AOC and TNC (Ta-Nehisi Coates) on MLK Day

[Deleted member 7130]

Who misses Joe Crowley now? lol

I think she's the kind of political figure this country has needed for a long time and I hope some of the other freshmen like Rashida Tlaib are of a similar position. Hopefully more will come in future elections. There always seemed to be roadblocks either by circumstance or by conscious intervention to bring together both social and economic justice into the pantheon of actual policy making in this country. So I'm excited to see what comes as a result of the POV that people like AOC will inject into our national discourse and legislative bodies.

 

[Brinbe]

Absolutely amazing, especially that last five minutes or so. Anyone that still doubts AOC, show them this interview. She's the real deal and she gets it. She gets that it's not about her and she understands the urgency of our current situation.

More than anything I hope she inspires so many other intelligent and talented young minds to come out and change the way things are done in our politics.

 

[Deleted member 1248]

Who misses Joe Crowley now? lol

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idontknowher.gif

 

[Deleted member 22490]

A sitting US Congressperson just talked about the workers owning the means of production in a positive way. When was the last time that happened? The early 1900s?

 

[CrocM]

A sitting US Congressperson just talked about the workers owning the means of production in a positive way. When was the last time that happened? The early 1900s?

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Pre-Reagan at least I'd assume.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

Pre-Reagan at least I'd assume.

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Yeah, at least. Her statement in itself is huge.

 

[Kotto]

"We don't have to compromise our values to find common ground with other people." - AOC

Where Boogie at

 

[Mivey]

AOC is what many Trump voters wanted to vote for and thought they were voting for: someone who would fight for the common person and shake things up in DC

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Why would white supremacists (or enablers of such people) that dream about going back to pre Civil Rights era or even further back, wanna vote for a non-white woman that talks about helping minorities?

 

[Unknown Unknown]

This is the type of talk about socialism, democratic socialism, a responsible technocratic movement cognizant of the consequences, of the effects on communities and taking these things into account when developing legislation which when communicated clearly can appeal more broadly.
She makes it clear that it isn't communism, which is important. That it's still capitalism but workers get to benefit more from the wealth generated by their labour.
Her understanding of shifting of the Overton Window and asking for more than what was necessary to accommodate the disingenuous engagement from Republicans on policy was helpful in contextualizing and understanding her tactic in asking for 70% marginal tax rate.
It was great to hear her talk about her internal processes involving social media.
She's incredible in how well she articulated all this. Inspirational.

 

[sphagnum]

Pre-Reagan at least I'd assume.

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More like pre-Cold War.

 

[Stardestroyer]

Why would white supremacists (or enablers of such people) that dream about going back to pre Civil Rights era or even further back, wanna vote for a non-white woman that talks about helping minorities?

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They meant in terms of rhetoric. They wanted someone to call out the Washington sc elites.

They didn't literally mean AOC.

 

[WedgeX]

A sitting US Congressperson just talked about the workers owning the means of production in a positive way. When was the last time that happened? The early 1900s?

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Not ever actually elected, but not since the days of Upton Sinclair and Eugene Debs.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

Not ever actually elected, but not since the days of Upton Sinclair and Eugene Debs.

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And that's a loooong time. AOC just made history as far as I'm concerned.

 

[blackw0lf48]

A sitting US Congressperson just talked about the workers owning the means of production in a positive way. When was the last time that happened? The early 1900s?

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Liz Warren has a proposal where corporations would be required to have workers make up 40 percent of the board of directors.

Of course Warren is a capitalist, but it's interesting how we see a lot of socialist ideas becoming embraced by those who don't actually embrace socialism.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

Liz Warren has a proposal where corporations would be required to have workers make up 40 percent of the board of directors.

Of course Warren is a capitalist, but it's interesting how we see a lot of socialist ideas becoming embraced by those who don't actually embrace socialism.

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Warren is about workplace co-determination/workplace democracy, but AOC basically said that workers should own the means of production. It's what Richard Wolff talks about all of the time. Though, if I'm wrong, it's still an amazing thing.

 

[blackw0lf48]

Warren is about workplace co-determination/workplace democracy, but AOC basically said that workers should own the means of production. It's what Richard Wolff talks about all of the time. Though, if I'm wrong, it's still an amazing thing.

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True, as I said Warren is a capitalist. Just pointing out that we're seeing trends towards more worker ownership.

We see this in the housing discussion also with a greater focus on housing co-ops and community land trusts.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

True, as I said Warren is a capitalist. Just pointing out that we're seeing trends towards more worker ownership.

We see this in the housing discussion also with a greater focus on housing co-ops and community land trusts.

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Oh yeah. I'm glad it's moving in that direction, too. It's sorely needed and it's very palatable to everyone. I sometimes talk to my coworkers about workplace democracy and no one immediately jumps up and shouts COMMUNISM!

 

[sphagnum]

Oh yeah. I'm glad it's moving in that direction, too. It's sorely needed and it's very palatable to everyone. I sometimes talk to my coworkers about workplace democracy and no one immediately jumps up and shouts COMMUNISM!

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Well, why would they? Barely anyone knows the actual definition of communism.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

Well, why would they? Barely anyone knows the actual definition of communism.

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Pretty much. The Red Scare kind of created its own blind spot in regards to this. By making everyone think it means a bigger government, it gives us space to come in and say "why the boss get to keep all the profit when we do all of the work?" Don't even have to mention the government.

 

[AncientReptileBrain]

Is this video still around somewhere?

 

[GrrImAFridge]

Is this video still around somewhere?

