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BLOODED_hands

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,937
Are you all seeing a lot of rolled ice cream places? Seems like that's the new fad, but, like, it isn't even that good, it takes forever to make, and it's usually very expensive. We thought to try the Blue Nova truck last night, but their ice cream was $10/serving. Fuck that.

So we went to Honeymee instead, that that place was great.

I think there's one a couple of blocks away from me. Same thing my friend said. Took too long and was too expensive for it. The one near me, from what my friend told me, was more of a sit-down restaurant though and he said the place wasn't the cleanest of places....
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
I had a discussion like that with my friend many years ago. He pointed out that Russians and a vast majority of Russia is part of the Asian continent. Yet when we look at Russian people, we never immediately think, yeah, he/she's Asian. Though there are other ethnicities living in Russia that does look more like Asians.

All of the Russians I've spoken to had no idea what to call themselves. They would always go "Russia is in Asia, but the Census says I'm European", and my response would be "fuck the Census. They're always getting it wrong. You are who you are.".
 

Miletius

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,257
Berkeley, CA
Are you all seeing a lot of rolled ice cream places? Seems like that's the new fad, but, like, it isn't even that good, it takes forever to make, and it's usually very expensive. We thought to try the Blue Nova truck last night, but their ice cream was $10/serving. Fuck that.

So we went to Honeymee instead, that that place was great.

Yea, it's the new thing I think. Icicles had a soft launch a couple of months ago, and I've been twice (once with a friend, once with the GF). It's pretty good, but it's def overpriced. It's about 7.5 for a ice cream, which granted, is pretty generous portions with custom flavors and all the toppings you want, but it's still expensive compared to most ice cream places.
 

S-Wind

Member
Nov 4, 2017
2,176
Ah, I made it here!

Boy, is our former home ever deeeeaaaaaaddd!

And with the mass exodus of mods and regular posters from there, the right-wingers, and non-progressives seem to be more free to speak their minds.

On that note, what I am currently most curious about regarding this new place is the moderation. Our former home was very good at stamping out homophobia, transphobia, anti-semitism, [some] sexism, and racism - EXCEPT when it came to racism against Asians. Far too often I saw racial slurs and/or disparaging remarks against Asians get a free pass. I wonder how it'll be here.... Are there any members on Asian-ERA on the moderation team?
 

Jintor

Saw the truth behind the copied door
Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,424
oh wow red text on dark theme does noooot look good.

wonder if there's a stylish thing to muck with that
 

wandering

flâneur
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
2,136
Ah, I made it here!

Boy, is our former home ever deeeeaaaaaaddd!

And with the mass exodus of mods and regular posters from there, the right-wingers, and non-progressives seem to be more free to speak their minds.

On that note, what I am currently most curious about regarding this new place is the moderation. Our former home was very good at stamping out homophobia, transphobia, anti-semitism, [some] sexism, and racism - EXCEPT when it came to racism against Asians. Far too often I saw racial slurs and/or disparaging remarks against Asians get a free pass. I wonder how it'll be here.... Are there any members on Asian-ERA on the moderation team?

Spider and BronsonLee are mods
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
On that note, what I am currently most curious about regarding this new place is the moderation. Our former home was very good at stamping out homophobia, transphobia, anti-semitism, [some] sexism, and racism - EXCEPT when it came to racism against Asians. Far too often I saw racial slurs and/or disparaging remarks against Asians get a free pass. I wonder how it'll be here.... Are there any members on Asian-ERA on the moderation team?

As a Jew, I'm gonna have to disagree with the bold part.

I experienced quite a bit of antisemitism when I was on that site, although the more overt (i.e. white supremacist) kind was stamped out quickly.
 

S-Wind

Member
Nov 4, 2017
2,176
As a Jew, I'm gonna have to disagree with the bold part.

I experienced quite a bit of antisemitism when I was on that site, although the more overt (i.e. white supremacist) kind was stamped out quickly.

Can you elaborate on that? I am curious as to what I missed.

Also, are you counting calling out the actions of the Israeli government and/or Israeli military as anti-Semitism? Because if you are then I am proud to say that I was, and will continue to be, a part of the voices that speak out against certain actions of the Israeli government and Israeli military.
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
Also, are you counting calling out the actions of the Israeli government and/or Israeli military as anti-Semitism? Because if you are then I am proud to say that I was, and will continue to be, a part of the voices that speak out against certain actions of the Israeli government and Israeli military.

