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Where are you leaning?

  • I aim to go with the more powerful system first, so it still matters

    Votes: 76 19.1%
  • I care about the power, but it’s not a dealbreaker

    Votes: 213 53.5%
  • I don’t care about the power much and will stay with my chosen brand

    Votes: 109 27.4%

  • Total voters
    398

Lionheart

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,844
It mattered because xbox one was 100 dollars more expensive and weaker. In addition to xbox brand being in toilet until they reversd course with better messaging and actions.

Power alone means less to the console war than all of that combined. Much less

Just like how ps3 having less impressive games..more difficult to program for meaning worse performing multiplats and more expensive made it butt of jokes for years.
Bingo. OP is really reaching here.

Its not very difficult but you are looking at this in a vacuum. Power and resolution do matter, but they also get cancelled out to an extent when the machine is sold for a much higher price and or comes out a year later. Because those trade offs balance out. If it is indeed more expensive, that washes out the advantage. If it is indeed a sold at a year later, people will take the console that is available now (see 360). Now if all is equal, price, launch date then power differences matter more. Now if your box is MORE expensive and weaker, resolution gate is a big deal.

Resolution gate was around during PS3 era but maybe you weren't on the forums then, PS3 was releasing worse 3rd party games then 360 while launching a year later and more expensive. You bet your ass it was a big deal on forums.

Any console manufacturer can release the most power machine, at the cost of an expensive machine. They dont have secret sauce they all have access to the same hardware. Its all about the price point they want to launch at and the time that will determine the power. If they release at 399, it will be X cost, 499, X+ $100 etc. Sony can release a $300 machine and a $1000 machine but it doesn't make business sense to do so. Sony wants one box, MS wants two. I prefer one base console at launch. OP comes off disingenuous tbh.
 

Aldi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,634
United Kingdom
I'd say the new forum has much better moderation. A lot of the animosity and trolling wouldn't fly here on Era.

This.

50+ page threads with dozens of members getting banned while other members laughed and posted Sam Jackson gifs were normal.

I'm glad to be a member of this board, not only is it better moderated but it's more transparent with its moderation too.
 

Inuhanyou

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,214
New Jersey
I'm confused by your wording. I'm asking about a specific topic of conversation that was more prevalent in the first couple years of the gen than now. Are you trying to ask me if I know some people care about things besides power? Because I feel like the poll options and OP answer that as a yes - I'm pretty clearly noting people seem to have dropped the topic possibly because of other influences in their perception.

Let me change and boil the question down a little bit for you.

Do you realize, at the very leasr, that the situation at the start of this gen is not comparable to the launch of the Pro/X or the PS5/XBSX?

The situations and variations in what makes people prioritize certain things change the perception, and power itself is only one element of that.

This.

50+ page threads with dozens of members getting the banned while other members laughed and posted Sam Jackson gifs were normal.

I'm glad to be a member of this board, not only is it better moderated but it's more transparent with its moderation too.

Eh..maybe in certain aspects. Dont go into the politics threads.
 
OP
OP

BAD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,565
USA
Let me change and boil the question down a little bit for you.

Do you realize, at the very leasr, that the situation at the start of this gen is not comparable to the launch of the Pro/X or the PS5/XBSX?

The situations and variations in what makes people prioritize certain things change the perception, and power itself is only one element of that.
I'm not sure I do understand what you think is different about the example of when Unity came out, or the X/Pro differences, compared to next gen. I'd be happy to hear your opinion on why they aren't comparable.
 

Inuhanyou

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,214
New Jersey
I'm not sure I do understand what you think is different about the example of when Unity came out, or the X/Pro differences, compared to next gen. I'd be happy to hear your opinion on why they aren't comparable.

As i said before....it takes a multitude of things for people to create their perception of value.

Xbox One got so much shit in regards to PS4, not just for resolution or power disparity. That alone would not have created such a furvor.

Games, services, power, branding/marketing, price and a lot else determine the variables, but not just one element.

The power disparity was the final straw and largely just a vehicle for people to express the chip on the shoulder they had with MS and the Xbox brand, for a terrible launch and that never really left them in a good position. Especially when Sony started bringing out their titles and MS continued to lag behind.

It was the same for the PS3 which had a terrible launch and a terrible first few years that Sony spend the entire rest of the generation trying to make up for. Shitting on Sony was common and them having worse performing games despite being more expensive and supposedly on paper more powerful in certain ways made it much worse.

