Avengers: Endgame |Spoiler OT| Let's go get this son of a bitch

[Cantona222]

In my second viewing I noticed that at the end of the movie Bucky said to Captain America while hugging him and before traveling back in time "We will miss you." Although Hulk said that he is going for only 5 seconds. That means that Cap and Bucky definitely had a conversation about staying in the past. Nice touch by the writers/directors.

 

[Cantona222]

Infinity War had more fight scenes compared to Endgame. Maybe that's what I missed the most.

The fights I remember in Infinity War:
-Thanos Vs Hulk & Thor
- New York Fight (DR. Strange, Iron Man)
- Vision, Scarlet, and Cap fight in the warehouse in Europe.
- Iron Man & Spider-Man fight in the bad guy's Spaceship.
- Fight at the planet against Thanos when he dropped a moon.
- The final epic fight in Wakanda.

Maybe the final fight in Endgame is more epic, but still.

 

[Ragnorok64]

Infinity War had more fight scenes compared to Endgame. Maybe that's what I missed the most.

The fights I remember in Infinity War:
-Thanos Vs Hulk & Thor
- New York Fight (DR. Strange, Iron Man)
- Vision, Scarlet, and Cap fight in the warehouse in Europe.
- Iron Man & Spider-Man fight in the bad guy's Spaceship.
- Fight at the planet against Thanos when he dropped a moon.
- The final epic fight in Wakanda.

Maybe the final fight in Endgame is more epic, but still.

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Warehouse? How many European warehouses have train tracks going through them?

 

[Cantona222]

Warehouse? How many European warehouses have train tracks going through them?

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Hehe. I remember it being a big, dark, and empty indoor place. Train station it is then.

 

[LiK]

Kinda liked that the Dark World is essential viewing for Thor's scene when he traveled back in time.

 

[Nostremitus]

OK, I need to see a movie set in post WWII where a Mjolnir wielding Captain America appears with full knowledge of history and who the Hydra Agents are.

A post End Game God-Cap would essentially be a Spangled Punisher.

 

[Veelk]

I don't see how Endgame disproves this.

The Avengers in IW were essentially split into two camps , one defending the timestone and one defending the mindstone. These two camps we light years apart, which allowed Thanos to defeat each camp individually.

Vision was essentially rendered useless by Thanos' lackeys because he and Wanda were off the grid.

Now imagine an alternate universe where the whole crew is together in NY when the ship shows up. Does Vision get nerfed? Does Strange get kidnapped? It's a whole different ball game and getting the last two stones becomes much harder for Thanos and crew.

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Keep in mind that Wanda and Vision were the Captain Marvels of the Avengers before Captain Marvel became a thing, and this movie proves that Wanda could light Thanos' ass on fire if in a 1v1 fight.

So it's more accurate to say that the original 7 avengers that defeated Loki couldn't beat Thanos.

But the current line up, with Wanda and vision able to fight on the front lines, with Strange using all his mystic arts including the time stone, with Black Panther and the Wakanda army at their back while Tony's technology backs them?

If nothing else, they'd atleast have a solid chance against Thanos and his other stones. Maybe it wouldn't be a sure victory, but they'd have a legitimate chance. The only issue is whether Thor still gets Stormbreaker and whether Bruce can bring out Hulk again.

 

[Ryuelli]

OK, I need to see a movie set in post WWII where a Mjolnir wielding Captain America appears with full knowledge of history and who the Hydra Agents are.

A post End Game God-Cap would essentially be a Spangled Punisher.

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I was kind of hoping the whole CA-going-back-in-time-to-redeliver-the-stones thing would lead into a final solo movie, but I think the MCU is so big at this point that we're never going to get a true solo movie again.

 

[LL_Decitrig]

I just realised that at least part of the reason The Ancient One was disturbed is because she realised Banner was from her future and Strange was not around. This and the news that he had given up the Time Stone changed her mind.

 

[GrimGrinningGuy]

I was kind of hoping the whole CA-going-back-in-time-to-redeliver-the-stones thing would lead into a final solo movie, but I think the MCU is so big at this point that we're never going to get a true solo movie again.

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Give me a Disney + mini series showing caps time adventure

 

[Posty McPostface]

I don't see how Endgame disproves this.

The Avengers in IW were essentially split into two camps , one defending the timestone and one defending the mindstone. These two camps we light years apart, which allowed Thanos to defeat each camp individually.

Vision was essentially rendered useless by Thanos' lackeys because he and Wanda were off the grid.

Now imagine an alternate universe where the whole crew is together in NY when the ship shows up. Does Vision get nerfed? Does Strange get kidnapped? It's a whole different ball game and getting the last two stones becomes much harder for Thanos and crew.

