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Rendering...

Member
Oct 30, 2017
19,089
I mean, Halo Reach was the best Halo. So, yeah.
Not my favorite Halo by a long shot, but the team dynamic was totally successful IMO. Surrounding the player character with good supporting characters is key.

It's actually same approach to characterization that defines the Chief in Halo 1. In those days, he was an empty hero suit that the player could step into. We got to know him through the way the supporting characters talked about him and reacted to him.

I like this approach. It worked for the Chief when his character amounted to a cool voice and iconic armor. It can work for a different protagonist too.
 

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,390
343 never should have brought Chief back as the lead.

Halo 4 should have been Kilo-5 vs Jul Mdama with Naomi as the lead.

Would have been so much better than the contrived nonsense in Halo 4 and 5.

The Rookie and Noble 6 were not strong characters. They were even more blank slates than the Chief was in CE.

Hell, the Rookie doesn't have a single line iirc.


Locke wasn't badly received because he was a bad character, he was badly received because the story as a whole in H5 was badly presented and people misattribute that to Locke.

The story was bad, and poorly written characters was a factor in that... Locke was one of them.
 
Jul 26, 2018
2,464
All nostalgia aside, what's so good about Halo? I installed the MCC and started with Halo CE, i'm about an hour and half in. I haven't uninstalled it but I don't feel the urge to keep playing it either. What makes it so special?
 

oriic

Prophet of Truth - Press
Verified
Oct 30, 2017
2,182
Hungary
"Assuming John 117, The Master Chief is ever officially retired or KIA,"

Spartans never die...

Idk. Chief is my Hero. For me the Halo series is all about Chief, I say that with Reach being a good game and the two Halo Wars being a big favourite. There may be a new FPS coming in the future, but that will be different for me.
 

TheGhost

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,137
Long Island
All nostalgia aside, what's so good about Halo? I installed the MCC and started with Halo CE, i'm about an hour and half in. I haven't uninstalled it but I don't feel the urge to keep playing it either. What makes it so special?
Besides the fact that at the time it released there was nothing else like it on consoles and spawned a wave of failed halo killers?

It changed the console space, changed it further with Xbox Live parties and matchmaking.
 

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,390
All nostalgia aside, what's so good about Halo? I installed the MCC and started with Halo CE, i'm about an hour and half in. I haven't uninstalled it but I don't feel the urge to keep playing it either. What makes it so special?

In 2001 the controls, AI, weapon system, and multi-player was revolutionary for console fps
 

Xwing

Unshakable Resolve - One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 11, 2017
9,892
After Cortana and the Banished are taken care of, and perhaps a few more adventures after that, I think the best path forward would be to take a page out of the Marathon playbook and fling Master Chief into the far future.

We still don't know the full extent of what the Librarian activated in Chief, and a rather protracted lifespan might be one of the benefits/curses. I think having him frozen again, but this time for far longer (100+ years) then waking up to a weird new status quo galaxy, a new set of armor, a new set of potential friends and enemies, maybe a couple descendants of old friends (grandson of the Arbiter or something?) would be pretty damn cool personally.
 

Cantona222

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,136
Kuwait
Ryu from Street fighter is now 57 years old and is still going strong.

ryu_bio.png
 

Arn

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,747
The Rookie and Noble 6 were not strong characters. They were even more blank slates than the Chief was in CE.

Hell, the Rookie doesn't have a single line iirc.


Locke wasn't badly received because he was a bad character, he was badly received because the story as a whole in H5 was badly presented and people misattribute that to Locke.
Noble Team was a good example of how a strong group of Spartans could lead a Halo game, you're right that Noble Six is literally a vessel for the player. Regarding the Rookie his silence fit the game they wanted to make, which was a lonely experience punctuated by the personality of the Superintendent. I know what you're saying in that those two characters aren't full of personality but they fit with the story and purpose of each game.

Similarly The Arbiter is a voiced character with a deep backstory that could absolutely lead a Halo game.

Locke was a poorly written character in a poorly written game. His motivations and game-logic were paper-thin and I had zero interest in playing as him. I had no backstory as to who he was or why I should care about him. If you're going to put players in the shoes of a new character you need to give them a reason to want to; that's something Bungie did well with The Arbiter in giving him real personality and depth in the scenes before you take control of him.
 