With Pro Vs X, it was literally just releasing a stronger box. But MS still didnt really do much to take advantage of that with games while PS4 was still hitting it out of the park, and it came a year later than pro and understandably more expensive, so the rush for people to care about power in itself was also very low.

With PS5 and XBSX, they both seem to be coming in learnt from the mistakes of the past, and running with game libraries and strong services as draws, so again not a proper comparison to the beginning of this gen. Power being a single aspect for a lot of people after the good will in branding that Sony built up this gen.
 

Fisty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,227
I think power was important to the PS4 initially, absent any games. But really, games are all that matter and that will never change. Regardless, Playstation still wins graphics awards over Xbox, even though Xbox has nearly 2 more Tflops... which just goes to show that power doesnt even really matter for graphics.
 

dynamitejim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
884
720p looks like ass on modern 40"+ displays. It also didn't help that XBO originally had crushed blacks and super aggressive sharpening in it's hardware upscaling. TBH, even 1080p is starting to look bad with the blur most modern TAA solutions inherently have. The image sharpening in newer AMD drivers/cards works impressively well on TAA blur, so maybe next gen systems will be better able to combat it.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,926
Resolution gate was around during PS3 era but maybe you weren't on the forums then, PS3 was releasing worse 3rd party games then 360 while launching a year later and more expensive. You bet your ass it was a big deal on forums.
This is a good point but one notable difference is the heated comparisons persisted in 360vPS3 throughout their lifecycle while that sort of stuff died down for PS4vXBO right around the period the OP mentions.
 

JeffGubb

Giant Bomb
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
842
it stopped being a thing when exclusives started coming out for the consoles and people started actually playing games instead of trying to justify why they spent money on a system they were barely using.
 

Burrman

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,633
I noticed this talk stop once the Xbox one x came out. DF threads died down after its little launch window. Power matters but only to a certain extent.
 

get2sammyb

Editor at Push Square
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
3,009
UK
The differences were always overplayed and have only been getting less and less meaningful. I don't think many people care at this point.
 

Deleted member 1476

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,449
People never forgave anything, things change as the console wars goes.

It goes way back than this example (you can probably go back even to the time Sega had a console) but just talking about the past two gens, people who gave a shit about power when the x360 was stronger were suddenly fine with the XB1 being weaker and with 720p games. Then they started caring about power again when the XBX released.

Same with Playstation, people argued about exclusives during the PS3 then when the PS4 arrived they changed to power. When the PS Pro was weaker, the conversation went back to exclusives again.

It's a cycle that will never end.
 

Calvinien

Banned
Jul 13, 2019
2,970
[QUO
the honest truth that no one wants to admit is that the power gap complaint only goes one way on this site. It was a big deal when xbox was less powerful, but once it became more powerful exclusives suddenly seemed to matter alot more, and power really didnt anymore amongst users. I just wish that some people here would admit to just preffering playstation over xbox no matter the difference between the consoles. It would save a lot of tripping over excuses then working to quickly move a goal post. Its okay to prefer one brand over another, and to want to see it succeed. Playstation fans (xbox fans too) just need to stop being so disingenuous and become more transparent regarding their prefference.

It isn't limited to this site. And it isn't limited to power gap. Lack of exclusives gets the same treatment. The early days of the ps4 were so bereft of quality exclusives that Andrew house apologized to the shareholders over it. The xbox one had a bunch of interesting exclusives every year until around 2016 when they started to peter out. But early in the generation exclusiv didn't matter. Resolution did. And then it didn't. When the relative power of the SX and ps5 was leaked, power and graphics didn't matter. But tell that to all the concern trolling about cross gen exclusives. Suddenly everyone is 'concerned' about a theoretical and temporary gap in performance at a time when the new consoles will be at their least compelling.

You hit the nail on the head. A bunch of the discussion is dominated by console wars BS.
 

British

Member
Dec 15, 2018
87
I'm looking forward to seeing performance comparisons once the new consoles come out. It will probably influence my purchase decision by about 40%, with exclusives and services.
 

pksu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,240
Finland
There was like a 17-page thread over hypothetical teraflops in the next gen consoles a week ago here. The cycle will continue as long as there are competing platforms.
Yeah...it's not going to stop anytime soon. People will keep on counting pixels and complaining about something not being rendered in native 4k in the future too.
 