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It hasn't been removed. It just can't be viewed as an embed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3-QvoIfpxc

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

Just like I said in the other thread about her, she's effectively the leader of the Democratic Party and she is certainly its future. If we are to survive fascism, climate change, and injustice, the party needs to be moving in her direction

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AOC is definitely the future of the party, but she isn't its leader. She has her role to play as Pelosi's attack dog and moving the country left in the media and social media, which is a big job not every politician can do and she's great at that task. She's a brand new kind of politician who leads her followers, not the party itself. The party won't move with her by default, she's going to have flex her political muscles to make that happen and she's nowhere that influential yet.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

Pretty much. The Red Scare kind of created its own blind spot in regards to this. By making everyone think it means a bigger government, it gives us space to come in and say "why the boss get to keep all the profit when we do all of the work?" Don't even have to mention the government.

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To be fair, the government has to get involved eventually with adjusting its economic system. The public isn't going to do that on its own while the government drinks coffee in the background.

 

[sphagnum]

To be fair, the government has to get involved eventually with adjusting its economic system. The public isn't going to do that on its own while the government drinks coffee in the background.

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It would be more of a background role though. I would expect she would want to adopt something like Corbyn's policy of first right of refusal.

 

[Deleted member 22490]

AOC is definitely the future of the party, but she isn't its leader. She has her role to play as Pelosi's attack dog and moving the country left in the media and social media, which is a big job not every politician can do and she's great at that task. She's a brand new kind of politician who leads her followers, not the party itself. The party won't move with her by default, she's going to have flex her political muscles to make that happen and she's nowhere that influential yet.

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She's not a "leader" in an official way, but she is a leader in that she is driving the narrative of the party and pushing it left.

To be fair, the government has to get involved eventually with adjusting its economic system. The public isn't going to do that on its own while the government drinks coffee in the background.

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Well, yeah. Obviously it would get involved eventually, but depending on who I talk to, I don't have to mention the government. This is just stating the obvious.

 

[Canyon]

Hey, that "breathe fire" remark from AOC gave me palpitations.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

It would be more of a background role though. I would expect she would want to adopt something like Corbyn's policy of first right of refusal.

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I don't see the US government being alright with its own citizens having that type of control of its economic system. The government would have to significantly change with the Republicans and Dems for that to have a slight chance of occurring, anything less and this ends before it began.

She's not a "leader" in an official way, but she is a leader in that she is driving the narrative of the party and pushing it left.

Well, yeah. Obviously it would get involved eventually, but depending on who I talk to, I don't have to mention the government. This is just stating the obvious.

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Fair enough.

 

[sphagnum]

I don't see the US government being alright with its own citizens having that type of control of its economic system. The government would have to significantly change with the Republicans and Dems for that to have a slight chance of occurring, anything less and this ends before it began.

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Well of course not. It's an apparatus of the bourgeoisie.

The goal is to change that.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

Well of course not. It's an apparatus of the bourgeoisie.

The goal is to change that.

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The force required to accomplish sidelining the government like that would affectively make them the new government. The logistics involved in succeeded that are incredible, something the socialist movement in America has never achieved in its history. Socialists in Latin America I could see doing that, however, like what occurred in Brazil when they took over the country from the fascists by the late 80's.

 

[sphagnum]

The force required to accomplish sidelining the government like that would affectively make them the new government. The logistics involved in succeeded that are incredible, something the socialist movement in America has never achieved in its history. Socialists in Latin America I could see doing that, however, like what occurred in Brazil when they took over the country from the fascists by the late 80's.

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I don't think anyone expects this to be anything other than a protracted struggle.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

I don't think anyone expects this to be anything other than a protracted struggle.

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Then this remains more of a dream than a realistic goal. Brazil socialists were under worse conditions and they succeeded so why were they able to do something American's can't? Once the American socialists figure that out and replicate it it'd be a game changer and you'll be one step closer to this being reality.

 

[MickeyKnox]

I was already a fan but this conversation is incredible. Thank you for the link.

 

[Snowy]

Not a big TNC fan, but AOC really does seem to be the perfect synthesis of basically every part of the Dem coalition. She's really something.

 

[Tom Nook Says...]

AOC is definitely the future of the party, but she isn't its leader. She has her role to play as Pelosi's attack dog and moving the country left in the media and social media, which is a big job not every politician can do and she's great at that task. She's a brand new kind of politician who leads her followers, not the party itself. The party won't move with her by default, she's going to have flex her political muscles to make that happen and she's nowhere that influential yet.

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I imagine things are going to get real when she starts naming names in regard to primarying people in 2020, and her success in doing so will basically make or break her as the de facto leader of the party, or at least accelerate/decelerate the speed at which it happens.

 

[Juan29.Zapata]

The force required to accomplish sidelining the government like that would affectively make them the new government. The logistics involved in succeeded that are incredible, something the socialist movement in America has never achieved in its history. Socialists in Latin America I could see doing that, however, like what occurred in Brazil when they took over the country from the fascists by the late 80's.

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I feel like Socialists in Latin America are mostly tankies though. At least the ones I know in Colombia. Or are so unliked by their background (like being in guerrilla groups), that they can't reach AOC levels.

 

[Ichthyosaurus]

I feel like Socialists in Latin America are mostly tankies though. At least the ones I know in Colombia. Or are so unliked by their background (like being in guerrilla groups), that they can't reach AOC levels.

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I was talking about political parties like the Workers Party from Brazil.

I imagine things are going to get real when she starts naming names in regard to primarying people in 2020, and her success in doing so will basically make or break her as the de facto leader of the party, or at least accelerate/decelerate the speed at which it happens.

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She's already angered people in the party by threatening this, it's why she's a controversial figure in various sections of the Democrats. I agree, things will get rocky when it happens in real time.