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Anyone else think that Horizon FW's main villain is kinda problematic?

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ket

ket

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The main villain of Horizon FW was revealed recently as a female tribal leader named Regalla.

Regalla is played by a famous Black actress named Angela Bassett. This is what Regalla looks like:

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Her face design is clearly inspired by indigenous face paint, right? Isn't that cultural appropriation?

It is usually a good thing when non-white VAs get prominent roles in games (especially big AAA ones) but this casting and other similar ones such as Miles Morales and Far Cry 6's dictator villain being played by Black men who aren't Hispanic give me pause because they're people taking on identities (to varying degrees) that are not their own.
 
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Theswweet

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The stinger at the end of Zero Dawn also revealed that the supposed antagonist for the whole series is black, too. Hrmm.
 
hey it's that dog

hey it's that dog

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Oct 25, 2017
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Is warpaint exclusive to one specific culture? Isn't it just a thing some tribal societies that fight a lot arrive at independently as a cultural practice?

I'm not trying to be dismissive, I'm open to being corrected if I don't know what I'm talking about.
 
Icy

Icy

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Oct 25, 2017
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Definitely not a new thing with this series; Zero Dawn (deservedly) received this criticism.
 
CorpseLight

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I don't see an issue? It's war paint on a futuristic human tribal leader where the world went to shit and everyone regressed.
 
nsilvias

nsilvias

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Oct 25, 2017
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the paint is the least of the problems with what you posted op. both sylens (he's morally grey i guess but near the end he seemed more like a temporary frenemy) and this character being black if they are evil is much more questionable.
 
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OhMyZach

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Oct 27, 2017
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I've never heard anyone complain about Miles voice actor before. He's mixed, but being voiced by a black actor is perfectly okay. This is a strange stance to take.
 
hey it's that dog

hey it's that dog

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For this to be problematic I think you'd have to make the case that this warpaint design is indisputably in the style of a specific US indigenous culture. Are there visual examples OP could post to aid their argument?
 
Ferrio

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nsilvias said:
the paint is the least of the problems with what you posted op. the main villian is black and so is the dude from the last game.
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Isn't the main villain the whitest douchiest tech bro ever?

Horizon made one of the most vilest villains ever and he the opposite of a minority, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt until I play.
 
Star-Lord

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It's a video game where they're are mechanical dinosaurs, I don't think it's going for realism or base it off of real events.
Also the game isn't out yet so we don't know how it is fully represented
 
BabyDontHurtMe

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The tribal design in Horizon basically mashed together a whole bunch of indigenous cultures around the world to make a unique hybrid sort of thing. Is it appropriation? I guess by definition yes and no? It's definitely taking cues from historic cultures but it's also giving its own creative design to it. It kinda toes the line. Then again I'm not really critical about this sort of thing which is why I never comment on it.
 
hydrophilic attack

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lots of people saying sylens will end up the main villain of the series, but i'm not sure. i think they'll stay morally grey

if they do end up as the main villain, I'd probably be ok with it just because i enjoy lance reddick's performance so much, lol
 
misho8723

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nsilvias said:
the paint is the least of the problems with what you posted op. the main villian is black and so is the dude from the last game. its got that dark is evil energy
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And the problem being? Are they the only ones black characters in the Horizon games? How many there are villains in videogames that are white and how many there are that aren't ? Don't we want more diverse characters, be it when it comes to races, characterisations, looks, professions, roles, etc. in games?
 
AImalexia

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misho8723 said:
And the problem being? Are they the only ones black characters in the Horizon games? How many there are villains in videogames that are white and how many there are that aren't ? Don't we want more diverse characters, be it when it comes to races, characterisations, looks, professions, roles, etc. in games?
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Yeah... but when the evil characters most of the time tend to be black, regardless of the rest of the representation, well, that just ain't it.
 
808s & Villainy

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Cultural appropriation of who? The made up cultures in the game?? It's a fictional universe and numerous cultures paint their faces in real life
 
Tailesque

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Theswweet said:
The stinger at the end of Zero Dawn also revealed that the supposed antagonist for the whole series is black, too. Hrmm.
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What? Sylens is not a clear cut main antagonist for the whole series, no. He's actually a pretty nuanced character compared to many others in the game. He's playing by his own rules and sometimes does bad shit to achieve his goals, but not always.
 