Orioto

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,716
Paris
Hm i'm pretty sure when the 2 new consoles hit and comparison vids about multiplatform games start to be made, it'll be war again, don't worry.

I'd also say beyond exclusives, there is an economic reality now about perf war. Evenif that doesn't change a lot, if one or the other console costs the same but big multi titles at lunch runs less good on it, i'm convinced you have a certain demographic now that will compare and chose accordingly. Basically, "what's the best Callof machine for my bucks".
 

scabobbs

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,104
It turns out it really didn't matter much would be my guess. I think it had much more to do with the price being $100 more, and it being "weaker" on top of that really ruffled the hardcore gamers feathers.

I dont think you saw it much with the mid gen refresh consoles because it wasn't a new generation so less people cared. Still, there are probably plenty of folks who are playing on the Xbox One X over PS4 because it's the superior hardware I imagine.

My guess is you'll see a lot of this stuff return when the ps5 and Xbox series X come out since it's a brand new generation of consoles. If pricing is the same between the two though I don't think it'll matter.
 

monmagman

Member
Dec 6, 2018
4,126
England,UK
I really don't care how games look on systems I don't own...why would I.
I played games on PS3 that had higher rez on Xbox360.....didn't care.I've played games on base PS4 that had lower rez on Xbox One....didn't care.I'm now playing games on base PS4 that have higher rez on Xbox One X/PS4Pro....still don't care.
I'll probably be PS5 only next gen and I'll take whatever resolutions are offered....just give me great games.
 

Tyaren

Character Artist
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
24,788
I'm not able to vote here, because none of the poll options apply to me. :/
I do not care about power and I do not have a "chosen brand" with which I stick. I get the console with the games that appeal to me the most. This generation it was mostly the PS4, last generation it was mostly the Xbox360 and before that it was mostly Nintendo consoles.
 

Tagyhag

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,507
It's usually just early gen system wars.

It will absolutely happen again for the first 1-2 years of next gen, and then it'll die down again once people realize it's about the games.
 

ArjanN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,114
I feel there was definitely a certain amount of fanboyism to it, in that whatever argument works best against the other tribe is important and if it looks bad for your team then it suddenly doesn't matter.

I feel generally in the back half of the console cycle there's less tribalism though, probably because most people are locked into an ecosystem for that gen anyway.
 

Pryme

Member
Aug 23, 2018
8,164
The power disparity was the final straw and largely just a vehicle for people to express the chip on the shoulder they had with MS and the Xbox brand, for a terrible launch and that never really left them in a good position. Especially when Sony started bringing out their titles and MS continued to lag behind.

This only really started to happen in 2016 ish. Resolution-gate trolling and platform warring started from Day 1 2013. And the Xbox didn't have a 'terrible launch'. Surely you mean the reveal?
 

gothmog

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,434
NY
If the announcement that there will not be Series X exclusives for a while is right, then it seems that Microsoft's whole strategy is rooted in letting the consumer decide the tradeoff between price, power, and performance. I guarantee there will be a ton of S vs X vs Series X articles when people get their hands on Halo Infinite. So nobody has forgiven the power differences, and Microsoft in this case is leaning in to it.

PS5's power is unknown at this point, so I am not going to lose sleep over rumors at this point. I trust that Sony will put together a compelling package which probably makes it easier to "forgive" the imaginary power differences at this point.
 

Black_Stride

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
7,389
I got an XBox One VCR knowing it was weaker and more expensive than the PS4.
The ecosystem is what actually got me to stick with MS.

With Phil at the helm i dont see MS making any major mistakes again, so imma stick with them next gen....even if im not buying at launch ill still be on Gamepass with my PC and XB1
 

Spades

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,781
People seemed to stop caring when MS had the more powerful console. It was literally all we read about on boards when the OG consoles first came out and then when the Pro/X were released, most people seemed to play it down.
 

Sprat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,684
England
None of the poll options match my situation. Power is nice but I doubt really care. I go where the games I want to play are over everything else.
 

zma1013

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,687
It was more about games not utilizing my 1080p tv for me.

When it's the 2nd set of HD consoles and the majority of your games still can't do 1080p HD and are even struggling to run 720p, that's an issue for me. I could forgive it during PS3/360 era because of the new HD development issues, but not now.