The fact that you immediately jumped to this conclusion (while also invoking the "Jews who complain of antisemitism are playing the race card for political benefit" chestnut) is setting off some major internal alarms, I will say that.

But if you want a more detailed articulation of my thoughts, see here: http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/what-is-and-is-not-acceptable-criticism-of-israel/
 
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OP
OP
Pet

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
Are you all seeing a lot of rolled ice cream places? Seems like that's the new fad, but, like, it isn't even that good, it takes forever to make, and it's usually very expensive. We thought to try the Blue Nova truck last night, but their ice cream was $10/serving. Fuck that.

So we went to Honeymee instead, that that place was great.

On IG, yes. But I haven't tried any.

There's a Honeymee in Irvine. I actually like it quite a bit! Sometimes the honey freezes and gets a weird texture though :(
 

Cybit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,326
Ah, I made it here!

Boy, is our former home ever deeeeaaaaaaddd!

And with the mass exodus of mods and regular posters from there, the right-wingers, and non-progressives seem to be more free to speak their minds.

On that note, what I am currently most curious about regarding this new place is the moderation. Our former home was very good at stamping out homophobia, transphobia, anti-semitism, [some] sexism, and racism - EXCEPT when it came to racism against Asians. Far too often I saw racial slurs and/or disparaging remarks against Asians get a free pass. I wonder how it'll be here.... Are there any members on Asian-ERA on the moderation team?

I am...not expecting things to be that much better over here on the racism against Asians front, at least based on most of the mods I saw listed. Bronson and Spider will help, but there were far more asian mods percentage wise on our old home than there is here IIRC. It's going to be basically more of the same, maybe a little worse, once things settle down here. I hope I'm wrong, though.

As a Jew, I'm gonna have to disagree with the bold part.

I experienced quite a bit of antisemitism when I was on that site, although the more overt (i.e. white supremacist) kind was stamped out quickly.

Yep; I don't think they were particularly against bigotry as much as aligned with progressive beliefs - so if you were a minority group that progressives didn't like (Israeli, Mormon), you were sort of SOL. I don't think that's going to change here.

The fact that you immediately jumped to this conclusion (while also invoking the "Jews who complain of antisemitism are playing the race card for political benefit" chestnut) is setting off some major internal alarms, I will say that.

But if you want a more detailed articulation of my thoughts, see here: http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/what-is-and-is-not-acceptable-criticism-of-israel/
The anti-racism / sexism / etc was tied to politics, not principles. I think that was pretty clear. That's why the anti-semitic views were A-OK when couched as criticism of Israel (and anyone who defended Israel) but not otherwise. (Same with Asians - all the racist comments about asians as it came to gender relations and anything else under progressive politics at the time were A-OK)
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
I am...not expecting things to be that much better over here on the racism against Asians front, at least based on most of the mods I saw listed. Bronson and Spider will help, but there were far more asian mods percentage wise on our old home than there is here IIRC. It's going to be basically more of the same, maybe a little worse, once things settle down here. I hope I'm wrong, though.



Yep; I don't think they were particularly against bigotry as much as aligned with progressive beliefs - so if you were a minority group that progressives didn't like (Israeli, Mormon), you were sort of SOL. I don't think that's going to change here.


The anti-racism / sexism / etc was tied to politics, not principles. I think that was pretty clear. That's why the anti-semitic views were A-OK when couched as criticism of Israel (and anyone who defended Israel) but not otherwise. (Same with Asians - all the racist comments about asians as it came to gender relations and anything else under progressive politics at the time were A-OK)

Yup, I've already experienced dogpiling on at least two occasions. One for saying Jews are not white, and the other for pointing out that Jews do, in fact, experience typecasting in Hollywood (basically, unless you're white-passing and have a white sounding name, you could almost always expect to be saddled with comedy films and stereotypical roles; Wonder Woman was an exception to the rule, which is why it was so important for us).

As far as criticism of Israel goes, I would agree that it's not always antisemitic, but it definitely can be antisemitic (and usually is, as my Times of Israel article tries to explain). I find the 3D test (demonization, delegitimization, double standards) to be very useful in that regard. Most progressive criticism, unfortunately, violates one or more of those 3 Ds, and Jews who call it out are quickly shouted down.
 