MayorSquirtle

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Ferrio said:
Isn't the main villain the whitest douchiest tech bro ever?

Horizon made one of the most vilest villains ever and he the opposite of a minority, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt until I play.
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Yes, the actual most reprehensible character in the Horizon universe responsible for the extinction of life on Earth is the epitome of privilege and an obvious Elon Musk expy.

Plus, Varl is black, Vanasha is black, even the AI that was made to save the planet (and succeeded) was given the appearance of a black woman. It's pretty reductive to just say "two villains are black" and not examine things any further.
 
platocplx

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I don't think they are "just" the main villain they seem to have a role in the conflict and I think without seeing how it's all written it's hard to just call it that.


JaredG said:
Yes, the actual most reprehensible character in the Horizon universe responsible for the extinction of life on Earth is the epitome of privilege and an obvious Elon Musk expy.

Plus, Varl is black, Vanasha is black, even the AI that was made to save the planet (and succeeded) was given the appearance of a black woman. It's pretty reductive to just say "two villains are black" and not examine things any further.
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Exactly it's a mixture of things in all of this.
 

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Theswweet said:
The stinger at the end of Zero Dawn also revealed that the supposed antagonist for the whole series is black, too. Hrmm.
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Is he though? He seems more opportunistic than a villain. What are you getting at exactly?

Also, we are talking about a game in the future, with tribes with all races living along side each other. Who is she appropriating exactly?

I need help on this one folks.
 

Deleted member 13798

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Not going to criticize it in full until I see the portrayal. Facepaint is not automatically indigenous cultural appropriation- not even sure who this would be appropriating.

I'd also be surprised if this character is just an unambiguous villain- the first game was kind of all about flawed shades of grey in intention.
 
Rowsdower

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I thought Sylens was morally grey really, on his side and no one elses. Ted Faro was more the main villain. Actually wasn't the leader of the shadow Carja the main bad guy for the last half?

Maybe there's multiple villains again.
 
xxracerxx

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Problematic because she is black, a supposed villain and has facepaint on? Is that the gist?
 
Makeno

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1) Doubt she's the main villain
2) Don't know her motivations, I'm sure at one point we might talk-no-jutsu her.
 

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The main villain you fight in HZD is some white dude with another white dude causing the apocalypse. Sylans is not the villain.
 
Pocky4Th3Win

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African tribes also used face paint. I don't see why it automatically is seen as native American or Indian. Heck for all we know about the game she can flip and be good. To assume she's the villain based on marketing is taking an early leap. We should wait till the game is out to judge on characterization of the cast since Sony often misleads to hide key story elements.
 
Synohan

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Weird thread.

Sylens is morally grey, while the real overarching villain is Ted Faro. Gaia, Varl, and Vanasha are all allies. I also think Regalla has the potential to become an eventual ally, due to the world ending threat that most likely once again involves the real Villain, Ted Faro.
 
HStallion

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Pocky4Th3Win said:
African tribes also used face paint. I don't see why it automatically is seen as native American or Indian. Heck for all we know !I'd game she can flip and be good. To assume she's the villain based on marketing is taking an early leap. We should wait till the game is out to judge on characterization of the cast since Sony often misleads to hide key story elements.
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Tribes in Europe used facepaint. I'm willing to guess most tribal people had some kind of bodily decoration from body paint to scarification to tattoos and so on.
 
Neonep

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As someone that is african american with a name that every single person on here would struggle to pronounce, I see no issues. That fact that Angela Bassett is in this game as a villain is a win, very cool.
 
NinjaScooter

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the series very clearly takes influence from Native American cultures top to bottom (and that is a fair conversation, as much as I loved the first game for a game that draws inspiration from native culture its also very, very white, so a conversation about whether the game properly respects its source material is fair game) whether this particular depiction is a "problematic" appropriation probably depends a lot the character herself, and playing the game and experiencing it, rather than trying to draw any hot take conclusions off of a single screen shot of her face paint.
 
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