DanielG123

Member
Jul 14, 2020
2,490
I mean, they could move on to a new protagonist, but should they? No. At least, not right now. Plus, as it's been stated already, John's been in cryo multiple times and for extended periods. That, combined with him not aging normally anyway due to his genetic modifications, he's still got a plethora of juice left in the tank, as do the other Spartan IIs.

Sgt. Johnson was in his 70s at the start of the series, and he both looked, acted, and performed 30 years younger than that. And, since the Chief had been blasted with Forunner energy in H4, I'd say that he's got life and peak performance in spades. He's fine, and if/when Steve Downes decides to retire from the character, then there are surely other voice actors out there that could bring a similar gravitas and stoicism to Master Chief.

Also, side note: Master Chief has plenty of personality and character, it's just only been relegated to the novels and extended lore. However, his book personality has thankfully begun to filter into the games, starting with Halo 4. The man isn't really the super silent, kind of "one-note" solider that Bungie made him to be; he talks and emotes plenty.
 

blamite

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,557
It could have, and should have, if 343 had been able to pull it off successfully the first time. Unfortunately with Halo 5's story being as bad as it was, they were forced to lean harder on him than ever, and I don't think they're able at this point to even attempt a protagonist switch again.

Maybe at most there'll be a couple ODST-sized spinoffs with original protagonists. But I think that's probably all.
 

Divorced Dad

Banned
Feb 16, 2021
267
First, it's science fiction, secondly 49 really isn't that old as compared to what it was 30 years ago. At 45, I'm in the best shape of my life (pulled 555 yesterday in the DL and can run a 5K in 22 minutes). If I can do that, so can a s super soldier built on the best genectics and super science
 

teenaxta

Member
Feb 13, 2021
454
highly unpopular opinion, but i dont think chief was a good character to begin with. Like he was okay and all but to say that he was a good character, i'd disagree with that. He literally had no character. He was literally a NPC. Halo needs a new protagonist, one that has story, emotions, and personality. The 'i wont speak badass' is simply not good enough
 

GattsuSama

Member
Mar 12, 2020
1,761
I think that for the Halo franchise to move on from Master Chief as a protagonist it needs to be a prequel or a sequel set a long time later.

If Master Chief is alive then I can see a spinoff one shot game like Reach or ODST working, but for a continuing narrative it cannot be set while MC is alive and not feature him in some way.

It would be very cool to play a game set hundreds on years in the future where the protagonist is some sort of chosen person that is out to look for Master Chief. People think he is still alive and just asleep in some lab, but the twist is that when you get to him that he is dead but you inherit the armor or something.
 

Roshin

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,840
Sweden
A young boy learns he's an abandoned attempt by ONI at cloning Master Chief, has to deal with a secret resurgence of the Covenant while also going through the trials of going to high-school, with the power of friendship and using the Domain powered REQ system, he summons heroes from Halos past to Finish the Fight before class starts.

Hold on now, we may have something here. :)

A shady organisation, concerned about Master Chief's increasing age and ability to fight, clones a younger version of him, without consent! The cloning goes well,, but they are discovered and troops led by Master Chief himself descends on the facility, destroying the cloning labs and killing everyone. Master Chief is furious over the slight to his age and abilities, but also over the idea of a copy gone rogue. Clone Chief must be destroyed, but he escapes!

Clone Chief must then fight the Covenant who are at it again, somehow, avenge his creators, and fight off the real Master Chief, who pursues him through the game. Or is he the real Master Chief? Who can say? Important questions about identity, belonging, and personal rights will be raised on the battlefield of the future!

Are you ready for... THE TWIN MASTER CHIEFS!

Anyone got Kojima's email?
 

FUNKNOWN iXi

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,608
How old is doom guy?
Old enough to kick ass.
49 with the amount of mileage John has is pretty old. Even with the 5 years of cryosleep. The dude is a supersoldier but I truly wonder just how fucked his body is from his years of constant fighting.
We haven't really seen old Spartans tho, so perhaps the aging process is heavily slowed. Spartans could remain at their peak for a long time, especially Chief with his Forerunners mojo.
343 never should have brought Chief back as the lead.

Halo 4 should have been Kilo-5 vs Jul Mdama with Naomi as the lead.

