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CDPR: Cyberpunk 2077 will still have "some very occasional" 3rd person cutscenes
- Thread starter Son of Sparda
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With indie games we have more diversity than ever, maybe you're looking in the wrong avenues.
Why do you think the option feels so off in Bethesda games and completely lacks polish?
Considering that it was so they could focus on a more ambitious way of handling cinematics than the witcher 3, highly doubt it.
Literally read the thread on why driving around having a 3rd person perspective makes sense. To be blunt as possible It doesn't seem like it wouldn't be a hard amount of to you because you've never worked on a game and thus you are suggesting some asinine armchair developer tier hot takes. Like, nothing is free in game development, things take time to implement, things take time to polish, that time spent takes away from other things.
The divinity games are on console, the recent torment game launched on console, and planescape torment comes to console this month.
Not saying you can't have a preference against them, just not sure it's appropriate to lean so heavily on "those are pc games" angle.
While third person cutscenes being axed is unfortunate, I have faith they'll get it right, especially with the potential in that clip I linked.
Cyberpunk 2077 threads are exposing some real culture-clash between people who grew up on JRPGs and people who grew up on CRPGs. The two genres eventually developed completely different sets of expectations for their players.
Maybe it's the fact that Witcher 3 is a 3rd person game with a pre-written protagonist which made it a bit more palatable to people who grew up on console RPGs. In other aspects though, CDProjekt's games and development have been clearly inspired by CRPGs. CP77 furthermore is based on a tabletop game. It makes perfect sense they'd take it in a direction that aligns more with Fallout and Deus Ex.
Maybe it's the fact that Witcher 3 is a 3rd person game with a pre-written protagonist which made it a bit more palatable to people who grew up on console RPGs. In other aspects though, CDProjekt's games and development have been clearly inspired by CRPGs. CP77 furthermore is based on a tabletop game. It makes perfect sense they'd take it in a direction that aligns more with Fallout and Deus Ex.
Dunno man, are you sure you're not mistaking dialogue scenes with actual cutscenes?
Though I'll most likely be fine with this decision when the game ships. It's just a bit odd realizing that you barely see your character.
But I'm sure they will do some cool stuff with the FPV at least.
I'm more talking about the style than about the platform. I HAVE Divinity on PS4 and I made it all the way through the first act before giving up - I just don't enjoy it at all. Like I said before, I just have absolutely no nostalgia for the Infinity Engine era of CRPGs. I see what they're going for and I'm sure they executed it very nicely but it holds zero appeal or entertainment value for me.
The same way every movie ever portrays body horror? You can defend the decision to make the game strictly first person without attacking third person as a legitimate perspective when it's been used in every genre in every way for a hundred years.
Every part of Bethesda games feels off and lacks polish.
Removing proper cinematography from a game isn't a more ambitious move and certainly leads to less time devoted to crafting cutscenes, which in turn leads to lower cost of development.
What a disappointment, the more i hear about this game my interest keeps going down, from sure purchase to rental to see if i like it.
Fair enough, just wasn't sure if you were framing "PC games" as a literal platform barrier or preference barrier.
Let me be completely unfair and move my goal posts a bit then, my original response was a bit off the cuff and unnecessary. I see this kind of first person body horror and think it is extremely cool and something I have never seen done in videogames before, if the entire game is filled with moments like this then I'm completely fine with the removal of third person (which is unfortunate as it showed a lot of personality) but I am confident CDPR will get it right.
Most of the best and well renowned CRPGs are isometric so I'm not sure what you mean by this.
It's still day 1 for me, I just doubt it's going to be April.
It's a bit of both. I have a history of my gaming PCs developing crippling hardware issues very quickly and eventually I just gave up on the platform entirely after my last graphics card imploded three years ago because I don't enjoy hardware customization and I don't get paid well enough to replace parts when they die.
I was also raised on Macs (my dad is a graphic designer, so that's all we had), so my options for computer games were always extremely limited. I never developed the kind of affinity for PC-focused RPGs that a lot of CRPG fans love - I played stuff like BG2 well after Chrono Trigger, Suikoden II and Tactics Ogre defined my taste in RPGs so going back to them was always me dicking around for like an hour and then getting bored by the core mechanics.
The one computer RPG I really had any love for was the Diablo series, and that's more or less a hack and slash than an RPG so my expectations were very different.
So driving in third person (even though it's not as "Immersive" as first person) is ok but third person while walking is "not ok because muh immersion?" You lose all right to use "immersion" as a defense for no third person while exploring but then throw it in for driving, imo.
There is NOTHING you can do while driving in third that you can't do in third, it's an option and just like the viewpoint when on foot, people like using one or the other.
I know nothing is free in game dev, but you're literally acting like having a simple walk/run animation for the player character in a third person view (which the animation already exists for npc's) is some insurmountable thing that can NOT be done in the game, like it'd take hundreds of hours to offer or do, I literally showed you a THREE MINUTE video of how easily someone (in Maya) can take an animation set and then "share" it between one character and another, three minutes.
There are literal MODS in Skyrim/Fallout, etc that allows you to share npc animations with the player character and things too.
Well first and foremost we know that different outfits change the way people look at you based on "cool" and "street cred" stats. Beyond actual gameplay implications though you can still take personal pleasure in how your character looks despite not getting to see them all the time. I don't have a third person camera in real life and I kind of care how I end up looking on a day to day basis.
