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Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,670
They only started making any profit within the last few years, which is why this discussion has started now. For the vast majority of their history, they made no profit or almost no profit at all, which is why they have a low tax bill. The government designed the tax laws to encourage businesses to invest, because investment is good for the economy.

Amazon doesn't have a free pass. They are benefiting from an incentive that was specifically designed to get them to do exactly what they've done. If you change the laws, it would encourage businesses to not invest in the economy, which is exactly what you want them to do.

Except in this case it isn't good for the economy. Amazon's investments coupled with shareholders not caring if they don't make a profit have given Amazon monopoly power which they use to crush their competitors.

No VC will fund a competitor to Amazon. They know any company that tries to fight them will either get crushed or acquired.
 

FlintSpace

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,817
So you really don't see the issue with Amazon throwing cash around to influence legislation?
I am saying equal blame to people accepting those thrown around money. Of course they will throw money around if it's legally escapable..it's business.

Where are the articles blaming these politicians ?
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,670
I am saying equal blame to people accepting those thrown around money. Of course they will throw money around if it's legally escapable..it's business.

Where are the articles blaming these politicians ?

You see them all the time? People have been talking about corporate money for years.

Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's okay.
 

Rover

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,420
Amazon doesn't have a free pass. They are benefiting from an incentive that was specifically designed to get them to do exactly what they've done. If you change the laws, it would encourage businesses to not invest in the economy, which is exactly what you want them to do.

They are inherently forced to invest in the US to have their warehouses and shipping facilities spread out and close to their customers.

If Amazon was a forest, it would be in a wild overgrowth with nothing keeping it in check.

The problem with corporations growing too big in this environment, in case you haven't noticed, is that they gain too much influence in politics, the environment, the economy, and people's lives. None of it is democratically decided.
 

PepsimanVsJoe

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,137
I am really getting tired of reading "Don't blame the corporations!" bullshit.

They're practically making the laws, so fuck them.
 
OP
OP
Exile20

Exile20

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,055
Basically, can't knock people for rules that are in place.

If I was making that type of money I would make as much as possible, that shit won't last forever. Someone will eventually come along and try to take it
from you.

Imo, I'm not trying to go back to a world with out Amazon so I don't attack them. It saves me gas money, it saves me mileage and I like to believe I catch less colds in the winter months because I don't have to go into stores with germ infested people that lack the common courtesy to cover their mouths and nose when they sneeze or cough

Wow, this post is just amazing. So Amazon actually paying taxes means they don't exist? Amazon making 10 billion instead of 13 billion profits means amazon will go out of business?

Well fuck the debt and any social programs because corporation are not paying their fair share but I guess you get your vitamin C.
 

Merv

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,462
If the law allows me to reduce my tax burden you can be damn sure I'm doing it. Anyone not taking advantage of shitty laws but complaining about others doing it should blame their legislators instead of sitting on some morale high horse.

Why should i pay more taxes than I legally have to?

Point is the average person can't reduce their tax burden in the same way. Not everyone is a giant corporate entity. There is no high horse to be had in this situation. Also, as has been pointed out several times, corporations like Amazon have rigged the game in their favor.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,018
It seems a lot of people are still falling for the Yahoo Finance clickbait article this topic is based on. Amazon set aside $2.4BN for taxes last year. That includes US Federal, US State, foreign (no double taxation), and deferred.
 

Baji Boxer

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,380
If the law allows me to reduce my tax burden you can be damn sure I'm doing it. Anyone not taking advantage of shitty laws but complaining about others doing it should blame their legislators instead of sitting on some morale high horse.

Why should i pay more taxes than I legally have to?
These aren't individuals looking to reduce their tax burden, these are massive companies that work to create the loopholes in the first place. If I bribe someone to do something unethical for my benefit, we're both at fault.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,018
Got a reciept? They paid 2.4BN in taxes?
It's in the 10K. I provided a better link to it in my post on the first page here. I said they set aside $2.4BN. We don't know what any company pays exactly in taxes because we don't get their tax returns, we just see what they're setting aside for it in their earnings filings which is probably the same thing.
 

Sampson

Banned
Nov 17, 2017
1,196
Dude, Amazon has been fairly profitable since 2003. The reason why people are talking about this is because Trump lowered the corporate tax rate and Amazon makes a shit ton of money. The corporate tax cuts were supposed to get businesses to pay their workers more and stimulate the economy, which they didn't do. Not only that, but it allows companies like amazon to get away with paying meager portions of their profits.
You can't trust corporations to do the right thing when they have investors to please.

Uh... No?

Did you start following the news in 2017 or something?

For years people accused Amazon of running some kind of Ponzi scheme where they made no money. The same things people say about Tesla today but worse. There are so many examples but here is an article that sums up the sentiment just about 5 years ago:

 

mxbison

Banned
Jan 14, 2019
2,148
Honestly more than I expected. Someone must have fucked up.