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OP
OP
Pet

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
Cybit - Who was Asian on GAF's mod team? I was under the impression that most of the Asians were just expats living in Asia.

The anti-racism / sexism / etc was tied to politics, not principles. I think that was pretty clear. That's why the anti-semitic views were A-OK when couched as criticism of Israel (and anyone who defended Israel) but not otherwise. (Same with Asians - all the racist comments about asians as it came to gender relations and anything else under progressive politics at the time were A-OK)

Yeah, this is a pretty spot on explanation of how I saw things.
 

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,848
My eyes are burned out of my skull but at least I was productive...what's going on in here?
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
Cybit - Who was Asian on GAF's mod team? I was under the impression that most of the Asians were just expats living in Asia.

The only one I remember is duckroll.

Yeah, this is a pretty spot on explanation of how I saw things.

That's why I think the community spotlights are super important. It's an opportunity to show people that we're not ok with these things. I'm working on a really long post on antisemitism, which I will post in here (if it's done in time).
 
OP
OP
Pet

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
Oh, for some reason I thought they were either nonAsian expats or Asian Asians.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
None of the mods from that site are mods here, so it means little imo.
Kagari is. Not sure her ethnicity, though.

On IG, yes. But I haven't tried any.

There's a Honeymee in Irvine. I actually like it quite a bit! Sometimes the honey freezes and gets a weird texture though :(
I know I said it's not even good, but you should try it.

Yeah, the honeycomb got really hard after it was frozen.
 

ccbfan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,498
Defitely agree that the in the old site (and probably the new) it was more important to align with the progressive hive mind than be actually against racism, sexism, rape etc. Still remember the topic where the majority of posters and mods defended a rapist and mocked the victim cause rapist was gay while the victim was not and made some homophobic comments.

Racism against Asian went way farther than progressive politics in the old site though. It was downright ok to make fun of Asians eating pets, studying too much, not being well rounded and interesting and having small penises.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
I remember the old affirmative action threads would be the worst, as those would really pit Asians against blacks. It annoyed me so much that high academic achievement amongst Asians would be hand-waved away as rote memorization and lack of well-roundedness, and no one would believe that Asian applicants actually were negatively impacted by it.
 

cdyhybrid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,422


Originally posted by Malyse in BCC. This shit is crazy.

Also, if you're American, make sure you get your ass out and vote today.
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
From what I remember, if you weren't black, Latino, or Arab-Muslim the mods (along with most of the community) really didn't give a shit about you. There were a lot of "Chingrish" jokes in gaming threads, and Jews (and other West Asian minorities, e.g. Kurds) were mostly fair game, unless it could be blamed on white supremacists. They were far more invested in toeing the "progressive" party line than listening to minorities. Ex-Muslims had a pretty rough go of it too.
 

Cybit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,326
Duckroll, Falk, and maybe Shota? (was he still a mod?)

Shouta is, I think Kadey is, and there were a few others. A lot of them were the old time mods who stepped down just due to work / RL stuff.

I remember the old affirmative action threads would be the worst, as those would really pit Asians against blacks. It annoyed me so much that high academic achievement amongst Asians would be hand-waved away as rote memorization and lack of well-roundedness, and no one would believe that Asian applicants actually were negatively impacted by it.

Yep. My favorite was always being edited out of white supremacy / sexism statistics, because asian men and women sort of make the narrative look awkward (for instance, I believe asian women, as of this year, will make more per capita than white men. Asian men already do). The best part was always being accused of being racist if we dared point out that some of the policies used to try create a more equal playing field were racist against Asians (or would be called as such if it were another group being targeted).

From what I remember, if you weren't black, Latino, or Arab-Muslim the mods (along with most of the community) really didn't give a shit about you. There were a lot of "Chingrish" jokes in gaming threads, and Jews (and other West Asian minorities, e.g. Kurds) were mostly fair game, unless it could be blamed on white supremacists. They were far more invested in toeing the "progressive" party line than listening to minorities. Ex-Muslims had a pretty rough go of it too.

This is why I wanted Asian OT to be called "Schrodinger's Minority". We are only considered a minority if it served another group's purposes.
 

Deleted member 2585

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,133


Originally posted by Malyse in BCC. This shit is crazy.

Also, if you're American, make sure you get your ass out and vote today.