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And isn't this what Stark is mad about when he's brought back to Earth? I don't remember the exact lines, but I think at one point he yells at Cap that he needed him, and my impression is he was upset about how things played out with them split up.

 

[Xaszatm]

I'm not seeing how Captain Marvel is too OP when they managed to keep Scarlet Witch's power without making everyone else useless.

 

[IcyInferno]

Give me a Disney + mini series showing caps time adventure

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Just gotta get Evans on board. I imagine he wants to take a break, but wouldn't be surprised if he wants to reprise the role for a 6 hour mini series like 5 years from now. (6 hours , 6 episodes, 6 stones)

 

[LiK]

I'm not seeing how Captain Marvel is too OP when they managed to keep Scarlet Witch's power without making everyone else useless.

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Scarlet vs Thanos was more impressive than Captain Marvel. Except for that headbutt.

 

[Nisaba]

I really liked how this movie gave Dark World a bit of rep with Frigga and also how we got to see The Ancient One again.

I'm hoping to go for another viewing again soon if possible!

 

[Ryuelli]

Just gotta get Evans on board. I imagine he wants to take a break, but wouldn't be surprised if he wants to reprise the role for a 6 hour mini series like 5 years from now. (6 hours , 6 episodes, 6 stones)

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Make it an animated series, find a VA who sounds like him. Not quite sure how like-ness licensing works, but I'd assume they have the rights to use his likeness in any Captain America related activity.

 

[Deleted member 7051]

Uhh....because there are some things none of the other heroes can handle but only she can.

You want proof? Infinity War, no one can do ****, then Captain Marvel is there to help in the sequel and both times she is around, Thanos gets his ass whooped. Captain Marvel, numero Uno, second to none, A+ class super hero, the winner of the ultimate showdown of ultimate destiny.

So imagine having her around in Infinity War, I don't think the movie would have ended on a cliffhanger had that of happened. Also, I bet Asgard would still be around if she showed up in Ragnarok, she'd be a lot more help than The Hulk.

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You're really exaggerating her power, y'know. She's not so much stronger than Thor, Wanda or Doctor Strange that all threats anyone else has ever faced would be casually brushed off by Carol. Wanda was tearing Thanos apart and she was able to match his physical strength while shattering the same sword that cut through Cap's shield.

And isn't this what Stark is mad about when he's brought back to Earth? I don't remember the exact lines, but I think at one point he yells at Cap that he needed him, and my impression is he was upset about how things played out with them split up.

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Yeah. He said something like "when I said we'd lose, you said we'd lose together. We lost - but you weren't there."

 

[Xaszatm]

Uhh....because there are some things none of the other heroes can handle but only she can.

You want proof? Infinity War, no one can do ****, then Captain Marvel is there to help in the sequel and both times she is around, Thanos gets his ass whooped. Captain Marvel, numero Uno, second to none, A+ class super hero, the winner of the ultimate showdown of ultimate destiny.

So imagine having her around in Infinity War, I don't think the movie would have ended on a cliffhanger had that of happened. Also, I bet Asgard would still be around if she showed up in Ragnarok, she'd be a lot more help than The Hulk.

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In Infinity War, Scarlet Witch held back Thanos with one hand while the other hand broke an infinity stone and you're saying that no one is on Captain Marvel's level? Okoye even says "Why was she up there all this time" in response to Scarlet Witch not being in the battle from the start.

 

[MrKlaw]

So you don't have her flying around in infinity war (which they didn't, even though she existed at that point in time). It's really as simple as that, don't put her in a situation where she is able to effortlessly defuse the narrative tension.

You don't even need to go to other movies for that, you see it in action in endgame itself: If Captain Marvel showed up as soon as Thanos bombed the Avengers headquarters or even at Cap's Avengers Assemble moment, then it'd have been game over for him, he'd have never gotten the gauntlet. So instead, they had her show up at the tail end of the fight, where even her unstoppable power couldn't prevent Thanos from getting the gauntlet and almost winning.

And - AGAIN - the fact that Captain Marvel introduced a new tier of power that's greater than Thor doesn't change that either. That's the part you don't seem to be getting. How problematic a character's power level is is only ever narratively relevant. The solution for why Captain Marvel won't break the story is the same as was for Thor. They're only going to be introduced at the point where their powers won't effortlessly solve the problem.

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All good points

But when they started the time heist they should have had carol there as cover. Just in case - because they were planning to bring back all the infinity stones and create a gauntlet. That's a huge risk to the universe

Of course they didn't because plot reasons as mentioned but still seemed odd

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Great post and it's a shame this thread will just keep going round and round and round with the same discussion.

The last bit is basically why Thor has gone missing at the climax of most fights in the avengers films.