Maybe they can re-organize some peon jobs to even it out.
 

Silly Buck

Member
Oct 28, 2017
522
the players are making the rules

The players are taking advantage of a system that allows them to lobby and make the rules.
That still falls under "the game" to me.
If this was on an episode of Game of Thrones we'd all be lauding at the sheer genius of the moves. But because we also pay taxes and feel like shit having to pay taxes while an enormous corp walks away essentially Scott free, we throw a tantrum.
 

Mona

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
26,151
The players are taking advantage of a system that allows them to lobby and make the rules.
That still falls under "the game" to me.
If this was on an episode of Game of Thrones we'd all be lauding at the sheer genius of the moves. But because we also pay taxes and feel like shit having to pay taxes while an enormous corp walks away essentially Scott free, we throw a tantrum.

i bet people were happy when joffrey died, but if that was their little brother they wouldn't have cheered, hypocrites
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,715
The players are taking advantage of a system that allows them to lobby and make the rules.
That still falls under "the game" to me.
If this was on an episode of Game of Thrones we'd all be lauding at the sheer genius of the moves. But because we also pay taxes and feel like shit having to pay taxes while an enormous corp walks away essentially Scott free, we throw a tantrum.

Ah yes, we don't care about something fictional in literature, but do about something that is happening to us right fucking now. What an incredibly astute observation.
 

Baji Boxer

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,380
The players are taking advantage of a system that allows them to lobby and make the rules.
That still falls under "the game" to me.
If this was on an episode of Game of Thrones we'd all be lauding at the sheer genius of the moves. But because we also pay taxes and feel like shit having to pay taxes while an enormous corp walks away essentially Scott free, we throw a tantrum.
If we lived in the Game of Thrones world, a fair number of us would probably have been raped, murdered, or both. A bunch of sibling fucking degenerates would be hording the wealth and making our lives 10 times worse.
 

Eeyore

User requested ban
Banned
Dec 13, 2019
9,029
The players are taking advantage of a system that allows them to lobby and make the rules.
That still falls under "the game" to me.
If this was on an episode of Game of Thrones we'd all be lauding at the sheer genius of the moves. But because we also pay taxes and feel like shit having to pay taxes while an enormous corp walks away essentially Scott free, we throw a tantrum.

This isn't entertainment. These are people's actual lives here. The fact you're pulling this disingenuous bullshit and saying it's a tantrum to want to hold a company responsible for paying the taxes they should means you've bought into this bullshit.

Yes Amazon isn't doing anything illegal. There are plenty of legal things that are fucked up in this country, just look at the amount of people incarcerated. If you judge everything by whether it's legal or not, you are using logic by a brain dead ant, aka Donald Trump. I urge you to reevaluate this.

To run a damn empire?

I'm sure I would give some money to family and causes that matter to me. Probaby rescue animals or something

So on one hand, we have an individual person making decisions about billions of dollars to causes that they think are just, in Bezos's case this is space travel. On the other hand, we'd possibly have a government, that while spending inefficiently, at least would hopefully have their citizens' well-being taken into account. There are millions of Americans living in poverty and Amazon is out here lobbying to reinforce this paradigm. Why do so many people support them? Empathizing with a billionaire instead of poor people. It's so aggravating.
 

TrueSloth

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,067
Uh... No?

Did you start following the news in 2017 or something?

For years people accused Amazon of running some kind of Ponzi scheme where they made no money. The same things people say about Tesla today but worse. There are so many examples but here is an article that sums up the sentiment just about 5 years ago:

That's from the shareholders perspective, they're talking about profit margins. This is about paying taxes, which they still reported profits. They don't get retroactive tax breaks for investments in the company. I have no idea how much they paid in prior years, so I can't comment on that, but the point is for an incredibly large company to pay next to nothing in taxes is incredibly wrong. Just hiring people isn't enough went state and federal need funds to support public services and improve infrastructure.
 

leder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,111
The amount of people stepping in to criticize even pointing out that amazon has a ridiculously low tax bill is blowing my mind. This is some next level bootlicking.
 

Sampson

Banned
Nov 17, 2017
1,196
That's from the shareholders perspective, they're talking about profit margins. This is about paying taxes, which they still reported profits. They don't get retroactive tax breaks for investments in the company. I have no idea how much they paid in prior years, so I can't comment on that, but the point is for an incredibly large company to pay next to nothing in taxes is incredibly wrong. Just hiring people isn't enough went state and federal need funds to support public services and improve infrastructure.

Actually they do. Read this:


Amazon isn't engaging in any kind of weird scheme. They are just taking advantage of the laws which were designed to encourage businesses investment.