Would have been so much better than the contrived nonsense in Halo 4 and 5.
This would've been interesting. But then after a long time, Chief would have to return in some grand fashion like Arbiter finding him in a lost credits scene of Combat Evolved 2 which followed Arbiter's journey after the war.
 
Oct 27, 2017
9,430
I don't think they are going to age out master chief in a science fictional game in the future. 50 years old then could be different than 50 now.
 
Dec 25, 2018
1,926
Hold on now, we may have something here. :)

A shady organisation, concerned about Master Chief's increasing age and ability to fight, clones a younger version of him, without consent! The cloning goes well,, but they are discovered and troops led by Master Chief himself descends on the facility, destroying the cloning labs and killing everyone. Master Chief is furious over the slight to his age and abilities, but also over the idea of a copy gone rogue. Clone Chief must be destroyed, but he escapes!

Clone Chief must then fight the Covenant who are at it again, somehow, avenge his creators, and fight off the real Master Chief, who pursues him through the game. Or is he the real Master Chief? Who can say? Important questions about identity, belonging, and personal rights will be raised on the battlefield of the future!

Are you ready for... THE TWIN MASTER CHIEFS!

Anyone got Kojima's email?
Now the greatest hunt in gaming history truly begins!
 

Ballpoint Ren

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,425
Canada
Died how exactly? Last time I checked, Halo was doing pretty well. Other franchises wish they were Halo dead.
I mean, yeah if you're gonna take it literally they're still making games. The quality of which has gone down the shitter.
The franchise died after Bungie and 343 split tbh. The gameplay was passable, but in terms of narrative Halo 4 was some hot garbage. Any mystery or wonder that was expertly conveyed in the games that came before it was thrown out the window, particularly in revealing the Forerunners.

Character design in 4 felt very uninspired to me as well. We go from awesome looking aliens in the covenant and the flood, to bland chrome promethians and voldemort-ass forerunners.
 
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noinspiration

Member
Jun 22, 2020
2,009
Just...stop referencing the timeline. The last game took place last week, the next one takes place tomorrow. Whatever.
 

Trup1aya

Literally a train safety expert
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,390
Old enough to kick ass.

We haven't really seen old Spartans tho, so perhaps the aging process is heavily slowed. Spartans could remain at their peak for a long time, especially Chief with his Forerunners mojo.

This would've been interesting. But then after a long time, Chief would have to return in some grand fashion like Arbiter finding him in a lost credits scene of Combat Evolved 2 which followed Arbiter's journey after the war.

I absolutely agree.
 

Watership

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,119
People want to play as Master Chief, regardless of how "developed" a character he is. People would RIOT if a major METROID game was made and you weren't playing as Samus, and who that character is has even less relevance than the Chief.

The only thing stopping this is how long Steve Downes wants to voice the character. Even then, i'm sure another voice actor could be found. It won't be the same, but things change.
 

Black Mantis

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,123
Definitely. I'm a huge Halo fan, but it's definitely the universe that's the biggest draw for me, not MC. I think they missed the perfect opportunity in moving away from him between H3 and H4. I would've left him drifting for a longer amount of time and centred games around Blue Team (sans MC), Team Osiris and maybe Jun from Noble Team to fill in the gap.
 

Kittenz

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,159
Minneapolis
There's all kinds of rich fiction in Haloverse without Chief. I actually think the success of the TV show might play a role in whether or not it can happen. If they're ever going to get the masses engaged in a non-Chief/Cortana main, it's going to be over 10 episode seasons. Or it's not.
 

Arctic Chris

Member
Dec 5, 2017
2,175
Ottawa Canada
If I can believe in Tom Cruise in the next Mission Impossible movie, I think I can get mind around an genetically modified animated character in a power suit also doing the impossible.
 

SimonM7

Member
Oct 27, 2017
359
Sweden
I think Halo should've expanded beyond the chief a long time ago and gotten to a point where he's no longer so firmly associated with the franchise that you need him in every single game. Reach is possibly my least favourite Halo from a gameplay and level design perspective, but in terms of a narrative it perfectly illustrates how easily and seamlessly you can tell other interesting stories in this universe.

ODST, which I do think is a fantastic game, not only emphasises that same point, but shows that you can play with tone and motif as well.