Look, I get it. That's real life versus a video game. "What's even the point in a dumb video game?" I don't know... role playing? It is a role playing game after all. You can still wear a jacket just because it looks cool even though you don't see it all the time. Take some personal pleasure in it. That's your character. Plus, you will be able to see yourself when you drive around in third person, and you'll probably catch glimpses of your character in a mirror every now and then. It's more subtle. Modern game design makes it pretty clear that subtlety isn't good enough these days since everything needs to be painfully clear and obvious, but its nice to see when developers are willing to be more subtle.
Again, if first person is enough to turn you off because you really need to see and customize your character then so be it, but it's really dumb to ask "what's even the point?!?!?"
But a lot are also 1st person, and what CP77 is doing is clearly following in the footsteps of PC games like Deus Ex, System Shock, and Ultima Underworld. The 3D Fallout games are clearly in that mold as well despite having optional 3rd person modes.
That's the thing, CDPR's goal is to make them one and the same. Which is why dialogue options keep popping up during fully animated scenes:
and yes this was a big highlight during the first demo:
and that's been a big goal of theirs since the witcher 3:
it's all for the sake of immersion and roleplay.
Having a first person perspective doesn't mean that you're removing proper cinematography. And when your intention is to have lots of cinematics interruptible and full of variables, that leads to a shit ton of work compared to a cinematic that'd be the same every time. Like even something like this starts to get costly when there are lot of instances of it.
Boi, that had to be a huge amount of assets sent to the dumpster. Certainly not a good production process.
How come? All that should've changed was camera action really. Unless they had 3rd person views outside of player's location, that is.
which is why the "it was obviously done to lower development costs" take is pretty silly. It's probably just CDPR's preference to have the game be in first person as much as possible.
Disappointing, I was hoping I'd get a lot more opportunities to see my character without needing to find a mirror as well as playing around with visual customization, but now that big part of my interest in the game has just been removed. :/
Also: some of you need to realize it's not a matter of which perspective you play in this game, but the fact that they were showing this game for a long time to have a mix of both and then *changed* it to only be one view. They set up expectations and then didn't meet them.
It's a big change and considering how much they were showing otherwise is where I think the issue is. I'm sure if it swung the other way we'd have people on the other side complaining about TP view as well.
Also: some of you need to realize it's not a matter of which perspective you play in this game, but the fact that they were showing this game for a long time to have a mix of both and then *changed* it to only be one view. They set up expectations and then didn't meet them.
It's a big change and considering how much they were showing otherwise is where I think the issue is. I'm sure if it swung the other way we'd have people on the other side complaining about TP view as well.
Yet none of those games mentioned have deep character customisation like CB2077. And the ones that do have a tpp toggle. You can see why people would expect to see their characters more if there is a whole customisation feature at the start of the game that lets you adjust the characters chin depth along with other minute facial features right?
before that decision they should have spent in mocap for the protagonist and on a cinematics director, artists along other things needed to craft a cutscenes third person. I guess a big chunck of that work will be wasted.
If I can look down at my character and/or look in a mirror/reflection then it is obvious why you would want customization still. Hell I rarely see my character in Fallout/TES titles, but I still care what I look like in those games (I play only in 1st person).
I prefer first person for the immersiveness but it's gonna suck that all your character customization will only be visible on mirrors (from the gameplay trailer with Samurai) or opening up the menu..
Edit: On second thought, it doesn't really change much, does it. They would still use mocap data, but mount game camera on the actors head. Happy to be corrected tho.
Yes end of story. 🤷♂️
Yea just like all those other games that have super polished 3rd person mods that totally aren't exact examples of why perspective is something that has to be incredibly thought out. Like resident evil 7, which is super playable in 3rd person.
er...or mirror's edge?
ummm..
Watching people attempt to play a first person shooter in third person is gonna look hilarious tbh.
Not very likely tbh. We can infer that the intention was to have the game in first person as much as possible. So it's not really a big loss to not have 3rd person cutscenes since the majority of them would've been in first person anyway if the demo's ratio is any indication.
You're assuming that a third person object and model is spawned in while on foot. Notably the vehicles have only shown third person models after the transition into to them has happened. Likewise the body might only be spawned in for cutscenes, like that mirror.
Then assuming you do manage to spawn in a first person model, where do you anchor it?
That dead island video actually can be misleading. Some first person games don't even spawn a body, or they don't spawn it inside the world.
There are so many unknowns here, that simply saying "do this here, it will be simple." Is overly simplifying what is required.
I hate the immersion excuse. I was fine with the game being first person only, but first person only cutscenes, especially in a game with character customization, is shitty.
This is.... rather fucking weird. And while I will play the game, this is seriously lowering my hype and I would like to hear an official statement as to why do this.
Because yes: What the fuck is the point of major customization if you are going to remove most instances one would even be able to see your character. Deus Ex is a title that combined third and first person relatively effectively. Most of the game is first person, but certain actions in gameplay switch to TPS and dialogue is entirely in third person save for very few.
This is really disappointing.
Because yes: What the fuck is the point of major customization if you are going to remove most instances one would even be able to see your character. Deus Ex is a title that combined third and first person relatively effectively. Most of the game is first person, but certain actions in gameplay switch to TPS and dialogue is entirely in third person save for very few.
This is really disappointing.
yeah i'll spend half an hour dicking around with CC on TES/Fallout despite it'll be 1st person the whole time. i get the overall argument here but lot of roleplay boils down to imagination
What makes you think we won't be able to see ourselves at all?
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