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??? There has been 4 Avengers films and he's been present at the final battle in all four (admittedly showing up half way through in IW).

 

[TheZjman]

??? There has been 4 Avengers films and he's been present at the final battle in all four (admittedly showing up half way through in IW).

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Yeah, he's been there but what i mean is he has quite often missed the crucial moment, basically because it would be unfair to have him there, or at least that's how I've always seen it.

Avengers: He's supposed to be bottlenecking the portal but stops doing it.
Ultron: Guide the seismic bomb device, and an ultron bot hits it(where does he go?)
Infinity War: Goes off to attack the ships so does not confront Thanos till right at the end.

Endgame: I can't actually remember but at what point after everyone come back do we see him there?

I'm not being critical, just saying.

 

[GrimGrinningGuy]

Just gotta get Evans on board. I imagine he wants to take a break, but wouldn't be surprised if he wants to reprise the role for a 6 hour mini series like 5 years from now. (6 hours , 6 episodes, 6 stones)

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Agree. Love it.

 

[Deleted member 15428]

What does Red Skull do on Vormir when nobody's looking for the Soul stone? What does he even eat? Where is his house?

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Yeah, he's been there but what i mean is he has quite often missed the crucial moment, basically because it would be unfair to have him there, or at least that's how I've always seen it.

Avengers: He's supposed to be bottlenecking the portal but stops doing it.
Ultron: Guide the seismic bomb device, and an ultron bot hits it(where does he go?)
Infinity War: Goes off to attack the ships so does not confront Thanos till right at the end.

Endgame: I can't actually remember but at what point after everyone come back do we see him there?

I'm not being critical, just saying.

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This is an odd interpretation of events.

Avengers - him and Hulk are smashing shit up and taking out the heavy hitters. I think Cap says to him to "light them up" (with his lightning) and he immediately jumps up high and destroys a couple of the monster-ships coming through the portal with a lightning attack. After that I would assume he's helping clean up invading ships and other monster ships who'd already come through.
AoU - everyone leaves to help civilians escape and Wanda stays behind the guard the device. She's more than capable but only gets distracted because her brother dies.
IW - he arrives to the battle late because of his axe quest. He's by far the biggest hitter there and takes out a lot of the ground troops and the ships. He doesn't have an earpiece so it makes sense he wouldn't know exactly where to be to confront Thanos.
EG - I don't particularly remember his role in the final battle after the undusting, but it doesn't really matter because it doesn't support your point anyway. He's there for the whole fight.

 

[Vish]

Why did they make the hulk so useless as a fighter in these movies?

 

[itwasTuesday]

Boom, Pepper shows up. Now who's watching Morgan?

 

[Lotus]

Boom, Pepper shows up. Now who's watching Morgan?

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Uncle Happy

 

[itwasTuesday]

Why did they make the hulk so useless as a fighter in these movies?

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I don't think Banner has a PhD for fighting.

 

[shinobi602]

Why did they make the hulk so useless as a fighter in these movies?

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That's another thing that kind of let me down. While I adored Hulk in this, I still wish we got an epic fight scene with him too. Would have loved to see a Thanos rematch.

 

[Valiant]

The only exception to the film's internal time travel rules seems to be Cap appearing as an old man at the end - and even that can be explained.

Cap returns the stones and lives his life in a different timeline, then returns to his original timeline using the wrist thingy. This maintains the rule that the past cannot be altered, while also enabling him to live a life before reappearing.

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Nope. Because if he flashed forward he would be in his new reality not the prime one. They explain this early on.

They return the stones to their proper places at the right moment.

Also they created another rift where loki is now somewhere in the universe with the tesseract.

 

[Vish]

Banner doesn't have a PhD for fighting.

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So this would just make me even more annoyed about it. He was a bitch in the first movie, and now he's too chill to fight.

 

[Deleted member 21339]

That's another thing that kind of let me down. While I adored Hulk in this, I still wish we got an epic fight scene with him too. Would have loved to see a Thanos rematch.

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Should have been Hulk fighting through to the van with the gauntlet and then holding open Thanos's hand instead of Capt Marvel

 

[Deleted member 21339]

Btw what were they trying to accomplish by bringing the gauntlet to the van? What were they going to do at that point ?

 

[Solo]

Should have been Hulk fighting through to the van with the gauntlet and then holding open Thanos's hand instead of Capt Marvel

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Heh, it's funny, I remarked back before CM hit how unearned it was going to feel when CM saves the day in Endgame a mere month after being introduced. I got some flak for that, some "settle down, she will barely be in it/barely do anything" responses, and yet.....she kinda did exactly what I feared.

 

[itwasTuesday]

Uncle Happy

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Yeah probably.