You asked whether the franchise can successfully continue onward without Master Chief, however, and Microsoft already sorta answered this question by re-committing to focusing on him for the big FPS releases after seeing a sharp decline in interest with both ODST and Reach. On the most surface level, Halo is Chief, Cortana, ring world and sex toy-esque alien ship design. Infinite is a hard reset to all the elements that scream Halo, because it's the consensus that we got too far away from the elements people fell in love with 20 years ago.

Some of the things I associate the most with the first Halo are a sense of wonder and discovery, feelings that the familiar will never inspire- but I'm just not a very nostalgic guy or precious about a lot of protagonists. Someone mentioned a Metroid without Samus, but I'd honestly be cool with another protagonist in a Metroid game as long as it doesn't mean we lose a rare female led scifi/space franchise to a generic space man.

But I'd advise against swapping out Samus it if they want to sell Metroid games... is my point. 😊
 

C J P

Member
Jul 28, 2020
1,302
London
The Chief is the kind of character you want for a franchise like this: he's simultaneously paper-thin and iconic. Add in the fact that gamers are giant babies who abhor any kind of change and he's clearly not going anywhere any time soon
 

ElNino

Member
Nov 6, 2017
3,720
I mean, yeah if you're gonna take it literally they're still making games. The quality of which has gone down the shitter.
The franchise died after Bungie and 343 split tbh. The gameplay was passable, in terms of narrative Halo 4 was some hot garbage. Any mystery or wonder that was expertly conveyed in the games that came before it was thrown out the window, particularly in revealing the Forerunners.

Character design in 4 felt very uninspired to me as well. We go from awesome looking aliens in the covenant and the flood, to bland chrome promethians and voldemort-ass forerunners.
While I might have enjoyed the narrative in Halo 1-3 more than 4/5, gameplay in Halo 5 was the best in the series as far as I'm concerned.
 
Feb 15, 2019
356
It will definitely have to be, given the voice actor is the most iconic part of Master Chief, and I think recasting the voice actor (whenever he's unable to or done with voice acting) would be a bigger deal than replacing him unless they manage a very good in-universe explanation for his voice changing. And unless they plan to end their biggest IP whenever that happens, I think they'll put a lot of work into getting the audience accustomed to the new character (hopefully way better than they did with Locke) well before he's replaced, maybe Halo: Infinite has some expansions that focus on another character who ends up taking the reigns for whatever the next Halo after Infinite is. I think Halo's cultural peak back during the Halo 2/3 days will never be matched again, but I think Halo could definitely retain it's current level of popularity (maybe even more with Game Pass and F2P multiplayer) even without Master Chief, though it would certainly be sad for me whenever he's done
 

Last_colossi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
4,257
Australia
If Chief is 49 isn't he only like... 31 years into his possible 100 year active duty? I mean don't Spartans live to almost 200 years old or something?
 

Bulby

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 29, 2017
5,039
Berlin
I like old chief. I dont know how they will deal with Steve Downes getting older (long may he continue).

I just hope they let Chief be quiet and stoic again and use the characters around him. Johnson and Cortana were the perfect foils for him.

I hated his character in 4 and 5. It sounded like teenage fan fiction.

What they have shown so far for Infinite is perfect. Chief doesnt need to a fully formed 'human' character. He is the Judge Dredd of the story.
 
Feb 13, 2018
1,241
New Jersey
It's difficult to pin Chief's age because of his augmentation, time in cryo sleep, combat stress, and whatever the Librarian did to him. That glimpse under the helmet showed that he definitely isn't a young man, buy its not the years; it's the mileage, and Chief has racked up a lot. The stress from augmentation process alone probably took 7 years off his life.

I hope 343 has an idea of how they're going to wrap up Halo, because there's only so far they can go with the remnants of the Covenant. Or once they are taken care of, the Precursors; as Flood, come to retake the galaxy in full fury
 

Edward850

Software & Netcode Engineer at Nightdive Studios
Verified
Apr 5, 2019
992
New Zealand
You see his face in the first 2 dooms. Like all the time
Excluding Doom64 (kinda, but easily written off as unnecessary); basically all of them, even Doom3. It wasn't until 2016 that they decided to obscure his face for some reason. His defining trait was that he was unnamed (as he was always "you", which... uhh... I guess vanished in 2016 as well).