The Pro and X consoles hit 1080p with ease for virtually most titles so it wasn't an issue. Now maybe when I eventually upgrade to a 4K display, I will probably care about what console can run resolutions above 1080p.
 

bionic77

Member
Oct 25, 2017
30,894
My prediction for the console wars of the next generation is that resolution will often be the same on both consoles so we will have to pick something else to argue about. My guess will be load times. My ass is telling me that Sony's console will be weaker than MS's but will have slightly faster load times. That will be the new benchmark for the brave console warriors on whether or not a game is trash.

'Call of Duty loads 10% lower on the console I don't own making it unplayable!'

Many usernames and accounts will be lost on the fight over this.
 

Dog of Bork

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,993
Texas
I buy consoles for exclusive games. MS has made that very easy next gen, which is awesome. Hopefully someday their philosophy spreads.

Power has never been my primary (or even top 3) reason to buy a console.
 

ty_hot

Banned
Dec 14, 2017
7,176
This thread makes no sense, you start by talking about AC Unity looking the same on PS4 and Xbox One despite the PS4 being mre powerful and the devs clearly saying that they were in fact doing that. Then everything else you said has almost nothing related to that. The comparison would only make sense if a dev came out and said Xbox One X games will look the same as the PS4 Pro, despite being more powerful because they wanted them to look the same. About next gen, it is all speculation and nothing points to the direction of versions looking the same despite one being more powerful than the other.

And lol maturing of gamers yeah sure
 

CatAssTrophy

Member
Dec 4, 2017
7,621
Texas
Though I love their content and they are absolutely blameless in any of this kind of stuff, I do think the rise in performance comparison videos like the ones DF does can provide a bit of fuel for that. It becomes a competition between platforms or the gulf between the differences is made to feel larger than it is.

I can understand (and am very outspoken about) issues with performance making the experience worse, like FPS dropping, tearing, input lag, etc. but counting pixels and showing a graph at the number of times 2 different consoles switched resolutions during a scene is something else entirely.
 

laxu

Member
Nov 26, 2017
2,782
Power aside, for resolution we are starting to reach "it doesn't matter that much" levels on consoles as well.

With GPUs (and hopefully next gen consoles as well) offering features like context-aware image sharpening or AI upscaling, the difference between 3840x2160 (4K) and say 3264x1836 (0.85x 4K) is hard to tell without being able to compare the two easily like you can on PC. I'd even go as far as to say that resolutions between 1440p and 4K don't have a massive difference in overall visual fidelity and it gets to more diminishing returns the closer you get to native 4K.

So 900p vs 1080p can be a more significant difference than 1440p vs 4K. The more pixels you have the more fine detail can be resolved and the easier it is for image sharpening algorithms to also make up for any blurriness from non-native resolutions.
 

CatAssTrophy

Member
Dec 4, 2017
7,621
Texas
Yeah that's definitely true. It's different from when HD tv's were first a thing, and displaying any non-native resolution signal to it looked like hot garbage. Scaler chips and checkerboarding algorithms etc have made things a lot better for sure.

I play Ni No Kuni Remastered in 1440p/60fps mode on my 4K tv and cannot tell a difference between that and the native 4K mode at all. At the beginning of this gen though that might have been a different story.
 

Rosol

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,397
There definitely have been comparison threads about Xbox one x having better versions especially when RDR2 came out. They're simply not as popular, as less people own the stop gap systems, and on average more people on PlayStation. I think though as we get towards the end of a gen no one cares about the comparisons as much, many enthusiasts become pc gamers waiting on the next console. Also the consensus had already been set, I think we're in for another heated battle again once we get full reveals on the next gen systems. The one thing I really loath on this forum is when people try to suggest one group of fans is worse than another's.
 
Dec 4, 2017
11,481
Brazil
Scorpio came too late in this gen, it came at the end of 2017. 4 years latter. By the time it arrived people were too invested in the new IP'S/GOTY contenders.

"OMG, now I can spend 500 dollars on this powerful console... Or buy as many games I want"

It isn't too hard to understand. In 2013 you would spend 100 dollars more in a weaker machine, how is that supposed to work without stellar first party games? Nintendo did an amazing job making switch different enough to get people's attention and launching with a new Zelda.
 

Angst

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,426
I feel like the OP is trying reeeeeeaaaaallly hard to say "I think you're all Sony fanboys" without actually saying it.
 