Side note. The cheeseburger exchange between the two is probably my favorite bit of dialogue in the film.

 

[Deleted member 21339]

Heh, it's funny, I remarked back before CM hit how unearned it was going to feel when CM saves the day in Endgame a mere month after being introduced. I got some flak for that, some "settle down, she will barely be in it/barely do anything" responses, and yet.....she kinda did exactly what I feared.

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I really didn't mind what they did but I think it would have been more dramatically satisfying if it was Hulk there instead.

 

[Valiant]

This is an odd interpretation of events.

Avengers - him and Hulk are smashing shit up and taking out the heavy hitters. I think Cap says to him to "light them up" (with his lightning) and he immediately jumps up high and destroys a couple of the monster-ships coming through the portal with a lightning attack. After that I would assume he's helping clean up invading ships and other monster ships who'd already come through.
AoU - everyone leaves to help civilians escape and Wanda stays behind the guard the device. She's more than capable but only gets distracted because her brother dies.
IW - he arrives to the battle late because of his axe quest. He's by far the biggest hitter there and takes out a lot of the ground troops and the ships. He doesn't have an earpiece so it makes sense he wouldn't know exactly where to be to confront Thanos.
EG - I don't particularly remember his role in the final battle after the undusting, but it doesn't really matter because it doesn't support your point anyway. He's there for the whole fight.

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Not to mention he is Fat Thor who has lost a little pep in his step and also has to face Thanos again, after failing to kill him, and then killing him.

 

[kurahador]

Btw what were they trying to accomplish by bringing the gauntlet to the van? What were they going to do at that point ?

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Basically just throw it into the quantum realm I guess.

 

[Solo]

I really didn't mind what they did but I think it would have been more dramatically satisfying if it was Hulk there instead.

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Me too because it felt appropriate for one of the heroes weve grown to love over the past decade to be deeply implicated in taking down Thanos instead of a character we just met.

 

[PaJeppy]

That's another thing that kind of let me down. While I adored Hulk in this, I still wish we got an epic fight scene with him too. Would have loved to see a Thanos rematch.

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Yup. My only real complaint with the movie.

Should have given him a bit of redemption.

 

[Garrett 2U]

Heh, it's funny, I remarked back before CM hit how unearned it was going to feel when CM saves the day in Endgame a mere month after being introduced. I got some flak for that, some "settle down, she will barely be in it/barely do anything" responses, and yet.....she kinda did exactly what I feared.

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Did it feel unearned when Doctor Strange saved the day in Infinity War?

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Btw what were they trying to accomplish by bringing the gauntlet to the van? What were they going to do at that point ?

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It was the only means of time travel they had left and they had to get it away from Thanos.

 

[Solo]

Did it feel unearned when Doctor Strange saved the day in Infinity War?

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No one saved the day in IW?

 

[Blader]

Yeah probably.

Side note. The cheeseburger exchange between the two is probably my favorite bit of dialogue in the film.

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It's funny, of all the things around Tony's death and funeral, that little callback I think touched me the most. It got me thinking suddenly about how far things had come from that first movie, and that it was Favreau - the man who really started it all - in that scene with her made it sweeter.

 

[RedStep]

I'm hearing that Kraglin is somewhere in the final battle but they really couldn't add one 10-second shot of his arrow zipping through a few Outriders and into his hand?

Easy character development (last time we saw him, he was practicing) and connect more to GOTG.

 

[Garrett 2U]

No one saved the day in IW?

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By giving up the stone he saved the day, we just didn't know it yet.
Regardless, he had a massive role in Infinity War and Endgame, despite only having one solo movie.

Does it feel like unjustified attention?

 

[Gustaf]

do you guys know "hulk" doesn't exists anymore right?

 

[Lotus]

Heh, it's funny, I remarked back before CM hit how unearned it was going to feel when CM saves the day in Endgame a mere month after being introduced. I got some flak for that, some "settle down, she will barely be in it/barely do anything" responses, and yet.....she kinda did exactly what I feared.

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She barely was in it, so...

Either way you slice it, her contributions were unsurprisingly a far cry from the borderline concern trolling over how she'd overshadow everyone else.

 

[kurahador]

I'm hearing that Kraglin is somewhere in the final battle but they really couldn't add one 10-second shot of his arrow zipping through a few Outriders and into his hand?

Easy character development (last time we saw him, he was practicing) and connect more to GOTG.

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Maybe his part was supposed to be added during reshoot but unfortunately his brother aka writer/director for Kraglin scene got fired.

 

[Lotus]

Yeah probably.

Side note. The cheeseburger exchange between the two is probably my favorite bit of dialogue in the film.

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It's not my favorite, but it's certainly a very clever and touching callback. :(