Every time I look in the mirror I have an existential crisis about the slantedness of my eyes /s

Huge tangent:

You know, I read an academic article a few years ago about how a certain kind of "ethnic lit". You probably know the type: a young Asian-American doesn't get along with their parents, then they find out that their parents have gone through some horrible tragedy back in Asia, and then they use that tragedy to grow closer. I don't remember the thrust of the article, but it's pretty obvious that there are some questionable politics going on. Otherness (the main character never feels American; the parents are always portrayed as weird and distinctly non-American), authorial ownership (using tragedies to make a convenient plot point; the tragedies are never actually fully explored, they're there to shock and act as a plot point), orientalism (always showing the Asian countries as being backwards and strange).

There are definitely some Asian-American authors that handle the subject very well, but there are some who double down on all the stereotypes. Joy Luck Club comes to mind as an example of the latter.

As a counterexample to the commercialized ethnic lit, the article mentions Nam Le's short story, The Boat. It's really interesting, because it starts with the same trappings as the ethnic lit that the article bashes, but then turns in a different direction. The main character is a Vietnamese-Australian who has to write a short story for the Iowa Writers' Workshop. He previously swore to never write ethnic literature, but with a deadline coming up, he decides to write a story about his estranged father, a survivor of the My Lai Massacre. The father visits, and upon learning that his son is writing about his experiences, rips up the story and burns it. There's no heart-to-heart or anything like that - just a son who used his father's traumatic experiences on a whim.

Looking at Nam Le's Wikipedia page, there's a quote about this subject:
My relationship with Vietnam is complex. For a long time I vowed I wouldn't fall into writing ethnic stories, immigrant stories, etc. Then I realized that not only was I working against these expectations (market, self, literary, cultural), I was working against my kneejerk resistance to such expectations. How I see it now is no matter what or where I write about, I feel a responsibility to the subject matter. Not so much to get it right as to do it justice. Having personal history with a subject only complicates this — but not always, nor necessarily, in bad ways. I don't completely understand my relationship to Vietnam as a writer. This book is a testament to the fact that I'm becoming more and more okay with that.

I tend to agree with him here. It's good to write about your background and ethnicity, but it has to be handled carefully. Amy Tan, I don't think, was very respectful or thoughtful when she wrote Joy Luck Club. I much prefer the works of people like Change-Rae Lee.

Ugh, writing this out reminds me of how little I've read these past few years.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
Speaking of books, I'd like to take this opportunity to recommend Barry Eisler's John Rain series. The protagonist, John Rain, is a half white Asian-American who operates in Japan and actually gets plastic surgery to look more Asian to blend in. That aside, though, it's also an incredible suspense series.
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
Yep. My favorite was always being edited out of white supremacy / sexism statistics, because asian men and women sort of make the narrative look awkward (for instance, I believe asian women, as of this year, will make more per capita than white men. Asian men already do). The best part was always being accused of being racist if we dared point out that some of the policies used to try create a more equal playing field were racist against Asians (or would be called as such if it were another group being targeted).

They also subsume Jewish statistics (and those of other MENA groups) under "white". We're not even officially considered a minority at all, and very few people understand how that actually hurts us. The US/Canadian Census can go to hell.
 
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Miletius

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,257
Berkeley, CA
Defitely agree that the in the old site (and probably the new) it was more important to align with the progressive hive mind than be actually against racism, sexism, rape etc. Still remember the topic where the majority of posters and mods defended a rapist and mocked the victim cause rapist was gay while the victim was not and made some homophobic comments.

Racism against Asian went way farther than progressive politics in the old site though. It was downright ok to make fun of Asians eating pets, studying too much, not being well rounded and interesting and having small penises.

To some extent, it even existed on the edges of the old site as well. I remember that every "short man" topic would devolve into Asian stereotyping at some point. While being short isn't a uniqeuly Asian trait, it is an experience that is more likely to occur to Asian Americans, and so it naturally followed to make fun of people who were short (or just tons of shitposts by people driving by and saying "I'm 6'0'' mmkay.)

Problem is attitudes like these are quite pervasive, even among the liberal elite. We literally had to correct an instructor about this misconception yesterday, while discussing consumption of meat (earlier in the lecture, she had mentioned dogs as a common source in the Far East). She was baffled by the fact, that, yes, at UC Berkeley, where nearly half of the student population is Asian or Asian American, would have a problem with equating Asians to pet eaters. The only thing that gave me any solace in that conversation is that the class stood up to her and told her it was not ok to other a group like that, regardless of what she may believe or what the textbook happens to say.
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
Speaking of professors, there are many all across the country who hold antisemitic views as well. There are at least 3 prominent professors at my local uni alone (Jasbir Puar, Michael Chikindas, and a third guy whose name I can't remember) who believe that we harvest organs, among other things.
 
