife excuse isn't true according to a post on this very page.

Well if you jump into a discussion without reading any of the context it can be quite hard to actually understand what's being said.

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A whole lot of deflection and muddying the waters for your boy Ninja. This ain't it, chief.

 

[Jeffram]

They are actually textbook examples of misogyny. The "women are bad for me by being near me, so there won't be any women" is a classic case that is used against women a lot.
In fact, we see this exact argument *right now* with wallstreet execs.

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Wallstreet is much different in that they are treating the women themselves as a risk, as not trustable. Ninja is worried about the community whether they be men or women.

Women streamers especially know how toxic their communities can be. Most do not dare speak bout a boyfriend or a husband, due to fear of harassment. Many female streamers understand and respect his stance: "https://www.polygon.com/2018/8/13/17684832/ninja-twitch-female-streamers-reactions-pokimane-valkyrae"

I don't think it's a great decision he's made, it's not a good look, but we don't know what experiences he's had, and the proposed "victims" of his discrimination don't see it has largely problematic. Its not the same.

 

[Dream_Journey]

No that's not what he is saying. And that's not what he got rewarded for, you are wrong on both accounts. He doesn't want to make himself or his wife a target of trolls, rumours/gossip and harassment. And he won a popularity contest, not good guy of the year or something.
https://www.pcgamer.com/ninja-defends-his-decision-to-avoid-streaming-with-women/

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He have the power of change this awful behavior, at least a bit and he can try other than ignoring and scaring isn't it? Maybe he should try to show the right way to them about how they should treat women with his power especially childrens who watching him.

Not like they are trying to sex with you or something Ninja, just wanna play game and maybe some talk but when you say that shitty statement you turning that innocent behavior to so wrong places.

 

[melikefishnchips]

Between people not understanding why SonicFox would declare pride in his sexuality and people not understanding the destructive nature of Ninja's statement, no one on this board should ever wonder why the industry is in the shape that it's in

 

[OrdinaryPrime]

Wallstreet is much different in that they are treating the women themselves as a risk, as not trustable. Ninja is worried about the community whether they be men or women.

Women streamers especially know how toxic their communities can be. Most do not dare speak bout a boyfriend or a husband, due to fear of harassment. Many female streamers understand and respect his stance: "https://www.polygon.com/2018/8/13/17684832/ninja-twitch-female-streamers-reactions-pokimane-valkyrae"

I don't think it's a great decision he's made, it's not a good look, but we don't know what experiences he's had, and the proposed "victims" of his discrimination don't see it has largely problematic. Its not the same.

Click to shrink...

He has arguably the biggest channel on Twitch (for the purposes of my point hopefully you can accept this even if there is someone bigger). If he started something that he wouldn't accept this type of toxicity on his channel, it could possibly set a standard and move Twitch from where it is right now. A largely toxic, transphobic hellhole. At least in the bigger channels. But all of these people are worried about maintaining the status quo because it is quite lucrative. And to me, that's depressing as hell.

I would also say Twitch has a responsibility to get better but again that pesky capitalism means the likelihood is small that any major changes will occur.

 

[Morrigan]

I was saying that it's not irrational for his wife to not want to be the constant centre of internet drama and rumours.

Click to shrink...

I guess this must be the 4th time in this thread that I point out that his wife had nothing to do with any of this.

 

[Budi]

He have the power of change this awful behavior, at least a bit and he can try other than ignoring and scaring isn't it? Maybe he should try to show the right way to them about how they should treat women with his power especially childrens who watching him.

Not like they are trying to sex with you or something Ninja, just wanna play game and maybe some talk but when you say that shitty statement you turning that innocent behavior to so wrong places.

Click to shrink...

Yeah I agree, I wish he rather played with women and stood up against any assholes who might want to troll. He has a platform to do good, which he does tbf, but this is him running away rather than standing up and doing the right thing.

But he has nothing against women (supposedly), he isn't afraid of women. He is concerned about the trolls, the toxic gaming community.

 

[jem]

It's a good thing that the wife excuse isn't true according to a post on this very page.

Click to shrink...

I'm guessing you're referring to Ninja saying that it was entirely his decision?

Well, that is entirely irrelevant. The guy presumably knows his wife fairly well, therefore I'm guessing he can probably deduce what she does and doesn't like. I don't think it's a stretch to imagine that perhaps he realised that his wife would not at all enjoy being involved in drama and rumours and so took steps to ensure that this wouldn't happen.

Basically, his wife doesn't need to explicitly tell him her wishes. In a long term relationship you can make decisions on behalf of your SO.

That's also assuming that he was telling the truth in that statement. Considering his wife is basically his business manager I wouldn't be at all surprised if this was something they discussed before hand. Even then they have certainly have discussed it now.

I guess this must be the 4th time in this thread that I point out that his wife had nothing to do with any of this.

Click to shrink...

That means nothing.

See the above.

 

[pargonta]

you're missing context and the ability to look beyond soundbites

 

[Gonzalo]

ERA/OldGaf awards > TGA's

 

[Gotdatmoney]

"I'm going to ignore the words the dude actually said to make up some shit he actually meant"

Yeah of course you are.

 

[saenima]

Well that first clip conveniently cuts out the fact that the kid calls him a faggot

Click to shrink...

First off, it would be appreciated if you didn't type that. Not telling you what to do, just asking.

Secondly, it's not a convincing excuse. That reaction is inexcusable. I have been called that and much worse btw, never felt the need to behave like that.

 

[OrdinaryPrime]

I'm guessing you're referring to Ninja saying that it was entirely his decision?

Well, that is entirely irrelevant. The guy presumably knows his wife fairly well, therefore I'm guessing he can probably deduce what she does and doesn't like. I don't think it's a stretch to imagine that perhaps he realised that his wife would not at all enjoy being involved in drama and rumours and so took steps to ensure that this wouldn't happen.

Basically, his wife doesn't need to explicitly tell him her wishes. In a long term relationship it's fairly easy to figure those out on your own.

That's also assuming that he was telling the truth in that statement. Considering his wife is basically his business manager I wouldn't be at all surprised if this was something they discussed before hand. Even then they have certainly have discussed it now.

Click to shrink...

I wouldn't be surprised with this level of dedication if you're his business manager.