Deleted member 12352

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,203
Over? I thought it just transitioned into the yawnsome checkerboarding vs "true" 4k arguments.

I feel like the OP is trying reeeeeeaaaaallly hard to say "I think you're all Sony fanboys" without actually saying it.

Lotta that going around lately.

Generational transitions always brings out the crazies and salt.
 

HommePomme

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,052
4K-ish (checker boarding, 1800p upscale, 4K native, etc) is basically good enough that I don't expect people to care that much about resolution differences this time, whereas before the Xbox One was more expensive and running some games at the same resolution as PS3/XBOX360.

Still prefer the more powerful console, of course, but minor differences in things like shadow resolution might not be as immediately obvious and comparable as 1080p -> 900/720p.

I expect these new consoles to be even more similar than before as they probably will have the same memory architecture, as opposed to the weird embedded ram disaster that the Xbox One launched with.
 

Jazar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,478
South Florida
I feel like the OP is trying reeeeeeaaaaallly hard to say "I think you're all Sony fanboys" without actually saying it.
These kinds of threads have been popping up a lot lately it seems.

I'm going to give answer as to why things have changed a bit since the PS4/XBoxOne launch personally.

1) Xbox was not only the weaker console it was the more expensive one. That's basically the beginning and end of the discussion.

2) The PS4/One generation started with a clean slate. With basically no backwards compatibility at launch the decision to buy a console was focused only on the games that were launching with the system. The PS3/360 libraries were off the table. Had Xbox started with your 360 library carrying forward a LOT of people would have overlooked the differences bit the bullet and stayed loyal. This upcoming generation customers are going to have to decide on whether they want to leave their old libraries behind if they want to switch brands.

3) 4K Televisions not as widely adopted as 1080p sets - diminishing returns. I still don't have a 4k set so for me it was a much bigger deal to get away from sub 1080p resolutions than sub 4k with these current systems.
 

Deleted member 3010

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,974
With time it's an issue where diminishing return will make a power difference a lot more tolerable.

Most people will be a LOT less bothered by say, a 1800p signal over 4K (2160p) than a 720p one over 1080p.

I say this as I'm gaming on a 1070Ti card which runs most games at 1800p on my 4K display. Unless you're real close to the screen, you most likely won't notice.
 

TooLive

Member
Jan 28, 2019
194
There was a lot of animosity in threads early this gen, in particular when unlike most multiplatform releases, AC Unity devs revealed they were moving toward visual parity for that game. Many had happily been documenting games that had a lower resolution on base Xbox One up to this point, so there was an outcry by some when for no clear reason, resolution of PS4's Unity would be no better than the less powerful Xbox One.

This topic around the resolution differences in the early gen was so pervasive it was given a nickname and reported on.



But then I noticed a weird halt to this discussion by the time Xbox One X hit. Despite it becoming the best system for multiplatform games, I didn't see much of a response anymore when it became clear that PS4 Pro was quickly outrun and has had the worse looking versions of many big games, from Red Dead Redemption 2 to Battlefront 2. But ok, maybe people at this point had spent enough this gen and were ok that Xbox One X had more power a year after PS4 Pro.

But when polled about next gen, people still seem to be ready to forgive the potentially weaker PS5 up against a seemingly confirmed powerhouse Series X. No longer am I seeing people so invested in their best version of multiplatform releases. It almost feels like the resolution doesn't matter to people now. Is this a maturing of gamers? Or is it tied to their favorite brand being the one that fell behind in power?
Haven't you heard? "Resolution-gate" is dead the new thing is "Cross-gen Games-gate"
 

Arklite

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,640
If the PS5 has games often releasing at 1080p resolution like the X1 often had games at 720p, it will absolutely come back. The reason people aren't bitching today is because most everyone who cares about resolution is covered by an option on their preferred platforms.
 

funky

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,527
its all about the mix of price to power IMO

Xb1 got so much flack early on because it was clearly less powerful and more expensive / the same price as PS4 once Kinect was removed. If the Xb1 was 50 bucks cheaper I think a lot of the bullshit could have been avoided.

If Lockhart still has the big new visual bells of the XSX (Ray Tracing, targeting high framerates) but is targeting 1080p instead of 4K and is $200 cheaper I think that will be the most disruptive system next gen.