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OP
OP
Pet

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
Yep. My favorite was always being edited out of white supremacy / sexism statistics, because asian men and women sort of make the narrative look awkward (for instance, I believe asian women, as of this year, will make more per capita than white men. Asian men already do).

But when you equalize for education, white men make more.

Problem is attitudes like these are quite pervasive, even among the liberal elite. We literally had to correct an instructor about this misconception yesterday, while discussing consumption of meat (earlier in the lecture, she had mentioned dogs as a common source in the Far East). She was baffled by the fact, that, yes, at UC Berkeley, where nearly half of the student population is Asian or Asian American, would have a problem with equating Asians to pet eaters. The only thing that gave me any solace in that conversation is that the class stood up to her and told her it was not ok to other a group like that, regardless of what she may believe or what the textbook happens to say.

Wow lol. I hope she learned instead of getting just defensive.
 

Cybit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,326
But when you equalize for education, white men make more.

Yep. If you want a really funny one, break it out by age category, education, and whether they have kids. The gender / racial gap does...interesting and unexpected things.

But because accounting for education, job type, and other factors makes all the gaps look a lot smaller than people expect them to, most minority groups don't want to do it. They also include educational opportunities as part of the prejudice, which means if you do try to equalize for education, they claim that the study is not appropriate / racist.
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
One thing I've noticed is that progressives like to use the black/Latino experience as a yardstick for measuring how oppressed other groups are. They ask us things like "when's the last time you got pulled over by police", but what's lost in all of this is that our experiences and histories are different. We are oppressed in ways progressives have (apparently) not yet learned to recognize.
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,262
They also subsume Jewish statistics (and those of other MENA groups) under "white". We're not even officially considered a minority at all, and very few people understand how that actually hurts us. The US/Canadian Census can go to hell.
I wouldn't necessarily blame the census. You're free to put Jewish down as your race.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
Hey, so dramatis never made it over, huh? I feel like the conversations that are going now would be right up his/her alley.
 

Miletius

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,257
Berkeley, CA
Pet I'll do a writeup on Japanese style curry for the thread showcase, if you don't mind. I think it's something that a lot of people have familiarity with and one that has an interesting and modern history.
 

Jintor

Saw the truth behind the copied door
Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,424
I'd be pretty interested in that. Japanese curry is very different from my malaysian/indian curry expectations and I'd love to know why.
 

Deleted member 2779

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,045
I tend to agree with him here. It's good to write about your background and ethnicity, but it has to be handled carefully. Amy Tan, I don't think, was very respectful or thoughtful when she wrote Joy Luck Club. I much prefer the works of people like Change-Rae Lee.

Ugh, writing this out reminds me of how little I've read these past few years.
I always knew it was a thing but didn't know that 'ethnic lit' had a name to it, is any book from Chang-Rae Lee good to step into? I've been meaning to get back into reading, for real tho!, and I'd like to know how to handle these subjects too.
 

Deleted member 2585

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,133
I always knew it was a thing but didn't know that 'ethnic lit' had a name to it, is any book from Chang-Rae Lee good to step into? I've been meaning to get back into reading, for real tho!, and I'd like to know how to handle these subjects too.

I've only read Native Speaker, and it was really good. I have Aloft sitting in my bookshelf, unread. Oops.
 
Oct 28, 2017
605
I guess now's as good a time as any to field this question.

Do East Asians experience racism in academia too? Jews sure as shit do, and because we seem to have so much else in common experience wise (just based on this thread alone), I wondered if this was a problem for you too.
 

dramazen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
510
Hey, so dramatis never made it over, huh? I feel like the conversations that are going now would be right up his/her alley.
I'm actually not sure what happened to him.

If someone has an account over there, they should see what he's up to!
My member number is lower than both of yours

Hi Riley, here's a not-food pic

77jmlcm.jpg


Hope you got one of the 100 year ones, because I lost mine :(



Oh yeah, yesterday a guy asked me if I was above or below 19 years old. Guess I'm still in the category of the thread title.